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All Out III - 9/5/2021


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On 9/2/2021 at 11:56 AM, Jiji said:

As for Santana and Ortiz, I'm not sure it's just bad chemistry with FTR or they waited way too long to give us these tag matches, but neither match has lived up to my very lofty expectations. I get that the first one was in a helluva tough spot following the crowd deflating Dark Order/Hangman loss but they got the prestigious opening match slot last night and, while it was better than the first, still didn't come close to the heights I was expecting.

Agreed. But Cash is obviously still very fucked up from the injury in the first match.

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1 hour ago, Shartnado said:

Considering the last (well, I have no idea how often he flies between UK and US) time he got stuck in UK for 8 months, surely PAC could have waited until the PPV before visiting home! I would have been looking forward to that match, but obviously, I won't be seeing the PPV anyway, until who knows when, so it's a moot point. Maybe they get to do it on a Dynamite or Rampage episode later on.

I wonder who takes the spot? No shortage of hot free agents, so it could be really interesting. To me, the only sufficient replacement for PAC would be Buddy "Murphy" Matthews, but I think they will go with someone else.

...at least Flips seems to be on the same wave-length. Read that after posting...

Assuming that they have Bryan Danielson lined up to appear on the show, plus likely surprise or two in the women's battle royal (Ruby Soho), I would actually put Sammy Guevara in Pac's place for the match against Andrade. Keeps free agent surprises confined to those spots, plus rewards one of your top in-house wrestlers not on the card yet. Andrade likely would still go over (and it wouldn't hurt Sammy a ton). and that would likely be a really good match (and would not need a huge amount of time either, like 12-15 minutes).

Edited by Big Z
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1 hour ago, Big Z said:

Assuming that they have Bryan Danielson lined up to appear on the show, plus likely surprise or two in the women's battle royal (Ruby Soho), I would actually put Sammy Guevara in Pac's place for the match against Andrade. Keeps free agent surprises confined to those spots, plus rewards one of your top in-house wrestlers not on the card yet. Andrade likely would still go over (and it wouldn't hurt Sammy a ton). and that would likely be a really good match (and would not need a huge amount of time either, like 12-15 minutes).

Adam Cole or it's the worst show of all time.

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30 minutes ago, Jiji said:

Adam Cole or it's the worst show of all time.

Have him cost Christian the match, Danielson debuts to close the show and maybe save Christian from a beat down, then have Kenny Omega and Adam Cole versus Christian Cage and Bryan Danielson on Dynamite. Purchase advertising time during Raw showing both Danielson and Punk. Come on TK!

I feel like you could run this after Punk versus Darby and bring the exhausted crowd back into it for a crazy finish to the show.

Edited by christopher.annino
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All of the debuts are run-ins during the cage match just to piss people off. And Christian and Brian Cage also interfere.

Punk/Darby is the main event, right? What are people's thoughts on Jericho/MJF outcome? That promo actually sold me a lil bit on the idea of Jericho retiring (from AEW, he's been specific about that whereas AEW has tried to make it sound like a flat out retirement stip). Win or lose I hope he takes a step back and isn't as much of a focal point for the company moving forward. It'll be nice to move beyond this feud that's been going on for so long regardless. What opens the show? Does QT/Wight serve as a buffer after perhaps the cage match and before the main event?

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I think the title match still goes on last.

Jericho probably wins? 

And I actually think Darby wins. If I'm the booker though, that move makes me really nervous. Darby becomes a made man with that win, but does it happening in Chicago hurt Darby more than it helps him? How much would it deflate the crowd if Darby wins? Punk winning just seems too obvious and that's for a company that paints by the numbers as much as AEW does when it comes to booking.

Also, if Punk wins and does the handshake deal with Darby post match, does it make Darby look like more of a loser?

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As for match order, TK leans into hammering fans with one big match after another. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if the final three are the cage match, Punk match, and finally the AEW title match. 

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I don't think Darby losing to Punk takes anything away from him, especially in Chicago. As long as it seems like he gives the hometown boy a run for his money, I think he'll still look good in the end if he takes the fall.

I'm not really sure which way the Jericho match goes, it's nicely unpredictable...

I think the title match goes on last because of anybody can bring the crowd back into it, it's Omega and Christian with the anticipation of Danielson showing up.

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1 minute ago, christopher.annino said:

Also I know it won't happen but I would shed a tear of happiness if Kojima enters the ring and gets showered in baguettes from the audience.

Or throw Wonder bread at him like he's a pigeon.

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21 minutes ago, Craig H said:

And I actually think Darby wins. If I'm the booker though, that move makes me really nervous. Darby becomes a made man with that win, but does it happening in Chicago hurt Darby more than it helps him? How much would it deflate the crowd if Darby wins? Punk winning just seems too obvious and that's for a company that paints by the numbers as much as AEW does when it comes to booking.

This is the Japanese booking philosophy. Punk has been out of the ring for seven years and Darby has been hungry and is more than ready to go at this point. I don't think they do it because it would probably kill the crowd as you said. I'm fascinated by the match from the perspective of seeing where Punk is at and the outcome. Still more excited for Miro/Kingston but I'm in the minority understandably. But yeah, I don't want Darby to shake hands afterwards. They've done that enough with him with Moxley and he's got to be beyond it at this point.

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On 9/2/2021 at 12:46 PM, Jiji said:

Andrade can beat Austin (with outside interference) but no way should he beat Da Man, Colten Gunn. 

Colten Gunn is Hook for the working man.

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  • Mox starts them off hot, save the important stuff for later
  • QT gets squashed by Don't call me BS after some attempted trickery
  • Sloppy battle royal
  • Miro vs Kingston 
  • Jericho vs MJF oh god please let Max win
  • Baker vs Statlander
  • Cage match
  • Tag title match, put it on after Omega to give people a whiff of a possible big title change regardless of the result
  • CM Punk returns, goes over decisively, the people go banana, maybe a surprise who knows 

Something like that. I'm probably wrong about everything. Maybe have the Gunn Club come out after the QT squash so the people feel like they got their money's worth. 

When they have a world title match with no chance of a title change and something else that's big and could produce one, I'd like to start seeing some title bouts go on after the main men's single title. That is if they have any interest in presenting the illusion of parity among the belts. I'd put the women's belt over the men's world belt in the future too. Not now, 'cause it's just Statlander and it's now. But that Rosa-Britt rematch is coming down the road...

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A thing I can't figure out about Darby/Punk, is whether Sting's promo about not being ringside is blatant lampshading, foreshadowing, or legitimately just a way to keep the focus 100% on the match, and not even tease the slightest possibility of interference. I'm virtually certain it's the latter. But of course the trope is that anytime you're promised that interference can't and isn't happening, it definitely is. And no one was thinking that Sting was going to get involved anyway. And even if you did want him to leave ringside, he could have just done it, rather than promising that he would ahead of time. (But I really do think there's nothing to be made of all this, that Punk will win a competitive, clean match.)

As for Jericho, I think it's interesting that TK mentioned the cruise isn't an official AEW event. So, Jericho could keep booking himself even if he loses. 

I'm not convinced that a lack of title changes matters, here. The theory that there should be one is mostly to make the crowd feel they saw something important, and got an "I was there moment" worth erupting for and remembering. They're going to get Punk's first match at the very least, and maybe an enormous debut or two also, which I think fulfills that emotional register. 

Edited by Beech27
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14 minutes ago, mystman said:

I don't think Darby-Punk is going to have a clean finish. They're setting something up with 2.0 and Garcia. I think they're working with someone else, I just don't know who.

I think that would be a dumb fuck WWE move, not you just them should they do it. Large majority of people buying this PPV for that match. Just have Punk go over clean. It's fine.

Edited by Jiji
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4 hours ago, Shartnado said:

Considering the last (well, I have no idea how often he flies between UK and US) time he got stuck in UK for 8 months, surely PAC could have waited until the PPV before visiting home! I would have been looking forward to that match,

Meltzer seems to think there's more to it and has compared it to the Sasha Banks/Summerslam situation.

 

“There was one major change to the show, as the Andrade vs. Pac match is off. We had been told that one of the matches, but not one of the main events, was off due to a health situation with one of the wrestlers. AEW didn’t confirm that but the next day Khan tweeted that the match was off because of a travel situation involving one of the performers, which was later confirmed to being Pac.

“It is likely the two reports are related because travel issues being known days ahead would seem to point to those issues and obviously a pure travel issue is not going to keep someone off a PPV unless it’s something that happens at the last minute, and even so, they are going to have people in town for this show shooting angles days ahead of time. AEW does not generally release specific medical information on talent.”

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If it's me, Darby vs Punk main events. You have a 30 minute time limit. They go to a draw. 5 more minutes. It's still a draw. Second over time and one of them wins clean. Take your pick. This protects them both as virtual equals. I'd go with Punk over. Darby gets made to look equal and can survive the loss. Punk gets the story beat of "wow do I still have it? Sure I won, but just fucking barely." Then the handshake. Post match 2.0 & Garcia beat down. PPV ends on Bryan Danielson making the save and beating the shit out of Daniel Garcia for our enjoyment.

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Damn, i hope Pac is okay.

The only interference I could see happening is jabroni 2.0 and Garcia come out and it leads to a momentary alliance and Darby n Punk go back to fighting after dispatching the goobers. I still don't think that is necessary at all though and overcomplicates what should be a straight forward big moment.

@NoFistsJustFlipsYou think Punk can go 30-40 out of the gate with all the adrenaline of first match back and it being Chicago too? He's super smart in the ring but I find it hard to see a compelling 30 minute Darby Allin match without a lot of wasted space. 

Intriguing match whatever happens because it could go in so many different directions.

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I do think he can last 45mins. Maybe if he had a super fast paced cruiser style to begin with I could see that as an issue. Or if he hadn't been working on any cardio since he left. But MMA training is grueling on cardio. So his normal style, being able to spend a few minutes here and there soaking in the most likely crazy loud crowd reactions, a couple breaks for each overtime... I think he'd be fine. A lot of what I expect the match to be is the old Michaels vs Diesel strategy of a pinball bumping around a stationary object. I don't mean that as a slight. I mean that as in Darby will be doing all kinds of craziness and most of Punk's stuff will be counters to the craziness / trying to slow him down. Take a full minute or two to setup his top rope elbow, he misses, big sell, Darby pinballs a series of offense. Ends with him missing. More selling / holy shit chants for the crash & burns. I think Darby is the perfect guy for his return match to be against in that sense.

I'd be less confident if it wasn't in Chicago. But that crowd is gonna be giving Punk everything they got and that adrenaline can carry a dude.

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