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December 2021 Wrestling Discussion


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4 hours ago, cwoy2j said:

98 WWF tag teams weren't great either. Granted, you didn't have Judy Bagwell as a champ there but WWF's division was basically The NAO and everyone else. Summer of 98, the WWF tag-titles were basically just story line advancers for Austin/Taker/Kane/Mankind. 

The NAO carrying the whole thing through the summer was something the WWF had over what WCW did with tag teams that year. Turning Gunn/Road Dogg from JTTS guys in 1997 to an actual thing in 1998 helped a bit for the entire product.

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Best match I've seen in person is probably the Brock/Kurt Angle ironman match or TLC from SummerSlam 2000. 

Worst match would be The Kat vs Terri Runnels in a "stinkface match" at that same SummerSlam. I'm sure I saw worse at some crappy indie in NC but that was embarrassing. 

Favorite match was probably Steve Austin vs. Big Show and Ric Flair in the old school blue cage at a random house show. The match was nothing special but the next night they wrestled the exact same match at Judgment Day sans cage and my mom and I had so much fun calling the spots.

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57 minutes ago, MoeCristyV.1.6 said:

I don't think that will get over with Roman Reigns. 

I'd be surprised if Vince would announce this without a lot of the talent being on board.  He's not going to alienate his biggest/only draw.

FWIW, supposedly athletes in various pro sports leagues are badgering their unions to do away with COVID tests and protocols.  NBA, NHL, and NFL are all having issues with athletes testing positive, but 90% or so of the players in each league are vaccinated.  My impression is that few people are getting very ill, so the players don't want to miss games or be quarantined for 7-10 days because they have the sniffles.  It seems like more people are getting caught by routine weekly/daily tests than by people having to be tested because they're ill.

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26 minutes ago, Mark said:

the players don't want to miss games or be quarantined for 7-10 days because they have the sniffles

well good news for pro athletes, the CDC is stepping by halving that from 10 to 5 days for asymptomatic people. However you wish to define asymptomatic because I'm sure some entities will try their best to make as many people asymptomatic as possible who aren't on the verge of hospitalization

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24 minutes ago, Dog said:

That's ... that's how you combat an epidemic. Doesn't matter how sick they get; it's about slowing the spread.

Unless I'm misunderstanding you.

I assume you mean "That's not how you combat an epidemic"?  You're correct, but I can understand why pro athletes don't see it like that.

 

9 minutes ago, Cobra Commander said:

well good news for pro athletes, the CDC is stepping by halving that from 10 to 5 days for asymptomatic people. However you wish to define asymptomatic because I'm sure some entities will try their best to make as many people asymptomatic as possible who aren't on the verge of hospitalization

CDC's been making a concerted effort to change their messaging in recent weeks.  This is just one of the more obvious signs of that. 

 

1 minute ago, Brandon Bones said:

So a buddy of mine just texted me.  He just now found out Sami Zayn was El Generico.

I'd laugh, but Paul Wight was in the WWE for 10-12 years before I realized he wasn't really related to Andre.

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I think it was an ROH show called Honor Reclaims Boston(?). 
 

Davey Richards and Rocky Romero had a really bad match in the opener that thankfully had better matches on the show afterwards.  He wasn’t quite “a steel cage Davey Richards” yet.  But he would get there eventually.

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21 minutes ago, Brandon Bones said:

So a buddy of mine just texted me.  He just now found out Sami Zayn was El Generico.

I laughed at him.  Good times!

we need more masked guys.. partly for the wonder of these revelations

also, so that the really green NXT guys can work under masks and then they can debut as 'new' wrestlers without the stink of people seeing all their growing pains on a nationally televised developmental show

22 minutes ago, Mark said:

CDC's been making a concerted effort to change their messaging in recent weeks.  This is just one of the more obvious signs of that. 

The messaging is what it is when circumstances can change quickly and when various officials and figures can go on news shows and mention the things that they'd want but aren't happening (see Fauci mentioning vaccination mandates for flights this weekend). The CDC accidentally sunk all mask mandates back in May only to realize "hey, we might actually need to do this while inside". Lately the messaging is sort of a challenge since the recent news cycle isn't exactly what you'd want for the purposes of convincing people to get vaccinated and I guess they'd just have to position themselves in a spot for the rebound in a few weeks.

As for today, the AP managed to omit the part about reduced isolation for asymptomatic people from the headline tweet, so the rollout for this announcement could be going slightly better even if that reporting error isn't the CDC's fault.

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1 hour ago, Cobra Commander said:

we need more masked guys.. partly for the wonder of these revelations

also, so that the really green NXT guys can work under masks and then they can debut as 'new' wrestlers without the stink of people seeing all their growing pains on a nationally televised developmental show

 

Oh yeah, I was super excited when I found out who Orange Cassidy used to be in CHIKARA. Feels like in the age where everyone knows everything and who used to be who in the indies, that was a super pleasant surprise.... even though it's a little weird seeing a Colony dude in the same stable with a former FIST member.

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I just read that in addition to 12 producers, Raw has as many as 20 writers working on the show, plus Vince and whoever else.  That seems like a lot.  Too many cooks spoiling the broth and all that.

Lol, now I'm thinking of infinite monkey theorem - an infinite number of monkeys banging away randomly on a infinite number of typewriters for an infinite amount of time will eventually type out the complete works of Shakespeare - and wondering who could put together a better Raw show, Vince's writers or the monkeys?

My money is one the monkeys.  They'll eventually churn out Twelfth Night.  An infinite number of WWE writers banging away on an infinite number of laptops for an infinite amount of time would probably be lucky to write a very special episode of Saved by the Bell where Slater does drugs but kicks his habit in 23 minutes + commercials.

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1 hour ago, Nineteen said:

Oh yeah, I was super excited when I found out who Orange Cassidy used to be in CHIKARA. Feels like in the age where everyone knows everything and who used to be who in the indies, that was a super pleasant surprise.... even though it's a little weird seeing a Colony dude in the same stable with a former FIST member.

One of the reasons I want Gulak in AEW at some point is for the Colony reunion.

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13 hours ago, cwoy2j said:

98 WWF tag teams weren't great either. Granted, you didn't have Judy Bagwell as a champ there but WWF's division was basically The NAO and everyone else. Summer of 98, the WWF tag-titles were basically just story line advancers for Austin/Taker/Kane/Mankind. 

That's a Tired WWF booking trope. 2 guys can't get along, Win the tag titles over established team although they can't coexist. Happened twice with Austin in 97. Honestly the ones in 97 with Austin and Michaels and with Dude Love were the only time it worked although Michaels and Cena odd couple Champs led to the Match with Cena and Michaels vs Undertaker and Batista at No Way Out 2007

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Austin/Dude was at least more of a reluctant partnership thing. Sorta closer to "Cactus and Mikey in ECW" than to "Undertaker and Austin in Summer of 98"

They probably didn't have anything planned but I kinda wonder how they would have moved the belts off of Austin/Dude if not for Austin's neck injury. Like they're not exactly gonna have Austin/Foley job to the Godwinns through some sort of interference or something.

They had a tag team tournament leading up to the Owen/Davey Boy vs Austin/Dude match where the 8 teams were Farooq/D-Lo, Vader/Undertaker, Legion of Doom, Godwinns, Owen/Davey Boy, New Blackjacks, Headbangers, and Lawler/RVD.

Then they had a four way match for the titles at Ground Zero with the Headbangers, Legion of Doom, Godwinns, and Owen/Davey.

So perhaps the Outlaws were right on time for filling a giant void on the heel side of the Tag division

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6 hours ago, Mark said:

I just read that in addition to 12 producers, Raw has as many as 20 writers working on the show, plus Vince and whoever else.  That seems like a lot.  Too many cooks spoiling the broth and all that.

Lol, now I'm thinking of infinite monkey theorem - an infinite number of monkeys banging away randomly on a infinite number of typewriters for an infinite amount of time will eventually type out the complete works of Shakespeare - and wondering who could put together a better Raw show, Vince's writers or the monkeys?

My money is one the monkeys.  They'll eventually churn out Twelfth Night.  An infinite number of WWE writers banging away on an infinite number of laptops for an infinite amount of time would probably be lucky to write a very special episode of Saved by the Bell where Slater does drugs but kicks his habit in 23 minutes + commercials.

All I want out of a pro-wrestling show is Much Ado.

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One of the things I hate about wrestling (the internet worsened this) is when wrestlers make fans out to be fools. It's bad enough that Vince has done it for decades but jesus christ. We all knew about Carmella and Graves and they tried to say nothing was going on.  Same thing with Tay and Sammi. It was obvious to everyone they were seeing each other. Why deny it and try to make your fans look stupid?  Now for whatever reason they do a 360 and can post their "Date night" pics but can't come out and say "sorry guys you all were right?  

 

Another example is when a wrestler posts a picture in a town of a big event that they aren't booked on. People see it and say "Underaker will be here" or "Punk will be here" and the worker denies it repeatedly only to show up as a "surprise"

Raises the big question, has the internet helped or hurt pro wrestling?

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I absolutely don't care about a wrestler's love life. Who gives a fuck.

And the second point - it'd be incredibly dumb to just publicly announce on Twitter, where we've already established represents an extreme minority of fans, that they're actually going to be at an event where they're booked as a surprise. You don't blow up your own spot just because you were seen in the same town as a show, or on set for a show/movie if you're an actor. You wait for the company you're working for to officially announce it, or that event/movie/show/whatever to go live.

It's stupid that we're still asking this question, in almost 2022, about the internet and if it's helped pro wrestling. Kayfabe is stupid, and the internet has allowed individual pro wrestlers, and companies, to expand their reach and promote their brand without the need for being on weekly TV or with the help of a massive corporation like WWE (and WCW when it was around).

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When Jericho was making a surprise comeback in WWE one time, and fans spotted him arriving at the airport, he not only denied having been there, he kept rt'ing peoples photoshops of him at the Pyramids and in the Antarctic.

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I'm not gonna quote it, but man is that a gross opinion. Hey Tay Conti you wrestle on TV so fuck your privacy. You're not allowed to live your life away from da twitterverse. You owe everyone an explanation of who you fuck and why. 🙄🙄🙄 Jesus Christ lol. She's an adult. She's not required to validate your feelings of righteousness for being a creep and knowing what's going on in her personal life away from cameras. AEW as a company damn sure shouldn't validate that behavior.

Nor should anyone feel compelled to ruin a surprise debut just because someone posted an airport picture on twitter. Even if the twitter bubble consisted of 50% of all the fans viewing (it doesnt) you're advocating for ruining the experience of the other 50% of the viewing audience (it's more like 75%) and punishing them for not being all up in the scoopz on airport pictures 24/7.

Those opinions are quite a bit warped there man.

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