Jump to content
DVDVR Message Board

Dynamite - WINTER IS COMING - 12/15/2021


Recommended Posts

35 minutes ago, HarryArchieGus said:

Going into the title fight, having read many finish ideas, they pulled one out that was unexpected and brilliant.  I'd be on board with the Hangman draw is a mistake had they not had him hit that incredible buckshot making it plainly obvious he was about to win.  One of the best finishes this company has ever done.  So many ways to go from here.  

That said, some concerned chaos post match might help sell these draws.  I'd love to see two medical teams checking on each of the competitors.  Maybe even full on Rocky I/II and pay top dollar for a Bill Conti score.  Lastly, just a reminder, when you start with the main event there's opportunity for updates on said match throughout the rest of the show (see any classic SNME), and they'd be smart to do that.  A simple update outside the wrestler's dressing room, a nice highlight package of said match in hour 2 etc.  

I agree with this. There seems to be a lack of inspiration in modern wrestling productions, and when you see inspiration it’s crummy low budget Marvel comics special effects. We’ve fallen so far from WCW being inspired by CNN coverage of domestic bombings when doing angles like the MGM Studios attack. But I also realize they are on a strict time limit with TV, and a card that they need to deliver. So any extra coverage could cut into a match like WCW would to a Steven Regal match because they need that extra time to show The Outsiders run the Steiner’s off a dirt road outside of Atlanta.

Edited by LoneWolf&Subs
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Casey said:

Danielson got his second ever (right?) 5 star match with the Hangman one hour draw.

It seems his winning formula, for Meltzer anyway, is to just do draws in AEW ?

Well deserved. Fucking joke Bryan Danielson only had two ***** from Dave Meltzer, Page/Danielson and Omega/Danielson. Ten from moi:

10. Daniel Bryan vs. Randy Orton vs. Batista. WWE WrestleMania XXX. *****.

9. Daniel Bryan/Kane/Ryback vs. Dean Ambrose/Seth Rollins/Roman Reigns. WWE TLC 2012. *****.

8. Bryan Danielson vs. KENTA. ROH Glory by Honor V: Night Two, 2006. *****.

7. Bryan Danielson vs. Takeshi Morishima. ROH Manhattan Mayhem II 2007. *****. My worldwide 2007 MOTY.

6. Bryan Danielson/Samoa Joe/Adam Peace/BJ Whitmer/Homicide vs. Chris Hero/Claudio Castagnoli/Necro Butcher/Eddie Kingston/Nate Webb. ROH Death Before Dishonor IV. *****. My worldwide MOTY for 2006.

5. Bryan Danielson vs. Minoru Suzuki. AEW The Buy In: Rampage, 15th October 2021. *****.

4. Bryan Danielson vs. Adam Page. AEW Dynamite Winter is Coming, 15th December 2021. *****.

3. The New Daniel Bryan vs. AJ Styles. WWE TLC 2018. *****.

2. Bryan Danielson vs. Kenny Omega. AEW Dynamite, 22nd September 2021. *****. My 2021 worldwide MOTY.

1. Daniel Bryan vs. John Cena. WWE SummerSlam 2013. *****. My worldwide 2013 MOTY.

Edited by The Natural
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, LoneWolf&Subs said:

So any extra coverage could cut into a match like WCW would to a Steven Regal match because they need that extra time to show The Outsiders run the Steiner’s off a dirt road outside of Atlanta.

That angle is something me and my friends still talk about to this day and was exceptionally well done. I think William Regal was fine. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, HarryArchieGus said:

Going into the title fight, having read many finish ideas, they pulled one out that was unexpected and brilliant.  I'd be on board with the Hangman draw is a mistake had they not had him hit that incredible buckshot making it plainly obvious he was about to win.  One of the best finishes this company has ever done.  So many ways to go from here.  

Bah to the idea that booking a draw was a mistake.  Page and Danielson beat each other from pillar to post and each can claim victory.  Page can say that he was on the verge of pinning BD before time ran out and BD can still say he is undefeated and that the current and former AEW champions could not put him down.

Booking in the long view, this is the best possible outcome.  Page is still champion, Danielson is still undefeated, and Dragon can continue to kill his way to another title shot as he will most likely remain the unbeaten #1 contender.  The fact that there was no clear winner obviously lends itself to a future title match with no time limit or last man standing where the violence level can be ramped up to 11. 

Edited by J.T.
  • Like 6
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, LoneWolf&Subs said:

I agree with this. There seems to be a lack of inspiration in modern wrestling productions, and when you see inspiration it’s crummy low budget Marvel comics special effects. We’ve fallen so far from WCW being inspired by CNN coverage of domestic bombings when doing angles like the MGM Studios attack. But I also realize they are on a strict time limit with TV, and a card that they need to deliver. So any extra coverage could cut into a match like WCW would to a Steven Regal match because they need that extra time to show The Outsiders run the Steiner’s off a dirt road outside of Atlanta.

For sure, I think they should just cut that additional match.  Of it's many strengths AEW's pacing is not quite (yet) one of them.  They've certainly gotten a lot better along the way, but this week, not unlike (the better example) their marathon PPVs with match after match after match, inevitably leads to big matches suffering from exhausted crowds. 

How much to sell a post-big match or angle with highlight and replay packages, etc. is something they still seem to be figuring out.  

Edited by HarryArchieGus
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 hours ago, Peck said:

Speaking of, there were quite a few douchey-looking guys wearing shades indoors. Leave that to Orange Cassidy and his cosplayers.

Douchey-looking guys in the Dallas suburbs, you say?

  • Haha 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, Jiji said:

That angle is something me and my friends still talk about to this day and was exceptionally well done. I think William Regal was fine. 

I mean I love it too. Anytime they’d  do an angle that cuts into the commentary team discussing the proceedings with Tony tapping his ear, and saying “Hold on a second I just got word of something bad happening”, or they received a mysterious tape with something on it, is my favorite part of Nitro rewatches. But it must suck for the performers that get thrown to the wolves to fill 3 minutes of time. Though rewatching again it’s  clear somebody loved Regal too, because he’ll have a 14 minute TV Title match with Psychosis where the fans are 100% behind Nicho randomly.

Edited by LoneWolf&Subs
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I can’t imagine that MJF is not the Champion by the end of 2022. That is unequivocally the correct end to the Page reign. MJF feels like the man who will lead AEW for the next decade. Danielson will put Page over most likely, but he’ll stick around as the grumpy vet that opposes the lack of virtues from MJF, and his future reign. Maybe also teach MJF to work a tighter chain wrestling sequence too, before ultimately putting over Friedman.

Edited by LoneWolf&Subs
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I just like that I can turn on wrestling on a random Wednesday night and see a great wrestling match that is completely different and be entertained. You can break the booking and decision making down a 100 different ways but at the end of the day that's all that matters to me. 

I'm not an AEW guy and Hangman doesn't mean anything to me. From my perspective as an outsider, Hangman is a young talent on the rise who hasn't reached world champion level. He just went 60 minutes with the best wrestler in the world. Whether he won or lost is largely irrelevant.  

 

  • Like 6
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The split in fanbase is interesting, with people who have come in over the last few months and those who have been here from the start. This was my first real Page match that I've ever seen for instance. I think it's just been clips and moments before this.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If the ratings are any indicator, it doesn't seem like there are too many people who have really stayed on board after the initial increase from Punk and Danielson. I wonder if some regular viewers from the first two years stopped watching for some reason. I know we aren't supposed to care about ratings but I find it super odd that they're low even after adding two legitimate stars. They did something like ~30k more viewers for this year's Winter is Coming compared to last year's and apparently the demographic swayed older than usual. What's going on? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

No offense to @Jiji but I hate that we as fans discuss ratings after a show like this. This show was put together for us, the people who love pro wrestling. As long as they're over their ratings floor, and not in danger of being canceled I don't care if anyone other than us watches it. It's not WWE who wants to be everything for everybody. It's for us, or at least that's how it feels to me. 

  • Like 9
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Do they track the 7-day DVR numbers? I know networks do this. I understand that something like AEW is supposed to be more like live sports and "DVR-proof" but I watched Winter is Coming on a 40-minute delay to skip commercials and I usually am a next day watcher.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

i'll just say this now to get it out of the way:  The Page/Danielson match was good, but i definitely don't have the attention span for a 60-minute match, so it certainly wasn't my cup of ale.

the draw was fine, but wouldn't have been my first choice as-is. Hangman has been largely absent for the past few months. Having him win a match or two between his title win and this match (even if they were non-title) would have helped lessen the "he didn't win his first title defense" take. Danielson was in charge for something like 80% of the match (especially the opening half), personally i would've liked to see Hangman have more offense. 

i missed the CM Punk shirt on my first watch, so i am glad everyone here pointed it out. love it.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, twiztor said:

i missed the CM Punk shirt on my first watch, so i am glad everyone here pointed it out. love it.

One of my favorite things about AEW production is watch them try to cut from things (like signs or occasionally hand signals) or (maybe) Punk's shirt. "Oh crap. There's an "Earthbound is Terrible" sign on the screen. Camera 4!"

  • Haha 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The proposal of doing a 60 minute draw on the live weekly broadcast sounds really risky in the boardroom if you can’t present it in a way that doesn’t kill the room.  That’s why there probably weren’t that many people considering a draw as the outcome prior to the match happening.  (They certainly unintentionally signaled a bunch of times in the broadcast at the draw possibility).
 

But I really don’t think how it worked out resulted in any way that gives it a negative grade.  Adam Page (I thought) needed a big win to get his reign going and change his identity from perennial challenger to worthy champion.  But AEW doubled down on AmDrag pulling the best singles match of Hangman’s career.  Instead, THIS is the rung he steps up on to elevate and he still has something to chase in a rematch.  
 

And yes, the finish does suggest Page as having found the way  to beat the guy who spent that hour kicking his ass.  That’s good shit, pal.  Good work.
 

One last thing.  After two high profile draws. The next time they project another one, AEW could probably do the last second finish.  

  • Like 4
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest Jimbo_Tsuruta

No problem with the draw as it adds more zest to a rematch and I want as many undefeated Dickhead Danielson matches and unbearably smug promos as possible before Page gives him his comeuppance. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
×
×
  • Create New...