SirSmUgly Posted July 14 Author Share Posted July 14 (edited) Show #193 – 14 June 1999 “The one which suggests the hypothesis that Rick Steiner is a harbinger of doom for a show's quality” After a quick review of the 83 Weeks episode on GAB ’99, I learned that Eric Bischoff was actually quite high on the show's quality and thought the dumb dog attack spot was neat, which explains a lot about why he was relieved of his position about three months from that show’s original airing. There are no angles or feuds right now that I’m looking forward to and a few angles and feuds right now that I’m dreading (WTR/No Limit, whatever the hell the Steiners and Sting are doing, Piper/Bagwell). That’s really the problem. I would have loved it if they just put the belt on Savage and had him spend the next month surviving title defenses on Nitro through Team Madness gaga, jibber jabber, and unadulterated fuckery. That would have helped. Speaking of that last group, they arrive at the MCI Center in DC right before we hit the title sequence. It looks like Virgil and Crush are going to face Curt Hennig and Barry Windham (w/Bobby Duncum Jr.). Hold on a second, I have a vague memory of Virgil being part of the WTR as “Curly Bill” all of a sudden. It’s weird how often random things pop up out of the recesses of my mind while I watch these shows, stuff I didn’t even think I knew. Tony S. and Bobby H. talk about how many tiny groups and stables are popping up and how they can strategically use the Freebird Rule. I think the Freebird Rule is one of my favorite tropes in pro wrestling, and I agree wholeheartedly that it makes some of the potential match combinations between these potential stable feuds more interesting. They talk about Sid and Savage and Piper and Flair and Buff throughout this match, which is fine because it is so freakin’ BORING, man, no one in this ring does much for me. Sorry, Barry Windham fans. I enjoyed him in 1988, at least! There’s not a babyface team here, so Virgil is the Wrestler in Peril, mostly because he’s exactly the wrestler in this ring who you’d expect would spend his time in peril, at least according to kayfabe. Windham and Hennig kick the shit out of this guy for a long time. I guess it works! Virgil counters a vertical suplex with one of his own, and the crowd applauds. He actually follows it up with a couple of nice lariats before making the hot tag. Crush gets two on a legdrop to Windham, but Hennig comes in and clears him out. The match breaks down and the nWo, once again outnumbered, falls to the numbers game. Duncum yanks Crush – the legal man, mind you – out of the ring, and Windham takes Duncum’s bullrope, points the ref over to Duncum and Crush brawling outside the ring, and then tags Virgil – NOT the legal man, mind you – with the cowbell end of the rope. Windham covers for three, and boy oh boy, was that match a) mostly a snoozer and b) too damned long. I will say that though I noted that Virgil was not the legal man, I actually don’t mind it that much. Anderson lost control of the match and simply lost track of who the legal man was. Refs fuck up all the time in real sports, after all. There’s a pre-recorded press conference to introduce Master P to WCW, which I LOVE because Okerlund has to say, “I Miss My Homies” when introducing Mr. Miller, and my only sadness is that they didn’t make him also mention another Master P hit, “Make ‘Em Say Ugh.” Bischoff said the title on the 83 Weeks episode about GAB ’99, though! It was great! He said it like this: “Make Them Say Uh.” As a Black American who has been described by one linguistics major as talking like a, and I quote, “local Midwestern newscaster from Nebraska,” I got a kick out of it. It reminded me of one of the funniest Boondocks bits. Take it away, Riley Freeman: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXvADWAPJ0M Man, I love Regina King. Anyway, even though when it came to Southern rap families in the late ‘90s, The Dungeon Family > Cash Money > No Limit, I enjoyed a couple of Master P records, as well as a couple of Silkk the Shocker, C-Murder, and Mystikal records, back in the day. Master P is a legit wrestling fan, and I think it’s too bad that WCW put him and the No Limit Soldiers in a no-win situation angle-wise as I and zendragon have both pointed out elsewhere in this thread. I’m not sure Eric Bischoff gets it, though. I don’t think it’s some sort of obfuscating stupidity thing; I just don’t think Bisch is a very deep thinker, the more I listen to him. Team Madness, minus Sid, comes to the ring. Savage does some idiosyncratic bragging: “Last night, I was crowned the uncrowned undisputed world heavyweight champion of all time.” That is an amazing sentence if you want to try and parse it. He feels ripped off that he’s not holding the gold right now. He dropped the Savage Elbow and should have won, but he’s not happy about the ref’s count or something. He shares his version of the events of GAB ‘99’s main event. Savage is hilarious. He says that all the ladies in the ring are his witnesses that he beat Nash. He calls Madusa the “all-time women’s wrestling champion.” He says that Mona “beat 25,937 other women” to become Miss Madness while Mona blows on her fist and polishes it off. Then, he announces that Gorgeous George is retiring from wrestling as the only undefeated wrestler ever. This is like when Bart Simpson retired from a boxing video game (IIRC) before Homer could beat him. Anyway, Savage has decided to be entertaining on the mic tonight, which I appreciate. Gorgeous George quite lasciviously gets down on the mat to portray Kevin Nash while Savage covers her and Madusa counts three. Savage is determined to get that belt from Nash and says that he’s going to be “unbelievably VICIOUS.” He proclaims himself the uncrowned champ once more and gets a fifty-fifty response from the crowd. He’s got two more words for Kevin Nash: 1. THE; 2. WOLFPAC; 3. SUCKS. Then he has some more words after those before he finally leaves the ring. The Nitro Girls dance. That’s a pretty fun watch! Sting and Rick Steiner stills from GAB are next. That’s not a pretty fun watch! When listing off feuds that I really don’t want any part of, I forgot this Billy Kidman/Hugh Morrus feud. No thanks. I assume that Konnan and Rey Misterio Jr. peel away from fighting the WTR to end up forming the Filthy Animals so they can feud with the First Family for three months or whatever. Yuck either way. When Rey and Kidman were tag champs, they had a lot of backing from the crowd, and especially the ladies. They were like a Rock ‘n Rolls for the ‘90s. I don’t think that team had a ton of longevity because the dudes in the crowd would be quick to turn on them, but you could have had them be a team for four or five months, fending off tag challenges from the other teams until one heel team finally finishes their run. See, that’s where having a team like KroniK formed earlier than 2000 would have been nice; you give Kidman and Rey a run into September or October, debut KroniK in August and let them kill guys, and then they murder Kidman and Rey for the gold at Fall Brawl or Halloween Havoc. Let me leave my fantasy booking aside to tell you about this match. Morrus dominates, Kidman fires up with headscissors and dropkicks, and Morrus takes things outside. A chair gets involved in the proceedings. Kidman prepares to use it, but gets tangled up with Jimmy Hart instead of just using the chair while Hart has the ref’s attention. Morrus jumps him and hits a press slam that drops Kidman on the chair. Then, he closes the chair and puts it flat on the mat so that he can powerbomb Kidman. I bet you can guess how that goes for him. Kidman follows up with an SSP for the victory to a BIG pop, and let me tell you, these crowds are fucking hot for this guy. He really did get quite over in a way that I think I realized at the time, but totally sort of forgot or obscured later on down the road. It’s kind of like Jericho’s 1998. I hadn’t seen it in a long time, thought maybe it was overrated as the memories faded, then saw it again and realized that no, it was like I initially remembered. Gene Okerlund is in the ring to interview Ric Flair (w/Arn Anderson). Flair admires himself on the NitroTron, then rants about how cool he is and how great his life is in between threatening/threatening to fuck the mothers of various crowd members. I guess he and Roddy Piper’s on-again, off-again relationship is now squarely set to ON. Flair asks Piper to join him in the ring and accept the position of WCW’s new VP. Charles Robinson can’t really fulfill the duties of said position right now, so it’s logical. Flair even went out and got some pipers (not “bagpipists,” duh) to play Roddy to the ring. I really don’t get Roddy’s continuing overness. I hear a faint RODDY chant for a second or two, even. Do you want to know why I don’t get Roddy’s continuing overness? Here’s one example, straight from Piper’s mouth himself: “Those bagpipers, I ain’t heard that much wind passed since Bam Bam Bigelow ate a burrito at Taco Bell, man.” Yeah, I’m going to be a judge of TRUE WRESTLING FANDOM right now. Any fan who cheers for this man or chants his name has bad taste in pro wrestling. B. A. D. Piper accepts the position., though not before Flair insists that Roddy will fuck many of the crowd’s mothers and also Hillary. Yuck. Piper does some unfortunate political “humor” and then hates on the young guys in the back. Then he does some more unfortunate political “humor.” I will say that Flair makes me laugh when Piper asks about what happens if Flair is incapacitated. Flair’s response: “At my age, I might fall over right now.” Heh. Dean Malenko stomps down to complain about this unholy alliance. OK, if they are insisting on doing this young-versus-old angle, Dean Malenko is not a guy you want heading it. I can only imagine how much better it would have been if Chris Jericho was cutting promos on Flair and Piper. That’s the guy you want doing the bulk of the talking for the young dudes. My belief that Jericho was WCW’s biggest loss to WWF during this era only grows stronger with each show. Malenko with his widows peak and lined forehead looks like he should be joining up with the old dudes himself. He comes out and basically is like, WOW Y’ALL ARE OLD, IT’S THE SAME OLD SHIT HERE IN WCW, but in a totally uncharismatic way. The crowd is sort of behind him, though. See, part of the issue is that the fans like some of the young guys and some of the old guys, so they don’t want to root against either party. This tepid mic battle ends with the old guys jumping Malenko. Buff Bagwell runs down and fights all three old dudes off for the save, initially, but they finally win the numbers game. We get a split screen; Saturn and Benoit see the carnage on a monitor and rush to help, but are jumped backstage by the Jersey Triad. Imagine this angle, but with Rock and Stone Cold on the young dudes’ side along with Jericho. Fuck yeah. Not possible for obvious reasons, but watching those three eviscerate Piper on the mic would be a fun watch. Dammit, Bischoff’s joined commentary. I didn’t think it necessary, but WCW’s going to hopefully end this Cat/Scott Norton feud tonight. I am entirely too excited for babyface Commissioner Cat coming to the ring with Ms. Jones. Oh man. There’s a lot I love about 2000 WCW, actually. I’m pretty excited to get there and see that stuff. Miller grabs a mic and promises to finish Norton off tonight since he didn’t get that chance last night. “Rockhouse” plays, but then the music stops. Miller crows that Norton is scared of him and doesn’t see Norton spring to the ring and jump him. Norton mows down the Cat and as Bischoff talks about the great shape Norton is in, I think he’s not exaggerating. Norton has toned up and slimmed down, but he still looks like a walking beer keg with limbs and a head. We get a wandering brawl outside as the Cat tries to get some space and finds none. Back in the ring, Cat finagles an eye rake, then lands a dropkick to Norton’s knee. He throws a flurry of kicks at Norton’s knee, but Norton works through them and hits a chop and a body slam. Sonny Onoo senses trouble and grabs the ref’s attention so that the Cat can low blow Norton. The Cat rolls outside and puts a slipper on. He misses his kick and ducks a couple of lariats, but the ref is wiped out by the last lariat. Bischoff mocks Jim Ross’s calls on martial arts kicks like a doofus as Onoo hops in the ring and hits Norton on the back with the crowbar. The Cat covers and the ref crawls over, but he only counts two before Norton kicks out. Groggily, Norton gets to his feet and goes after Onoo, who hops off the apron. Norton turns around, eats a Cat superkick with the loaded slipper, and this time can’t kick out before the ref counts to three. We go to break before Miller can dance. BOOOOOO. The Nitro Girls dance. Disco Inferno comes out and also dances. Bischoff promises an upcoming Nitro Girls search. Are the Nitro Girls around until the very end? I don’t remember them being there in 2001, but I do remember a few of them ending up as valets and managers, like Sharmell. They’re going to feed Disco to Van Hammer, I think. Look, as DVDVR’s self-proclaimed foremost Van Hammer fan, even I don’t think this is a great idea. Disco actually has enough credibility that you’d only want to feed him to someone who is more over than Van Hammer. Before Hammer and Disco lock up, Tony S. announces an eight-man tag for later tonight between Ric Flair, Roddy Piper, DDP, and Kanyon on one side and Malenko, Benoit, Saturn, and Buff Bagwell on the other. Bischoff is like SEE, WE’RE THROWING SOME YOUNG GUYS OUT THERE IN THE MAIN EVENT A BIG NITRO MATCH, STOP COMPLAINING. Hammer dominates with power, and again, I don’t understand why people act like this guy is some example of shitty work. It’s not 1992 anymore. He’s actually a solid hand. Is he, like Horace Hogan, dependent on the level of the guy he’s working? Yes. I’m not saying he’s a world-beater. But he’s fun when he’s facing a fun worker. It’s funny because Raven’s Flock breaking up was good for Kidman, and very bad for everyone else in the Flock. Some of these guys need to be the heavy in a group. They can be effective in those roles. Disco makes a comeback after early Hammer domination and stomps a mudhole in the corner. Disco stumbles Hammer with a back elbow, then follows up with a lariat for two. Disco shoots Hammer in and tries a leapfrog, but Hammer catches him and lands a spinebuster. Hammer doesn’t go for the cover, instead choosing to bash Disco’s head into the canvas, land a couple of elbows, and choke Disco. Hammer doesn’t press his advantage enough, in kayfabe, as Tony S. notes. Bischoff well-wishes Bret on commentary while Hammer lands a legdrop to the small of Disco’s back and continues to beat Disco down. Disco tries to make a comeback, but gets cut off. Hammer locks on a sleeper while the crowd chants for GOLDBERG. Disco counters with jawbreaker, but runs himself into a chokebomb. Disco tries to fight up with punches, but Hammer digs his fingers into Disco’s eyes. Disco side-steps a Hammer charge and then, oh yeah, here's why everyone says Hammer sucks, Hammer blows a swinging neckbreaker. Disco continues his assault, lands a second rope elbow, and gets two. Disco tries a Chartbuster, but gets shoved out of it and into the ref. Disco hits a swinging neckbreaker, but the ref’s not there to count it. Disco goes to talk to the ref, and Hammer creeps up from behind, hits a back suplex, and covers Disco while holding the tights for three. I think that’s somehow a worse finish than if Hammer just won this match outright. He looks weak and Disco still lost anyway. If you’re protecting Disco in a loss to Van Hammer, what are you doing, really? Disco Chartbusters the ref in frustration. Fit Finlay faces Brian Knobbs (w/Jimmy Hart). I do like that there’s been a lot of wrestling and not so many bad promos or vignettes. The promos they’ve had have been entertaining or served to move an angle along or both. This is a much better Nitro than they’ve lately put on, at least so far. One thing about 1999 WCW is that a non-descript Nitro that isn’t particularly great, but that isn’t particularly bad just comes off so much better because of the utter dreck that WCW usually serves up. Finlay jumps Knobbs outside the ring as Knobbs jaws at the crowd. Finlay is so much better than Knobbs that I don’t get why he isn’t getting the push that Knobbs is getting. I mean, I do get it, I understand why, but you know what I’m saying. They brawl around ringside and clear out the ring steps. Bischoff insists that the driver of the Hummer wasn’t Sid, but a woman. This is so dumb. Sid makes perfect sense as the driver. Why would you not just take that obvious storyline track? You know what, I’m ignoring this dumb shit. Bischoff was wrong in kayfabe. Sid was driving the Hummer. Great, now I don’t have to wonder who was driving the Hummer. Back in the ring, there’s a tepid brawl and a Pit Stop. Knobbs does land a nice floatover powerslam on a charging Finlay in there, so let me credit him for that. The match goes back outside the ring for a second as Jimmy Hart gets involved, then re-enters the ring. Knobbs misses a splash, and Finlay comes back with a legdrop, a sit-down splash, and a rolling fireman’s carry slam. He misses a corner charge, though, and posts himself. Bischoff talks about how many guys are out injured right now, and that makes me wonder why DDP’s been sort of shunted down the card and out of the world title scene or why Sting is mired in a heatless feud with Rick fucking Steiner, of all people. In the ring, there’s a convoluted spot in which Knobbs runs into a chair wielded by Jimmy Hart and then Hak runs down and whacks Knobbs with a kendo stick besides. Finlay covers for three. Well, I’m glad Finlay at least got a win. Hey, look, it’s Sable Rena Mero. She’s sitting in the front row while Bischoff is like WOW I KNOW HER FROM THAT ONE PLAYBOY ISSUE, YOU KNOW THE ONE, LEGAL WON’T ALLOW ME TO SAY HER STAGE OR ACTUAL NAME, BUT YOU KNOW, YOU GET IT. Ooh, how edgy. Kevin Nash comes to the ring for an interview. He is partially interrupted by SABLE chants for a little bit, which is kinda funny. Anything for a pop, huh Bischoff? Desperate used car salesman Bischoff on commentary reminds me of Dennis Reynolds trying to hold it together when a nineteen-year-old woman that he’s hitting on points out his hair plugs. Nash asserts that he who has the gold is the champ and that Savage is delusional or on drugs, maybe on both. Why do they keep showing shots of Sable Rena Mero during this interview? It’s so dumb. Nash calls out Sid and challenges him to a title match later tonight. Sid responds on the NitroTron. He yells a lot, and it’s cool. Sid agrees to the match is the long and short of things. The eight-man tag is up next. It starts as an eight-person brawl in the ring, and the babyfaces do the business to the heels and clear the ring. The crowd seems to be behind the young babyfaces. I still think reactions are a bit muted, though. Other than Page and Kanyon, crowds actually want to cheer the bulk of the guys in this match, at least in most of the cities that WCW goes to. The match settles down. Flair and Benoit have a chop-fest that Benoit wins. Benoit runs over Flair, then catches Page in a Crippler Crossface when he runs in to try and score a cheap shot at Benoit. The match settles down again and Buff out-punches Piper before the match sort of breaks down again, but the ring is clear again and Piper eats punches from Buff, then punches from everyone in the babyface corner. Piper calls for time out, and Flair runs in and kicks Buff in the knee. Buff is dragged back into he heel corner as we go to break. After the break, Buff apparently got himself out of trouble because Benoit is scoring flash pinfalls on Ric Flair. He and Flair try another bridge spot and Benoit struggles with it again. That’s another thousand Hindu squats backstage after the match for him! Benoit is sort of the FIP, but he gets a lot of flash pinfalls and scores an enziguri, so it never seems like he’s in that much trouble. He wraps Flair in a Figure Four. Page comes in and tries to break it up, but gets put in a Figure Four by Saturn. Malenko and Buff do the same to Kanyon and Piper respectively, and as contrived as the spot feels, it’s very over with the crowd. The ref has no clue where to look, so he doesn’t see Bam Bam, standing at ringside, jump in the ring and break up the Benoit Figure Four. Benoit plays FIP, and takes more damage befitting that role than he did before. Kanyon hits a top-rope Rocker Dropper, for example. Benoit takes some more abuse for a few minutes that is perfectly acceptable heel control. Page and Kanyon have some nice double-team moves, which really helps things. Benoit makes a tag that the ref misses, but shortly after, he gets boots up on a Page dive and is able to make a hot tag to Buff. It’s interesting because Buff is very over with one specific section of the crowd that you can see in the camera shot. The rest of the crowd isn’t really reacting. The match breaks down and everyone brawls outside the ring except for Flair and Malenko, who brawl in the ring. Flair is distracted by Malenko; he shoulderblocks Malenko away, then turns around and into a Blockbuster that gets three. The crowd does pop for that. I think this is why the young/old feud isn’t going to work. If you have a bunch of guys who are still being treated as babyfaces by the crowd, it’s just not going to get over. Flair and Piper are just too entrenched as legends to garner any real heel heat from most of these crowds. Hak (w/Chastity) faces Rick Steiner. Yuck. Bischoff comments on Chastity’s looks and talks shit to Hak about not having a cigarette this week. Double yuck. Rick and Scott think WCW sucks, but Rick Steiner comes down in a WCW ring crew jacket. OK. Ricky jumps Hak and beats the shit out of him. This is a real bummer. They quickly brawl to the back so that Hak can crash into stuff. They get on top of a truck and Tony S. says THIS IS A NITRO FIRST! A FIGHT ON TOP OF A VEHICLE! No, we will not erase the memory of the 4/29/96 (Show #33) Nitro's Fit Finlay/Steven Regal vehicle brawl. WE WILL NOT. That match ruled hard and had a piledriver on top of a tiny little Datsun or Honda or something that looked insanely dangerous. This brawl sucks, man. It’s boring as hell. Hak tries hard by bumping off the truck and diving into shit. It’s not his fault. None of this crappy WCW run he’s had is his fault. I assume Steiner’s jacket is because he’s going to take some sort of dumb spot or maybe a vulture attack from Sting or some shit. Let’s hurry up and get to whatever it is already. The men fight on top of another vehicle, and Sting pops out of the cab and tosses Rick through the gimmicked side of a trailer. Sting marches Ricky through the backstage area and into the arena, which pops for Sting and also probably for getting to watch some action right in front of them and not on the screen. Sting pokes Ricky in the gut with his baseball bat, then just leaves the guy laying there to go to the ring and cut a promo. Sting quotes, um, Jim Carrey in Batman Forever. He tells a couple of dad jokes. What is happening right now? What exactly is happening? Sting drops the mic, then goes back to Ricky Steiner on ramp and hits Ricky with the bat while Bischoff does a bad baseball PBP man impression. Sting picks Ricky Steiner up and carries him away as we go to break. Everything Rick Steiner is involved with is just awful, man. It’s all so bad. This guy has been the common denominator in a bunch of shitty angles, segments, and promos for well over a year now. La Parka and Psicosis tag up together against Rey Misterio Jr. and Konnan (w/No Limit Soldiers). Were they using a No Limit joint as entrance music? I ask because the Konnan theme drowns out all other noise and was clearly dubbed over the top of this entrance. Let me check while Konnan does his Catchphrase Roulette. OK, it’s “Hoody Hoo.” Aw, that would be a better theme IMO, but they won’t even pay money for the Cat’s theme, so I get why they dubbed over it. This match is fine. Rey and Psicosis have a fine little opening exchange. Konnan and Rey end up controlling the ring, and hey, I think that’s Brad Armstrong out there with the NLS. Konnan switches things up by playing FIP for a little bit. Bischoff yammers on and on about what a game changer this Master P deal is. So desperate. I’d be too embarrassed to listen back to these commentary spots if I were Bischoff. Then again, I do have a modicum of shame. But yeah, listening to Bischoff, it’s pretty clear why Schiller ended up making a change. This guy Bischoff is losing it. The babyfaces come back and hit stereo suicide dives to a super-muted pop. This crowd just seems tired or bored at this point. Konnan gets back into trouble for a bit, but he works out of it, Rey hits a Bronco Buster on Psicosis, and then Konnan and Rey get a double pin off a sit-out facebuster for Konnan and a top-rope rana for Rey. The WTR comes out and plays their terrible theme over at the DJ booth, then run off after the NLS chases them away. Master P cuts a promo once they leave and then plays “Hoody Hoo,” which is not dubbed over. I’m done with this angle. Please just end it now. Are there going to be two, three more months of this? I’m bummed out. Michael Buffer is here with about eight minutes to go. Sid and Nash come to the ring. Actually, Sid doesn’t even come down there; Savage does. Michael Buffer’s Ring Announcing Quality Control: It’s Team Madness, not Team Savage. Okay, that one might not be official; how did Team Madness get its name? From the fans? Anyway, Buffer was generally fine. Savage demands that Nash hand him the big gold. Three minutes remain in the show. I guess we’re getting the ol’ bait-and-switch, huh? Nash makes to hand Savage the belt, then drops it as Savage reaches for it and throws punches. The bell rings, so is this a match, or something? Nash hits a big boot. George gets in the ring and distracts Nash; Savage low blows him, but gets cleared out when he holds Nash in place for a Mona missile dropkick and Nash ducks away. Madusa gets in and tries a kick, but Nash catches her leg. Sid runs down; Nash meets him with knees, but falls to the numbers game. The crowd chants for GOLDBERG as we get a two-man beatdown of Nash. Sting runs in for a very late save to a huge pop because, like GOLDBERG, Sting is an extremely over babyface and should be the champ right now rather than Nash. This show went from mediocre to bad, and it did so when Rick Steiner showed up. Coincidence? Probably, but it’s enough to make you wonder. 1.5 out of 5 Stinger Splashes. Edited August 15 by SirSmUgly 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirSmUgly Posted July 14 Author Share Posted July 14 2 hours ago, caley said: I was REALLY irked by the WCW Hardcore divison at the time, maybe moreso now. As a guy who couldn't watch ECW at the time, I was blown away by the ECW mini-invasion (Sabu and RVD in particular) in WWF and thought the Hardcore division was great. It did start out really well in the WWF! I think Mick Foley specifically took it seriously, which helped big-time to establish the division. Quote So when WCW brought in Hak (Whom I knew of on reputation) and seemed to be building a Hardcore division around him, I thought it was great. And when he started battling Bam Bam (who had ECW experience and I was super into at the time), I was all-in. That they had Raven and Kanyon in Hak's intro vignettes made me think they'd come co-mingle there, and the hiring of Mikey Whipwreck (who iirc was hired specifically to learn how to make that collapsible ring dealy) had me all excited and...then Brian Knobbs strolled in, then Hugh Morrus and then Fit Finlay (Whom I was a few years away from truly appreciating). And Knobbs seemed to ALWAYS win, and the few times he didn't, it was because of something screwy. Using this division as a vehicle for a Knobbs push in 1999 is insane. Completely bananas. And you are right; except for Bam Bam, Knobbs is pushed stronger than the rest of the division. I also do note that Hak showed up, hung out with Raven, and Raven looked longingly at a Roddy Piper promo photo...and none of that was ever addressed again. Man, WCW's booking of secondary angles pretty much went completely south after Jericho's Cruiserweight Championship run and Eddy/Chavo ended. Quote The crowd liked Hak, partially on his ECW rep and partially because he did a handful of things that weren't prevalent on the big rosters), and he should have been the big goofy babyface of the division even without the smoking/drinking entrance he had that great "drunk uncle at a party"-energy and mixture of insane disregard for his own body that the crowd would have cheered him battling guys like Bam Bam; you could have Raven mentoring Kanyon into the hardcore style; you could have used Mikey in the same way they did in ECW as a perennial underdog who runs from everyone; mix in the various big guys with nothing to do (Hammer, Enos, Wrath, Scott Norton as a hardcore guy who refuses to use weapons because he doesn't need them would have been funny) and you'd have a perfectly entertaining little segment for every show. The other thing is that they took an ETERNITY to actually bring in a belt. Hak and Chastity were over, so they spent their time jobbing Hak to anyone and everyone for three straight months. I also LOVE your idea for Norton. That's a fantastic little character/booking idea for Norton in the hardcore division. Norton proclaiming that he's the only weapon he needs would have ruled. And I thought they were going to present a new WCW Hardcore Championship belt back at Spring Stampede, so yeah. Quote I actually kind of think that they brought in the hardcore division because WWE had one but the agents in the back had absolutely no interest in running one, so they basically just said "Go out and hit each other for five minutes and get lost" because it had no direction whatsoever. The WWE hardcore stuff definitely grew tiresome, but they had enough deviation from the routine that it kept it generally interesting. This times a thousand. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curt McGirt Posted July 14 Share Posted July 14 12 hours ago, zendragon said: One of the big problems with The West Texas Outlaws/Rednecks was you have a group of cowboys booked as heels in a former Southern/NWA promotion. That was never going to quite work It was pre-Russo so you can't blame it on making fun of the South. If it was Nash it was him making a natural enemy for the rappers he was fans of. I think Sullivan's Committee of Darkness was after the No Limit Soldiers and them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caley Posted July 15 Share Posted July 15 9 hours ago, SirSmUgly said: No, we will not erase the memory of the 4/29/96 Nitro's Fit Finlay/Steven Regal vehicle brawl. WE WILL NOT. That match ruled hard and had a piledriver on top of a tiny little Datsun or Honda or something that looked insanely dangerous. Is that the match where Bischoff flips out about how violent it is and keeps yelling at the cameraman to pull back?! But he also does in kind of a smug way like he's expecting the fans to be on his side: "That's right, Bisch! We don't want to see something violent!" I loved that match almost as much as them murdering each other on WCWSN I forgot to mention the Mexican Hardcore match from a page or so back blew my mind live because it was so much more violent than anything going on in WCW or WWF at the time with luchadors getting hit out of the air like baseballs with steel chairs and the sickening last power bomb on the chairs. So I'd bring it up anytime I got into a "Hidden Gems" type discssion, and then when we had a Best WCW matches way back in the day at Smarks Choice, I got all excited to put it really high, watched it back and was rather non-plussed. It's was still pretty violent, but it was also kind of a mess and I seem to remember the announcers laughing as guys were scrambling each others' brains. And, yet again, those are a couple more guys they could've thrown in the hardcore division, Damien for sure would have sacrificed himself nonsensically to get the division over. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zendragon Posted July 15 Share Posted July 15 11 hours ago, Curt McGirt said: It was pre-Russo so you can't blame it on making fun of the South. If it was Nash it was him making a natural enemy for the rappers he was fans of. I think Sullivan's Committee of Darkness was after the No Limit Soldiers and them? I would probably put the blame on Bischoff breaking in to wrestling in the AWA and miss understanding WCW historical base ( which could probably be a topic unto itself) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curt McGirt Posted July 15 Share Posted July 15 That depends if Bischoff was still booking then. I'm thinking it was the Nash era right then. You want to talk about an unheralded gem watch the pre-junkyard brawl Regal/Finlay match at one of the PPVs. INSANELY violent. I remember Finlay just palm-striking Regal right in the nose, nobody does that and it looks so vicious. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirSmUgly Posted July 15 Author Share Posted July 15 9 hours ago, caley said: Is that the match where Bischoff flips out about how violent it is and keeps yelling at the cameraman to pull back?! But he also does in kind of a smug way like he's expecting the fans to be on his side: "That's right, Bisch! We don't want to see something violent!" I loved that match almost as much as them murdering each other on WCWSN Yeah, back in Show #33, which I should edit into the original post, actually. Bischoff seemed more worried about showing Regal bleeding from his head than smug about it, IIRC; he's really trying not to piss off Turner by being too violent or whatever. Quote I forgot to mention the Mexican Hardcore match from a page or so back blew my mind live because it was so much more violent than anything going on in WCW or WWF at the time with luchadors getting hit out of the air like baseballs with steel chairs and the sickening last power bomb on the chairs. So I'd bring it up anytime I got into a "Hidden Gems" type discssion, and then when we had a Best WCW matches way back in the day at Smarks Choice, I got all excited to put it really high, watched it back and was rather non-plussed. It's was still pretty violent, but it was also kind of a mess and I seem to remember the announcers laughing as guys were scrambling each others' brains. And, yet again, those are a couple more guys they could've thrown in the hardcore division, Damien for sure would have sacrificed himself nonsensically to get the division over. Heenan is the weak link, IMO. Tony S. chuckling and Heenan chuckling read as two different things. Tony S. seems to be chuckling in disbelief. Heenan's forced chuckling just sounds like he's laughing at the competitors for being goofs. It pains me to talk about what a massive negative Heenan is at this point in his run. One of the low-key issues with WCW is that they never really had a strong color commentator in position on Nitro or Thunder. Dusty was great at it, but he never really gets burn on one of the major shows in that position. I liked Scott Hudson sitting next to Tony S. near the end, but otherwise, color commentary has been a glaring weak link on this show the whole run. 17 minutes ago, Curt McGirt said: That depends if Bischoff was still booking then. I'm thinking it was the Nash era right then. You want to talk about an unheralded gem watch the pre-junkyard brawl Regal/Finlay match at one of the PPVs. INSANELY violent. I remember Finlay just palm-striking Regal right in the nose, nobody does that and it looks so vicious. This is the Uncensored 1996 match that I think you're talking about. People herald that match as a gem in the DVDVR/PWO fandom, I think, but yeah, more widely, I don't think people talk about it much. The last time I saw it, I found it stiff, but overlong and a bit aimless in the middle. I don't think I wrote about Uncensored for this thread because I came to it before I decided to just watch the major TV and PPVs from the whole era, so after I finish with this run of WCW, I'm going to add all the PPVs that I didn't cover here already. I wonder how my perception of the match will have changed since I saw it four or five years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zendragon Posted July 15 Share Posted July 15 Heenan only went to WCW so he could get his neck fixed according to his daughter 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirSmUgly Posted July 15 Author Share Posted July 15 10 minutes ago, zendragon said: Heenan only went to WCW so he could get his neck fixed according to his daughter That's the same reason Mikey Whipwreck spent six months in WCW, I think, to get surgery. This explains why he wrestles sparingly and then disappears for about three months after his first few appearances. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirSmUgly Posted July 15 Author Share Posted July 15 Thunder Interlude – show number sixty-seven – 17 June 1999 "The WCW Gang practices their in-ring character work before knocking off early for the night" Ah, Thunder, a weirdly solid oasis in the midst of some WCW-ass nonsense on Nitro and PPV… Curt Hennig and Bobby Duncum Jr. are TAPED on Thunder tonight…How do I know this?...They come out to Duncum’s generic ‘50s Western theme instead of “Rap is Cr*p”…I will be censoring the name of that title out of protest for the bad musical takes of the whole WTR…I do love that “bad musical takes” really do get heel heat for me…Unfortunately, the uncomfortable cultural and racial implications of this feud take all the fun out of things, at least in my opinion… The WTR members wrestle the Texas Hangmen…It’s dull, but inoffensive…Both teams bring a cowbell to the ring…If I squint just a bit, it almost feels like a match from a random 1992 WCW taping…Hennig lands a PerfectPlex for three…At least it wasn’t too long…Rey Misterio Jr. and Konnan jump the WTR after the match… Recap: Roddy Piper and Ric Flair make up, but Piper and Buff Bagwell have beef… Scotty Riggs admires himself in the mirror, wrestles a contest against Disco Inferno, who dances a whole lot…Tenay points out that these fellas tend to get lost in themselves when they should be pressing for victory…Scotty admires and Disco dances…Disco dances and Scotty admires…Actually, Scotty’s preening is too much even for Disco…That’s how you know that you need to scale your behavior back…This is a man who once tapped out so that he wouldn’t muss up his hair or lose his ability to dance… Riggs lands a dropkick and celebrates for a good forty-five seconds…It’s kind of amusing, actually…Disco slowly asserts himself and controls the pace…He dances and lands a second-rope elbow…This is a cool spot…So, Riggs immediately hops up from the elbow and checks his face for blemishes…Disco tries to rush him, but Scotty sidesteps it because he can see Disco advancing in the mirror…Tenay doesn’t quite get the spot and just says that Scotty used the mirror “as a distraction”…It’s too bad because it was a clever spot… Riggs gets offense in, but celebrates and poses far too much…He looks in the mirror again, and Disco waits for him to put it down before sneaking up behind him and getting a roll-up for two ….Riggs shoves Disco away from one Chartbuster and lands another dropkick, but he doesn’t get three…Riggs is very casual about the cover on that one, and again after landing a crossbody for two…Tenay does point that out…Riggs’s nonchalance and laziness are his downfall, as he jumps right into a fist and then eats a Chartbuster for three…You know what?...The lengths they went to in working their characters into the spots and the flow of the match make this a worthwhile Charming Uniquity… Hype package/feud recap: Percy “Master P” Miller is just here to show the kids how to spin ten thousand dollars into a billion-dollar empire…And that mean ol’ Curt Hennig can’t stand a self-made man like him…Actually, Master P is kind of a modern American renaissance man…A Chinese league-level basketball player…A rapper and producer…A business, man rather than a businessman, if you consider him similarly to Jay-Z…Funny enough, no less a website (that I didn’t even know existed) than capitalism.com has a whole feature on what an aspirational figure he is…Yep, he’s specifically an AMERICAN renaissance man… I do find it interesting that the WWF, a northeastern wrestling company run by a guy from backwoods North Carolina, managed to leverage rappers way better than WCW…WWF Aggression is pretty great…Plus, it spawned one of the classic “I don’t like rap, but I love this rap song” tracks in the Run DMC version of “Break It Down”…”The Kings” is a classic theme remix… Evan Karagias really needs Shannon Moore and Shane Helms to get into this company, already…I think he has to suffer through being paired with Madusa first, though…Prince Iaukea gets a jobber entrance…This is an okay match…It helps that Iaukea is a good hand at this point…They have an obligatory ringside brawl…We go to break as Karagias lands a springboard clothesline for two…For a longer match between two guys with minimal heat and only one of them is any good, this is actually a decent little bout… Iaukea gets more heelish as he gets more overrun, grabbing the ref to avoid a sunset flip and slapping Karagias disrespectfully…I respect that guys are trying to get a sense of their characters across in their work tonight…Iaukea has an extended period of control…Karagias makes a comeback, so Iaukea goes to the eyes…Karagais manages a series of flash pinfalls and finally gets three by slipping behind Iaukea and rolling him up…This is the best possible Iaukea/Karagias match in all worlds…They probably should be getting their reps in on SN or Worldwide rather than Thunder in an ideal situation, but this was pretty solid stuff for Thunder… La Parka and Silver King job to Hugh Morrus and Brian Knobbs…Man, the booking of La Parka was a total miss on Bischoff’s part…Parka was getting over as the “Chairman of WCW”…He just never got a consistent push…Bisch bringing in a bunch of talented luchadores and then only pushing Rey consistently (and Juvi inconsistently) sucks…And Eddy’s in that mix too, I guess…So two guys who got pushed consistently, and one who is off-on with his push…Bleh…La Parka would be a better base for the cruisers than Dean Malenko could ever dream of… Parka and Silver King do some excellent, but thankless double-team work…Larry Z. gives this interesting kayfabe explanation of why WCW execs are shying away from adding an extra ref to the ring for these chaotic multi-man matches…The luchadores and Larry basically carry this thing, and Knobbs and Morrus should have thanked each of them for that…Parka is bumping like a lunatic for stuff…He bends himself in half off a Knobbs back elbow…A Jimmy Hart chair shot blunts a comeback from the luchadores…Morrus drills Silver King with a No Laughing Matter for three…Entirely watchable stuff… I think Larry Z. has been better since he was paired solely with Tenay on Thunder…He tries to match Tenay’s tenor by giving insights into what’s going on in the ring or why things are the way they are…He still goes off in Larry Z. style sometimes, but I can deal with that if he’s going to also be so cogent about what we’re seeing in the ring… Booker got hurt again, but he’s back…He’s facing the Barbarian tonight…Booker chases Jimmy Hart away from the apron before the match begins…This match is perfectly fun when Booker is on offense, and merely watchable enough when he’s selling for Barb…Booker slams Barb’s head into Hart’s on the outside…He eats a huge overhead release belly-to-belly that triggers a Barbarian control segment…There’s a commercial break as Barb controls on the outside… Barbarian continues getting in offense when we get back…Hart gets in there and chokes Booker… Barbarian is tired and loves chinlocks…Lots of chinlocks…Lots of long, boring chinlocks…Booker makes a comeback, but Hart grabs Book’s leg as Book goes for an axe kick…Barb lands a Kick of Fear that knocks Booker to the floor…That allows Booker to recover from Barb’s finisher enough that he kicks out when Barb gets him back in the ring and covers…Booker eats a clothesline on a corner charge, but Barb tries it again immediately, and Booker hops over him, hooks his legs around Barb’s waist, and gets a sunset flip for three to escape with a win…Glad to see Booker on television again!... They are short on material, I guess, so they show the whole eight-man tag from Nitro again…What wrestling fan wasn’t watching Nitro, but was watching Thunder regularly?...Come on, now…The laziness is knocking an “O” or two off the WOO score for this show… Still, outside of the lazy nature of the show’s ending, Thunder continues to do nothing but be a generally enjoyable wrestling show…I’d say that one of my biggest surprises in this whole watch is that Thunder, which gets trashed as bad almost from the beginning, is actually pretty solid for the first year-and-a-half of its existence…I assume Russo will change all that, but until then, I’ll continue to enjoy what is a mostly pleasant wrestling show…This one gets a WOOO… 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twiztor Posted July 16 Share Posted July 16 7 hours ago, SirSmUgly said: Thunder Interlude – show number sixty-seven – 17 June 1999 “Rap is Cr*p”…I will be censoring the name of that title out of protest for the bad musical takes of the whole WTR Scotty Riggs admires himself in the mirror, wrestles a contest against Disco Inferno Larry Z. gives this interesting kayfabe explanation of why WCW execs are shying away from adding an extra ref to the ring for these chaotic multi-man matches… this might get me heat with you, but i have a certain appreciation for Rap is Crap. it's not good. at all. but it makes me smile. i don't listen to much country music, but anytime i'm making a playlist that leans that way, this song almost always finds a way on it. Disco is a guy i had no time for in '96/'97/'98. Just a dumb jobber. But he pleasantly surprised me in my WCW rewatch and more often than not i would find myself enjoying his matches. He could usually find something unique to do. Scott Riggs? not so much. His short ECW run was just as worthless, even if i got a single solitary chuckle out of him and "the clap" well? don't leave us hanging, man! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caley Posted July 16 Share Posted July 16 7 hours ago, SirSmUgly said: La Parka and Silver King job to Hugh Morrus and Brian Knobbs…Man, the booking of La Parka was a total miss on Bischoff’s part…Parka was getting over as the “Chairman of WCW”…He just never got a consistent push Uh oh...I'm having WCW PTSD memories of La Parka with someone doing voiceovers for him calling himself "The Bone Man"...did I...did I dream this?! 5 minutes ago, twiztor said: this might get me heat with you, but i have a certain appreciation for Rap is Crap. it's not good. at all. but it makes me smile. i don't listen to much country music, but anytime i'm making a playlist that leans that way, this song almost always finds a way on it. Hahaha, I'm the same way. I don't have it on any playlists but something about the fact that they did not really, you know, over-produce it or rehearse it or...try...makes it kind of endearing to me. Like, you can hear the smile on Curt Hennig's face as he sings it. And the whole "rap is crap" was such an OLD dad joke made it sillier to me. In fact, I think there was an episode of NewsRadio around this time where Bill did an editorial about rap music (preceded amazingly by Bill having the bass up so high on his stereo that he had no idea that rap music had lyrics) that concluded with "It's not rap music, it's crap music" followed by Dave suggesting he invent a time machine to go back ten years to when anybody would have even cared about it. I can understand the cultural problem mentioned above by Smelly , but to me, admittedly a middle-aged white guy, I enjoy the whole "Rap is Crap" as a mark of WCW ineptitude: "We're going to team up with a "Cool" hip hop superstar, create a rival faction for them to play off of, and the only ones who get over out of the whole thing will be the band of over-the-hill wrestlers we toss together with an uninspired, goofy parody song". It's SO WCW! "Hey, you know who could really get some traction off this No Limits partnership? Barry Windham's younger, less talented brother!" 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zendragon Posted July 16 Share Posted July 16 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZwefYGWeYY Have the WTR started using this yet? whats your take? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirSmUgly Posted July 16 Author Share Posted July 16 (edited) 14 hours ago, twiztor said: this might get me heat with you, but i have a certain appreciation for Rap is Crap. it's not good. at all. but it makes me smile. i don't listen to much country music, but anytime i'm making a playlist that leans that way, this song almost always finds a way on it. 14 hours ago, caley said: Hahaha, I'm the same way. I don't have it on any playlists but something about the fact that they did not really, you know, over-produce it or rehearse it or...try...makes it kind of endearing to me. Like, you can hear the smile on Curt Hennig's face as he sings it. And the whole "rap is crap" was such an OLD dad joke made it sillier to me. In fact, I think there was an episode of NewsRadio around this time where Bill did an editorial about rap music (preceded amazingly by Bill having the bass up so high on his stereo that he had no idea that rap music had lyrics) that concluded with "It's not rap music, it's crap music" followed by Dave suggesting he invent a time machine to go back ten years to when anybody would have even cared about it. I can understand the cultural problem mentioned above by Smelly , but to me, admittedly a middle-aged white guy, I enjoy the whole "Rap is Crap" as a mark of WCW ineptitude: "We're going to team up with a "Cool" hip hop superstar, create a rival faction for them to play off of, and the only ones who get over out of the whole thing will be the band of over-the-hill wrestlers we toss together with an uninspired, goofy parody song". It's SO WCW! "Hey, you know who could really get some traction off this No Limits partnership? Barry Windham's younger, less talented brother!" These are perfectly valid feelings to have about the whole deal! "Rap Is Crap" is this off-key nonsense tune sung over what sounds like a Casio keyboard's stock "country western" recording. It's objectively funny in a stupid way. I'm just coming from my own specific experience where IRL, these arguments about music were sometimes a cover for more insidious arguments w/r/t race. And they still are sometimes even though most of the modern country songs I hear are as overproduced as modern rap is. It's not quite a dad joke to me, but if you're coming from a different perspective, it definitely is, and I get why it'd be amusing. Quote Disco is a guy i had no time for in '96/'97/'98. Just a dumb jobber. But he pleasantly surprised me in my WCW rewatch and more often than not i would find myself enjoying his matches. He could usually find something unique to do. Scott Riggs? not so much. His short ECW run was just as worthless, even if i got a single solitary chuckle out of him and "the clap" I think at this point, we've well passed peak Disco Inferno. The issue is that once he became a semi-serious fighting babyface, then regressed back to hapless dorky dancer who was too corny for the Wolfpac, it felt like we took two steps back. I don't know whether it's the booking, the performer himself, or both, but Disco the character should have found a better balance between dance machine and plucky fighting babyface/opportunistic and cunning heel. As for Riggs, he stinks, which is why I was so surprised to enjoy his broad character work in this match. I've said it before, but I want to see his run in Dusty's TCW as the ace just out of sheer curiosity. Quote well? don't leave us hanging, man! I guess I overplayed how good it was by not going into detail; I liked it, but it's not as good as maybe I made it sound! He just talked about how promotions had been trying to address this issue in the past and that two referees for a multi-man match had been tried in multiple cases, but they found that the refs were just so used to being alone that they struggled to space themselves properly and even injured one another when working in close proximity. It wasn't anything amazing, but it was just such a good kayfabe explanation for one of the questions that non-fans who can't suspend their disbelief might ask, and it came after a flurry of action that the ref couldn't possibly keep up with. Larry Z. has been doing more of that since he became lead color on Thunder, and I suspect that trying to keep up with Mike Tenay and Tenay's rep as the knowledgeable PBP guy has something to do with it. 8 hours ago, zendragon said: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZwefYGWeYY Have the WTR started using this yet? whats your take? I have not heard this on the shows, but after listening to the link here are my takes: 1. Off-key singing by heels is always funny, no exceptions. 2. This is a Jimmy Hart dry run for the more iconic Three Count theme, down to listing all the things from this one musical culture that the singers of the theme enjoy. 3. Curt Hennig is from Minnesota, which last I checked, is nowhere near the south, so I am dubious about his claims to be "Southern born" or "Southern bred." Edited July 16 by SirSmUgly 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caley Posted July 16 Share Posted July 16 52 minutes ago, SirSmUgly said: I'm just coming from my own specific experience where IRL, these arguments about music were sometimes a cover for more insidious arguments w/r/t race. And they still are sometimes even though most of the modern country songs I hear are as overproduced as modern rap is. It's not quite a dad joke to me, but if you're coming from a different perspective, it definitely is, and I get why it'd be amusing. I was worried that I had downplayed your concerns because I do also think you're spot-on that there's definitely a portion of the audience that covers their feelings about race as an argument about musical taste. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirSmUgly Posted July 16 Author Share Posted July 16 1 hour ago, caley said: I was worried that I had downplayed your concerns because I do also think you're spot-on that there's definitely a portion of the audience that covers their feelings about race as an argument about musical taste. Aw, heck no. For one, I've been posting here for a while. I know most of y'all are cool. For two, I love writing about WCW and would do it if no one read or commented, but reading everyone's comments and seeing their different viewpoints, preferences, and thoughts is a huge chunk of the enjoyment from writing these for me. Please feel free to keep those thoughts coming without worrying that I'm going to feel badly because you have a different perspective or experience. (As a side note, Larry Z. takes your interpretation, which I think is the dominant one, of the WTRs: He compared them to his parents' generation getting pissy about rock music in the '60s. Would Larry Z. steer any of us wrong? Obviously not.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zendragon Posted July 16 Share Posted July 16 I kinda love the idea that Curt Hennig who was well established as being from Minnesota decided to start hanging out with three texans, threw on a cowboy hat and was like "I'm a country boy" 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirSmUgly Posted July 16 Author Share Posted July 16 Show #194 – 21 June 1999 “The one that explains a lot about Kevin Nash's support for Eric Bischoff in the Who Killed WCW mini-series” I can see the end coming. Only about six weeks more in this Bischoff-and-Nash tenure. Nash is responsible for some of the vilest Nitros in the whole collection. If anything, he’s inoculated me from having a fear of sitting through Russo-and-Ferrara booked Nitros. Team Madness pulls up in a Hummer, gets out of their vehicle, and walks into the arena. Nash pulls up in a limo and chases the Hummer as it takes off, and for a second, I didn’t get it. I forgot; we’re still pretending like the Hummer driver wasn’t Sid, the most logical person for that role. This is a slow opening. I wish they’d do some of that in media res stuff they’ve done before. It’s effective when done every once in a while, and I thought it made for a neat start on a couple of those 1995/1996 shows. Recap: The NLS/WTR feud. We’re in New Orleans tonight, by the way. It's the home of No Limit Records, if you didn’t know. Blipmo: Lenny Lane is in the back trying to decide between tights of two different, yet equally gay colors, I guess. Yellow and purple are apparently super-gay, fellas. Don’t ask me who decided this is true because I don’t know. Lodi comes in, fires Lenny up, and gives him a pre-match massage while Lenny talks about how much stamina has and how he can outlast any man oh God, why, please, someone fire that idiot Bischoff. Psicosis comes to the ring to face Billy Kidman in the opener, but holy fuck, these commentators just yammer on about the NLS/WTR feud. Yuck. Please focus on the fine competitors in the ring, fellas. Bischoff being desperate has really made these Nitros a tough watch. I feel like the crowd response to this match as Psicosis takes early control is muted. Even Kidman sounded like he was less over than he typically is when he came out for this match. Seriously, Bisch is killing the crowds by letting Nash book the show into the ground and also adding his own ideas to book the show into the ground. After eating various stomps, Kidman comes back with a couple of dropkicks and a lariat that sends Psicosis to the floor. He follows up with a springboard crossbody. Kidman continues his assault back in the ring, garnering two on a legdrop. However, when he puts Psicosis up top, Psciosis blocks his suplex and hits a super-facebuster for two. Psicosis goes back to lots of stompin’ and lots of preening, so it doesn’t take Kidman long to score a counter-lariat. This match feels sort of low energy. It’s not bad, but if you were to call it a HOT CRUISERWEIGHT OPENER, you’d only be two-thirds correct. They wander outside again for a bit, then back inside the ring, and then back outside the ring. Psicosis does land a nice split-legged moonsault to the floor in there, though. Unfortunately for him, he gets counter-dropkicked when trying to follow up with a dive in the ring. These dudes at commentary decide to opine on who is driving the hummer while Kidman and Psicosis trade two counts. I guess they’re underwhelmed by this match, too. That, or they are paid to flog bad angles. Kidman reverses a powerbomb into a facebuster and then goes up for an SSP, but Psicosis doesn’t get in position for it, and what the hell, Team Madness comes down and we get a schmozz because the cruiserweights don’t matter. Sid beats the heck out of Psicosis and gets a small SID chant. Sid does rule. Sting runs everyone off, but not before Sid can drop Psicosis with a powerbomb. I wish they’d put the belt on Savage and spend the next three months with him using Team Madness to keep the gold in increasingly ridiculous main events full of jibber-jabber. They won’t, but they should. Kevin Nash comes down to join Sting in the ring. The former Wolfpac members do not have a happy reunion. Nash is suspicious because Sting, um, popped out of a black Hummer last week to attack Rick Steiner and er, Sid and Savage just left the ring a couple minutes ago instead of attacking Sting (Sting, astonished, mouths THEY JUST TOOK OFF). Sting says he didn’t drive the Hummer, but Nash is like I’M NOT ACCUSING YOU, BUT IF YOU DID, I’M GOING AFTER YOU. Nash is not as popular as Sting, so unless Nash is turning heel, this maybe wasn’t the best way to book things. Who was the moron booker who put Nash in this position, anyway? Ric Flair and Roddy Piper sit in the executive office; Flair decides that Sid/Savage vs. Nash/Sting should be the main event for Bash at the Beach. Really? That’s more like a Nitro main event, bud. Piper insists on running Sting/Sid later tonight. Both men are excited about their somewhat underwhelming booking plans, but in as irritating a way as possible. Recap: Just in case you tuned out when Piper and Flair were beefing and now you wonder what the hell happened, here’s how Buff Bagwell is to blame for getting these two lunatics back together. Lenny Lane faces Meng. The crowd starts chanting a homophobic slur at Lane. Boy, the rest of 1999 is just going to be brutal, huh? Lodi walks down holding a sign. I’m good, man, I’m good, let’s move this fucking thing along. Lane can’t hit any effective offense for probably a couple minutes longer than needed because we get the point, already. Meng wins with a TDG. Lodi helps Lenny out of the ring. This has been an awful show so far. There’s a break. The Nitro Girls dance. The commentators talk. I watch that Morishima/Noble WWE dark match in a second window while this happens. We see a review of that Sting/Rick Steiner garbage during Steiner’s match against Hak from the previous week, then get another break. Morishima reminds me of Terry Gordy. Maybe that's a semi-common POV? Anyway, don’t ask me why he reminds me of Gordy because I haven’t formulated why yet, but he just does. The NLS is in the ring to have a birthday party for Silkk the Shocker. Gonna be honest, if these guys aren’t the babyfaces in New Orleans, Bisch should pull the plug on this feud. A fan – wait, hold on, not descriptive enough, a fan in a KORN t-shirt – gets in the ring and leads the crowd in singing “Happy Birthday.” Curt Hennig comes out wearing a black cowboy hat and a Dallas Stars Stanley Cup Champs t-shirt. That’s how you know he’s a heel; it’d be like me wearing an OKC Thunder championship shirt (may they only ever be worn by kids in developing nations) in public. Did the Wild not exist yet in 1999? Even so, come on, gimmick or no gimmick, I would have my pride before I’d wear that if I were him. So, Hennig has a present for Silkk. Hennig talks in a faux-Texan accent. The long and short of it is that Hennig bought Silkk a cowboy hat, but Silkk stomps it, and then they smash some cake on Hennig. I’m gonna be real, if you want the NLS to be babyfaces, maybe don’t have Hennig go up to these guys one-on-fifty because, you know, that’s what a babyface would do. Who the fuck books this shit? Probably the same dumbass who booked babyface Nash to threaten a bigger babyface in Sting for no real reason. The NLS is NOT OVER in New Orleans, by the way, just in case you wanted to know. They kinda had the crowd at “Happy Birthday,” and things rapidly slid downhill for their popularity from there. THA JOOOOOCY ONE, no, forget it, not even hyping myself up about a Juventud Guerrera appearance is going to do much for me when it comes to this show. Hey, Eddy Guerrero is his opponent! OK, I actually am pretty excited now! Juvi walks over and hugs Eddy, which is in line with how he treated Eddy the last time they were together. Eddy’s not having it. He yells something at Juvi about agreeing to end the lWo when Flair offered them a deal. The crowd is faintly chanting EDDY, but um, Eddy came out two weeks ago and was a quiet, thankful babyface. Why is he now heeling? He should hug it out with Juvi, by all rights. Remember, two weeks ago, he told us in character how happy he was to just be alive. Yeah, and he means that for real, too, but he was saying this as his character on Nitro. This is like sticking with Buff’s heel turn even when the crowd wanted to cheer for him after his neck injury. Eddy slaps Juvi, then lays in strikes. Eddy and Juvi have a pacey little match into the break; Juvi does Kidman’s facebuster-out-of-a-powerbomb counter way better than Kidman does it. Juvi slaps Eddy back after that, and Eddy bails. Eddy regains control by feinting with his upper body and then kicking Juvi’s kneecap, though. He locks on a sleeper as we finally go to commercial. We come back to Juvi fighting up and getting two on a flash pinfall attempt. Eddy goes back to the leg to get Juvi to stop running. Eddy lands a brainbuster for two, then punishes Juvi with chops. Well, Eddy should be proud of himself: He is a good enough heel to get the crowd sentiment to dissipate and garner an EDDY SUCKS chant. Juvi tries one more comeback, but can’t quite find the move that will put Eddy away or even keep him down for long. Juvi attempts a Juvi Driver, but Eddy slips out of it and hits an airplane neckbreaker, then lands a Frog Splash for three. The match was merely adequate, but it was a solid comeback match for Eddy. The airplane neckbreaker was neat, though. I thought he was going to attempt a Gory Special at first. Prince Iaukea heads to the ring to face Ernest Miller (w/Sonny Onoo). The Cat gets a mic before the match, yells at the crowd, and actually, this guy has a lot of signs for him in the crowd. The people who hate him apparently really hate him because some dude jumps the rail to try and get in the ring. Maybe it’s a plant – this is WCW, after all – but I think the rail-jumper is legit. Say what you will; yelling at the crowd every match apparently works to get heel heat! Iaukea is a fiery babyface tonight and hits some nice offense – he has a great dropkick – but the Cat and Onoo have great rapport when it comes to finagling wrestling victories. They double-team him outside the ring and the Cat lands kick after kick inside the ring. He even hits his People’s Elbow knockoff except with a boogie and a chop that I need to get a name for. Iaukea tries to come back, but Onoo distracts the ref so that Miller can put on his red slipper and land a high kick for three. He even finds the strength to dance after the match. There was no way this whole post-match dance routine wasn’t going to eventually turn him babyface. Kanyon comes to the ring and says that he’s got a question to ask the crowd before he beats Booker T. and heads on out to Bourbon Street. He asks the question in a very bad faux-Cajun accent, but very few people in the crowd bother to answer. Booker’s music hits and everyone starts raising the roof. People really loved interacting like this at a wrestling show. These ‘90s wrestling shows are like the pro wrestling equivalents of a Rocky Horror or The Room showing. Kanyon fares quite well against Booker to start, but once they start running, even the agile-for-his size Kanyon struggles to contain Booker. Booker lands a dropkick and puts on an armbar. Kanyon works his way out and throws a few strikes, but when he shoots Booker in again, Booker lands a forearm and then clotheslines Kanyon to the floor. Book celebrates with the crowd as we go into another commercial break. The wrestlers have established that when the pace picks up, Booker is at a clear advantage, and Tony S. even underlined that point on commentary, so let’s see if they build around that thread in the rest of this match. Yeah, we come back to Kanyon losing another Irish whip, this time to a corner clothesline and ten punches. He finally ducks a roundhouse kick on a rope run, but Kanyon can’t get Booker up on a crucifix sort of move and they topple over; Kanyon just gets up and quickly lands a neckbreaker, then takes control of the match. Kanyon gets two on a guillotine legdrop, then locks on an inverted Boston Crab. Booker survives it and reverses by pushing off with his legs, which puts him in position for a flash pinfall that gets two. Kanyon sends Booker outside, and we get an obligatory ringside brawl. Kanyon wins one whip into the guardrail, but gets reversed on a second. Irish whips really aren’t working out for the guy in this match, and he should stop trying them in kayfabe. Booker tries to follow up in the ring and attempts to sunset flip Kanyon from his position on the apron, but Kanyon counters it into a Northern Lights Suplex and bridges for two. Kanyon locks on a rest hold, but Booker works up pretty quickly, so Kanyon hits a boot to the gut and lands a side slam for two. Kanyon is also wrestling with less energy than normal. Maybe it was super humid in New Orleans that day or something. Anyway, he scores another couple of nearfalls, but he can’t put Booker away. Booker makes an inevitable comeback, looks like he’s about to finish Kanyon off, and then here comes the rest of the Jersey Triad. Booker fights off Page and Bigelow, but Kanyon hits Booker with a tag title and then lands a Flatliner. Page and Bigelow land a tower Diamond Cutter on Book after that. This match went way too long and had too much downtime while Kanyon was in control for me, especially considering the DQ ending. Gene Okerlund interviews Ric Flair and Roddy Piper in the ring. Asya and Arn escort them out. Asya. Psh. More like Sry Lanka or Mycronesya. Piper is ostensibly a heel, but he needs to do his whole cheap pop thing with a twist, so he yells HOME OF THE SAINTS for a cheer, then says that if he were on the team, they might have made the Super Bowl to get some cheap heat along with his cheap pop. He proceeds to cut a terrible promo except for when he imitates Buff Bagwell in a whiny voice: “My mummy says that I stay in the sun bed three hours a day; why aren’t I in the main event?” That is something that Judy Bagwell might have credibly said, and I think there is a reasonable chance that someone told Piper that Judy made this complaint to a WCW higher-up, and it made its way into this promo. Other than that, Piper thinks calling Bagwell “Buffy” and making pop culture references to the Joss Whedon-created show starring Sarah Michelle Gellar in the title role is cute or funny or good. When does this fool stop showing up? I hope Russo sends this dude back to Oregon to collect a check for the rest of his contract. Ric Flair yells a lot and pretends that Buff Bagwell's significant other thought about sleeping with him. He cuts a promo that is unhinged, but in what I consider a bad way. I think it stinks, and probably, Roddy Piper is rubbing off on the guy. He and Piper both deny that Buff beat Flair even though we saw it with our own eyes last week. Hmmm, disturbing presidential parallels. Buff Bagwell comes down and goes right after Flair, putting himself in a one-on-two situation. This feud stinks. The crowd immediately chants for GOLDBERG for a second, and this show is so much poorer for not having him around right now. If, rather than Buff coming out to wrestle competitive matches, Goldberg came out here to kill Flair and Piper, that would rule. They beat Buff down, and Flair makes it an official handicap match immediately. I don’t know, if Flair was like LOL I FUCKED UR GIRL to me in 1999, I’d be like, Whatever you old-ass ball of wrinkles, you better hope the eventual inventors of Blue Chew hurry up and figure out the formula. This dude is out here looking like he’s auditioning for a Hims commercial. His boasting only works if he's not a heel who is a fifty-year-old alcoholic that increasingly looks like a sixty-year-old alcoholic. I guess Flair’s shtick works because a tiny RIC FLAIR SUCKS chant starts. The match is as good as a handicap match featuring Buff Bagwell and 1999 Roddy Piper can possibly be. Buff locks on a chinlock at the exact time a woman on the hard cam side behind him holds up a sign that says BUFF CAN STUFF MY BAG WELL, which is so bawdy and has such silly wordplay that I respect it. Buff survives a Piper sleeper (kinda huge in kayfabe) and a Flair top-rope attempt (the opposite of "kinda huge in kayfabe"), but can’t quite kill either of these dudes off. Piper does one of the worst chokes I’ve seen. It looks like he’s massaging Buff’s neck muscles. How do you fuck up a choke when you’re a 20+-year veteran? Dean Malenko runs down, but all he does is distract that dope Mickey Jay. Jay allows Malenko to stay and apparently makes the match a tag match. What the fuck? The president made this match specifically to have the handicap advantage, right? So why would President Flair let Jay up and make it a regular tag? Just a little consistency and logic would be nice. This segment and match feels like it goes on for hours. No, longer than that. It feels like it goes on for almost as long as Rick Steiner matches seem to go on. Do you think this match – or maybe a Rick Steiner match – is what the kid in the Stephen King story “The Jaunt” saw when he kept his eyes open while being jaunted to Mars? This match is definitely LONGER THAN YOU THINK, DAD, but rather than going insane and scratching my eyes out, let me just tell you the ending: Malenko gets a hot tag, the match breaks down, and Malenko puts Arn in the Texas Cloverleaf. Piper takes the opportunity to sneak into the ring and hit Buff with a loaded fist; Flair covers for three. Konnan and Rey Misterio Jr. (w/Chase Tatum, Brad Armstrong, and Swoll) are getting a tag title shot next; they face DDP and Kanyon (w/Bam Bam Bigelow). Tony S. talks about Hennig’s “Rap is Cr*p” song getting a music video, and I note that the captioner wrote it as “Rap is ----,” so maybe they’re as disgusted with Hennig’s small-minded approach to music as I am. Or they’re really doing too much with the censoring of words that are swear substitutions, one or the other. By the way, Chase Tatum and Brad Armstrong being anywhere near this group feels, uh, like not quite the fit you’d expect. Brad Armstrong is a country dude from Tennessee in particular. It’s not a race issue – 2004 John Cena would fit right in, and he’s a white dude from Massachusetts who’d be tasked to hang out with Southern rappers. Tatum and Armstrong just don’t fit. This match feels pointless almost immediately because of WCW’s booking style and the fact that the NLS got one over on Hennig with no response. I actually think both these teams have some neat double-team spots, but only Lane/Meng, Eddy/Juvi, and Iaukea/Cat have had finishes that didn’t involve another person coming out and affecting the match, so it's nearly impossible to get invested in a potential title change. On that note, while Konnan plays FIP, I think this sort of screwy booking in big TV matches can work, but you’d have to look at what Bill Watts did in Mid-South when it was a hot territory as a guide - funny enough, since Eric Bischoff shits on the guy as a booker every chance he gets. You’d have to a) have babyfaces give as good as they got and win some or most of the fuckery-filled finishes that happen, and b) build the feuds to PPVs that have clean finishes and definitively end feuds. Bischoff and his booking committees have heels win most of the screwy encounters and then also has a lot of screwy bullshit on his big shows. I guess taking cues from what worked in the past would probably mean that Bischoff stop pretending that he invented the modern professional wrestling show all by himself in the ‘90s, though. Page and Kanyon are a good team, so their control segment is fine. Bigelow is an effective cheater outside the ring, but why are Tatum, Armstrong, and Swoll just letting Bam Bam interfere from the floor like that? They should probably be neutralizing Bam Bam before too many of these spots where Bammer cheats. Konnan finally rolls away from a Kanyon moonsault and gets a hot tag. Rey's a great hot tag. He lands blows to both Page and Kanyon and then clears out Bam Bam on a suicide dive. Konnan comes right back in after a long beatdown and just starts landing offense with no lingering effects. Huh. The WTR runs down and blows up the match; Benoit and Saturn follow and go after the Jersey Triad. Master P. brings a bunch of other NLS members to chase the heels away. That was a match that filled time and existed, but at least it wasn’t entirely unpleasant. Let’s just do this fucking main event already. It’s so low-rent that Sid doesn’t have a theme yet. The same was true of Bigelow. OK, he was an unsigned outlaw for a while, but once he was a regular part of the roster, get him a theme! Michael Buffer’s Ring Announcing Quality Control: Update your note cards, stupid. Sting stopped being “reluctan[t] to join any organization” in the middle of 1998. That is not, in any way, a defining characteristic of Sting at this point. It’s a minor quibble, but still. This match starts with about nine minutes to go. After about sixty seconds of not much action and a lot of standing around, the rest of Team Madness comes to ringside. Sid and Team Madness talk at ringside and yell into the camera for another minute. If you don’t want to really give away too much, then why book this match in the first place? Sting and Sid go to hook up, and Savage grabs Sting’s ankle and yanks him so that Sid can get control with a stomp. The crowd starts chanting for GOLDBERG. Yeah, things would be so much better if he were kicking around WCW right now. Anyway, not much happens in this match. Sid embarks upon a ponderous beatdown at half-speed for three or four minutes. Sting makes a comeback. Savage jumps in and attacks, and the match ends. Lex Luger runs in with a chair for the save. Savage gets on the house mic after a bit of standing around; he does some mic work in which he promises that Team Madness will destroy them both. Sid takes the mic and yells a lot. Then Sting responds by prompting the crowd to chant a DX catchphrase. Oh WCW, you are so low-rent. So, so low-rent. As my title for this review indicates, this show cleared up for me why Kevin Nash was so defensive of Eric Bischoff in Who Killed WCW? These two fellas teamed up to make some consistently awful television for a few months, so it’s in Nash’s interest to protect the guy who elevated him to a creative position that he was abjectly bad at. People who get on Nash for not really understanding or getting wrestling and just being in the business for money should look less at his in-ring work and more at this booking stint of his. He fundamentally doesn’t understand key things about how pro wrestling works. But then again, neither does Bischoff. -20 out of 5 Stinger Splashes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caley Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 (edited) 4 hours ago, SirSmUgly said: “reluctan[t] to join any organization” I'd like this in my tombstone! So Kanyon wrestled twice in this show!? That's bizarre for a company with about 7 thousand wrestlers under contract Edited July 17 by caley 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twiztor Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 4 hours ago, SirSmUgly said: Show #194 – 21 June 1999 It’s so low-rent that Sid doesn’t have a theme yet. The same was true of Bigelow. OK, he was an unsigned outlaw for a while, but once he was a regular part of the roster, get him a theme! as hard as it may be to believe, the Giant never had a theme song in WCW. He started with the Dungeon of Doom, left them to join the nWo, and when he left just.....never got a theme. even reading these reviews (and even as a non-fan such as myself), the lack of Goldberg is noticable. He must be filming a movie or something? is this when he was gone for Universal Soldier 4? i never watched that. i think i only saw the original. Was this one any good? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caley Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 It's weird, you're right, but my brain has replaced every musicless Paul Wight entrance with "Welllllllll..." I kinda liked Bam Bam not having music at first because it gave off the aura that "Hey this guys not supposed to be here!" I also loved the one time he got out of the car to attack Goldberg but I had also repeatedly misremembered it. At first I remembered it as him leaping at Goldberg from a moving car and cloitheslining Goldberg which would be awesome but basically impossible. Then I remembered it as him nearly running Goldberg before storming out of the car to attack him . I can't find the clip now but I think ultimately he just kinda stepped out of a parked car but it was still kinda cool! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirSmUgly Posted July 17 Author Share Posted July 17 2 hours ago, caley said: So Kanyon wrestled twice in this show!? That's bizarre for a company with about 7 thousand wrestlers under contract Bam Bam's got a back injury, but I'm not sure why Kanyon needed to wrestle Booker unless they want to start a Booker/Jersey Triad feud. Maybe Booker will link up with Benoit and Saturn? I have no idea what will happen. 2 hours ago, twiztor said: as hard as it may be to believe, the Giant never had a theme song in WCW. He started with the Dungeon of Doom, left them to join the nWo, and when he left just.....never got a theme. There were also the handful of times he walked out to Lex Luger's theme when he was teaming regularly with the Total Package! Quote even reading these reviews (and even as a non-fan such as myself), the lack of Goldberg is noticable. He must be filming a movie or something? is this when he was gone for Universal Soldier 4? i never watched that. i think i only saw the original. Was this one any good? He was filming Universal Soldier and also resting some nagging injuries, I believe. WCW's been struggling with the injury bug: Eddy and Booker just got back from injury; Hall and Hogan are off TV almost entirely; Scott Steiner hasn't wrestled in weeks, so I assume he's injured; Luger's bicep has been hurt since February or so; and now Goldberg is out. It doesn't help that Bret is off TV because of Owen's death or that Jericho is off TV because he's out of the company in another month or so. As much as I get on WCW creative for never ending the nWo angle, the whole thing fell apart because just about everyone except Kevin Nash ended up on the shelf. No Hogan, no Hall, no Luger, and now Scotty's hurt too. Buff and Hennig got ejected from the group. The B-Teamers were cast off via storyline. Disco quietly stopped wearing Wolfpac shirts. The whole thing is just over because almost all the big names left television at the same time. Bad luck, to be sure, but had Bischoff done the right thing and ended the nWo storyline at one of the two obvious off-ramps he had (Starrcade '97, Starrcade '98), this wouldn't be an issue in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zendragon Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 I could have sworn the West Hollywood Blondes where a Russo thing.... Count me among those who love "Rap is Crap" its so bad its good One of the main problems along with the others we've discussed with the NLS/WTR feud is that the NLS kinda suck.. Had to look up who Chase Tatum was, he actually wrestled Cena when John was The Prototype, but other wise a bit of a tragic end 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirSmUgly Posted July 17 Author Share Posted July 17 6 hours ago, zendragon said: I could have sworn the West Hollywood Blondes where a Russo thing.... Me too! Actually, I misremembered a lot from this time, which makes sense since I wasn't watching and was only following along via online articles. Here are other things that I thought didn't happen until Russo got in that actually happened under Bischoff/Nash: The dog attack, Lenny and Lodi, the Hummer attack, the Jersey Triad, even a Filthy Animals tease before I thought there'd be one. I'm interested to see what else Bischoff and Nash fit into the next six weeks of television that I misattributed to Russo. Is all the weird Sting/Vampiro/ICP stuff Russo or Bischoff/Nash, for example? I guess I'll find out. Quote One of the main problems along with the others we've discussed with the NLS/WTR feud is that the NLS kinda suck.. Had to look up who Chase Tatum was, he actually wrestled Cena when John was The Prototype, but other wise a bit of a tragic end That's obviously why Brad Armstrong was added, but I think that it would have been better just to have Misterio/Konnan/Kidman create the Filthy Animals and have the NLS align with them as their backup, no Tatum or Armstrong needed. You still have the problem of the WTR being a) heels, yet b) totally outnumbered, though. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zendragon Posted July 17 Share Posted July 17 Shame we never got Big Bad Booty Daddy v Booty Man in a battle for booty supremacy 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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