March 2022 Wrestling Discussion

[supremebve]

3 minutes ago, odessasteps said:

I guess the question about NXT and what was the ultimate goal for Hunter: to make a "good" promotion or prepare people for the main roster. 

Arguably, he did good at one and not so much as the other. 

I disagree,  all of those people could have been used effectively on the main roster if they moved them up with a plan. They pulled people from NXT, gave them new characters that didn't suit them and/or never pushed them in a way that made the audience care.  That's not HHH's fault. 

[John from Cincinnati]

After engaging about SeeWhyEnn earlier, I caught a clip on reddit where Ethan was complaining that nobody took him in his proper context re: the eighty-eight-percent thing (I did). So, being the sucker that I am, I listened to the entirety of that interview to offer him all the context he wanted. 

Note: With some people, certainly some public figures whose views I suspect are congruent with Ethan's, no amount of context will be sufficient if you're inclined to criticize their perspective. But I'm in the mood to offer a fair hearing. 

I've timestamped to a section that perked my ears up. If you're inclined, I encourage anyone interested to listen through to Ethan complaining about wrestlers posting online about asking for their release. 

"Why would those wrestlers publicly posting about asking for their release need to shut up?" would be my follow-up. Aren't they doing exactly what Ethan wasn't doing in the WWE? Dax and Cash controlled their narrative. Brodie Lee controlled his narrative. Mustafa Ali is controlling his narrative right now. Shouldn't these people be respected for drawing a line in the sand and telling their story? At least by your standards? I wish there'd have been follow-up on this. 

Even people who don't make public their desire to leave there have controlled their narrative. CM Punk controlled his narrative. PAC controlled his narrative. Toni Storm controlled her narrative. Should I think less of Ethan for not doing more to control his narrative when it would have been a choice rather than waiting to be cut? Once again, I'd love to see some follow-up and interrogation of what this guys really thinks. 

In his refusal to make a stand there and speak up for what he believed in and risk being released, I see a reflection in him refusing to own his world view. If you watch the full interview, you'll see your standard presentation of someone who's above the left/right paradigm because one side's bad and the other side's nuts, someone who's presenting as a free thinker, a dude doing your standard (almost unprompted) use of Bernie Sanders to explain why Joe Rogan isn't that bad. It all rings so hollow because of his refusal to commit to anything. He's certainly defining himself in opposition to ways of thinking he wants to present as foolish. But he's not explicitly for much. 

I enjoyed his framing of how the Rant Room with Aries went. I certainly believe a lot of wrestling fans would have trouble articulating their specific grievances concisely and pointedly in person with a wrestler they admire. And of course most of their audience would self-select as fans of most of these guys. But it tends to be the case when these "free thinkers" speak, they normally only have stories to tell about confrontations where they're right and their critics are unequipped. About as self-serving as you'd expect. 

Full disclosure: I tend to agree with Ethan largely about the overuse of some moves. Not sure we'd agree on the solutions. And yeah, Tony ghosting people is probably not the best practice. 

Final thoughts: Hit up Chris if you need a friendly interview. 

[Infinit]

51 minutes ago, odessasteps said:

I guess the question about NXT and what was the ultimate goal for Hunter: to make a "good" promotion or prepare people for the main roster. 

Arguably, he did good at one and not so much as the other. 

There's no "right way" to prepare performers for Vince and the "creative" process of the main roster. HHH's NXT provided a platform for talent to grow and develop. But call ups were more often than not lambs being led to slaughter.

Has everyone seen the ticket sales for Stand and Deliver? Only have moveds 2/3rds of a scaled down arena. HHH's Takeovers used to be guaranteed full arena sellouts. 

 

[supremebve]

1 hour ago, Infinit said:

There's no "right way" to prepare performers for Vince and the "creative" process of the main roster. HHH's NXT provided a platform for talent to grow and develop. But call ups were more often than not lambs being led to slaughter.

Has everyone seen the ticket sales for Stand and Deliver? Only have moveds 2/3rds of a scaled down arena. HHH's Takeovers used to be guaranteed full arena sellouts. 

 

One of my favorite wrestling memories was going to Takeover Dallas when Nakamura debuted. I really hate that they gutted NXT, it was by far my favorite wrestling promotion of the 2000s so far.

[peterien]

19 hours ago, The Natural said:

@John from Cincinnati.

I’m open to being proven wrong but I don’t see Vince letting Cody be ‘AEW Cody’, maybe some aspects of it but not all. I also think there will be a big buzz around Cody at WM and Mania week but after that I’m not so sure. 

[TheVileOne]

I am all for Cody replicating his US Agent act in Double Double E

[StretchMediatedHypertrophy]

HHH obviously got a lot of shit talked about him, and I don't have clean hands in that regard by any means. His heat with the internetz basically started because WWE didn't see enough in RVD or Booker T too give them that greenlight push, amplified with some...tasteless creative choices at times, and obv because he was banging Stephanie. In the end though, he didn't really do anything re: holding people back that Austin didn't do before him and Cena didn't do later. The difference was he was a heel (mostly) and he didn't really draw money - he also didn't really have the matches either. But ultimately he was mostly the nightwatchman until they had people wanted to greenlight push. That's not to say he wasn't a smart political player, who protected himself, and he clearly learnt from the best...but end of the day, yeah it was like that when he got there. 

And whilst it's possible to overanalyse this kind of thing, I think Booker kinda got to dine off the sympathy he got from coming out of that WrestleMania match for a long time - if Booker T had won that match and had a 4 week run as champ, he wouldn't really have been any better off and maybe his King Booker run would have felt a little less special. Nigh on 20 years on later, all WWE seems to have is cookie cutter shit but we all remember that finish - even if not fondly. 

[bazzil]

12 hours ago, Infinit said:

There's no "right way" to prepare performers for Vince and the "creative" process of the main roster. HHH's NXT provided a platform for talent to grow and develop. But call ups were more often than not lambs being led to slaughter.

Has everyone seen the ticket sales for Stand and Deliver? Only have moveds 2/3rds of a scaled down arena. HHH's Takeovers used to be guaranteed full arena sellouts. 

 

 

 

i remember going to NXT in Dallas on WM weekend in 2016. cost me $300 to buy a ticket on the secondary market. granted that wasnt in the NBA arena, but just looking it up now according to wikipedia they had a sold out 9000 people in the building.

[TheVileOne]

47 minutes ago, RunningFromAmerica said:

HHH obviously got a lot of shit talked about him, and I don't have clean hands in that regard by any means. His heat with the internetz basically started because WWE didn't see enough in RVD or Booker T too give them that greenlight push, amplified with some...tasteless creative choices at times, and obv because he was banging Stephanie. In the end though, he didn't really do anything re: holding people back that Austin didn't do before him and Cena didn't do later. The difference was he was a heel (mostly) and he didn't really draw money - he also didn't really have the matches either. But ultimately he was mostly the nightwatchman until they had people wanted to greenlight push. That's not to say he wasn't a smart political player, who protected himself, and he clearly learnt from the best...but end of the day, yeah it was like that when he got there. 

And whilst it's possible to overanalyse this kind of thing, I think Booker kinda got to dine off the sympathy he got from coming out of that WrestleMania match for a long time - if Booker T had won that match and had a 4 week run as champ, he wouldn't really have been any better off and maybe his King Booker run would have felt a little less special. Nigh on 20 years on later, all WWE seems to have is cookie cutter shit but we all remember that finish - even if not fondly. 

Some creative revisionism here, but I don't think fans should feel guilty about their past anger or negativity toward Triple H as long as it was "these matches and storylines are bad and making me turn off the TV."

Also, that's a very rose-colored view of what happened with Booker T at WrestleMania 19. 

I do credit Triple H for mellowing out in his later years, and the NXT people clearly like and respect him. Triple H clearly took an investment in the NXT prospects and treated them well. Even James Storm spoke highly of Triple H for his brief cup of coffee in NXT. I hope to some degree that Triple H learned from his mistakes earlier in his career and that helped him become a better player/coach for NXT.

Edited March 26, 2022 by TheVileOne

[StretchMediatedHypertrophy]

Clearly there are aspects of that HHH-Booker T feud that I absolutely detest, and I don't think they should have had HHH say those things, and especially not if he was going over. Whether I think HHH was morally obligated to refuse to along with it on general principle is another matter.

[AxB]

When they were trying to set up a Hart Foundation vs NoD feud by implying that the Harts were racist, Bret refused to do it.

[Kevin Wilson]

HHH of all people clearly had the power to refuse to do anything he didn't want to do. Now, I know the theory that when they were plotting the match that originally Booker was supposed to win, then plans changed later when Goldberg signed and it changed post-WM plans (I don't remember if those rumors were ever confirmed or someone in 2003 made it up). Not saying it would have made the promos "better" if Booker had won the match, but I think people would be less mad about it anyway and probably would have forgotten it by now. HHH for many many years as an on-screen character was absolutely unbearable but I'd like to think he learned from that as he got older.

[NoFistsJustFlips]

If we're being objective there's really three Triple H's.

1. In ring performer Triple H
2. Backstage political Triple H
3. Executive / NXT booker Triple H

1. In ring performer Triple H was one of the best technicians of the last 20 years. Now I will be the first to admit his intentionally slowed down territory heel act from 2003 - 2005 was a chore to watch. That character was heel and he was trying to be hated, but he did it in such an unenjoyably way. It was so unenjoyable that everyone universally despises it and it taints the objective view of his ring work. 1998 - 2002 Triple H was fucking awesome. The 1998 Rock IC Title feud and ladder match was very good. 1999 Triple H putting all the pieces together finally was fun as hell to watch. 2000 Triple H was the best in the world at the time having dope matches with everyone from Taka to Foley to Jericho and everyone in between. Plus that killer love triangle story. 2001 Triple H was just as good but the injury derailed him. 2002 Triple H was not quite as good, but he was so incredibly over when he came back that it carried him to a solid year.

From 2006 on he was basically an amalgamation of the peak good Triple H mixed with bad territory Triple H. Never bad in the ring. But never quite hitting that peak run. But he still had great matches with Batista and Cena. Less great tag stuff with DX. Mostly bad stuff against Orton. Then you have part time Triple H who was still quite good. The Bryan WM match being the peak. Some good Undertaker WM matches. A few solid Lesnar matches. The bad Punk / Nash stuff. Overall his run in ring is pretty favorable if you're being honest. But what truly taints that is...

2. The backstage politics of Triple H are unparalleled. From latching onto The Clique, to marrying the boss' daughter, to complaining that Kurt Angle was too small to be believable... this is by far the worst aspect of his legacy. His slow Harley / Flair territory in ring stuff also coincided with him holding down a whole host of more likable performers. He was outspoken about not believing in Jericho, and Edge, and Booker, & RVD, & Angle. And when he finally did put someone over it was Goldberg who was universally hated at the time. Which multiplied the resentment. But then you do have to give him credit for going all out for the guys he did believe in. He put Benoit over strong as fuck. He put Batista over strong as fuck. He put Cena over strong as fuck (even if it was undermined by the choice to acknowledge Cena "can't wrestle"). As time went on he also undercut Punk among others. He squashed Booker again when Booker was at his absolute peak doing the king gimmick. Political Triple H is probably close to the most detestable political animal wrestling has ever had. But a lot of that has softened over the years because...

3. Executive / Booker Triple H is one of the best of the last 20 years. He took a floundering developmental program over and completely molded it into smart fan's ideal dream promotion. FCW was nothing. Games show NXT was nothing. But Triple H's vision merged them and turned them into the most fan friendly thing WWE has ever had. We can argue if his NXT prepared guys for the main roster. But that point is moot in my opinion. There's nothing that can prepare anyone for that. Because the "main roster" is literally just whatever Vince's whims are. They change constantly. And he only likes what he likes, regardless of how ready you are. We got a prime studio wrestling show mixed with a super indy mixed with some names that we never thought would get a foot in the door. The matches and characters that really worked REALLY FUCKING WORKED. Bayley, baby face Sami Zayn, ect. He revitalized tag wrestling in WWE (for a short period of time). He completely re-imagined women's wrestling by giving them the platform to do what they were always capable of. He went from probably the most hated personality in the business to being sent fruit baskets by those same ranting fans. Un-fucking-matched.


He's not Rock/Cena/Hogan. He's not Undertaker/Andre/Lesnar. He's more like mixing the careers of Ultimate Warrior, Macho Man, & Pat Patterson. He's not on my mount rushmore for wrestling. But for me he absolutely is on the mount rushmore of executives / bookers / creative minds. Under rated and simultaneously over rated for in ring performance. Unparalleled for backstage political fuckery. But when both of those were out of the picture, one of the best fucking ever when using his mind for the benefit of others. Legit a legendary & iconic figure with no true equal. He's one of a kind. And in a lot of ways that's harder to accomplish than being an Austin/Rock transcendent figure. There's no road map for the shit Triple H was able to accomplish.

[caley]

4 hours ago, RunningFromAmerica said:

Clearly there are aspects of that HHH-Booker T feud that I absolutely detest, and I don't think they should have had HHH say those things, and especially not if he was going over. Whether I think HHH was morally obligated to refuse to along with it on general principle is another matter.

I've always assumed (and you know what happens when you do that) that the way the angle was set up was to lead to a Booker T win and the actual result was almost definitely a last-minute Vince change-of-heart "He's not getting over...it's not the right time...everyone expects it".  Especially that last one,  the more wrestler biographies you read, the more you read Vince telling someone "Everyone's expecting that...we're going to change it".

2 hours ago, AxB said:

When they were trying to set up a Hart Foundation vs NoD feud by implying that the Harts were racist, Bret refused to do it.

Well they still went forward with the NOD dressing room being defaced with racist graffiti and the Hart Foundation being blamed (Though I always assumed (there's that word again!) that the end game of that was going to be DX defacing the dressing room to get the Harts in trouble because graffiti and shit-stirring was DX's M.O.). 

[AxB]

Double post because someone replied before me, innit?

Although seeing as I'm here, I might as well posit that Triple H is probably the major reason why the Wrestling business went from massively successful during the Monday Night Wars, to gradually becoming less and less mainstream and more and more niche over the next 2 decades. The business' decline lines up pretty well with the period where he was being expected to carry the biggest company as it's biggest star.

Edited March 26, 2022 by AxB

[AxB]

58 minutes ago, NoFistsJustFlips said:

If we're being objective there's really three Triple H's.

1. In ring performer Triple H
2. Backstage political Triple H
3. Executive / NXT booker Triple H

1. In ring performer Triple H was one of the best technicians of the last 20 years. Now I will be the first to admit his intentionally slowed down territory heel act from 2003 - 2005 was a chore to watch. That character was heel and he was trying to be hated, but he did it in such an unenjoyably way. It was so unenjoyable that everyone universally despises it and it taints the objective view of his ring work. 1998 - 2002 Triple H was fucking awesome. The 1998 Rock IC Title feud and ladder match was very good. 1999 Triple H putting all the pieces together finally was fun as hell to watch. 2000 Triple H was the best in the world at the time having dope matches with everyone from Taka to Foley to Jericho and everyone in between. Plus that killer love triangle story. 2001 Triple H was just as good but the injury derailed him. 2002 Triple H was not quite as good, but he was so incredibly over when he came back that it carried him to a solid year.

From 2006 on he was basically an amalgamation of the peak good Triple H mixed with bad territory Triple H. Never bad in the ring. But never quite hitting that peak run. But he still had great matches with Batista and Cena. Less great tag stuff with DX. Mostly bad stuff against Orton. Then you have part time Triple H who was still quite good. The Bryan WM match being the peak. Some good Undertaker WM matches. A few solid Lesnar matches. The bad Punk / Nash stuff. Overall his run in ring is pretty favorable if you're being honest. But what truly taints that is...

2. The backstage politics of Triple H are unparalleled. From latching onto The Clique, to marrying the boss' daughter, to complaining that Kurt Angle was too small to be believable... this is by far the worst aspect of his legacy. His slow Harley / Flair territory in ring stuff also coincided with him holding down a whole host of more likable performers. He was outspoken about not believing in Jericho, and Edge, and Booker, & RVD, & Angle. And when he finally did put someone over it was Goldberg who was universally hated at the time. Which multiplied the resentment. But then you do have to give him credit for going all out for the guys he did believe in. He put Benoit over strong as fuck. He put Batista over strong as fuck. He put Cena over strong as fuck (even if it was undermined by the choice to acknowledge Cena "can't wrestle"). As time went on he also undercut Punk among others. He squashed Booker again when Booker was at his absolute peak doing the king gimmick. Political Triple H is probably close to the most detestable political animal wrestling has ever had. But a lot of that has softened over the years because...

3. Executive / Booker Triple H is one of the best of the last 20 years. He took a floundering developmental program over and completely molded it into smart fan's ideal dream promotion. FCW was nothing. Games show NXT was nothing. But Triple H's vision merged them and turned them into the most fan friendly thing WWE has ever had. We can argue if his NXT prepared guys for the main roster. But that point is moot in my opinion. There's nothing that can prepare anyone for that. Because the "main roster" is literally just whatever Vince's whims are. They change constantly. And he only likes what he likes, regardless of how ready you are. We got a prime studio wrestling show mixed with a super indy mixed with some names that we never thought would get a foot in the door. The matches and characters that really worked REALLY FUCKING WORKED. Bayley, baby face Sami Zayn, ect. He revitalized tag wrestling in WWE (for a short period of time). He completely re-imagined women's wrestling by giving them the platform to do what they were always capable of. He went from probably the most hated personality in the business to being sent fruit baskets by those same ranting fans. Un-fucking-matched.


He's not Rock/Cena/Hogan. He's not Undertaker/Andre/Lesnar. He's more like mixing the careers of Ultimate Warrior, Macho Man, & Pat Patterson. He's not on my mount rushmore for wrestling. But for me he absolutely is on the mount rushmore of executives / bookers / creative minds. Under rated and simultaneously over rated for in ring performance. Unparalleled for backstage political fuckery. But when both of those were out of the picture, one of the best fucking ever when using his mind for the benefit of others. Legit a legendary & iconic figure with no true equal. He's one of a kind. And in a lot of ways that's harder to accomplish than being an Austin/Rock transcendent figure. There's no road map for the shit Triple H was able to accomplish.

Nah, he sucked.

[Kuetsar]

18 hours ago, Infinit said:

There's no "right way" to prepare performers for Vince and the "creative" process of the main roster. HHH's NXT provided a platform for talent to grow and develop. But call ups were more often than not lambs being led to slaughter.

Has everyone seen the ticket sales for Stand and Deliver? Only have moveds 2/3rds of a scaled down arena. HHH's Takeovers used to be guaranteed full arena sellouts. 

 

Well that's what happens when you have two old guys like Edward James Olmos and Lou Diamond Philips  in the main event. . . . . 

Edited March 26, 2022 by Kuetsar

[StretchMediatedHypertrophy]

1 hour ago, AxB said:

Double post because someone replied before me, innit?

Although seeing as I'm here, I might as well posit that Triple H is probably the major reason why the Wrestling business went from massively successful during the Monday Night Wars, to gradually becoming less and less mainstream and more and more niche over the next 2 decades. The business' decline lines up pretty well with the period where he was being expected to carry the biggest company as it's biggest star.

That's a very USA-centric pov tbh. In many ways even in the USA, WWE is more accepted in the mainstream culturally than it was. 

Ultimately the decline lines up with The Rock and Austin no longer being full-time performers, and there not being anyone Vince fancied to replace them until Cena, & to a lesser extent Batista. As I say, HHH was the nightwatchman.

[AxB]

Wrestling was bigger in the UK during the Monday Night Wars, than it was at the peak of the Britwres boom. It went from a lot of casuals, to a much smaller group of more committed fans (who filled Wembley Arena, so it's still a lot of people. Just not a lot of people). 

Then again, how did the Britwres boom come to end? Who killed it?

Spoiler

There are multiple factors. But the fact that most of the people who were draws for Progress at it's peak then went on to draw flies for NXT UK strongly implies it's a presentation issue.

 

[Ultimo Necro]

5 hours ago, NoFistsJustFlips said:

If we're being objective there's really three Triple H's.
 

Triple Triple H.

Regardless of anything else I think his place in wrestling will always be as one of the hardest working guys in the business.  He was rarely in anything other than spectacular shape in ring, somehow stayed clear of the demons of the kliq, poured a ton of time and energy into NXT.

My favourite Triple H thing ever is in (possibly season 1 of) Tough Enough and he is taking about intensity and back bumps.  It’s hilarious but frightening at the same time.

[A_K]

3 hours ago, RunningFromAmerica said:

That's a very USA-centric pov tbh. In many ways even in the USA, WWE is more accepted in the mainstream culturally than it was. 

Ultimately the decline lines up with The Rock and Austin no longer being full-time performers, and there not being anyone Vince fancied to replace them until Cena, & to a lesser extent Batista. As I say, HHH was the nightwatchman.

Naw. Just take a look at the crowd shots from late(ish) 90s - early 00s F/E & compare to now. Pictures tell a thousand words. There’s a reason they bring back broken old men year after year to rescue events of any commercial merit.

As for HHH, he was part of a scorching hot run during that late 90s - early 00s period but resolutely boring for nigh on 20 years thereafter. He was a great accessory .. but that’s really all he ever was, an accessory. Pretty bland, overly-intense guy. Never mastered humour (as heel or face) in the way that Rock, Austin did. If Scott Hall epitomised effortless cool, then HHH was his try-hard opposite.

Edited March 26, 2022 by A_K

[kafkonia]

Wrestling is littered with guys who though they were better than they were. Hunter is possibly the best of that bunch, and one of the few who got to try to pull it off.

He was a good character worker, but not the kind you build a promotion around. They tried it anyway.

He had charisma, but not the kind to break out into mainstream crossover success. They tried it anyway.

He was a good wrestler, but not a superworker whose strengths lent themselves to epic in-ring classics. They tried it anyway.

He had a good physique. So they booked him in a posedown with Scott Steiner.

He had a couple of storylines where he was devious and manipulative. So they dubbed him the Cerebral Assassin and had him... hit people with sledgehammers and play-act necrophilia.

He was ultimately, ironically, a solid B+.

[Ziggy]

2 hours ago, Ultimo Necro said:

 

Regardless of anything else I think his place in wrestling will always be as one of the hardest working guys in the business.  He was rarely in anything other than spectacular shape in ring, somehow stayed clear of the demons of the kliq, poured a ton of time and energy into NXT.

 

He was very dedicated,  he was very good but I don't think he was this all time great he was precieved to be. I watched the first televised triple threat match on Raw with him ,Owen and Goldust today on Instagram and I remember I enjoyed his work so much as the Greenwich snob right up to before DX was formed. He was so good as taking a beating with his Flair esq bumps early on. He was some really good matches with Mero, Goldust, Mankind and guys at that level at the early part of his run. He had some good matches with Rock too later as a Face because it was like up to that point he was really still trying to prove he should be in the main event spot. Being the overly dominant heel champ in a babyface territory really hurt things especially once Austin and Rock was gone. 

[Niners Fan in CT]

12 hours ago, RunningFromAmerica said:

HHH obviously got a lot of shit talked about him, and I don't have clean hands in that regard by any means. His heat with the internetz basically started because WWE didn't see enough in RVD or Booker T too give them that greenlight push, amplified with some...tasteless creative choices.

I always vehemently disagreed with the idea that Kane, Booker T, RVD and an old Scott Steiner were held back. 

Those were the contenders at the time to challenge Hunter and none of them were top level guys, they all reached whatever ceiling they had. 

RVD for example was given the chance to main event WWE and usher in a new era of ECW and he would rather get pulled over with drugs in the car than to take his role seriously. 

Hunter was a very steady performer they didn't have to worry about. RAW was in a transition period and Triple H was the last proven draw they had on that brand. Yes, he was a proven draw because his 2000 heel run was a very successful period. The Rock should get most of the credit but Hunter was the top heel he had to play off. 

Once WWE did get some fresh talent on the brand, Hunter put them over. He put over Batista on 3 consecutive PPVs and cemented his status. He put over Cena at WrestleMania as well. He did what was best for the business in those feuds. 

Of course he also protected his spot but show me a main eventer who hasn't..

Here's the deal. The IWC was jealous of the situation Hunter found himself in. They never let it go. They could cry until the cows come home about friggin' Kane not getting enough rub but does anyone want to stick their neck out for Glen Jacobs now? Maybe Hunter knew and did us all a favor  

Oh one more thing..  Goldberg. Fuck Goldberg. He ended Bret's career and never called to even check on him. Boo hoo he didn't win the Elimination Chamber and didn't look OP for a night.. poor Bill. He shouldn't have beaten The Rock either, a young Niners was there in attendance at the Worcester Centrum. We were all behind Hollywood Rock. At least Goldberg still gets the Saudi paydays. He survived. A real main eventer wouldn't view a blonde wig as a career changer. Imagine The Rock not being able to recover because he wore a blonde wig. 

Take it easy Hunter. Spend time with your daughters, thank you for all the memories and also NXT.

[Kevin Wilson]

Anyone that does an over-the-top defense of HHH full of questionable "facts" and actually uses the term "best for business" in the process is clearly a troll.