Mister TV Posted August 12, 2020 Share Posted August 12, 2020 3 hours ago, Technico Support said: All the talk of Andre not doing business is laughable. He was always going to do the job. Anything else is just bullshit Hogan mythologizing. "Orndorff being held back just in case" has always been an unsubstantiated legend. Orndorff himself just recently said he can't remember. But come on. I really have my doubts that Andre was touch and go at match time when the guy worked matches in the lead-up and continued to work until, what, Mania 6? I mean sure, it was limited work, but that was all he was needed for here. I love all the myths we've built around Mania 3. Does anybody outside the hardcore WWF marks, lunatics on Wikipedia, and anti-Meltzer contrarians believe 93,173? Besides the SNME Battle Royal and WM3, Andre was inactive from September 1986 to Survivor Series 1987. Once they announced the match Andre was going to be in it unless he stopped breathing so the Orndorff thing is most likely bs. While most don't believe the 93, 173 the 78,000 number that Meltzer gives is way off, the Silverdome had 80,069 seats for football and a ballpark of 7,500 on the floor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig H Posted August 12, 2020 Share Posted August 12, 2020 On 8/11/2020 at 8:52 AM, NikoBaltimore said: It looks like COVID at least factored into it. This is sadly not surprising. My wife is a RN who left oncology to do dialysis treatments and now she manages the area around here. COVID is a huge struggle with all patients coming in for emergency dialysis or coming in to a treatment center. Obviously, different companies and locations are run differently. I know my wife runs a tight ship, but who knows what the case is elsewhere. It's also possible the cardiac arrest could have been related to his treatment or general physical condition and less COVID. I've heard a bunch of stories about patients crashing while on dialysis. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Technico Support Posted August 12, 2020 Share Posted August 12, 2020 (edited) 27 minutes ago, Mister TV said: Besides the SNME Battle Royal and WM3, Andre was inactive from September 1986 to Survivor Series 1987. Once they announced the match Andre was going to be in it unless he stopped breathing so the Orndorff thing is most likely bs. Thanks for clarifying! I knew he worked before and after, just not how much or how little. That's definitely less than I thought but the guy was not at death's door as the people who over-dramatize the story like to tell it. I'm sure everyone knew the whole time he was in decent enough shape for the match they would be doing and there's no way they'd switch the main on a show that big to a match they'd already shown on TV and home video. As you said, as soon as they announced it, there's no way they'd change it. Then they had Andre back in house shows against Bigelow, Duggan, and Savage in mid/late 88. Pretty good for a dead guy. Edited August 12, 2020 by Technico Support Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Posted August 12, 2020 Share Posted August 12, 2020 Andre's inactivity was for filming The Princess Bride and back surgery, IIRC. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister TV Posted August 12, 2020 Share Posted August 12, 2020 1 hour ago, Technico Support said: Thanks for clarifying! I knew he worked before and after, just not how much or how little. That's definitely less than I thought but the guy was not at death's door as the people who over-dramatize the story like to tell it. I'm sure everyone knew the whole time he was in decent enough shape for the match they would be doing and there's no way they'd switch the main on a show that big to a match they'd already shown on TV and home video. As you said, as soon as they announced it, there's no way they'd change it. Then they had Andre back in house shows against Bigelow, Duggan, and Savage in mid/late 88. Pretty good for a dead guy. The fear was more about Andre's back than him dropping dead. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted August 12, 2020 Share Posted August 12, 2020 I forgot this gem. The versatile William Regal. Bugger off! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert S Posted August 12, 2020 Share Posted August 12, 2020 6 hours ago, Technico Support said: All the talk of Andre not doing business is laughable. He was always going to do the job. Anything else is just bullshit Hogan mythologizing. I mean there is that Maeda debacle, but then, Maeda. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zimbra Posted August 16, 2020 Share Posted August 16, 2020 PW Insider is reporting that northeast Indy mainstay and former ROH champion Xavier has passed away at age 43. Link His ladder match vs Low Ki in UCW was one of the matches that got me into indy wrestling RIP. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jiji Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 (edited) 35 minutes ago, Zimbra said: PW Insider is reporting that northeast Indy mainstay and former ROH champion Xavier has passed away at age 43. Link His ladder match vs Low Ki in UCW was one of the matches that got me into indy wrestling RIP. 43 is way too young. I can certainly see why this match got you into the indies. I was worried when I saw only 10 minutes that it would be way too short, but then I saw "part 1 of 4" and immediately switch my concern to it being way too long. Let's see how this unfolds but part 1 absolutely rules. edit: there's a better version on IWTV for subscribers. The show also has an Amazing Red/Fujita match that is just nuts. Edited August 17, 2020 by Jiji 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted August 17, 2020 Author Share Posted August 17, 2020 15 minutes ago, Jiji said: 43 is way too young. I can certainly see why this match got you into the indies. I was worried when I saw only 10 minutes that it would be way too short, but then I saw "part 1 of 4" and immediately switch my concern to it being way too long. Let's see how this unfolds but part 1 absolutely rules. Live it was off-the-charts awesome... a real classic that put both guys on the map nationally and led to their feud getting bicycled around the region. This fucking sucks. RIP X. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zimbra Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 7 minutes ago, Pete said: Live it was off-the-charts awesome... a real classic that put both guys on the map nationally and led to their feud getting bicycled around the region. This fucking sucks. RIP X. I have a lot of fondness for that show since it was also the first time I saw Red and the rest of the Whipwreck guys, Hit Squad, Homicide, and the Backseat Boyz, but good god it was so damned long I got tired just watching it on tape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted August 17, 2020 Author Share Posted August 17, 2020 3 minutes ago, Zimbra said: I have a lot of fondness for that show since it was also the first time I saw Red and the rest of the Whipwreck guys, Hit Squad, Homicide, and the Backseat Boyz, but good god it was so damned long I got tired just watching it on tape. Long? That show wasn't long at all compared to the USA Pro shows at the Lodge that came later on with literally 80 guys on the card. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nice Guy Eddie Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 I have fond memories of Xavier's Fight without Honor against John Walters at Final Battle 2003. This past week has personally been a shit sundae, so this is the cherry on top. 43 is just way too young. Rest in Peace, Xavier. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paintedbynumbers Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 RIP Xavier, Gone way too soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infinit Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 1 hour ago, Nice Guy Eddie said: I have fond memories of Xavier's Fight without Honor against John Walters at Final Battle 2003. This past week has personally been a shit sundae, so this is the cherry on top. 43 is just way too young. Rest in Peace, Xavier. @Nice Guy Eddie Hope you're doing ok bro RIP Xavier 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 Moving. 7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 2 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said: I have fond memories of Xavier's Fight without Honor against John Walters at Final Battle 2003. This past week has personally been a shit sundae, so this is the cherry on top. 43 is just way too young. Rest in Peace, Xavier. R.I.P., Xavier. Condolences to his family and friends. Best wishes, @Nice Guy Eddie. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 (edited) I don't mean this as a slight, and if do, then it's on us and not him, but ROH Champion Xavier was pretty much the world's greatest Baron Corbin. ROH was, in a lot of ways, post-modern. You couldn't have conventional heels because the crowd was there for the workrate and they hadn't quite worked out the "Fight Forever" chants yet, but they were getting there quick. Whether Xavier was a guy with an easier schedule to plan around or less Japan politics to worry about in finishes or what, he's the one they went with for a long stretch instead of a lot of the draws people were coming to see. And instead of overcompensating the other way, he leaned into it and use that dissonance to get real heat on top in a setting where that should have been virtually impossible. I can't easily express how cathartic it was for that crowd when Samoa Joe beat him. Edited August 17, 2020 by Matt D 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EVA Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 4 hours ago, Matt D said: Whether Xavier was a guy with an easier schedule to plan around or less Japan politics to worry about in finishes or what, he's the one they went with for a long stretch instead of a lot of the draws people were coming to see. I think he was a guy that Feinstien was really high on. It’s always been interesting to me that Xavier basically vanished from ROH after the RF incident. I know he also had some injuries around that time, but they never made any attempt to bring him back post-RF, minus a couple of “Hey, remember Xavier?” nostalgia appearances at Anniversary shows. He really was great in his role as ROH champ, though. I feel like that booking was ahead of its time and would be received better today. That crowd (which was flocking to Indy wrestling to get away from HHH’s reign of terror) just wasn’t ready for that kind of heel champ yet. The setup to Xavier coming out of nowhere to beat Ki in his first defense was so good. I think that match was 4th or 5th from the top. No reason for anyone to think he had a chance to win until it happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clintthecrippler Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 To this day, I would love to know how the conversation with Low-Ki went about jobbing that night, given his notoriously prickly attitude towards that, even then? Did all of the overbooking for the finish make him feel more comfortable? Was it that he was being asked to put over someone he had a strong in-ring history with prior to then, or maybe he was just more confident and secure about doing an ROH job because he had steady gigs in TNA and Japan (in ZERO-ONE I believe at that time, right?). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
odessasteps Posted August 20, 2020 Share Posted August 20, 2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paintedbynumbers Posted August 20, 2020 Share Posted August 20, 2020 21 hours ago, clintthecrippler said: To this day, I would love to know how the conversation with Low-Ki went about jobbing that night, given his notoriously prickly attitude towards that, even then? Did all of the overbooking for the finish make him feel more comfortable? Was it that he was being asked to put over someone he had a strong in-ring history with prior to then, or maybe he was just more confident and secure about doing an ROH job because he had steady gigs in TNA and Japan (in ZERO-ONE I believe at that time, right?). He was doing a lot of TNA then. He got into Zero one more so in 2003 I believe. I know he faced AJ on one of the shows. Can't say if he had the bad attitude then or not but I do know he did in fact throw a tantrum about jobbing to a local guy in 2005 (John McChesney) Low-Ki is a strange fellow. If you've met him you know. He is extremely serious, shakes hands with a tight vice like grip. If he gives you merch or you buy it from him he folds it meticulously perfect and shows you both sides. Almost like when the flip over the Dairy Queen Blizzard. Outside of his refusal to job I've never had any negative interractions with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shartnado Posted August 20, 2020 Share Posted August 20, 2020 As far as Xavier goes, it freaks me out that he would go so early as 43, since I'll be the same age in a month. Terrible news, as is anything on this particular thread. As far as Low-Ki goes, vice-like grip? Butbutbut...I hear his forearms are tiny! How can this be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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