NJPW King of Pro-Wrestling 2017

[The Iron Yuppie]

2 hours ago, sevendaughters said:

Exactly. Not long before winning Omega was still doing that chainsaw arm thing. He could have bombed.

I'd download or Daily Motion stuff here and there, but I started to get into NJPW on a more regular basis with Wrestle Kingdom 9 then AXS.

With that limited exposure, I was HIGHLY skeptical of Kenny Omega as a main-event talent. He had great matches with KUSHIDA for the Jr. Championship, sure, but even at that had the arm chainsaw, the broom & the Bucks with trash cans gimmick...just assorted stuff that was still lingering vestiges of the comedy act I first saw on ROH in 2009. His taking over Bullet Club struck me as...not necessarily a panic move, but just sorta like, "Well, we're losing the top English speaker who moves Bullet Club merch and the English speaker who founded the group, who's the next native English up?" 

My initial skepticism has been more than assuaged, but yeah, I could definitely see the fear Kenny wouldn't get over at that level.  

[Belgian_Waffle]

Fack, Kenny vs Tenzan with Tenzan dying a glorious hero's death would have been incredible. FTR I do like Goto, probably more than most, I always just found his presence in that main event a bit of a head-scratcher (but then, as you have all ppinted out, so was Kenny's).

K now I'm just flagrantly going to take over this topic with hypothetical scenarios: 

If you were booking next year's G1 a year in advance, who would you be working toward? 

 

[Raziel]

EVIL, Naito, Okada, and Omega out of who's on the roster now.  Plus we don't know who they're getting in come January to April.

 

My problem with NJPW now, and the G1, is that there's a bit of a log jam at the top, and they really are probably as stacked top to bottom as they ever have been, and they possibly need to cut some dead weight and shuffle some guys around.  And some of the guys I'd have in dead weight I REALLY hate to call dead weight.

[sevendaughters]

My preferred two choices are unreliable: Kota Ibushi and Katsuyori Shibata.

Obviously it is insane to think of Shibata in a hard G1 when he might never wrestle again so I won't pursue this too much, only to say this: if he can work, do it.

With Ibushi you have a total superstar who is pretty flaky. Gedo won't book him beyond a .500 record because he won't commit. Well...would a G1 win force his hand? It's dangerous. He could win and then stay being Mr. Flighty. But it could also straighten him up and make him see NJPW headlining as a destiny that he should fulfill.

My expectation is that Okada will be off the title and will win in style. That would also be very popular and produce a lot of solid shows.

I'm off on holiday for a bit. I'll probably think about this some more while I'm away.

[The Iron Yuppie]

16 hours ago, Raziel403 said:

EVIL, Naito, Okada, and Omega out of who's on the roster now.  Plus we don't know who they're getting in come January to April.

*looks at your avatar* 

*lights a candle to Saint Anthony* 

[Belgian_Waffle]

I was actually thinking of Elgin.  His star seems to have waned a bit since he came back from his injury (maybe just cuz he had a weak G1)  but I could totally get behind him having a strong NJ Cup showing and then winning the G1 to assert himself as the #2 Gaijin behind Omega (maybe even do it as a monster heel rather than his lovable babyface character). 

 

Also if Minoru Suzuki won it would be awesome,  if not especially progressive booking.  

[J.H.]

I think if Goto ever won the belt he'd get more a Nagta 2nd reign than Nakanishi reign (i.e. win i nthe spring, get a defense against the previous geenration  and then drop to the NJC Winner)

James

[Niners Fan in CT]

I'm just not a big fan of Elgin. He's had some great matches at the top of the card but he still manages to be boring most of the time and most of the great matches are nearly ruined by him doing 3-4 power moves that should have ended the match.  

I would love so much to see Rusev in NJPW. 

[Ryan]

When 90% of your offense should be able to be the finish in any match in history and you can't sell or emote like AJPW 90's Main Eventers or NJPW's top guys, you're going to seem odd. You can only see him do the same sequence of stuff so many times before you wonder why he even bothers doing anything but his powerbombs.

[John E. Dynamite]

Is this what happened to him in RoH? I remember he came in hot and rose to the top of the card very quickly, and then the audience rapidly lost interest. I don't know if the crowd reached that saturation point of seeing his shtick too many times before or after the metric ton of heat he put on himself after the visa/MLB tryout/PWG job/etc. incidents. I know he wasn't drawing.

[Spritenaut 32]

What was the PWG incident?  Don't remember that one ( I don't watch PWG).

[Belgian_Waffle]

Valid points,  all.  Doesn't he also use the Burning Hammer as an arbitrary offensive move?  Dunno what I was thinking on this one. 

[John E. Dynamite]

20 minutes ago, Horton Hears a Wooo!!! said:

What was the PWG incident?  Don't remember that one ( I don't watch PWG).

He put over a very young Trevor Lee in an opening round BOLA match while RoH champion without getting it cleared by the management. Very likely RoH would have nixed it.

[Beech27]

Aside from the Lee put-over, I remember Elgin (supposedly) bothering some by playing the "Well he gets to do it!" card with the (more popular) Adam Cole, who he never had a lot of nice things to say about regardless. At least at the time, he had a rep as a guy with a very high opinion of himself, which wasn't necessarily supported by ticket or merch sales. The baseball thing was... weird. He also had a habit of vanity searching on twitter, calling out fans who hadn't tagged him, and claiming he invented moves he didn't. All together, he looked petty and insecure. 

He has kept his Burning Hammer a protected big match finisher, though. He beat Naito with it in a tag, and Omega with it in the G1. 

[Ryan]

I think his Burning Hammer is the safer Chaz-style one anyways or Spicy Drop.

[mattdangerously]

On 8/22/2017 at 6:48 PM, Belgian_Waffle said:

If you were booking next year's G1 a year in advance, who would you be working toward? 

 

EVIL.  He'll be a main eventer someday soon.

[Jiji]

Going from the slog that was HIAC to King of Pro Wrestling is night and day. That's not to say I didn't enjoy the two cell matches, because I thought the opener was good and the main completely over delivered. But, I'm only four matches in but it feels like a completely different genre and is so much more fun. The booking builds to the big matches but that doesn't mean the undercard is an afterthought. The opener featured the Revenge of Daryl Takahashi and I popped big for that. The match was super fun for what it was but unlike the wwe show, it would be easy to build on that. The tag cell match had every fucking spot imaginable in it and killed the crowd until the main event. I thought for sure Suzuki was going to get his revenge on Yano but they're building Yano up for a title match, which makes absolute sense and so did the finish. They tortured him during the match. Fun stuff. Roppongi 3k looked great, particularly Tanaka. His power spots were really impressive. Only criticism is their two big tag moves should be switched. The dominator spot looks way, way, way more impactful than the flap jack deal. 

This is the best way to spend Canadian Thanksgiving. So thankful for New Japan and World. 

[EVA]

Wow, you share my exact thoughts on R3K.  I never really rated those guys at the Tempura Boyz, but they came off like stars repackaged here.  The dominator/cutter combo is one of the best new tag moves I've seen in a while, and they should definitely be finishing with that instead of their Shatter Machine knockoff.

[Jiji]

Ospreay/Kushida was just the right amount of insane. I still haven't seen the BOSJ final, so I'm sure I missed some context and callbacks but that was awesome. Ospreay vs. Hiromu... Yes, please! Hiromu may be a top 5 guy on the planet right now. Little choked Marty interrupted his title challenge. Funny but disappointed. Takahashi is so charismatic and lives his character. 

I also dug Ospreay's Spiderman tights. He's no 1996/7 Mysterio but he's great in his own right and his athletic style fits the imagery. 

[Beech27]

I was mainly let down than Marty didn't manage the finger "breaking" noise into the mic Hiromu was still holding. The spot doesn't have a ton of novelty left, but that would have been neat. And the returning Tempura Adultz were a highlight for sure.

Weird show overall, though, in that the two biggest matches were so predictable that the rest of the card felt a little more compelling, to me. Of the two, I think Okada/Evil was better; but then, Okada's proven to be an exceptionally adaptable worker. Naito... has Naito matches, mostly. Which are very good! So good this hardly feels like a criticism. But I sorta felt like most reasonably dedicated New Japan viewers could have predicted Ishii/Naito, nearly spot for spot. And it didn't really show that Naito "solved" Ishii exactly--he mostly did the same things that didn't work before, but this time, he kicked out of the brainbuster, and then won. Maybe that's harsh? I guess there's a way to read it as Naito playing rope-a-dope, taking Ishii's best shots, then hitting his counter Destino to really set up the win with the proper version. It's also (yet another) example of how high the standard is in New Japan, right now; I can conceptualize something like an "average" four-star match, which ought to be a contradiction in terms.

All of this is to say, I liked basically all of the work on this show--and thus, the show itself--but I think I'm primarily interested in seeing the narrative moved forward, at this point.

[Jiji]

Pretty spot on in that the results in the two top matches were so predictable that it hurt the quality and that we've seen the Ishii/Naito match three times in the past three months. The G1 Evil/Okada was noticeably better than this version but that August match was near perfection in a year full of 4.5 star and better matches. It is cool that EVIL's finish was protected but it also meant the crowd never fully bought into his near falls. Okada ducking the chair on the outside was a great spot. I'd probably go 4.25 for the main and 3.75 or 4 for the semi-main for the reasons Beech mentioned. Honestly, I get Naito's appeal but I'd rather watch EVIL or Hiromu at this point and I love SANADA's act as much as Naito's though of course the former isnt as good as the latter. 

They've had better shows but everything made sense, was enjoyable and there were four great matches. Awesome stuff. 

One more thing... Evil had the best braids I've seen a wrestler or fighter sport. And his video package and throne entrance was tight. 

[EVA]

I am beyond pissed at Japan for buying into all this Marty Scurll shit.  YOU ARE NOT HELPING, JAPAN.

[EVA]

Naito/Ishii was definitely "a Naito match" but I feel like we're underselling Okada/EVIL here.  I thought Evil brought some new stuff to the table for his first IWGP title match and generally showed that he wasn't out of his depth, and Okada, for the most part, smartly hung back and let him show his stuff, putting most of his energy into coming up with slick counters to all the stuff Evil used to beat him in the G1.  The rana counter to Darkness Falls was very nice, and the STO counter where he spun the opposite way of how most people normally would was pretty slick and looked like it would legitimately throw someone off balance and create an non-contrived opening for a Rainmaker.

I'm a little concerned that it's apparently now a standard Okada trope that he takes some kind of nutty suplex variation off the top rope in every big match now, though.

[Jiji]

I know not a lot of people correctly put much weight in star ratings, but since the new year I've been trying to keep track of what I've watched with a google sheet and I've been including star ratings. I gave the G1 EVIL/Okada match 5 because not only was it a stupendous match technically and in its layout but it was a real star making performance and the energy that night in Osaka was off the charts. Today's match was great but it didn't have the passion the original had, as the crowd never really believed EVIL had a chance. Beyond that, what was there was fantastic for the reasons you mentioned. They played off the G1 match in a lot of smart and neat ways. One criticism I had was EVIL's use of the Banshee Muzzle (what a great name for a move btw!). He did so well during the G1 to establish it as a legit threat but it was a glorified rest hold today. 

The show was a blast to watch, it just didn't have that super high end MOTYC. It did have three matches in the 4-4.25 range imo, but New Japan 2017 has spoiled us with so many instant classics so it doesn't stand out as their absolute best. What a time to be a fan. Okada is just out of this world. He doesn't have a tonne of flashy or super impactful offense but he's reaching legendary status at being flexible to the needs of his opponent, timing, and general ability to tell a great narrative over several matches. 

One other thing... I don't get why the fans boo super babyface KUSHIDA and Okada when they kick their opponents and act disrespectful but are all into Naito spitting on dudes. Naito spitting on Ishii after the match was such a piece of shit move, but they didn't blink a collective eye. Seems odd but I guess they expect it from Naito at this stage.

[John E. Dynamite]

The set-in-stone booking of the Dome Show really puts a damper on NJPW shows after the G1. It's the company's biggest problem. They need to fix it.