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Posted

The coffin match didn't need the outside stuff.  If they had to do it I would have ditched the ether rag.  The convenient mound to flip off of was preposterous but we laughed.  Once they got in the arena I enjoyed the match.  Gabe is whatever but he shines in these environments and him and Darby trying to out-derange each other kind of worked for me.  Finish could have been different since Darby's done that in the past but for what they were doing I liked it.

I did like Swerve's promo wanting power but the timing of it all is way, way too sudden.  The promo was fine to have last night but the match should not be next week.  That's something you need to have marinate for at least a couple weeks and give both sides a chance to hype it up.  As is no matter who wins it'll be so jarring.  If I had to pick for something that sudden I'd say let Kenny win, he gets his shot and Swerve finds a way to fuck him over.  I will say though I'm glad Nana dropped the dancing and hope that sticks.  If Swerve is to be dangerous he shouldn't have things that will get people to cheer.  I would also cut the "Who's house?" line but I can see how that's to build the ego.

Aside from all that Mina/Marina was fun and was happy Mina won.  Speedball/Davis was also highly enjoyable.  Despite the crowd being shit and some stuff not being the best there were things to enjoy from the show.

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Posted
1 hour ago, Gorman said:

Low blows and pokes to the eye would be banned moves that would be okay in this match. 

 

I do think Bryan is right that a no holds barred match should ban weapon shots, and keep the rules of wrestling, minus illegal holds like those.  

Mina could still win by using ringpost figure-4 (a hold , technically outside the ring so countout rules could apply, though you could argue she's partially in the ring so it doesn't), followed by getting in the ring and figure-4 again for the tapout.

You'd still have rope breaks, countouts, interference leading to DQs, but any unarmed manuever is legal.

 

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Posted

Josh Alexander may have suffered a legit knee injury during the Collision tapings 

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Posted
11 hours ago, SovietShooter said:

Wasn't really feeling this Dynamite. 

After the ridiculousness of the Darby/Kidd car flipping, I was kinda done. 

Yeah this just felt drawn out in a bad way to me. Ospreay covered in tape seems to say he's not actually ready to wrestle again. The brawl was good, he and PAC should have a good match. Barely remember the Moxley/Yuta match. Then the WAAAAY TOOO FUCKING LONG coffin match. MJF's promo was actually the first one of his I liked. I found myself dozing off during the Speedball/Bailey match, which didn't deserve it, and gave up when I saw the "no holds barred" match was next. 

People who were in Fresno said the crowd was better then it sounded. 

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Posted

Go back and watch Speedball/Davis and the NHB, they're worth it and did get some heat. Unlike the coffin match which was pin-drop. As soon as they busted out the straightjacket I was done. There are some things that are too stupid even for wrestling. 

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Posted (edited)
12 hours ago, SovietShooter said:

Wasn't really feeling this Dynamite. 

After the ridiculousness of the Darby/Kidd car flipping, I was kinda done. 

Jack Perry getting a squirrel to eat out of his hand got a chuckle from me.  Speedball vs Davis was solid as hell.  Marina vs Mina was pretty good, but didn't need the weapons. 

TANGENT: How can you have a "no holds barred" match, when the promotion doesn't have any "banned" holds/moves?

 

1 hour ago, JLSigman said:

Yeah this just felt drawn out in a bad way to me. Ospreay covered in tape seems to say he's not actually ready to wrestle again. The brawl was good, he and PAC should have a good match. Barely remember the Moxley/Yuta match. Then the WAAAAY TOOO FUCKING LONG coffin match. MJF's promo was actually the first one of his I liked. I found myself dozing off during the Speedball/Bailey match, which didn't deserve it, and gave up when I saw the "no holds barred" match was next. 

People who were in Fresno said the crowd was better then it sounded. 

I skipped this show and it sounds like I did right to. I really don't like Will Ospreay, the Young Bucks, Jack Perry and Gabe Kidd without wishing to sound like a broken record. Fuck 'em.

Edited by The Natural
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Posted
12 hours ago, Curt McGirt said:

DEADEST. CROWD. EVER. 

TK should have done a reverse of what he did in I think Houston, and go out and tell Fresno they were never coming back. 

But yeah this was crap too, as well. The only good stuff was the absurdly stiff Speedball/Mark Davis match where pretty much any offensive exchange could have credibly ended the match, and the Mina/Marina match where Marina was mean as hell and said "I don't need no barbed wire" and "DO BETTER", and Mina ate shit on the table bump but she still won and she cried and it was awesome. 

The rest of it? Let's see... Jurassic Express' corny-ass bus. A cinematic part in a deathmatch where at least one guy should have actually died. The Young Bucks whining. Roppongi Vice in a main event. Going over-time just so people could talk. But the nadir was Swerve starting a "who's the boss" angle, when AEW has firmly NEVER had any of that bullshit in their booking. Like, ever. Fuck all that.

EDIT: Oh there was one other good thing! Juicey Boy cosplaying Tenryu. Man, I bet he could rock one hell of a punch perm.

Basically all of this. I FFWD through the Jurassic Express segment, life is too short for me to watch a Jack Perry promo. The Darby-Kidd segment was Russo WCW-level wrestlecrap. The Swerve-Ospreay tag angle against the Bucks, who were abusing their EVP power, was fine and should have been the end of any kind of EVP references moving forward. Relatedly, isn’t Swerve technically already an EVP as a result of that match? I didn’t watch the main event as I have no time for even more of the Young Bucks California nostalgia tour or Jack Perry wrestling.

Davis-Speedball was stiff and by far the greatest match, and also there was a point where Davis’s combination of moves credibly should’ve ended the match. Also, Davis has some killer singles power moves.

Marina-Mina demonstrated that Toni was doing a miracle carry job in that feud, as we revert to Marina doing multiple sloppy, dangerous judo hip throws and botching a table spot that they are very lucky didn’t immediately end the match with a concussion or neck damage for Mina. People screaming for Marina to have the title because of her aura are really dumb.

Ospreay vs. 10 years ago Ospreay was fun, Vanilla baby is really smooth. Ospreay did hold back some comparatively. I hope he’s not coming back too soon.

The opening tag match was also good, nice to see more of Wheeler on offense. He’s been treated a little too much as comic relief recently.

All that said, the Death Riders angle has gotten so confusing and in general I think AEW has been doing too many face/heel turns and angles all at once and it’s muddling the storytelling.

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Posted
2 minutes ago, JLowe said:

Basically all of this. I FFWD through the Jurassic Express segment, life is too short for me to watch a Jack Perry promo. The Darby-Kidd segment was Russo WCW-level wrestlecrap. The Swerve-Ospreay tag angle against the Bucks, who were abusing their EVP power, was fine and should have been the end of any kind of EVP references moving forward. Relatedly, isn’t Swerve technically already an EVP as a result of that match? I didn’t watch the main event as I have no time for even more of the Young Bucks California nostalgia tour or Jack Perry wrestling.

Davis-Speedball was stiff and by far the greatest match, and also there was a point where Davis’s combination of moves credibly should’ve ended the match. Also, Davis has some killer singles power moves.

Marina-Mina demonstrated that Toni was doing a miracle carry job in that feud, as we revert to Marina doing multiple sloppy, dangerous judo hip throws and botching a table spot that they are very lucky didn’t immediately end the match with a concussion or neck damage for Mina. People screaming for Marina to have the title because of her aura are really dumb.

Ospreay vs. 10 years ago Ospreay was fun, Vanilla baby is really smooth. Ospreay did hold back some comparatively. I hope he’s not coming back too soon.

The opening tag match was also good, nice to see more of Wheeler on offense. He’s been treated a little too much as comic relief recently.

All that said, the Death Riders angle has gotten so confusing and in general I think AEW has been doing too many face/heel turns and angles all at once and it’s muddling the storytelling.

Thanks for reminding me about Jack Perry. Add him to Will Ospreay, the Young Bucks and Gabe Kidd.

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Posted
1 hour ago, Jenalysis said:

 

I do think Bryan is right that a no holds barred match should ban weapon shots, and keep the rules of wrestling, minus illegal holds like those.  

Mina could still win by using ringpost figure-4 (a hold , technically outside the ring so countout rules could apply, though you could argue she's partially in the ring so it doesn't), followed by getting in the ring and figure-4 again for the tapout.

You'd still have rope breaks, countouts, interference leading to DQs, but any unarmed manuever is legal.

 

They can never decide what NHB means. I guess they want to ban weapons to distinguish from a street fight/No DQ. But why would they not allow rope breaks. The hold isn’t barred, it’s just still subject to a rope break. Choke someone, fine, but they can break the hold like normal.

I actually forgot that was a no hold barred match because the only things added were the weird champagne bottle spots and a badly botched table spot, which happens in most matches.

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Posted
2 minutes ago, JLowe said:

Relatedly, isn’t Swerve technically already an EVP as a result of that match?

No, that match wasn't "Winners become EVPs", it was "Young Bucks give up their EVP powers if the lose". Which is probably why Swerve was explicit that this time, he wasn't just asking for Omega to give up his EVP power; he wanted to get the power himself if he won.

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Posted
1 minute ago, JLowe said:

They can never decide what NHB means. I guess they want to ban weapons to distinguish from a street fight/No DQ.

I don't know. I loved it when Danielson said that, because in my opinion wrestling absolutely should have matches with different gradations of what's allowed - it enables better opportunities for escalation. But in my forty years of watching wrestling, I don't believe there's ever been a distinction between "No holds barred", "No disqualification", or "Street fight" (or any number of other terms).

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Posted
27 minutes ago, JLowe said:

there was a point where Davis’s combination of moves credibly should’ve ended the match.

Yeah, I mean credibly it could have ended at any time cuz they were so stiff, but you know when they hit the line and he should have got the pinfall. But they had to go a little longer to let Speedball win. I really don't wanna complain though because that match was the shit. 

Must admit that I did not catch the first half hour or so but what I heard of it wasn't earth shattering. 

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Posted (edited)

Random notes:

Edge is an old guy on steroids and is built like a golf tee.  He needs to burn every pair of skinny jeans he owns.

HOLEEEEEEEE FUUUUCK Mina almost died.

Mark Davis is low key one of the best workers in AEW.  His selling alone is like nobody else's...like a still dangerous wounded animal.  He's fucking GREAT.  He also likes Run the Jewels.  A+ dude all around.

Swerve becoming EVP and abusing his power, then winning the world title because of it, plays right into my "Hangman goes back on his word because WE NEED HIM TO" story.

Yeah, Okada shading Takeshita every chance he gets is amazing.  He probably ends his lovemaking with "I lasted a good 10 minutes....UNLIKE TAKESHITA!"

Swapping out "FATHER" for "ASSHOLE" on Christian's tron is tremendous and got a LOL out of me.

Danielson and Excalibur frantically trying to get the Storm storyline straight during Ospreay's entrance was hilarious.  

Edited by Technico Support
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Posted

I was worried about burnout (equalling displeasure) going in. I was also worried about Will Ospreay. I liked the Blake Christian match, but don't like the feeling that Ospreay is back too soon. Danielson mentioning Will's surgery being worse than what his was, "and he's back sooner", didn't help. I liked the post match promo and brawl with the Death Riders. Looking forward to the Pac match (sorta). Ospreay-Pac brawled beautifully. Mox/Yuta-Ace/Juice was a solid TV match. Tenryu Juice is a far better look than 80s jobber Juice. Oh man, that Kenny Omega promo was so corny. I love Kenny, but they needed a second, less earnest, take. The Kidd-Allin 'cinematic' portion was ridiculous. I never care for criminal activity treated as just another wrestling spot or angle. It's as lame as when a wrestler says "I'm gonna KILL you in that match". Stretching the suspension of disbelief oughtta be given a little more thought in AEDub. The actual match was ridiculous too, but they admirably fought thru. I'm all for Darby challenging MJF for a TV match! Jack Perry goes for 'comedy' and lands it slightly better than his recent cornball 'doing it for my family' melodrama whilst brandishing a fucking knife. I can't say I'm a fan of this Jurassic BTE BS. Goddamn, Swerve's promos are feeling like the aforementioned classic Edge monologues. Swerve needs to cut down these clumsy promos. Ugh, a match to challenge for an EVP Title and the lame Cody stip all in one week. Pretty solid Mike Bailey promo. Weird set-up from Renee to get Speedball to look at the camera, but it kinda worked. This wasn't a great promo, but it showed that Bailey has progressed a little. It also suggested to me he's working to figure out his mic game. That could be huge asset. Nice to see the Bailey-Davis match getting love. Really fun match all the way thru. I agree it's hard sometimes seeing Davis kill ppl with stuff for 2. Deserved and big win for Speedball. Good post match MJF promo from the PPV. I liked what I caught of Shafir-Shirikawa. Sloppy to be sure, but a bit gnarly in a fun way. I like Mina getting a win here. Fun Andrade/Callis/Cruz promo. Andrade is looking the part in his promos, which is not something that always happens in (sometimes slobby) AEW. Okada/Trent/Rocky-Bucks/Perry was very solid throughout. RPG haven't really been positioned to be working main events, but I am a fan. The Bucks are always cheesewhiz as babyfaces, but I thought the Cope/Cage/FTR segment was fine. They certainly weren't rambling like Strickland earlier. Even with the misses, this episode still hit for me. Watching on tape Delay, being able to skim break spots, etc. greatly elevates this show for me. Or allows me to have more of a sense of humour than if I was begrudging thru commercials after a segment I didn't like. And to ffwd Swerve drippiness. I didn't end up having much burnout watching this. Minimizing my wrestling intake to AEW and a few random NJPW/Indie, etc. shows has helped me avoid feeling burnout, but AEDub PPV weeks are certainly challenging.

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Posted
5 hours ago, tbarrie said:

No, that match wasn't "Winners become EVPs", it was "Young Bucks give up their EVP powers if the lose". Which is probably why Swerve was explicit that this time, he wasn't just asking for Omega to give up his EVP power; he wanted to get the power himself if he won.

Thanks, I thought at one point they did a promo acting like they would get their positions.

Posted

I feel like Shafir v Shirakawa should have been stopped as a no-contest after that table bump. 

I kind of got distracted and didn't pay as much attention to a lot of stuff as it may've deserved. (My usual Wed voice chat was pretty busy.) 

Finishing the main by 9pm but still doing a 10+ minute overrun was a poor choice. That said, we all fuckin lost it at Christian's new big screen.

Dug the main. 

Book Bang Bang vs Dogs for the most irritating Bullet Club rebrand, losers get an even worse new name.

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Posted (edited)

I did see what happened to Mina Shirakawa. Ate all floor and no table to break her fall. Reminded me of Julia Hart's when she nearly killed herself.

Edited by The Natural
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Posted
4 hours ago, Technico Support said:

Swerve becoming EVP and abusing his power

The only way this angle will be any good is if he just awards himself the belt.

Going back and watching the start:

I gotta bitch about that dude in the front row with the mohawk and Turnstile shirt, dude it's either one or the other. Turnstile is "punk" but not actual PUNK. Not foot-tall Wattie-from-Exploited mohawk punk. Lose one. (I admit I am saying this because I do not like Turnstile)

Blake Christian actually did some nice basic work on the neck. I'm down for someone just twisting someone else's head or putting their foot on the back of the neck instead of a sliced bread (which they did those anyway). For some reason I don't think security pulling backwards on PAC's arms in the Brutalizer is very smart 😄

That was alright. I'll go ahead and watch the tag and the two good matches again. 

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Posted
4 hours ago, Technico Support said:

Swerve becoming EVP and abusing his power, then winning the world title because of it, plays right into my "Hangman goes back on his word because WE NEED HIM TO" story.

Or, EVP Champ Swerve wants to get his hands on Hangman so bad that he lifts the ban. 

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Posted

That Darby-Kidd match was hilarious. Darby trying to drive into Gabe with his crapmobile. The ether and locking him in the trunk to drive into a hill about 20 feet away was hysterical. It was just missing Darby rolling out of the car and exclaiming "It jumped out right in front of me!" Gabe Kidd having to play dead for an interminable length of time, complete with Darby not quite fascinating the straightjacket on Kidd so Kidd had to pretend like he couldn't take it off for the rest of the match (Knowing what we know of Kidd...he might have struggled with the mechanics of a t-shirt so maybe it wasn't that far-fetched). I also greatly enjoyed Kidd saying something like "Making good memories" as if he was a Batman villain trying to show how crazy he was. Also the "Pushing Up Daisies" thing on the inside of the coffin was so silly, but even funnier when he turned the coffin around late in the match and some guy in the crowd reads it outloud at an extraordinary volume: "PUSHING UP DAISIES!" Also, why did the cameras keep focusing on that one knothole in the coffin? They zoomed in on it 2-3 times, were we supposed to see something, was Gabe supposed to stick something through. It was weird.

Mina-Marina was all right. The NHB stip seemed to only be there to give Mina any chance of winning. Enjoyed Maring throwing her socks at the announcers.

Liked Davis-Speedball. 

The Jurassic Bus thing was weird. Like Jungle Boy carrying the knife is supposed to make the goofy Jungle Boy moniker more menacing, but then they make a vignette where he feeds squirrels and makes his one-armed friend drive his bus?! Also the fact that they left the cameras on Perry and the Bucks an extra 3-4 seconds too long while they stood there looking...serious (?!) gave it a Werner Herzog-esque awkwardness to the proceedings.

I think my biggest beef with AEW storytelling is that guys feud, try to get the other fired/murdered and then turn and bury all that in the past. Like Perry and the Bucks hated each other, were trying to ruin each others careers, then all of a sudden "Two of my oldest friends in the business!" Moxley is cruel, mean and trying to destroy this company, then he's on commentary and Tony is cracking jokes with him. He tries to repeatedly kill Darby Allin but he wins a few matches in that tournament, and he's back to being cheered. Now Ospreay's back, and you're supposed to boo him again. I know it's wrestling, but i'd just like some consitency and not guys bouncing back and forth from blood feuds to alliances.

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Posted (edited)

Re: Swerve just removing the stipulation, that would make sense. 

I like how we're all fantasy booking this like Swerve already won the match. That's how bad introducing that angle is, it just gives away the winner.

Tenryu Juice is so great. Chops, punches, stuff powerbomb, the gear. If Moxley had started hitting him with overhand chops I would have lost it. He even ate a cutter like Tenryu used to do from Mutoh! 

Caley brings up a great point with Moxley, we really don't know how we should take him. Read @Matt D's stuff on Segunda about this. It seems kinda important to the booking of... everything.

Edited by Curt McGirt
Posted
12 hours ago, Jenalysis said:

 

I do think Bryan is right that a no holds barred match should ban weapon shots, and keep the rules of wrestling, minus illegal holds like those. 

You'd still have rope breaks, countouts, interference leading to DQs, but any unarmed manuever is legal.

 

That's pretty much how old WWWF Texas Death matches were.

Posted
3 hours ago, caley said:

The Jurassic Bus thing was weird. Like Jungle Boy carrying the knife is supposed to make the goofy Jungle Boy moniker more menacing, but then they make a vignette where he feeds squirrels and makes his one-armed friend drive his bus?! Also the fact that they left the cameras on Perry and the Bucks an extra 3-4 seconds too long while they stood there looking...serious (?!) gave it a Werner Herzog-esque awkwardness to the proceedings.

 

the only upside to the bus is a couple segments later when Okada declared it "isn't cool"

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