Linus Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 Wow, that's just offensive. If I were a wrestler, I could never work for a promoter who would send out a message like that. I mean, how am I supposed to believe you can run a competent promotion when your grammer is that atrocious? *grammar Atrocious. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Wilson Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 I'll make a statement about ratings here: Is it even possible to compare ratings now vs. even 10 years ago? The rise of internet streaming means that fewer people are watching TV period. RAW is a top 20 show both among 18-49 year olds and overall (http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2015/10/13/cable-weekly-top-25-the-walking-dead-is-no-1-for-oct-5-11-2015-ahs-hotel-opens-well/478339/) and they're getting beat mostly by sports and The Walking Dead. Could it be better? Yes, but there's no reason for WWE to panic yet and they likely won't change until the ratings really tank. My only counter-argument would be that live sports are not down as you mentioned (NFL is up, the other major sports have mostly hovered around the same ratings the last five years), and WWE tries to present itself as a live presentation instead of a weekly sitcom. So I'd be more apt to compare WWE to say MLB ratings than Modern Family. Plus wrestling is one of the harder programs to get advertising for so in a way they have to perform better than the shows around them to justify their existence, as the leaked Destination America email showed. But really all that matters is how USA feels, if USA tomorrow decided they were done with wrestling I have no idea what WWE would do as the landscape has changed. But if USA is satisfied with the ratings then they aren't going anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joseph2112 Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 The other thing to consider when talking ratings is that wrestling is an entity on to its own. There really is no comparison to other things. The WWE not "a" thing, it's the only thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonteCarl Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 If USA decided tomorrow to be done with wrestling, I wonder if WWE would just go all in on The Network and starting putting RAW and SD on there, making the only way anybody would be able to watch any WWE anymore is if they had the Network. Does the accessability of WWE on basic cable drive the Network? Or could they actually do it all on their own? In this digital content age where Netflix and Hulu and Amazon all have "network" exclusive shows, could WWE operate in the same manner? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
odessasteps Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 If they did put everything on the network, it prob would not still be $ 9.99. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirSmUgly Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 I just love that here in 2015, Vince fucking McMahon is having circles written and booked around him in large part by a dude who wrote for the Rachael Ray Show. Absurd. It's odd that RAW doesn't really leverage the fact that it's live programming and thus people should still be making sure to tune in to see it unfold. Hell, if you missed the first two hours, they'll recap everything important at the top of the third hour. They should really tinker with the format so that the announcers only allude to what people missed in the first hour or two rather than just giving it away. It might be wiser for them to edit the video clips of RAW and Smackdown (assuming Smackdown moves to USA and becomes a live show) that they put online so that they don't give as much away also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thee Reverend Axl Future Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 I agree with what OSJohn said. In fact, to extrapolate his analysis further (to a ridiculous level for the sake of discussion), is pro wrestling approaching a climate where the workers who get cheered are the ones that the audience perceives to be best performers and/or the most "authentic", and the folks who get booed are the ones who don't meet the standards of the times or who are "undeserving"? Meaning, are we at the fabled End of Babyfaces and Heel Era? In a McLuhan sense, has rassling become a cold medium, appreciated for it's craft and no longer a hot medium, where the viewer is expected to have an emotional response? It's definitely post-modern - just look at the ongoing debate here about Eva Marie - is the only way to get heel heat to appear that (actual or kay fabe) management is pushing someone who hasn't earned it? Or to get even farther down the PoMo rabbithole, that the office is trolling the fans with the illusion of the same? I have seen wrestlers get heel reactions on the indys (Jonathan Gresham comes to mind) but is it even possible in the WWE? KOwens came the nearest, but he is getting more cheers now for being an asskicker and entertainer. Look at what Foley and Austin had to do to turn heel, and what The Rock couldn't do, and that was a seeming lifetime ago. Rollins is a good heel, but doesn't inspire rabid heat - Cena gets booed more... gottagolateforworkstoopidwork, RAF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HumanChessgame Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 I think it has more to do with the antihero being more over than ever in popular culture. People don't cheer or boo characters/wrestlers because of where they fall on the good/evil spectrum, they get behind them based on how cool or interesting they are. Just look at Breaking Bad, Sons of Anarchy, and other popular shows out there. The main characters who are technically the protagonists are typically awful people, yet the creative process has made them cool or put them in situations where fans want to see them succeed. That carries over to wrestling as well - clean cut, athletic go-getters are boring and stale. Cheering for the popular high school jock is no fun, especially when said character does the exact same schtick week in and week out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OSJ Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 People, please: there is no such thing as "babyface heat". A face can be over, but only heels get heat. Learn the lingo. - RAF Oh dear, do we need to go back to telling folks to "lurk and learn"! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyJ Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 With ratings, the example I always point to when people bring up the, TV has changed argument is the Raw walkout angle of 2011. Unexpectantly Raw shockingly ends with the locker room walking out on HHH (due to miz/truth...it was a simpler time). The fans spent the next week speculating about what was going to happen next. That first hour of Raw the following week had 5.4 million eyeballs. That was over 1.25 million more viewers than the first hour of the week prior When it was revealed that the roster was just going to be brought back (and JR fired), Raw lost 700k viewers for the second hour. Which means if you give people a reason to watch, an enormous audience exists. If you give people a reason to tune out a million other options exist. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobholly138 Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 Sasha Banks is a more over babyface than Bayley, and she isn't even a babyface. I think you need to learn that a babyface isn't actually determined by how a crowd reacts. It's based off of how he or she is booked. And it's always been that way. Uh, no... The wily veteran of RSPW is spot on in this instance. Sasha is like Nakamura from six years ago, yeah, technically she's a heel, but she's such a fantastic performer the crowd has turned her without really turning her, if you get what I mean. How you're booked doesn't mean jack, it's how you connect with the audience. In fact, the WWE is going to have the same problem with Asuka as they currently have with Sasha (and it's not really a problem unless in typical VKM-style they dig in their heels and try to force things their way instead of letting the organic development occur), the fans have already decided that they love Asuka. She could come out and eat a kitten and she'll still get cheers. I'm sure that the idea was to make her a killer heel to face Bayley, but that's simply not going to happen. Her destruction of Dana and impending destruction of Emma have sealed the deal. No matter how heelishly she behaves, Sasha is such a great performer that people get behind her, it's like Flair in the early 1980s... He could act like a total douche and people still loved him. Matter of fact, the smart move for the women's division might be to turn Charlotte and draw on the Flair history. I think she can pull off arrogant heel with a sense of entitlement pretty well. A little reshuffling of say, Tamina, Natalya, and (not sure about the fourth, Nia Jax seems like overkill, maybe Paige in the Tully Blanchard spot?) and you have a legacy Four Horsewomen stable. Gives you two strong heel stables, allows for Naomi turning back to face (which she's much better at), and lets Sasha, Bayley and Asuka cut loose as three very different but likely equally popular faces. Old Smoreslock isn't the only RSPW vet here. I still remember some guy name John coming in there to go after someone named Chad Hell I still remember back when RSPW had Marc Mero posting there. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobholly138 Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 People, please: there is no such thing as "babyface heat". A face can be over, but only heels get heat. Learn the lingo. - RAF Oh dear, do we need to go back to telling folks to "lurk and learn"! I always heard it called "shine" when the babyface is getting over. And this is from guys who had been around at least 15 years,most of them 20. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Go2Sleep Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 From the PWTorch Insider Terms Glossary Heat 1. (n) Crowd noise, usually means boos and jeers, although also refers to general crowd noise, including cheers and clapping. 2. (slang) To "have heat" is to be in poor standing with someone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zakk_Sabbath Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 People, please: there is no such thing as "babyface heat". A face can be over, but only heels get heat. Learn the lingo. - RAF Oh dear, do we need to go back to telling folks to "lurk and learn"! I always heard it called "shine" when the babyface is getting over. And this is from guys who had been around at least 15 years,most of them 20. Maybe I'm an idiot but I wasn't familiar with that term until I started lurking here in high school, and later, PWO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vincey Greene Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 Sasha Banks is a more over babyface than Bayley, and she isn't even a babyface.I think you need to learn that a babyface isn't actually determined by how a crowd reacts. It's based off of how he or she is booked. And it's always been that way. Uh, no... The wily veteran of RSPW is spot on in this instance. Sasha is like Nakamura from six years ago, yeah, technically she's a heel, but she's such a fantastic performer the crowd has turned her without really turning her, if you get what I mean. How you're booked doesn't mean jack, it's how you connect with the audience. In fact, the WWE is going to have the same problem with Asuka as they currently have with Sasha (and it's not really a problem unless in typical VKM-style they dig in their heels and try to force things their way instead of letting the organic development occur), the fans have already decided that they love Asuka. She could come out and eat a kitten and she'll still get cheers. I'm sure that the idea was to make her a killer heel to face Bayley, but that's simply not going to happen. Her destruction of Dana and impending destruction of Emma have sealed the deal. No matter how heelishly she behaves, Sasha is such a great performer that people get behind her, it's like Flair in the early 1980s... He could act like a total douche and people still loved him. Matter of fact, the smart move for the women's division might be to turn Charlotte and draw on the Flair history. I think she can pull off arrogant heel with a sense of entitlement pretty well. A little reshuffling of say, Tamina, Natalya, and (not sure about the fourth, Nia Jax seems like overkill, maybe Paige in the Tully Blanchard spot?) and you have a legacy Four Horsewomen stable. Gives you two strong heel stables, allows for Naomi turning back to face (which she's much better at), and lets Sasha, Bayley and Asuka cut loose as three very different but likely equally popular faces. Old Smoreslock isn't the only RSPW vet here. I still remember some guy name John coming in there to go after someone named Chad Hell I still remember back when RSPW had Marc Mero posting there. I wish the UA posted here. And that guy who worked at Subway and had goofy rspw angles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammerva Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 In case you were wondering about Terry Funk recently. Yep still crazy and awesome. A brief clip of him last night at AIW Wrestling: 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OSJ Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 Sasha Banks is a more over babyface than Bayley, and she isn't even a babyface.I think you need to learn that a babyface isn't actually determined by how a crowd reacts. It's based off of how he or she is booked. And it's always been that way. Uh, no... The wily veteran of RSPW is spot on in this instance. Sasha is like Nakamura from six years ago, yeah, technically she's a heel, but she's such a fantastic performer the crowd has turned her without really turning her, if you get what I mean. How you're booked doesn't mean jack, it's how you connect with the audience. In fact, the WWE is going to have the same problem with Asuka as they currently have with Sasha (and it's not really a problem unless in typical VKM-style they dig in their heels and try to force things their way instead of letting the organic development occur), the fans have already decided that they love Asuka. She could come out and eat a kitten and she'll still get cheers. I'm sure that the idea was to make her a killer heel to face Bayley, but that's simply not going to happen. Her destruction of Dana and impending destruction of Emma have sealed the deal. No matter how heelishly she behaves, Sasha is such a great performer that people get behind her, it's like Flair in the early 1980s... He could act like a total douche and people still loved him. Matter of fact, the smart move for the women's division might be to turn Charlotte and draw on the Flair history. I think she can pull off arrogant heel with a sense of entitlement pretty well. A little reshuffling of say, Tamina, Natalya, and (not sure about the fourth, Nia Jax seems like overkill, maybe Paige in the Tully Blanchard spot?) and you have a legacy Four Horsewomen stable. Gives you two strong heel stables, allows for Naomi turning back to face (which she's much better at), and lets Sasha, Bayley and Asuka cut loose as three very different but likely equally popular faces. Old Smoreslock isn't the only RSPW vet here. I still remember some guy name John coming in there to go after someone named Chad Hell I still remember back when RSPW had Marc Mero posting there. I wish the UA posted here. And that guy who worked at Subway and had goofy rspw angles. Oh yeah, the sandwich kid... WTF was his name? Alec, Alex? And what about the guy pretending to be a Japanese exchange student, with all the weird insults (bitch-ninnie, cunt-eye, etc.) for anyone that criticized WCW? K. Urishima, that was it! Oh, look what I found... The Tao of K_Urishima Over the last few months RSPW has been privileged from time to time to receive witty and cogent commentary from the famed philosopher and raconteur K. Urishima. Rather than allow some of his waspish observations to slip into the Usenet cracks, we're pleased to be able to offer a "Best of K. Urishima" for your reading pleasure. Should you be in search of any additional enlightenment regarding these or other topics, be advised that Mr Urishima is always quick to respond to queries, generally with helpful advice. Biographical Details: (The Genesis of a Gourmand) "i lived as japan-china exchange scholar years ago, in Shenzhen across from the border to Hongkong. exchange scholar is a lot of time for no pay and no time for extra work, even china won't hire japanese guys, so theres that, i was poor. used to go to the Shenzhen health center for women and children to pick up small glass milk containers where removals were. the hospital gave them away free, about 10 per bottle, one bottle per week. one was enough to make a bowl of stew with wild herbs i picked on the way to health center. doctors at centers usually take the abort removals home for themself to make stews, but the ones in Shenzhen were nicer, would help the poor. sounds disgusting, to eat a fetus, but the taste of the stew is okay (best tasting is first-born male from young girl) and doctors at health center and Luo Hu clinic in Shenzhen all say it is very nutritional. good for kidneys, skin, hair. sometimes i got after birth, placenta, to make soup but most times women take those. chinese medicine recommends it. they are not as good as the removals, anyway. " With that sort of background, it's no surprise that our Mr Urishima is a man of many parts… Let's take a look, shall we? Wrestling Insider: "yo shaq the bball player is goin to wcw. that is surprise." Conspiracy Buff: "you know how those music companys like to create false images to sell records and stuff, the jeremy song was what propelled peral jam into the mega mega mainstream. seems convenient. what do you think." World Traveler and Philosopher: "what the fuck. there is no reason to eat vegetarian if you dont have to. you are still killing a living thing and eating it if you eat plants. and dont tell me we were meant to be vegetarians, i ate only two carrots, some tempura cucumbers and a bowl of oat meal yesterday. i will not tell you what happened on the toilet the next morning, but it took a whole roll of paper to clean an ass when it was done. bodies like meat, shits like meat to make them firm, nothing is wrong with meat. when i visited california all of the faggy vegetarians out there would eat fish and octopus but not cow and would not explain why. retard guys are dumber than octopus, is it okay to eat them? stupid. meat tastes good, bitchnannies." Rapier Wit: "mad from being exposure, huh yapapi. sucking the testicle exploder.." Confidant of Wrestlers: "well fuckhair i talked to kidman today in a bar and he said it was an assisted shooting star press so who do i believe you or kidman, hm. cunteye." New Age Guru: "eat a devil cock, stupid asswit. cats are mean too. they torture birds and sometimes do not eat them. so what if he killed it and didnt eat it. so what. if you like animals and think they have feelings and are intelligent and are worthy of keeping alive, you should not want them dead, no matter what the purpose. using your eyeballshitting cunt logic, murdering people would be okay as long as you eat them. either animals are good enough to not kill for any reason or they are not. they are obviously not. bitchnuts." Master Conversationalist: "again with fucked-o insulting bitchskull. what ever. either animal is good to stay alive or it is not. end of case. donut shitting fat death." Rhodes Scholar: "no for japan high school student, i was number third in my juku when i was going, i am no idiot. how about if you sex a blow seal? how about that fucker?" When all else fails, remember the CATCHPHRASE OF DOOM: "Sex a blow seal!" Brought to you by... OSJ - (Just another seeker of truth) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobholly138 Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 Sasha Banks is a more over babyface than Bayley, and she isn't even a babyface.I think you need to learn that a babyface isn't actually determined by how a crowd reacts. It's based off of how he or she is booked. And it's always been that way. Uh, no... The wily veteran of RSPW is spot on in this instance. Sasha is like Nakamura from six years ago, yeah, technically she's a heel, but she's such a fantastic performer the crowd has turned her without really turning her, if you get what I mean. How you're booked doesn't mean jack, it's how you connect with the audience. In fact, the WWE is going to have the same problem with Asuka as they currently have with Sasha (and it's not really a problem unless in typical VKM-style they dig in their heels and try to force things their way instead of letting the organic development occur), the fans have already decided that they love Asuka. She could come out and eat a kitten and she'll still get cheers. I'm sure that the idea was to make her a killer heel to face Bayley, but that's simply not going to happen. Her destruction of Dana and impending destruction of Emma have sealed the deal. No matter how heelishly she behaves, Sasha is such a great performer that people get behind her, it's like Flair in the early 1980s... He could act like a total douche and people still loved him. Matter of fact, the smart move for the women's division might be to turn Charlotte and draw on the Flair history. I think she can pull off arrogant heel with a sense of entitlement pretty well. A little reshuffling of say, Tamina, Natalya, and (not sure about the fourth, Nia Jax seems like overkill, maybe Paige in the Tully Blanchard spot?) and you have a legacy Four Horsewomen stable. Gives you two strong heel stables, allows for Naomi turning back to face (which she's much better at), and lets Sasha, Bayley and Asuka cut loose as three very different but likely equally popular faces. Old Smoreslock isn't the only RSPW vet here. I still remember some guy name John coming in there to go after someone named Chad Hell I still remember back when RSPW had Marc Mero posting there. I wish the UA posted here. And that guy who worked at Subway and had goofy rspw angles. Some of the UA was decent. But 2x was an idiot racist. Last I heard he get shanked at his job and is now on disability. Subway guy I am assuming was Alex Cain AKA Chad's arch nemesis. He is doing good. RSPW still exists. But it is 10 people. 2 of whom spend all their free time trying to see who has the most posts for that month. I miss Anal Warts Kelly,Pron Wars and the best thing in RSPW history,"SIT YO HONKEY ASS DOWN!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobholly138 Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 In case you were wondering about Terry Funk recently. Yep still crazy and awesome. A brief clip of him last night at AIW Wrestling: I had no idea Funk was gonna be at the AIW show. Then had Ray Rowe showing me a pic of him and Terry after the show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
odessasteps Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 About all i remember from RSPW is "shoot vader shoot" and KJP taking over recaps from CRZ. I have a better time with rec.arts.comic.misc and rec.arts.tv.mst3k. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramsey Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 In case you were wondering about Terry Funk recently. Yep still crazy and awesome. A brief clip of him last night at AIW Wrestling: I had no idea Funk was gonna be at the AIW show. Then had Ray Rowe showing me a pic of him and Terry after the show. It's nice to see Terry still walking. Knowing how bad his knees are and the fact that he's only a year younger than Harley Race who is using walker, it's nice to see the old man mobile and insane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyMax46 Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 Funk actually hurts pretty badly after doing anything physical for a few days. I'm sure he's in adrenaline when at a show though so he can get through it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trocar Slush Weasel Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I252sKM2CY4 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattdangerously Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 Let's hope he didn't reinjure himself getting to the ring. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SorceressKnight Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 I think it has more to do with the antihero being more over than ever in popular culture. People don't cheer or boo characters/wrestlers because of where they fall on the good/evil spectrum, they get behind them based on how cool or interesting they are. Just look at Breaking Bad, Sons of Anarchy, and other popular shows out there. The main characters who are technically the protagonists are typically awful people, yet the creative process has made them cool or put them in situations where fans want to see them succeed. That carries over to wrestling as well - clean cut, athletic go-getters are boring and stale. Cheering for the popular high school jock is no fun, especially when said character does the exact same schtick week in and week out. Even more than the anti-hero, it seems less like it's even "how cool or interesting" they are, and how with a lot of geek culture, the result is "what about ME?" more than anything. With the men, it seems less on "how cool or interesting they are", and as said "If I can't be the one who's at the top of the heap, then who's the closest TO me that I can make the star instead?" As such, you get male wrestlers who need to be one of us- usually giving indy wrestlers the inside track, since "I followed this person from the shindies and the backyards- I'M PART OF THIS!" will always be the inside track. Female wrestlers can have it from the indies, but "she really, really seems like she'd actually date me!" is more important in that level. Either way, it is less like people cheer or boo because of their character, good, evil, cool, interesting, but because they're really cheering for themselves, and only themselves, and the only way to satisfy them is giving THEM, and only them, full control of WWE behind the scenes and all glory onscreen...and then, everyone else in the world would just complain about why THAT person got it and not them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts