GuerrillaMonsoon Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 Would WCW have signed Shawn at that point whilst being a completely out of ring competitor? I suppose Shawn turning up at the end of Mayhem where Bret wins the title would have been pretty interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyWhioux Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 46 minutes ago, RolandTHTG said: Would WCW have signed Shawn at that point whilst being a completely out of ring competitor? I suppose Shawn turning up at the end of Mayhem where Bret wins the title would have been pretty interesting. I figure if they were willing to pay Rick Rude just to talk for people who didn't even need a designated talker, they'd have been willing to pay Shawn Michaels to do the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyWhioux Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 I am probably showing my old long-standing fan bias, but the more I think about it the more I imagine the WWF as being better off if HBK were excised from the timeline in late 1995. Assuming he goes away to be a trainer/open a school like he ended up doing instead of staying on as a road agent, you have the complete demise of The Kliq once Hall and Nash's contracts are up. Meaning: Vince has no option but to utterly depend on Bret. We get more of Bret in 96. As mentioned earlier, this means Vader is never buried at Summerslam 96 and stays over as a monster Title Contender and allows for Bret and Vader to take turns with the WWF championship until Austin is ready, and there's a good chance Austin actually wins the belt from Bret at WM13 (and if he's champ, maybe he doesn't wrestle Owen at Summerslam 97, and just think of the possibilities then). Hunter quite possibly never recovers from being The Whipping Boy for all The Kliq's sins, and given what he's gone on to do this is some huge Butterfly Effect Territory. Or maybe he's clever enough to make a new Right Set Of Friends and follows a similar path (Hunter/Owen as a tag team?) Does Bam Bam stay on now? Or at least, get convinced to come back when he sees the kliq is over? Imagine the Vader/BamBam team happening stateside. Alternately, more Bret/BamBam matches (yay), or even Bam Bam as the "bounty hunter" hired by Evil Mr. McMahon to rid him of his turbulent champion Stone Cold Steve (you know how Vince loves his real life day job gimmicks) Bikertaker starts a year or two early as well if/when he takes time off to sell "resigning in protest" when the Montreal Screwjob, if it happens at all, happens in Bret's Favor. Kane basically never happens, scrapped as a sacrifice to sell the authenticity of Undertaker's time off ("see? UT wasn't supposed to really go away, he was set to feud with his brother") one downside is we wouldn't get Sid winning the belt at Series96 and fistbumping Vladimir this way. 1 hour ago, RolandTHTG said: Would WCW have signed Shawn at that point whilst being a completely out of ring competitor? I suppose Shawn turning up at the end of Mayhem where Bret wins the title would have been pretty interesting. Is Bret/Shawn even as much of an issue as it is, if HBK retires before Bret ever drops the belt to him? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Cincinnati Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 Hunter is probably shrewd enough politically to have gotten ahead regardless. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AxB Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 Just imagine if the Montreal Screwjob was an old school double cross, with Ken Shamrock offering Bret the easy way or the hard way. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.H. Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 9 minutes ago, AxB said: Just imagine if the Montreal Screwjob was an old school double cross, with Ken Shamrock offering Bret the easy way or the hard way. I remained stunned that Vince didn't getthe belt on Shamrock to transition to Stone Cold. Having a legit guy be your champ putting on good matches with the right guys would've been great. We'd get more Shamrock/Vader, Shamrock/Taker and a few others (Shamrock/Mankind perhaps?) to set-up Shamrock/Austin, which is a match I would've dug I think. James Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Cincinnati Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 What if: Brawl For All never happened? How far does a Dr Death push really get in 1998? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuerrillaMonsoon Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 What if Foley died from being thrown off HIAC? Would it have been possible Taker sees jail time for manslaughter? Does any momentum WWF have in turning the tide in the ratings war dissipate as they end up fighting another expensive legal battle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.H. Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 34 minutes ago, West Newbury Bad Boy said: What if: Brawl For All never happened? How far does a Dr Death push really get in 1998? IC title at best, no way Austin can take Dr. Death's suplexes with that neck James 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister TV Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 9 hours ago, RolandTHTG said: What if Foley died from being thrown off HIAC? Would it have been possible Taker sees jail time for manslaughter? Does any momentum WWF have in turning the tide in the ratings war dissipate as they end up fighting another expensive legal battle? If Foley died the WWF would have gone out of business, I’ve always felt they were able to survive the Owen Hart tragedy due to it not being shown on the broadcast and because it was a pre-match “stunt” gone wrong. If Foley misses his mark and hits the concrete, hits the ring barrier, gets impaled by a piece of the table or lands in the front row it’s over for the WWF. The entire ppv audience would have seen it and most would have been recording it, news outlets would have covered it harder than Owen because they have footage of it and it was part of the match, the outcry and disgust by fans and the general public would have been to much for the PR firm the McMahon’s hired to spin it away. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 1 hour ago, J.H. said: I remained stunned that Vince didn't getthe belt on Shamrock to transition to Stone Cold. Having a legit guy be your champ putting on good matches with the right guys would've been great. We'd get more Shamrock/Vader, Shamrock/Taker and a few others (Shamrock/Mankind perhaps?) to set-up Shamrock/Austin, which is a match I would've dug I think. James To be fair, Ken Shamrock is insane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuerrillaMonsoon Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 Yeah, in hindsight, why they went with Dude Love instead of Shamrock for Austin's first title program was strange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SorceressKnight Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 3 hours ago, BobbyWhioux said: I am probably showing my old long-standing fan bias, but the more I think about it the more I imagine the WWF as being better off if HBK were excised from the timeline in late 1995. Assuming he goes away to be a trainer/open a school like he ended up doing instead of staying on as a road agent, you have the complete demise of The Kliq once Hall and Nash's contracts are up. Meaning: Vince has no option but to utterly depend on Bret. We get more of Bret in 96. As mentioned earlier, this means Vader is never buried at Summerslam 96 and stays over as a monster Title Contender and allows for Bret and Vader to take turns with the WWF championship until Austin is ready, and there's a good chance Austin actually wins the belt from Bret at WM13 (and if he's champ, maybe he doesn't wrestle Owen at Summerslam 97, and just think of the possibilities then). Hunter quite possibly never recovers from being The Whipping Boy for all The Kliq's sins, and given what he's gone on to do this is some huge Butterfly Effect Territory. Or maybe he's clever enough to make a new Right Set Of Friends and follows a similar path (Hunter/Owen as a tag team?) Honestly, that could also have some other question marks there. Austin wasn't truly ready in 1997, but needed a year to succeed in 1998. In 1998 with Shawn, he was about to retire and still needed to be convinced to do the job as it was. Shawn in 1998, with Bret Hart, who'd fit as a Corporate Champion for Vince, is under a 20 year contract- and Bret has reason to not want to work with Austin after the Owen thing- would be a change alone as it is. Then, you add the fact that Bret took The Rock under his wing and was very good friends with him (a big reason Rock refused the Shawn match for so long), and you also have the real chance Austin is bypassed and Bret passes the torch to The Rock earlier than before instead, which changes a lot (Rock wouldn't be truly ready himself until 1999). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister TV Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 10 hours ago, J.H. said: I remained stunned that Vince didn't getthe belt on Shamrock to transition to Stone Cold. Having a legit guy be your champ putting on good matches with the right guys would've been great. We'd get more Shamrock/Vader, Shamrock/Taker and a few others (Shamrock/Mankind perhaps?) to set-up Shamrock/Austin, which is a match I would've dug I think. James Shamrock was never over enough to put the belt on even short term and honestly not many people cared about "legit" credentials back then or really ever. He was slotted in the right spot during most of his run in the WWF. Vince was going to sour on Vader no matter what, he reminded him of his step-father, had weight issues and no one on the roster really liked working with him. Vince is going to audible and go with Sid in that spot with or without Shawn's fit following SummerSlam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olythegreat89 Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 What if Pillman never gets in the car accident in 96? Would he be in the IC picture or automatically put in a main event program with HBK? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyWhioux Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 Pillman was smart enough to avoid being killed off by Hogan in the doomsday cage thingy. I think he would have been smart enough to recognize a world title run against 96 HBK was a similar kiss of death. The “how to cut a promo” thread would be filled with Pillman on HBK content, though EDITING TO ADD: also, while I can't be certain Pillman was prescient enough to know Austin (rather than HBK) was where the money would be and position himself accordingly, he was already involved in Austin's orbit as he was and would've been cagey enough to make sure he didn't leave it once Austin started to become Austin [and Austin did not seem to be averse to doing business with him]. Pillman would've made a dischordant "Corporate Champ" to be sure but they did hype him up when he came in as having a contract that was special so the avenue was there. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casey Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 17 hours ago, SorceressKnight said: Honestly, that could also have some other question marks there. Austin wasn't truly ready in 1997, but needed a year to succeed in 1998. In 1998 with Shawn, he was about to retire and still needed to be convinced to do the job as it was. Shawn in 1998, with Bret Hart, who'd fit as a Corporate Champion for Vince, is under a 20 year contract- and Bret has reason to not want to work with Austin after the Owen thing- would be a change alone as it is. Then, you add the fact that Bret took The Rock under his wing and was very good friends with him (a big reason Rock refused the Shawn match for so long), and you also have the real chance Austin is bypassed and Bret passes the torch to The Rock earlier than before instead, which changes a lot (Rock wouldn't be truly ready himself until 1999). didn't Bret offer to drop the title to Austin (and a few others) shortly before Montreal? That would seem to indicate that Bret wasn't that opposed to working with Austin, even though he didn't like Owen due to the injury at SummerSlam that year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Great ML Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 He would have dropped it to anyone except Michaels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curt McGirt Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 Vader reminded Vince of his stepdad? Uh... what? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuerrillaMonsoon Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 Particularly triggering episode of Boy Meets World 1 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyWhioux Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 18 minutes ago, RolandTHTG said: Particularly triggering episode of Boy Meets World another case of "the wrong guy" getting that mainstream/crossover/outside-the-wrestling-bubble appeal that Vince is otherwise so starved for... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MORELOCK Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 I wouldn't really call that a what-if. A weekly show with all those people actually did happen, it was just called FCW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Web Conn Posted February 21, 2019 Author Share Posted February 21, 2019 If Sting hadn't had the personal problems that he had in 96/97 and had been in the gym for 2-3 hours a day 6 days a week when he wasn't at Nitro was jacked to the gills in the best shape of his life, clear headed, present and engaged that day would Hogan have lost clean to him in the middle of the ring or would he have found another excuse? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jiji Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 Brother isn't over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuerrillaMonsoon Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 "If I'm going to put him over, I'd rather he be 8 foot tall and worth 100 million dollars, like a basketball player. Eric, can we book Shaq?" 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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