FORBIDDEN DOOR IV - 8/24/2025

[Go2Sleep]

I think the only option to take down Toni at this point is heel Stat. She'd make the DR interesting again too, especially if they position her as the centerpiece.

I wouldn't mind that at Full Gear or World's End with the TOM horror cheese idea first. Toni and Thekla could do a great straight match, but the real money is Toni getting Alex and Jamie together to go after all 3 in a Hardy Compound style match.

[Steventon]

Just got round to watching. Not much to add to what others have already said other than:

- Bozilla is going to be a star. Give me more Big Women to kick ass. 

- They have once again bodged Wardlow immediately with this return. Coming in to beat up Prince Nana when Swerve is already down? Hardly an impressive moment. Then he gets over-shadowed by Takeshita a minute later. The John Callis Family seems to be where they house all the mid card and JTTS heels who they have no direction for (+ Fletcher + Takeshita).

- Having Ricochet and GOA, a heel group, cost The Hurt Syndicate, another heel group, the belts certainly was a choice. If there is no truth to the 'Hurt Syndicate don't want to job' talk then they're doing a bad job of arguing against it

- There is a Will Ospreay vs Gabe Kidd AEW World Title match headlining a major UK show at some point in the next 2-3 years, or Tony doesn't take open goals

 

[Brandon Bones]

In a world where AEW PPVs are almost routinely called “Greatest of All Time”.  This time around I guess I will have to settle for merely fantastic.

Loved: Bryan on commentary.  Bozilla having a great debut.  Toni being on a streak of amazing.  And that cage reminding me of the ROH Cage of Death vs. CZW from 06.  AEW crowds.  Might have been the best Zero Hour ever.  Moné well spent.
 

Didn’t love: The finish of Hanger/MJF.  Still a killer match.  Both guys rule in ring.

[NoFistsJustFlips]

The problem with the Bayne as Drago scenario is that she already got beat. Drago didnt come in and lose a fall to Rocky then come back a few months later as an unstoppable murder monster.

The unstoppable murder monster squash idea is a good idea and good way to shake up the division for a bit. But for that beat to work as well as Rocky, has to be someone new thats debuting as the unstoppable murder monster ala Drago.

[RazorbladeKiss87]

23 hours ago, The Natural said:

Who do we think ends Timeless Toni Storm's AEW Women's World Championship reign? I'd be happy with one of: Jamie Hayter, Kris Statlander or Willow Nightingale. That's probably my order of preference as well.

Not Willow. The person who beats Toni will be a big heel and I just don't think that's right for Willow yet.

Commentary was great. I like that you can tell the commentators are having fun. Dragon was great. Walker from NJPW English broadcasts was great too. I wish he was on a product I watched. 

At one point Callis made me spit out my drink. Talking about Fletcher he says "I like my men bred...to win" with the perfect pause.  They know what they're doing.  

[SovietShooter]

9 hours ago, RazorbladeKiss87 said:

The person who beats Toni will be a big heel and I just don't think that's right for Willow yet.

Willow is Ricky Steamboat. She should never ever turn heel. 

Yeah, at this point Toni either makes someone a star when they beat her, or it has to be Stat. Give me heel Stat, with Willow chasing her. 

[Steventon]

Eh, Stat's had her opportunities and hasn't impressed enough to have another pop at being the top dog in what is a roster with a handful or two of more talented, charismatic and over workers. She's hit her ceiling and been overtaken by Athena, Hayter, Bayne, Mone, Shirakawa, Thekla, Willow and even Anna Jay, Skye Blue and Julia Hart.

[SovietShooter]

2 hours ago, Steventon said:

Eh, Stat's had her opportunities and hasn't impressed enough to have another pop at being the top dog in what is a roster with a handful or two of more talented, charismatic and over workers. She's hit her ceiling and been overtaken by Athena, Hayter, Bayne, Mone, Shirakawa, Thekla, Willow and even Anna Jay, Skye Blue and Julia Hart.

Respectfully, I disagree. 

[matwarz]

Watching two guys I have at various points considered the best in the world have a great pro-wrestling match makes me happy. Then throw in respect to two legends I grew up watching every Saturday afternoon; we are very lucky to have AEW. 

[ExcellenceofAirPollution]

5 hours ago, Steventon said:

Eh, Stat's had her opportunities and hasn't impressed enough to have another pop at being the top dog in what is a roster with a handful or two of more talented, charismatic and over workers. She's hit her ceiling and been overtaken by Athena, Hayter, Bayne, Mone, Shirakawa, Thekla, Willow and even Anna Jay, Skye Blue and Julia Hart.

More talented?  Stat is the glue in all the multi-women matches she's in.  Watch the 4 way from last week or the match on Zero Hero, she holds those things together.  She's one of the best workers and a great base for the smaller women.  She's also been consistently over despite getting jerked around by the booking.  I guess charisma is subjective but she's always had it IMO

Stat is in the tier with Willow, Hayter and Bayne.  Right below Toni, Mone and Athena but would be a totally credible champ with a push, which hopefully they pull the trigger on with the Death Riders stuff

They do have a deep, talented women's roster now which is why I like adding tag titles, and think any talk of getting rid of the TBS title is silly.  That's been one of the better booked belts in the promotion!!  I also think if they ever feel the need to add any more programming it should be a one hour or 90 minute women's show.  Even if it's youtube or whatever taped on a soundstage a lot of them have potential but still need more reps.  Aminata is one, she's got worlds of potential but still very raw.  Harley Cameron is another one you didn't mention.  Lots of charisma, hard worker...never going to get enough ring time at this rate.  Anna Jay went to Japan....looked like she might be improving....she's right back where she was looking like more or less the same wrestler she was 3-4 years ago.  It's not that she's bad but she's still not very good after all these years

 

Edited August 27 by ExcellenceofAirPollution
wait what thread is this?

[SovietShooter]

9 minutes ago, ExcellenceofAirPollution said:

Stat is in the tier with Willow, Hayter and Bayne.  Right below Toni, Mone and Athena 

I resisted doing this, but now that you have...

Tier 1 - Toni, Mercedes

Tier 2 - Athena, Willow, Stat, Hayter, Shida

Tier 3 - Bayne, Thekla, Thunder Rosa, Harley

Everyone else is below this. These Tiers are based on a combo of workrate, overness, and promos.  Toni & Mercedes are kinda "god tier", both showing themselves to be generational main event drawing talents. I have Athena in the second tier simply because with most of her work being in ROH, she doesn't have the same level of exposure.  

 

[The Natural]

18 minutes ago, SovietShooter said:

I resisted doing this, but now that you have...

Tier 1 - Toni, Mercedes

Tier 2 - Athena, Willow, Stat, Hayter, Shida

Tier 3 - Bayne, Thekla, Thunder Rosa, Harley

Everyone else is below this. These Tiers are based on a combo of workrate, overness, and promos.  Toni & Mercedes are kinda "god tier", both showing themselves to be generational main event drawing talents. I have Athena in the second tier simply because with most of her work being in ROH, she doesn't have the same level of exposure.  

 

Mine's very similar.

Tier 1: Timeless Toni Storm, Mercedes Mone.

Tier 2: Athena, Willow Nightingale, Kris Statlander, Jamie Hayter, Hikaru Shida, Thunder Rosa, Serena Deeb.

Tier 3: Megan Bayne, Thekla, Harley Cameron, Julia Hart.

Thunder Rosa was borderline between 2 and 3.

Edited August 27 by The Natural

[Steventon]

1 hour ago, ExcellenceofAirPollution said:

More talented?  Stat is the glue in all the multi-women matches she's in.  Watch the 4 way from last week or the match on Zero Hero, she holds those things together.  She's one of the best workers and a great base for the smaller women.  She's also been consistently over despite getting jerked around by the booking.  I guess charisma is subjective but she's always had it IMO

Stat is in the tier with Willow, Hayter and Bayne.  Right below Toni, Mone and Athena but would be a totally credible champ with a push, which hopefully they pull the trigger on with the Death Riders stuff

They do have a deep, talented women's roster now which is why I like adding tag titles, and think any talk of getting rid of the TBS title is silly.  That's been one of the better booked belts in the promotion!!  I also think if they ever feel the need to add any more programming it should be a one hour or 90 minute women's show.  Even if it's youtube or whatever taped on a soundstage a lot of them have potential but still need more reps.  Aminata is one, she's got worlds of potential but still very raw.  Harley Cameron is another one you didn't mention.  Lots of charisma, hard worker...never going to get enough ring time at this rate.  Anna Jay went to Japan....looked like she might be improving....she's right back where she was looking like more or less the same wrestler she was 3-4 years ago.  It's not that she's bad but she's still not very good after all these years

 

I did think of Harley and Aminata but I'm not sure I could in good faith argue they are better in ring than Stat, though personally I enjoy watching them more. Totally accept I may be in the minority here, but just never been too wowed by Statlander. She's fine. Certainly not bad, very rock solid, but can't say I've ever been particularly impressed either. She had that one very good match with Mone, which was then followed up with a dud. But ultimately it's more that she's been around for years and, with the exception of the mess of a heel turn, hasn't done anything to stand out or improve her game, whereas workers like Anna Jay and Julia Hart have clearly evolved and improved over the years and are far more interesting to watch as a result. Stat unfortunately feels like she's still in the same place she was when the division was topped by Nyla Rose, Shida and Britt Baker. We have moved forward since then, for the better.

Moreover, I also think it's time to wind down the Death Riders now Moxley has been dethroned. Have him put Darby over then take some time off. Ospreay can get his revenge on Mox when he returns with or without the Death Riders. As a faction it has served it's purpose with the Mox run and has ran its course now. Claudio and Yuta can stay as a team but aren't really benefitting from being group members. Adding Stat to them would just be stale + stale = double stale

Edited August 27 by Steventon

[Niners Fan in CT]

Honestly, I would place Aminata and Thekla above Thunder Rosa at this point. 

[SovietShooter]

13 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

Honestly, I would place Aminata and Thekla above Thunder Rosa at this point. 

The thing with that is, Rosa is really over. And she still gets booked with the gravitas of being a former champion (whereas someone like Nyla Rose, is not).  Same reason why I have Shida in Tier 2 - when she is around she is treated like a big deal, she is mega over, and she can go in the ring. 

Aminata and Thekla still need a little something to move up a level. 

[Go2Sleep]

Any list that doesn't have Stat in the top tier is dead to me. She's been the rock of the AEW women's division and consistently has great matches despite not always being in a top position. I'd put her past year with the matches against Willow, Mercedes, and Megan in the same league as Toni. Toni just has much better angles and presentation leading up to her matches.

Thekla definitely has it. Only thing she's missing is a track record. While Julia and Skye have improved tremendously since day 1, they kinda feel like they've plateaued and are propped up by the cool entrance/gimmick. Thekla has been here for a couple months and already gives them that "ok shit's about to get real" aura when she gets involved.

Aminata has gotten shockingly good in the ring in a short amount of time, and is pretty close to putting it all together. It's just a matter of shaking off the jobber stink and climbing in a loaded division at this point.

[DreamBroken]

Catching up on things, not a ton to add but thought FD was another pretty great show.  Cope/Christian reunion tag was fun, Fletcher/Hiromu turned out real good, TBS 4 way was a blast. Zack/Nigel was good stuff. Brody and Bandido winning the tags was a nice surprise among the weird booking of the elimination/not elimination for the Hurt Syndicate to remain unpinned.  Okada/Swerve was pretty good.

Thought Toni/Athena started a bit slow but really picked up towards the end for an exciting closing stretch, surprised by the definitive submission finish there. Personally loved Hangman/MJF regardless of the overbooking bits, thought it was a pretty great main event title match. Lights out Cage was as wild as expected with lots of great spots and moments. Tanahashi wanting to climb the ladder was amusing, but cool to see him get the winning High Fly Flow. I'll miss Ospreay while he's out, one of my top favs. It was killing me how none of the babyfaces could climb in to the cage to save Will while Marina just climbed right on in to join the attack, but Ibushi trying to just break through it was the best.

22 hours ago, Steventon said:

Eh, Stat's had her opportunities and hasn't impressed enough to have another pop at being the top dog in what is a roster with a handful or two of more talented, charismatic and over workers. She's hit her ceiling and been overtaken by Athena, Hayter, Bayne, Mone, Shirakawa, Thekla, Willow and even Anna Jay, Skye Blue and Julia Hart.

Agreed 1000% this. Squashing Jade to end that record reign was enough and I would absolutely hate it if she was the one ending either of Toni or Mercedes' reigns, the good matches with Mercedes was plenty and feels like no need to keep going back to that.

Edited August 28 by DreamBroken

[tbarrie]

On 8/25/2025 at 8:53 PM, Casey said:

It clearly wasn’t an elimination match by the time the match started, but as others pointed out in the Dynamite thread - it was advertised that way, and even on their social media posts hyping up the match (which is how I discovered I was wrong about it being elimination, but then proven right when it wasn’t lol)

But the thing is, FTR were avoiding being tagged in, which makes no sense in a standard three-way and which kind of confused the announcers. And staying out of the match as much as you can would be good strategy if it were an elimination-style three-way. So were FTR themselves under the impression it was an elimination match? (Meaning FTR the performers, though I suppose one could argue the characters were confused by the flip-flopping elimination rule.) Or did they lay out most of the match under the assumption it was going to be elimination-style, then changed their minds too late to redo it?

[NoFistsJustFlips]

Huh? Heels staying out while the other two teams kick the shit out of each other and just breaking up pins until they find the right spot to steal the win is heel 101. Makes total sense to me.

[tbarrie]

11 hours ago, NoFistsJustFlips said:

Huh? Heels staying out while the other two teams kick the shit out of each other and just breaking up pins until they find the right spot to steal the win is heel 101. Makes total sense to me.

I mean, yes, but doing that means you're counting on having the opportunity to blind tag yourself in when the moment arises, which seems risky. And AEW has been pretty consistent about laying out tag team matches with three or more teams in such a way that the participants did everything they could to keep a member of their own team legal. (Which makes sense, because of course you can't win unless one of your team members are legal.) So seeing FTR avoid tagging in was kind of discordant, and added to the confusion regarding the stip in my opinion.

[Shartnado]

Completely random,hypothetical question here, but would you rather a) Climb the Mt. Everest OR b) Get duct taped onto a steel chair, get your already bleeding earlobe carved with a fork and then get bodyslammed WHILE still being taped to the chair?

Darby Allin: "Why not BOTH?!?"

Anyway, the main event was crazy and emotional. Bucks are really getting fucked over and it is funny! I mean getting Mmm-Bop just to mess with their heads can't be cheap! But with Swerve and Ospreay both gone for the foreseeable future, the tag match at All In now basically lived up to BOTH stipulations!

I really liked how the TBS title 4-way was laid out and it was super entertaining. 

Women's world title match was really good , but I think both Mercedes vs Athena and Storm vs Mercedes at All In were better. The suplex into a that submission hold by Athena was batshit, however!

Swerve vs Okada was good enough but you would imagine they have a better match in them. Wardlow returning was definitely a shocker.

The tag title match was very exciting but I was distracted and missed the Prickochet and Gates of Apathy interference. Brodido winning the titles was a big surprise to me!

The World title match told a crazy story and the wrestling was very strong, although I think I enjoyed their previous PPV match more. This was just so over the top overbooked, but it was probably the point. It's good that MJF may now be sidetracked by Briscoe for a few weeks or a month.

The opener ended up being very entertaining and I liked that KillSaurus took his opportunity to mess up Christian Cage and Copeland because of their previous issues, but he was also not being Sabian's friend even a little bit! So there may be a face turn in it for him yet!

Nigel vs ZSJ was terrific and I enjoyed every bit of it. Really surprised that Garcia was just being a good friend after the match.

TNT-title match was decent enough and a big win for Fletcher but it didn't really hold my attention very well. 

Plenty of inspiring stuff here, but this was just a PPV between All In and All Out!

Edited September 3 by Shartnado
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