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AEW - MAR 2021


Casey

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3 hours ago, A_K said:

I don't even understand how they're supposed to vaguely monetise Elevation, not least cover salaries of premium talent such as Paul Wight. Most recent edition of Dark scored c. 380k YT views. That can't be nearly enough to cover production/infrastructure costs, let alone talent? I don't really understand the upside of twice the Youtube show - someone correct my logic.

I have no idea what it'll be like when they start touring again. But literally this show costs next to nothing to produce currently. They own the building. They own the equipment. They're already paying the talent's salaries. The upside is talent development. How does Jungleboy keep improving wrestling only once a month on Dynamite? By wrestling up to 8 more times in that month on all the Dark shows. You gotta get reps in to get better.

It's always strikes me a bit odd when we get hyper focused on one specific aspect of a cost structure without factoring in the whole picture. Like yeah, they definitely don't break even strictly off of Youtube monetization. But Youtube monetization isn't the only income AEW brings in. They are profitable as is, based on PPV buys & Right's fees. Not to mention merch and toys in Walmart and whatever their split is of ad buys. They are sinking in a cost to help their performers get better, with the hopes that a roster with more experience brings that sunk cost back in better performances / drawing more money down the line.

But I don't think that's some high level thinking on my part. Basically common sense. The same thought process of how NXT & The Performance center definitely don't cover the cost of all contracted talents training at the PC or the NXT as a brand as a whole. It's an investment, not a stand alone profit stream.

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They said on the show that Jungle Boy has wrestled more matches for AEW than anybody else in the company if I heard correctly. I know that's been a talking point on the internet, so they haven't been shy with him at all. I agree that guys like him need more ring time though and this show is a good idea. They're likely going to feature Omega vs. Sydal next week too.

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51 minutes ago, NoFistsJustFlips said:

I have no idea what it'll be like when they start touring again. But literally this show costs next to nothing to produce currently. They own the building. They own the equipment. They're already paying the talent's salaries. The upside is talent development. How does Jungleboy keep improving wrestling only once a month on Dynamite? By wrestling up to 8 more times in that month on all the Dark shows. You gotta get reps in to get better.

It's always strikes me a bit odd when we get hyper focused on one specific aspect of a cost structure without factoring in the whole picture. Like yeah, they definitely don't break even strictly off of Youtube monetization. But Youtube monetization isn't the only income AEW brings in. They are profitable as is, based on PPV buys & Right's fees. Not to mention merch and toys in Walmart and whatever their split is of ad buys. They are sinking in a cost to help their performers get better, with the hopes that a roster with more experience brings that sunk cost back in better performances / drawing more money down the line.

But I don't think that's some high level thinking on my part. Basically common sense. The same thought process of how NXT & The Performance center definitely don't cover the cost of all contracted talents training at the PC or the NXT as a brand as a whole. It's an investment, not a stand alone profit stream.

I wouldn't call that common sense at all. You're overtly comparing the WWE structure that balances multiple national prime-time syndicated shows (and all the associated television revenue that yields) & streaming channel alongside a relatively slim non-revenue generating developmental program with a product where two-thirds of media is Youtube based with a comparatively slim mainstream-media revenue yielding base.

In terms of 'they're already paying the talent's salaries', again that assumes that all talent performing are on fixed-term contracts, which I do not believe is the case. A lot of savings-potential in using same set etc., but you would still factor in additional logistics costs, product-management costs, production costs etc. There is a lot more going on there than just turning a camera on, jumping in a ring that is established and saying 'go', or having the same determined costs on running an event for 1 night in a building you own versus 3 nights, for example.

We've gone through the "they are profitable as is" note before - other than some vague writing from Meltzer at odd points in the year since which they've added a host of new contracts there are certainly no concrete numbers on this, not that I've seen anyway. It is largely irrelevant anyway to the point - which is how beneficial really is another Youtube show with a few 100k viewers & a line-up that (based on this event) looks imperceptible from their other Youtube offering. It would have been good to see another externally hosted/TV show offering; hopefully that is still in the pipeline as the upside from this one seems minimal compared w/ what they already have (IMO).

Edited by A_K
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I agree with @NoFistsJustFlips that it's pretty much just common sense. It's "free" advertising for AEW merch and events. It's more in-ring experience for AEW's wrestlers. It's a chance to have a good look at some indie wrestlers whom AEW might want to employ some day. It's "practice" for the camera crews and tech people and announcers and so on. 

Also, Tonk K has made it clear that he is deliberately running a lot of matches during lockdown because he knows it is hard for indie wrestlers to find work and make money right now, and he'd like to give a payday to as many people as possible. To me, that seems like a very good thing.

I almost never have time to watch every match I'd like to watch every week (even in the current situation where I'm staying home a lot) but I am happy that AEW (and NJPW, NOAH, AJPW, and all the other various indies and promotions) keep producing more than I can consume. Let everyone get their reps in. Let everyone get better at their jobs. Let everyone make some money. Find another Bear Country, give J.D. Drake more exposure, let us see more characters like Abadon. 

It's all good!

Edited by El Gran Gordi
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That Maki Ito/Riho match was good.  It told a story and stuff which is odd for such a short match.  I also dug the Abadon match.

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Paul Wight did incredibly well for his debut. Focused on psychology and how moves affect the recipient. Put over the wrestlers. Really good stuff.

edit: That Tony Khan angle was not good. Brother, lol. 

Edited by Jiji
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Smart of TK to stay off Dynamite considering how bad he was in that.  But at least he's self aware about it though wish he just stuck with the stuff for Impact. 

As for Wright I liked him a lot especially for being new to commentary.  I get that he was nervous but I can't wait for when he gets more comfortable to see how good can be.  And while that was still too many matches (I get the reasons why) the show itself was pretty damn good.

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51 minutes ago, A_K said:

In terms of 'they're already paying the talent's salaries', again that assumes that all talent performing are on fixed-term contracts, which I do not believe is the case.

Are you referring to WWE or AEW here? Regardless I'm of the understanding they both have the same structure. Guaranteed contracts that pay a downside guarantee, or fixed-term as you put it, as well as bonus mechanics (merchandise / royalties / bonus for being in games / ect). Why would you assume AEW are using out-dated contract structures of the past where they pay by appearance? None of their roster would be making enough to live if they had the old school $300 a night deals TNA used to do with their lower card. You know when people like Jesse McNeal had to be on food stamps even tho he had a contract.

Now the indy guys they bring in are working on per appearance deals. The J.D. Drakes and John Skylars of the world. But that's not who I'm referring to when I'm talking about getting reps in. I'm talking about the contracted talent that are indeed on downside guarantees.

 

55 minutes ago, A_K said:

There is a lot more going on there than just turning a camera on, jumping in a ring that is established and saying 'go', or having the same determined costs on running an event for 1 night in a building you own versus 3 nights, for example.

Not really dawg. They fly in all the talent contracted to the taping every other week. That way if someone comes up with a spur of the moment creative idea you don't have to scramble to fly out someone who you didn't fly in. As well as in case of injury or emergency. So they literally are just sitting around bullshitting in the building if not being used. You might as well turn on the camera and let them get some work in. Since I have to be super literal with you it seems, no I'm not insinuating things are that spur of the moment with the Dark tapings. They book out the whole weeks worth of tapings to do on Wednesday, then the following week's work to do on Thursday, ahead of time. So unless you're really trying to argue minute costs like electricity or heat to run 6 hours of tapings vs 2 hours of Dynamite is make or break... then I have absolutely no idea what you're going on about here.

 

1 hour ago, A_K said:

We've gone through the "they are profitable as is" note before - other than some vague writing from Meltzer at odd points in the year since which they've added a host of new contracts there are certainly no concrete numbers on this, not that I've seen anyway. It is largely irrelevant anyway to the point - which is how beneficial really is another Youtube show with a few 100k viewers & a line-up that (based on this event) looks imperceptible from their other Youtube offering. It would have been good to see another externally hosted/TV show offering; hopefully that is still in the pipeline as the upside from this one seems minimal compared w/ what they already have (IMO).

They are profitable. That's what has been reported. Instead of trying to discredit what has been reported, why don't you try and substantiate your claim that they aren't? Got any reports saying they aren't profitable? Have any reason to believe the reports out there saying they are profitable are false? Just throwing your personal two cents in isn't going to cut it when you're the one ranting against what's been reported.

I can't tell if you're anti-AEW, pro-WWE, or just like stiring shit up. It's common sense you can not improve as a professional wrestler without wrestling professionally. A bunch. Over and over and learning and growing and improving. I can tell you from experience you can only grow so much doing training matches in an empty building. You need live rounds. The threat of fucking up and the repetition of digging yourself out of a hole when you make a mistake to get better at this. So whether you personally like that two Youtube shows exists is irrelevant, because they serve a valuable purpose.

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I know I've seen Limelight a couple times before, but this was my first time really paying attention to him. Going for that rolling stomp with Jungle Boy in too close is a bad look when he could've just stomped Jack. Flubbing on a roll-up attempt a minute later, and it clearly wasn't this guy's night. By the time he went for a destroyer on the apron, I was pretty much done with him. At least the rope walk and wrap-around head-scissors looked good.  Jungle Boy looked good.

Paul appearing not to know Jungle Boy's finish was an early sign there's work to be done. I wonder if JR's gonna give this rookie broadcaster a talk about "product knowledge," which seems to be a big concern for him.

I'm enjoying QT's new attitude and story. Could make for some really solid undercard stuff, especially against the people he's gonna be programmed with. Definitely more believable than anything they had going on with QT and Allie. And Marko always makes everyone's stuff look like a million bucks. Enjoyable. 

Lee Johnson video was a decent way to get to know a talent I'm not that familiar with. I'm for more of these.

Watched the Hobbs match and promo after all the praise from Goodear. Simple, believable, and largely decisive. Dig it. But Hook was on screen, so I imagine these segments weren't for everyone. 

The Khan segment was rotten. Between this and the Impact segments, he's shown zero aptitude for performing on screen. He even tried to get a little intense here, bless him. Hopefully this is one and done and not the start of something.

Didn't watch anything else. Got my fill. For anyone who watches Dark, how different was this? 

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This was the worst Limelight match by quite a lot.  Check out Fenix/Limelight from a couple months ago.  
 

I will have to rewatch some of the show.  I wasn’t paying attention to the Sydal/Omega stuff.  Tony K must have been desperate.  To put himself onscreen as Plan A could not have been in his dreams.

The real high point of AEW today was learning they signed Leyla Hirsch. When does Ayako Hamada get out of jail?

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2 hours ago, Casey said:

Layla Hirsch has finally been signed, but I'm sure some will complain that their roasted is too bloated or whatever.

They do in fact have more men than they need IMO, but it's hard to see that same argument being made about the women.

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17 minutes ago, Ryan Faulconer said:

When does Ayako Hamada get out of jail?

She's busy being an old Mexican luchadora. It looks like she doesn't really give a shit about wrestling.

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13 minutes ago, Eivion said:

Ayako got out of jail in 2018. She just never returned to the Japanese scene.

I saw an interview she did with a Mexican outlet not too long on Youtube. It appears she doesn't really identify with being Japanese anymore. She's fully embraced being Mexican and living in Mexico. She's gonna work Mexican indies whenever they open back up (and based on luchablog, everything is opening back up), and that's about it. 

She also seems super surly and weird:

 

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42 minutes ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

I saw an interview she did with a Mexican outlet not too long on Youtube. It appears she doesn't really identify with being Japanese anymore. She's fully embraced being Mexican and living in Mexico. She's gonna work Mexican indies whenever they open back up (and based on luchablog, everything is opening back up), and that's about it. 

If I recall correctly she basically felt the Japanese scene abandoned her when she was arrested while the Mexican scene tried to support her.

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4 minutes ago, Eivion said:

If I recall correctly she basically felt the Japanese scene abandoned her when she was arrested while the Mexican scene tried to support her.

That would explain why in the interview I saw, she only put over Aja Kong as far as the history of women she wrestled in Japan or had any reverence for. That's probably a given since Aja started her out. Maybe something was lost in translation, but it seems like the Japanese chapter of her career is definitely closed. 

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6 hours ago, John from Cincinnati said:

Didn't watch anything else. Got my fill. For anyone who watches Dark, how different was this? 

Other than having Omega, Tony and Paul on the show this could have been an episode of Dark and no one would have noticed.

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8 hours ago, John from Cincinnati said:

 

Didn't watch anything else. Got my fill. For anyone who watches Dark, how different was this? 

The matches were slightly more competitive than what is on Dark and there were more vignettes and interviews interspersed but it wasn't that different than Dark. Dark is about on par with WCW Worldwide where Elevation is along the same lines as WCW Saturday Night. It's still mostly jobber squashes, but the matches are slightly longer and there are some semblance of angles here and there. They also didn't play the ad for the Young Buck's book 50 times.

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The youtube shows kinda remind me of those old syndicated WWF shows that had Gorrilla and Hennan or Ventura doing commentary over house show matches. I would imagine they serve the same purpose as house shows (except revenue cause its not a house show buisness anymore) give guys work and road test ideas and gimmicks before they end up on dynamite 

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