NJPW G1 Climax XXXV.

[Niners Fan in CT]

Doesn't Takeshita have a contract in NJPW also?  I think him winning would do wonders for NJPW.  He's got the size, look and ability of a New Japan ace and he can carry the title on AEW television as well.  

[The Natural]

18 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

Doesn't Takeshita have a contract in NJPW also?  I think him winning would do wonders for NJPW.  He's got the size, look and ability of a New Japan ace and he can carry the title on AEW television as well.  

I think Konsuke Takeshita has a contract with AEW/NJPW/DDT. As you rightly note, he can be the Ace as he has the look, size and talent you need to be one. Konosuke Takeshita is one of the best wrestlers in the world.

[Doragon]

Unless plans change, Shota remains the ace they want, even if they do detours. Konosuke Takeshita would have to drop being from other companies and be NJPW only to be ace. They're sorta strict about these things. Konosuke also is not dojo NJPW Trueborn. Didn't matter much for Okada, but he was retrained in the NJPW dojo though.

If they drop Shota as Ace, then that looks bad too in the failed ace way.  Nagata was a failed ace in but a different way due to his booking and more. I don't remember if Babyface Naito was meant to actually replace Tanahashi before they went with Okada instead. 

They used "the strongest" term over ace term for Okada instead of fully taking it from Tanahashi, and demoting Tana into second place all those years ago.

I wanted Gedo gone years ago, I just don't think they would sack him yet. He seems untouchable. I think i remember Ditch from here writing about how Gedo and co can "scare" who to do what in the back, even Kidani, from reading the old puroresu pulse articles.

Edited August 16 by Doragon

[dorfus malorfus]

Maybe I'm just blinded by my disdain for this company but bringing in an outside guy who's already a main eventer in a different company and making him your ace after signing some sort of joint part-time contract sounds like yet another way to put over how disorganized and useless your booking is. I hope Evil wins just for the lolz.

[Eivion]

I've always been curious how Gedo got to be the top booker for NJPW. I know he was part of the booking team when NJPW was recovering in the late 2000s-early 2010s before Bushiroad bought, but said team was also Jado and Liger. Always thought it was odd those two seemed to drop out since it would seem more like the three of them together is what brought NJPW out of the red right before the buyout.

3 hours ago, Doragon said:

Didn't matter much for Okada, but he was retrained in the NJPW dojo though.

To be fair Okada was too young for when he started training or he would have started with NJPW.

[The Natural]

I hope Zack Sabre Jr is okay as the Avalanche Raging Fire by Konosuke Takeshita and the bump ZSJ took is one of the sickest top rope spots in years.

Edited August 17 by The Natural

[The Natural]

I properly got into NJPW in 2012 and watched every G1 Climax Final from that point. I can't watch EVIL in the final.

Edited August 17 by The Natural

[The Natural]

11 hours ago, The Natural said:

Not pushing the younger talent sooner is another knock on the booking with Kazuchika Okada/Kenny Omega/Will Ospreay leaving and Hiroshi Tanahashi/Tetsuya Naito/Kota Ibushi broken down. Took forever for Zack Sabre Jr to get the main event push last year he should have had years ago. You need to strike when the iron is hot.

I like Yota Tsuji. Yuya Uemura, Ren Narita though wish he was away from House of Torture BS, David Finlay, Ryohei Oiwa and Oleg Boltin. Shota Umino doesn't have it. Problem is the bad booking and just doesn't compare to peak NJPW still fresh in the memories: 2012-2019.

Gedo should have been replaced as head booker years ago. The fans online are really pissed at EVIL beating Hiroshi Tanahashi in his last G1 and now Yota Tsuji in the semi-final. It's inexcusable.

Putting the then IWGP Heavyweight Championship on EVIL and IWGP World Heavyweight Championship on SANADA as well. You need to build new stars but both were busts.

[The Natural]

Voicesofwrestling.com:

I have to say that watching a month-long round robin tournament, only for the one guy that I (and most other people, to be honest) didn’t want to see in the final actually make the final is a very hard pill to swallow. Unfortunately, that’s the reality we live in. The Finals of G1 Climax 35 will see EVIL battle Konosuke Takeshita. Obviously, I’m sure a lot of people (myself included) are pulling for a Takeshita win here, but with the way New Japan booking has been over the last year or so, would it really surprise anyone if they just went all in on more House of Torture heat and had EVIL win the whole thing? The only thing that’s truly a lock is that this will probably be the worst G1 Final that had a true finish (if you want to exclude the one year where the Final got cut short due to an injury to Kota Ibushi) since most of us started watching New Japan well over a decade ago. Even if Takeshita does win, I’m sure that won’t impact the House of Torture in any way (none of their other major losses have impacted them, why would EVIL losing this match be any different?). I believe I alluded to this in my last review, but I’m just going to outright say it, and join the chorus of others who’ve started to say it. New Japan needs a new booker. While Gedo is without question a Hall of Fame-level booker due to the years of success that New Japan saw under his watch, he clearly has lost his magic touch. If there’s any hope of New Japan truly getting over some fresh faces and getting back on the right track, removing Gedo as the booker is the first step that needs to be taken. As long as he remains in that spot, nothing will change.

---

I agree.

[Horangi]

The reaction from the crowd tonight is why EVIL was in this match 

Spoiler

Its a huge discourse I've seen on Reddit in particular about why HoT and EVIL in particular are pushed the way they are. EVIL is over, is possibly the top merch mover and the crowd wanted him to win badly tonight.

Match started about 60-40 EVIL, the normal bollocks drew loud boos but once that was over in the first third the crowd was very heavily pro-EVIL to the point when Takeshita won, it was a very muted polite reaction. 

People saying they won't watch this because its an EVIL match are really missing out, they got the normal shit out of the way early and then delivered a great match, one where I feel did more for EVIL than it did Take funnily enough (and this will be controversial but I felt EVIL was the better performer here). 

Ultimately, my biggest takeaways are that I hope Take wins the belt soon (KOPW probably) and then drops to Tsuji or Yuya at the Dome, and that there's money in a face EVIL (or atleast non-HoT EVIL) to be made.

 

[dorfus malorfus]

1 hour ago, Horangi said:

The reaction from the crowd tonight is why EVIL was in this match 

  Hide contents

Its a huge discourse I've seen on Reddit in particular about why HoT and EVIL in particular are pushed the way they are. EVIL is over, is possibly the top merch mover and the crowd wanted him to win badly tonight.

Match started about 60-40 EVIL, the normal bollocks drew loud boos but once that was over in the first third the crowd was very heavily pro-EVIL to the point when Takeshita won, it was a very muted polite reaction. 

People saying they won't watch this because its an EVIL match are really missing out, they got the normal shit out of the way early and then delivered a great match, one where I feel did more for EVIL than it did Take funnily enough (and this will be controversial but I felt EVIL was the better performer here). 

Ultimately, my biggest takeaways are that I hope Take wins the belt soon (KOPW probably) and then drops to Tsuji or Yuya at the Dome, and that there's money in a face EVIL (or atleast non-HoT EVIL) to be made.

 

I like this common sense take. Similarly I really enjoyed Takashi Yoshida's run in the Champion Carnival this year -- the online fans pile on the guy, but All Japan clearly recognize how over he is and I actually appreciate that when he drops the comedy (as he did in the CC) he's a low-key brilliant old school "less is more" worker. I see a close analog to that in Evil, who's obviously a very talented wrestler but has gone so overboard with the interference stuff that people are understandably averse to even trying to watch his stuff. I don't really follow New Japan and don't have any sort of quasi-religious idealism re the G1 the way a lot of people do (I also think Takeshita is another bombastic sacred cow totally lacking in substance -- we've had lots of these over the years, from Shawn Michaels to Ibushi to Ospreay)...but now I might actually check out this final. At least it promises to be something different than the big moves, finisher overkill, faux "epic" style they've been burning into the ground since 2016.

[Doragon]

Sad News

Spoiler

Evil lost.

 

[The Natural]

Spoiler

Konosuke Takeshita deservedly won G1 Climax 35 beating EVIL. Konosuke Takeshita will face the IWGP World Heavyweight Champion, currently Zack Sabre Jr at NJPW Wrestle Kingdom 20. I think it'll be ZSJ vs. Takeshita. It'll be the rubber match as ZSJ won their first ever match in this year's G1 and Takeshita the second.

 

[Ryback Hates Bullies]

Nigel beats ZSJ, then he beats Takeshita with HoT interference and becomes their new leader.

You know it makes sense.

[Niners Fan in CT]

I understand Gedo's strategy here but I completely disagree that we needed a month of EVIL and the House torturing us as fans in order for Takeshita to get over with the fans as an "outsider".   First of all,  he is a part of your company now.  He has everything you need to be the ace.  We didn't need 10+ matches of bullshit from EVIL for fans to care about Takeshita winning.  He worked his ass off in the G1 and the fans have noticed and accepted him.  

Anyway, the right guy went over and it's the best move they've made in a while.  Now don't fuck it up. 

[Niners Fan in CT]

3 hours ago, Horangi said:

The reaction from the crowd tonight is why EVIL was in this match 

  Hide contents

Its a huge discourse I've seen on Reddit in particular about why HoT and EVIL in particular are pushed the way they are. EVIL is over, is possibly the top merch mover and the crowd wanted him to win badly tonight.

Match started about 60-40 EVIL, the normal bollocks drew loud boos but once that was over in the first third the crowd was very heavily pro-EVIL to the point when Takeshita won, it was a very muted polite reaction. 

People saying they won't watch this because its an EVIL match are really missing out, they got the normal shit out of the way early and then delivered a great match, one where I feel did more for EVIL than it did Take funnily enough (and this will be controversial but I felt EVIL was the better performer here). 

Ultimately, my biggest takeaways are that I hope Take wins the belt soon (KOPW probably) and then drops to Tsuji or Yuya at the Dome, and that there's money in a face EVIL (or atleast non-HoT EVIL) to be made.

 

You must have had your TV turned down.  It was a 50/50 crowd split and every time someone came in to cheat for EVIL they were booed heavily.  FANS DONT WANT THAT BULLSHIT. 

[porksweats]

5 hours ago, Ryback Hates Bullies said:

Nigel beats ZSJ, then he beats Takeshita with HoT interference and becomes their new leader.

You know it makes sense.

You know what, that sounds great.

[Horangi]

6 hours ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

You must have had your TV turned down.  It was a 50/50 crowd split and every time someone came in to cheat for EVIL they were booed heavily.  FANS DONT WANT THAT BULLSHIT. 

Correct, a lot of the bullshit happened in the early part of the match and the crowd did boo it.  I'm thinking specifically around Narita's run-in where the crowd was cheering EVIL heavily, would boo the run in, then go back to cheering him not long after. 

The English commentary was forced to acknowledge the heavy pro-EVIL chants from the crowd. Definitely 50-50 at the start, I feel like it probably ended around 70-30 for EVIL, maybe higher. Whether we like it or not, the domestic crowd likes EVIL and it makes me wonder how much of the booing when they do their shit is "piss off we dont want this" heat or playing along with the act heat.

[dorfus malorfus]

I'm reminded of the line in that old Transformers voiceover parody from ebaum's world where Optimus tells Hot Rod that the only thing he can do to help the Transformers is "bring ME back to life to solve YOUR problems." That's how making Takeshita your new NJPW ace feels. The same way it felt when WWE brought in Cody and immediately made him their ace because they'd squandered everyone else. You don't develop new talent and and you abandon your existing talent so you pivot with the quick fix of just bringing someone else's star in and not addressing the root problems. I'm at a loss for why so many people think pushing Takeshita this hard (and sharing him with AEW at that) is a positive. 

Edited August 17 by dorfus malorfus

[Horangi]

3 hours ago, dorfus malorfus said:

I'm reminded of the line in that old Transformers voiceover parody from ebaum's world where Optimus tells Hot Rod that the only thing he can do to help the Transformers is "bring ME back to life to solve YOUR problems." That's how making Takeshita your new NJPW ace feels. The same way it felt when WWE brought in Cody and immediately made him their ace because they'd squandered everyone else. You don't develop new talent and and you abandon your existing talent so you pivot with the quick fix of just bringing someone else's star in and not addressing the root problems. I'm at a loss for why so many people think pushing Takeshita this hard (and sharing him with AEW at that) is a positive. 

I think this might be part of why the crowd was also pro-EVIL in that, despite having a contract, Takeshita isn't a New Japan guy. Chris Charlton did try to justify this by saying as much of a bastard EVIL is, he's their bastard.  As a NJPW fan, I am not against the idea of pushing Takeshita as I think he is the type of wrestler that can transcend this divide like Ibushi did but at the same time, I don't think he should be the ace of a company he cannot commit to long term. I think him winning the world title is inevitable (KOPW probably, Zack defends against Nigel at Forbidden Door, Narita at Destruction) so I hope they can use it as a way to give one of the Reiwa guys the big moment at the Dome which will be the biggest Dome show since 2020 (I hope at least, Tanahashi deserves a good gate for his last match). 

I do like your Takashi Yoshida comparison, made a similar connection to EVIL/HoT (that the domestic audience was into him but the online not so much), then I enjoyed his matches so much more. 

[Niners Fan in CT]

Why wouldn't it be a positive?  He looks like a star. He carries himself like a star.  He's the best wrestler.  He's young.  He has the size and the look of an ace.  What guy on the roster is better suited?  Also, he has a contract there.  This whole outsider thing is overblown to me.  He works there. 

[dorfus malorfus]

Eugenics aside (the idea that the strongest, fastest, prettiest guy is the obvious choice to be ace), he has no history with the company. They have a roster full of young talent they've constantly been fucking over for years to instead keep Okada and Naito on top. Going with Takeshita puts Tsuji & co on hold for another year or two (at least) so they you can push your new toy you're sharing part-time with another company. I don't see how it's a positive at all. I think you're missing the point of the anti-outsider arguments. People want to see new stars created, not imported. He's been a top guy in two other companies already (one of which is still his main employer). There's no arc, just him being brought in because, as you say, he "looks like a star." Ishii, who was actually "the best wrestler" for a decade but didn't "look like a star," never got the push a guy like Takeshita will always get. This is the nightmare we live in -- being a "super-athlete" has become the new being a roid freak, and sadly people can't see how superficial guys like Takeshita are (although, thankfully, maybe the pro-EVIL crowd is the start of a long overdue pushback against the predominance of this one style valued to the exclusion of literally everything else).

Edited August 18 by dorfus malorfus

[username]

1 hour ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

What guy on the roster is better suited? 

I mean, the crowd did seem to like that EVIL fellow better... >_>

I do think this is a simple case of for the first time in a long time the tastes/preferences of the domestic & international audiences having diverted significantly, and in that situation while it's not great for us as the internationals one would be insane to abandon someone the home audience is really into.

Also I feel no one wants to admit it but there is an added value in an over act that is less likely to be poached by those with the moneybags. 

[Niners Fan in CT]

Ah yes,  it's only the look.  That's all Takeshita has.  He's certainly not one of the top 5 best wrestlers on the planet. What was I thinking. 

[Craig H]

I mean, consider this. As much as TK is a dork and a mark for NJPW, EVIL is the one guy he wants nowhere near AEW. THAT'S HOW MUCH HE FUCKING SUCKS. I don't know how or why Gedo or anyone else in NJPW's booking can't see that unless HoT really is that over in Japan and/or they don't give a fuck. 

At this point, looking at NJPW's roster, anyone who thinks Takeshita isn't a good choice for this spot or to be near the top of the company is out of their element. They have completely botched Shota (although some of that is Shota's fault too), Yota Tsuji, and Yuya Uemura may be the best of the lot but even he lacks any sort of aura that makes me want to want NJPW despite the HoT bullshit. 

I think they would have been in a far better position had they not sat on the young lions they clearly wanted to be these new Musketeers for so long and used Naito before he was completely shot, Okada, and Tanahashi to get any of them over. I'll give them this though, it's not like Okada and Naito became stars overnight and each guy had to find their way to be THE guy in the company. And even then people bitched about Okada winning all the time but he still was the top star there and overcame the "lol Okada wins" stuff.