NoFistsJustFlips

I don't think it's without pay. The only way they can freeze the amount of time passing on a contract (which is what they mean when they say freeze it), is if they're still paying the wrestler their downside guarantee. So they would get paid whatever their base salary is. But if say Sasha had 5 months left on her deal when she walked out, in 5 months she'll still have 5 months left assuming she doesn't come back. She'll be at 5 months indefinitely until they "unfreeze" it. I know they used the word suspended. But I don't think they can suspend her without pay AND freeze her contract. It's gotta be one or the other. She can do whatever she wants during that time, except wrestling for a non WWE entity.

He didn't just wake up one day and say fuck my best friend. There are mitigating circumstances here and money issues and promises that may have been made / lied about. We don't know all the details. For all we know Colt could have done something shitty in this situation that hasn't gotten out to the public. Not really fair to use interpersonal dynamics of a friendship we don't know all the details of to damn one side. He did manage to get over with the fans. Big time actually with that Rusev Day stuff. Did that matter? He was slotted where he was slotted by the office. No amount of being a good soldier and getting over and delivering his best could change that. It's been proven that McMahon respects the people that stand up to him more than the people who just go with the flow. Not saying walking out back then would have made him a mega star. But keeping quiet sure didn't either. I personally respect the guys & girls more who will put their foot down and have some integrity and say I don't think this is very good, we should be doing better. And I think the positioning and power the wrestlers would be able to wield would be better off if they rallied behind each other in circumstances like this. Not expecting others to walk over it. Just showing support online. Posting about not agreeing with WWE being petty. Putting it out there that it's not right. You don't have to quit. But staying silent doesn't help anyone. It just hurts yourself when and if they decide to treat you like that.

Bucks and Hardys I'll grant you has history to rely on. The TBS Title match has zero story. JAS vs Eddie and Santant & Ortiz has a strong build. But BCC being involved has all of what 2 TV segments? HOB v Death Triangle have had what 1 interaction on TV since the last PPV? (Fenix's return). Well I guess they ran off HOB in that Julia Hart segment too. So 2 TV segments. But that's not much story that's been developed. The Owens are tournaments and don't need much story. But sooooo much of the TV has been built around getting to those two matches. Like 3-4 matches a show for the last month. Guess it's just me being too literal in wanting things officially announced and a refined & deliberate push to advertise everything to make everything feel special. What actually feels special for this show to you? In my opinion the only things with a special feel are Wardlow vs MJF and the two Owen matches. But again that's just an opinion.

Strongly disagree again. It's irrelevant how easy the events are to order. How are PPVs more special than an episode of Dynamite when the matches don't have a story behind them? What gives a viewer (beyond the hardcore instant buyers like us) the incentive to pay for a PPV vs just waiting and watching the TV for free if it's all the same? If you're just throwing out matches the week of the event then why are there only 4 PPVs? TK's been very public about the purpose behind having only 4 PPVs. To have time to tell longer stories and have proper build like they used to. It's a counter to the WWE style of throwing matches out within the week of a PPV. I do understand your point. The event is sold out. It's hard to criticize that in the current moment. But that's not going to last forever. And the downturn will come quicker than they expect if they let their foot off the gas and mail it in like this. WCW 1998 was selling out everywhere based off of 1997's hard work. But 1999 WCW tanked based off of 1998 WCW starting to mail it in. And 2000 was irredeemable based off of 1999 WCW. If you don't learn from history you're doomed to repeat it.

Strongly disagree. One of the big selling points of fewer PPVs is more time to tell stories properly. To make things feel important and special. And to make everything feel important and special, not just the main events. Just because the matches will most likely be very good regardless, does not mean we should give them a free pass for not trying. AEW has shown to be very good at long form story telling and paying off stories. Give me more Hangman v Omega. Give me more MJF v Punk. Give me more MJF v Wardlow. These long stories with the matches set up with plenty of time to get advertised and feel important by the time the PPV hits. For DON there was a good three weeks where only one match had been announced. I'm not sure if it's because of The Owen Tournament pacing or what. But they did a full on WWE build this time. Oh shit the PPV is two weeks away. Guess we gotta start booking matches for it. Just because the matches will be good, doesn't mean we should let it slide that the effort isn't there this time.

Who really knows at this point. They might throw one on there last minute. Speaking of, not digging how many matches are getting announced so close to the PPV. They normally have things setup a little sooner. Like MJF vs Wardlow has had the proper build for sure. HOB vs DT getting tossed on last night seems haphazard. As does Bucks vs Hardys getting announced only a week out. And the TBS Title match out of blue for Anna Jay with zero TV matches since what that hardcore women's street fight? Hell the Women's Owen Finals won't be set until two days before the PPV. Not sure why the timing on this one seems so thrown together. I'm still expecting a good show. But wasn't the point of fewer PPVs to really announce in advance and advertise and give everything that old school important feel? That isn't happening here.

Honestly I can't argue much of what you wrote here. I don't dislike Danhausen as much as you do tho. I like him a lot actually. I get what you're saying about why is he working out with Danhausen. But I just interpret that differently. In that vignette Hook is working out. He's going workout regardless because that's what Hook does. Danhausen admires him and tagged along and couldn't keep up. It's not like Hook was helping him Hogan & Mean Gene style in tiny shorts lol. I guess I just interpret it that he's not Danhausen's friend so much as he's just doing his thing and Danhausen is following him around and idolizing him because the curse didn't work on him. To me Hook isn't a babyface. He's just Hook. And he happens to be teaming with a face and fighting heels. But he still comes out of the heel tunnel. He hasn't changed any of his behavior. He didn't accept the gift of chips. He walked out on that. He's just a tweener doing his thing with a tag along.

I think your memory from that period is on point. By that point he had been used and abused by the office. He got over multiple times based purely on his work. By the time he was in ECW he was done trying to be a complete package and just went into coasting on spots. WGTT would have been tag team GOATs if they came up in the 80s. Imagine peak WGTT vs peak Steiners or Midnights or Rock n Rolls.

I can't help but think there is some real unrealistic views of Hook's place in the pecking order going on in this thread lol. There is something real and tangible with him, he is over and has a major value to the future. But he isn't even at the "pillar" level yet. Like he's clearly behind MJF, Jungleboy, Darby & Sammy in the pecking order. Being mad that he is with Danhausen and that it is ruining his aura is a bit of an overreach. Danhausen is very over. Hook is very over. Them together squashing low card dudes is going to be over. Hook isn't doing comedy spots. He's not doing the row boat spot or biting people's asses like Dink. He's still Hook doing Hook shit. He just has Danhausen standing there in the background now. To me (on a smaller level) they have that Rock & Sock thing going on. Two over acts on their own, that just have a fun chemistry together. Maybe a better analogy is Team Hell No. But by no means is this ruining Hook. Its giving him some meaningful stories to get his feet wet and learn and grow, without putting all of the weight on his shoulders. He just has to show up and keep wrecking dudes. Danhausen can carry the verbal stuff and Sterling / Neese are never going to be cool heels that get cheered over anyone. So this is good for his development. Outside of going full Goldberg with him, this is the best possible scenario to groom him for the future. And you can't go full Goldberg with him because of his look. You think we hear a lot of whining about Cole & The Bucks being tiny... imagine if Hook is out there no selling for Wardlow. This is good for Hook.

As Dolfan said the networks are big on keeping the brand extension a thing. But you could still merge all the needless titles and have champions work both brands. They can still have exclusive rosters. But just let the only world champion appear on both shows. Let the only men's tag champs appear on both shows. Merge the women's titles and do the same. The women's tags are already dual branded. You can keep the IC & US the show exclusive titles if you want. But with how they have paired down the roster there is no need for multiple men's tag champs or multiple world champs or multiple women's champs. All of that said, I'm sure they have a date in mind for a draft and one of the "networks" will just strip The Bloodline of half of their titles.

Fuck putting that in my house I want that on the hood of my car ?

Replica belt sales. Those merch sales for replicas are insane. I'm sure portions of which go to The Owen Hart Foundation as well which is good. Not much money in the replica trophy business from what I hear lol. Although for this specific instance I would have went with as close legally as I could get to a Slammy-like handheld trophy. Just feels right for an Owen Hart prize.

Very surprised @John from Cincinnati didn't pontificate about how she is graciously stepping away to make room for the new Chief Brandi Officer of WWE lol. Her taking time away could be just that, a little break. But this feels more significant to me. Time will tell. But Linda's been gone for awhile now. Shane is gone again. Triple H was gone for a bit (and is back but in a very limited capacity), & now Stephanie? Vince is the only day to day McMahon and he's almost 80? They really are getting ready to sell aren't they? All of the McMahons will get billion dollar payouts via stock buyouts. Someone's gonna get the company with Vince running it until the day he dies. And then Nick Khan taking over. /wild speculation

WWE had over 300 people under contract. What percentage of the business as a whole do you think that was? What percentage of people good at this does that account for? I understand your greater point but this isn't 2006 anymore. Signing 10 people (out of 15) that have been let go in a year is not the same as signing 10 people (out of 80) that have been let go in a year. This isn't TNA. I don't care what hangups people have on Cole or ORiley or Swerve or Keith Lee. All of them are fucking good at their job. Having them on your roster is a good thing not a strike against you. Where was this discourse in the 90s when WWE started pushing WCW jobbers? No one gave a shit that STEVE AUSTIN, CACTUS JACK, MEAN MARK, & JEAN PAUL LEVESQUE came in and were beating WWE guys. Just as it shouldn't be now. That's how the business works. You learn and grow and move on. Even back to the territory days. Dolph Ziggler being the same dude for 20 years taking up space is not a good thing. Movement and always improving your roster and change is good thing. I mean no offense to you personally. But this is a very dumb talking point.

According to Google local TV News people are members of SAG-AFTRA. Which means they have a union and collective bargaining at least. So unless Google failed me here, while their contracts may be similar... they still have way more rights and benefits than pro wrestlers. To your point, they may be able to be cut whenever and have no compete clauses like wrestlers, but they are still in a way better position than pro wrestlers are WRT benefits & financials.

Say no more, I understand your stance completely now. You see yourself as the Vince of your company so you empathize with his point of view here. The talking point of: ...is gross to me. Allow me to paraphrase here, but how I interpreter that is basically a POV of 'Well god damn pal you wouldn't be anything in this business if it wasn't for the letters WWE. You should be thankful we even pay you any money at all. You know how many people would do this job for free????' That is some toxic and manipulative shit. WWE the company has also been enriched by the talent here. Sasha main evented WM 37 Night 1. How much revenue did that bring WWE? My point here is the worker and the company mutually benefit, they both enrich each other. So to take the company stance that the worker is irrelevant to the equation and should just be thankful for having a job is ethically questionable and morally objectionable to me. I too will back away from this topic now because it's spiraling off topic. But take a second to consider WHY you're the only voice advocating for your POV in here. Could it be that maybe you're on the wrong side of this one? That maybe signing a contract to be a wrestler shouldn't entitle the company employing you to full liberty to use you & abuse you how they see fit? Just because I work somewhere and agree to a payment for my services doesn't mean that employer can send me out there to do stuff I don't agree with. Again if they want factory line workers, hire employees that get the same wage no matter what.

Couple notes on random things I saw mentioned... -They can't just throw out a Blood & Guts two weeks before a PPV. As two rings takes up way more seating than one ring, Blood & Guts will always be known ahead of time, even if it's not advertised yet... based solely on the format of the seating chart. They have to have a giant ringside area and the ramp area will not have as many rows. So people expecting to be surprised by this one day, sorry lol. -Mox's line was they wanted to kick the shit out of JAS in front of fans and that Stadium Stampede was lame because the fans weren't there live to see them get their ass kicked. Has nothing to do with the team format. So 10 man tag no DQ fits what he was saying just fine. -Think the post asking if Deeb was drunk is in poor taste since she was released from WWE for alcohol issues back in 2010. -100% agree Konosuke Takeshita is awesome. Put the ROH World Title on that man and let him become a big fucking star. -Loved Punk's shirt. I do wonder if that becomes a hindrance when it comes to ad sales down the line. If the Turner people see that and ask to tone it down. But fuck it, roll with it until you can't. -Johnny Nitro sucks. Sorry for the people that like him, but happy this will be a one and done. Pointing out to Joe where to stand on camera is pretty bad. They just did not click at all. -I called a Joe vs Cole final in the PPV thread and still think that's what we get. Thinking the women's final may end up being Ruby vs Toni now tho. -Itoh & Nitro as the jokers were fine. Not super sexy choices but enough star power to not be total letdowns. Itoh certainly has a place on this roster when she's available. But get Miz's sidekick the F outta here lol. -Pretty sure it's Hardys, Darby, & Sting vs Bucks & Dragons at The PPV. Which is such a random odd pairing of names that I wouldn't have believed if you told me that a year ago lol. -Da Meltz is saying Bryan getting his leg trapped after Rampage was him just fucking around with the crowd and not real or serious, thankfully.

Every contract can be canceled at any time by WWE. For budget cuts, or because you got an unapproved haircut, or because they sneezed in front of Vince. For any reason. They cut people all the time and have it in all contracts that it can be terminated at any time by WWE. The performers have no such rights. They are stuck in the deal once they sign it. There's like 2 or 3 people that have been able to negotiate a "no-cut" clause in the last few years. But of course those 2 or 3 are people WWE would never cut anyways. But outside of like Reigns & Orton & maybe Cody... anyone can be cut at anytime by WWE. And it's been that way since the Monday Night Wars when the contract structure changed to compete with WCW.

That's the name I got Lexy mixed up with. As my point stated they are all interchangeable and generic so this is very on brand for my point lol.

I think there's a misunderstanding in the bold part. They are for longer durations, usually 3 years or 5 years. No one is on a monthly contract. Now some did used to have rollover clauses but they weren't month to month. It's like if the agreement expires without the talent giving verbal notice they are leaving when the contract ends, it rolls over for another term. Meaning a 3 year auto renews another three year contract. But that is more of the old way they did things in the early 90s. Bret forgot to give notice in 1992 that he was going to leave. So when he was wanting to go to WCW it had auto renewed for another three years and he couldn't go. Toni negotiated a full release somehow. Some people the office just likes and will allow them to leave like her & Andrade. Some people the office want to be punitive with like Brodie Lee & Pac. So they stay in purgatory until WWE feel like they taught them a lesson. If they showed up somewhere after 90 days it's irrelevant. As BD posed above, the verbiage in the contracts states the promoter can terminate with 90 day notice. The performers can not. I believe the crux of the Lesnar suit was a bit different. He had a 10 year no compete that they were also enforcing on MMA. And wanted it enforced world wide. If memory serves me the court ruled that the no compete would stay in tact in the US, but Lesnar was free to wrestle outside of North America. Eventually they made a settlement after two years where Lesnar was let out of that 10 year no compete. And that's when he went to UFC.

Where's Mike Tenay at? Can he grow a Mean Gene mustache? lol Yeah Marvez is terrible. And they only use him on pre taped inserts. They also have a woman named Mckenzie (who I think is DDP's daughter). But she seems too much like the generic rotating cast WWE has doing backstage interviews. I never understood how they decide who Tony, Marvez, or Mckenzie interview. Seems random and arbitrary. They need someone with a bit of gravitas to be their Mean Gene. That's why his segments were good. He had credibility and was a known quantity. Tony would be fine in that role if he wasn't also announcing. But doubling up gets a bit weird sometimes. Would be a great role for a Kevin Kelly or a Mike Tenay or maybe The Coach. Just someone with some TV equity that people buy into being more than a rotating nobody. The perfect fit isn't available because he's in WWE. But man would I love to see AEW lead interviewer Doc Hendrix ?

The current answer is no. Would that hold up legally? Not sure, it's never been argued in court. Essentially if someone quits while under contract, they are done in pro wrestling until WWE decide it's not worth paying them their downside anymore. Take Pac for example. He walked out. They could have argued breach of contract and not paid him anymore. But that would also free him up legally to go elsewhere. Instead they decided to punish him by keeping him under contract for over a year. Eventually they released him. But not until they decided. Toni Storm did walk out. But she negotiated a release from WWE on amicable terms (somehow). They let her out of her deal within a week of whatever happened to her. Yet they sent Ali home for 6 months and wouldn't let him go. He still got paid his downside but he was punished by not being able to wrestle elsewhere and not being able to make any bonus income. Eventually they brought him back. Long story short WWE has all the power and the wrestlers have zero. They can bail and go home. But they won't be wrestling anywhere until WWE decides they're allowed to by releasing them. Probably the most famous walk out, Punk was released almost six months after he walked out. On his wedding day. As a big fuck you to try and ruin his day. Because WWE is the most petty place on earth.

Joker guesses: Men's: Jay White. Just have a feeling we get a Jay White vs Adam Cole final that leads us into Undisputed Elite vs Bullet Club at Forbidden Door. Women's: Mickie James. A big win for Britt against a known women's star. A good surprise that would be out of left field but doesn't need to win or look strong because she isn't sticking around.

Yeah ratings only matter so far as how much you can charge for ads. Unfortunately wrestling is seen as low brow entertainment. So while their ratings are far higher than NHL games, they don't get to charge the corresponding ad rate. Companies just don't look fondly on the viewership of wrestling. So say they can charge $100k per every one million viewers for a normal show. Wrestling can't get that kind of rate. They have to drop down to charge like $70k per every one million viewers. It sucks because people are people so who cares what kind of people are watching ya know? But ad companies do big studies on who buys products and what demos buy what percentage of products shown and stuff. And the viewers of wrestling just don't buy things in the quantities that their ratings show. I won't go all into the weeds on it. But it gets even deeper. Like how they make even less money when they do picture in picture ads because they're not getting the full screen and such. It's kind of a bunch of bullshit, but it's backed up by lots of data. So NHL games with half the viewers are charging probably like double the ad rate of wrestling shows.

Continuing down my Kim is the Walt of this show theory... (Episode 6 spoilers ahead) Her impetuous to pull this scheme with Jimmy is to get money to fully fund her pro bono work. Yet here she is, on her way to a meeting that would give her full funding to work on her pro bono work on the up & up, deciding that the scheme is more important than the meeting and bailing. Showing that this was never actually about the pro bono work. Kim isn't in the pro bono business, she's in the empire business. Just like Walt. She's addicted to the feeling of getting away with things she knows she shouldn't. And that's the appeal of dating Jimmy for her too. They sure are foreshadowing pretty heavily that whatever that is that they're gonna slip into Howard's drink is going to do more damage than expected. It sure feels like Howard is about to die and Kim will have to decide to do time or disappear. Or maybe it's all a brilliant misdirection. Either way I'm enjoying the ride. I do wish this last season had the pacing of Breaking Bad's last season. So much shit happened in just the first half of their last season. This show is not matching that. It's still gripping tv. But so far we've had one death, one gun hidden in a lab, and not much else happening.