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SHE-HULK: ATTORNEY AT LAW (SPOILER TALK)


The Natural
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Oof this crashed hard for me. I don't know how you can set up a plot, have your audience follow along for 9 1/2 episodes and then tell us "the plot sucks so we're not gonna go through with it". Shit, you guys are the ones who wrote the frickin thing. At any point during pre-production you guys could've come up with a story that you actually did want to present instead of having your fictional character make fun of the things you wrote! Very lazy.

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1 hour ago, odessasteps said:

Liked the gags about the 70s show. 
‘’Disappointed in the Emil heel turn, as expected. 
i wonder if they tried to get Byrne for a cameo. 

I don’t think it was a real heel turn.  The implication was that he was with Intelligencia, but I took it more as they just booked a private event at his place and he didn’t know what kind of group it was.

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Don't think the finale completely stuck the landing, but it was strange as fuck in a pretty awesome way. Loved the opening/tribute to the old Hulk show. Everything with K.E.V.I.N. was just wonderful. In a weird way what probably hurt it a bit was just kind of cutting to the end of the "climax" with Intelligencia. Was kind of expecting for a reset that eventually led to where we got, but just going there made it feel awkward. Otherwise I dug the aftermath with Matt showing up and Bruce introducing a certain someone to the family. Curious to see when/if we get a follow up on that.

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50 minutes ago, JonnyLaw said:

I don’t think it was a real heel turn.  The implication was that he was with Intelligencia, but I took it more as they just booked a private event at his place and he didn’t know what kind of group it was.

I guess if nothing else, him turning into the abomination violated his parole. Kinda dumb. 
 

i wonder if the plot was cliched on purpose the whole time so they could do the fourth wall breaking.

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9 hours ago, odessasteps said:

I guess if nothing else, him turning into the abomination violated his parole. Kinda dumb. 
 

i wonder if the plot was cliched on purpose the whole time so they could do the fourth wall breaking.

That's what I'm leaning towards.  The whole show took the piss out of various Marvel tropes so while initially jarring the "rewrite" process was pretty on brand for me.  I also saw it as a bit of "Wayne's World" ending magic where they decided to go with the supermegahappy ending after something less than ideal.  But at the same time I get Swift's points and had to ponder that for a bit.

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Wife has no idea what to make of the finale EXCEPT for that she was a lot happier with the outcome relative to where it seemed like everything was headed. She thought season 2 was going to be about Jen starting from nothing and having to work back up and basically agreed with all of Jen's complaints, even if she wasn't fully on board with the metatextual way they got there.

So yeah, basically :

  • Was not on board with the generic MCU ending
  • Much preferred the sort of ending Jen suggested
  • Would have rather seen Jen reach that ending on her own than some sort of waving a magic wand sort of way to get there.
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Can't wait to watch the season this weekend, as I hate watching weekly and prefer to binge all at once

Kudos to @The Natural for reminding me, of all the series this year I've only missed this and Ms Marvel so I might catch that one after She Hulk.

Seeing the cameos has me hopeful, tried hard as hell to avoid reviews for now.

If I can do a quick ranking of the series released, I've got Wandavision/Loki/What If in my first tier.. Winter soldier/Hawkeye middle tier.. And Moon Knight bottom tier. I'm curious, for my own tastes, where the She Hulk and Ms Marvel series will land 

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13 hours ago, (BP) said:

I don’t have an issue with the meta satire (that’s basically what I wanted) but to wrap up storylines involving revenge porn and Gamergate harassment like that seemed awfully cavalier. 

It's not like they can keep up with it perpetually and lord knows those fucking incel douchebag losers aren't going to stop just because they've been 100% pwned so if the MCU wants to take more shots of them, I'm sure the opportunities will (unfortunately) keep coming. 

She-Hulk ruled. 

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17 hours ago, christopher.annino said:

It's not like they can keep up with it perpetually and lord knows those fucking incel douchebag losers aren't going to stop just because they've been 100% pwned so if the MCU wants to take more shots of them, I'm sure the opportunities will (unfortunately) keep coming. 

She-Hulk ruled. 

She-Hulk sucked.  Bad writing excused by saying they meant it to be bad.  If you want something that 4th wall breaking you do it in the middle of the season where you have threads going and She-Hulk can ask the writers "Are you really going to have x do y?  Also, why would I say this one episode and then contradict myself the next?" That way you have it be fun where Jen wants to know what's going to happen and you can purposefully put one contradiction in to address it during this scene.  Instead they have terrible plots and inconsistent characters and end it with "Hah, got you incels who can't have sex with women because you are incels and you are probably white" and just tie it up with a terrible bow of cameos they mocked all the time.  It was the most cynical of all the shows and was all about mocking fans of comics.  Just because someone doesn't like your work doesn't make them a troll.  A troll would be someone who doesn't care about the franchise and just wants to piss you off.  This should could have been a fine legal comedy if they actually took the time to find writers who could pull it off.  

Phase 4 has been full of subpar content and I don't see much in the future to look forward to.  

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On 10/15/2022 at 4:48 PM, roofiethebutcher said:

She-Hulk sucked.  Bad writing excused by saying they meant it to be bad.  If you want something that 4th wall breaking you do it in the middle of the season where you have threads going and She-Hulk can ask the writers "Are you really going to have x do y?  Also, why would I say this one episode and then contradict myself the next?" That way you have it be fun where Jen wants to know what's going to happen and you can purposefully put one contradiction in to address it during this scene.  Instead they have terrible plots and inconsistent characters and end it with "Hah, got you incels who can't have sex with women because you are incels and you are probably white" and just tie it up with a terrible bow of cameos they mocked all the time.  It was the most cynical of all the shows and was all about mocking fans of comics.  Just because someone doesn't like your work doesn't make them a troll.  A troll would be someone who doesn't care about the franchise and just wants to piss you off.  This should could have been a fine legal comedy if they actually took the time to find writers who could pull it off.  

As a life-long comics fan a) who didn't feel the slightest bit mocked by any of that, b) whose skin isn't the thickness of a molecule, I can't help but feel like you wrote an awful lot of words just to tell on yourself.

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3 hours ago, Pete said:

As a life-long comics fan a) who didn't feel the slightest bit mocked by any of that, b) whose skin isn't the thickness of a molecule, I can't help but feel like you wrote an awful lot of words just to tell on yourself.

How did I tell on myself?  Where in that did I say I was offended?  I was pointing out how it was cynical to write your show in a way that would get people mad on purpose and at the same time make those people that criticize the show the villains.  They wasted some potentially great characters like Mallory and Titania to mock a small group on the internet.  That isn't entertaining.  They set up some good conflict between Mallory and Jen by Jen worrying if people would think she got her job because of She-Hulk and Mallory initially being offended Jen was hired when she worked hard for her job.  That lasted maybe an episode.  Titania could have been a better foil instead of what we got.  Yeah, the "Marvel Formula" has gotten pretty stale but I would have preferred that to this.  "Werewolf By Night" showed they have the ability to do something different that is fun and somewhat edgier.  A good fight between a better represented Wrecking Crew and She-Hulk and Daredevil would have given us the Hulk smash stuff we haven't had in a while and would bring the great Daredevil fighting we remember.  I was just hoping for something better than what we got.  

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Not commenting on anything else anyone's saying, but I'll say this.  
 

I was wrong.  

 

I though they were going to go a completely generic Marvel route with this character.  I thought we'd have a regular big bad, a regular plot, which would lead to yet another movie.  I've never been happier to say that I was wrong about all of that. 

I'll admit, I wasn't familiar with the She-Hulk character, but they managed to make it (no pun intended) broadly written enough so that someone like me can enjoy the character. Everyone looked like they were having a blast at kicking around at the standard Marvel cliches.  

The worst part, far and away, is the CGI... which they all but acknowledge.  Doesn't excuse how capital R, Rough it was, but that's on the producers of the show, not the VFX team.  

I'm glad I went through this, and wouldn't mind seeing it come back again in a year or two as like, clean up for the movies.  Or just onesie, twosie episodes here and there.   But if that's it for She-Hulk, that was solid.  

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Thanks to Twitter, i was ready for some of the 4th wall breaking going on, so that didn't catch me off guard. What did catch me off guard was how the writers knew almost nothing about setting up a compelling courtroom drama, so they kept pulling deus ex machina plothammer tropes to settle most of the courtroom shit. "Hey can you testify for me this? Hey can you get your dates to testify for you?" I dunno, I guess after Daredevil I was hoping for something compelling every time we hit the courtroom. That's on me though, since the series came off more Deadpool in being silly for the sake of being silly, so from that pov the courtroom shit was tolerable.

Liked the series, but hated the fucking ending where we're gonna get this massive brawl with all these cameos popping in and HOLY SHIT IT'S ABOUT TO GO DOWN just for them to go the ultimate route of 4th wall breaking and swerve us by skipping the main event to cut to the aftermath. But again, with KEVIN mentioning budget as the reason for skipping lots of CGI, I kind of get why they went there?

This doesn't slip into Moon Knight bottom of the barrel terrritory for me, but it definitely ranks behind the middle tier and just slightly above the bottom tier of the Disney MCU shows for me. Was funny enough with cameos enough to make it a good watch once I got out of my own head about what my expectations were.

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