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RING OF HONOR in 2021


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If I was in charge of ROH, I'd let Gresham keep doing what he's doing, but more of it.

I'd prob tweak pure rules a bit, allow refs to give the warning for excessive cheating equivalent to a closed fist to the face, and do the 2 falls/2 subs/1 ko for title matches/eliminators.   Most singles matches would be pure, and a lot more women.  Just go all in on being unique and trying to lock that #3 spot.

 

The pure stuff is what I watch ROH for, their standard wrestling is solid but I've seen it done just as well elsewhere.

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A mix of both is fine. A complete Pure rules promotion would get old after a while. Actually if the matches were less grapple fuck(Which is something Gresham is guilty of when booking those matches), you’d be able to hide the gimmicky-ness of that match type. It’s not like within the Kayfabe rules you can’t work a more common pro wrestling match. It’s just certain types will grapple fuck.

Edited by LoneWolf&Subs
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So how many people are actually under contract for ROH? It seems like the majority isn’t exclusive, so it’s like more, and more the shows are run like your every day indie show. Which is fine for me, but kind of sucks if you’re a TV wrestling promotion.

Edit: Oh wow, Alex Zayn is on this pre-show. I was surprised to learn he was in developmental, and then released. Dudes a handsome chap, and a really good worker. Only guy on this ROH show so far that looks like a star.

Edited by LoneWolf&Subs
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Jay Lethal cut a really good promo on tonight’s show that made it sound like ROH is making a big pivot into the “Pure” wrestling side of its company.

Its been a really good show tonight. Feels like the effects of the WWE releasing their grip on indie wrestling is finally showing its effects. I can feel a tide turn for the smaller companies now.

Edited by LoneWolf&Subs
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Skimming through the last two episodes of ROH right now. Man, Rok-C did the coolest submission to Angelina Love: she had her on her belly, floated over while holding the arm from behind her and bridged up while pulling the arm into an armbar. It was like a Fujiwara Cattle Decapitation. Has anyone ever done that before? My description of it may not describe it perfectly, granted. 

Also, Homicide's red The Town shirt with the robber in the nun outfit is dope as fuck. 

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On 9/13/2021 at 4:21 AM, LoneWolf&Subs said:

Jay Lethal cut a really good promo on tonight’s show that made it sound like ROH is making a big pivot into the “Pure” wrestling side of its company.

Wonder if there is big enough market for that.

Looking at how they won't be doing more live events this year and in general how RoH works, maybe they should drop TV title entirely? There isn't much purpose for it now and with that title removed they could give more time to Pure matches.

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On 9/13/2021 at 12:58 PM, LoneWolf&Subs said:
Now I applaud them for the way they handled COVID the past couple of years. But I doubt 99% of their roster aren’t taking indie bookings with crowds for the next 4 months.

To follow up on this - this was the blurb from the new WON

Quote

While a lot of wrestling is looking strong, Ring of Honor is clearly the coldest it has ever been, as shown by the lack of interest both in our polls and in the attendance at the 9/12 Death Before Dishonor show at the 2300 Arena in Philadelphia.

We only had 36 poll responses and the show drew just 340 paid with less than 400 in the building. Because of this, and also COVID concerns, the promotion has canceled all house shows until December’s Final Battle PPV in Baltimore. It will continue to tape television in empty arenas.

Joe Koff had talked before the return of a strategy of taping in empty arenas, thus spoilers don’t get out before the shows air. But now that everyone has fans again, fans aren’t going to watch empty arena wrestling for an hour in great numbers, and whether they know the outcomes ahead of time or not, that atmosphere isn’t conducive to watching. Then again, at this point the popularity has declined to where they wouldn’t have a great atmosphere at the events.

Still, the wrestling remains strong. They continued to tape television on 9/13 and 9/14 in Philadelphia on a closed set. But it is sad that the two companies that were hurt the most by COVID were the two major companies that were the most cautious, ROH and New Japan.

 

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That last part is kind of an iffy thing to say. Yes ROH ran that bubble, but it wasn’t like their on air TV strategy was any different from the other major promotions. ROH was already struggling pre-COVID after they were seen by fans as passé. A combination of losing the Bullet Club, losing more New Japan crossover dates, a very unpopular roster, and Bully Ray. I did see a lot of buzz when this whole nostalgia trip thing started, but it might’ve not taken completely, or the buzz died, with COVID, and metoo. 

on the New Japan front, they weren’t exactly the most impressively cautious of the Japanese companies, it’s just that they seemed to resent running empty arena shows(Eventually they gave in, after NOAH got a ton feedback for the weird Shiozaki Vs. Fujita match). But then you add bizarre booking choices, and deciding to run stadiums because it was a way to get a bigger house than they would normally get in a regular arena. They also have a very large foreign portion of their roster that they rely on to fill cards, and it’s bit them on the ass. Apparently they are still doing very well even with a lot of set backs, but I’m wondering how much that is before the recent WK shows. I have a feeling that this past year has been rougher on their business than last year.

Edited by LoneWolf&Subs
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Personally I think ROH was colder BEFORE the pandemic. Right now they have a women's division that's maybe (and this is me being fair to Impact) behind the Knockouts and WWE, their factions are strong, they still have cards to pull like Briscoes or Cheeseburger or Danhousen or an even slightly healthy Dalton Castle, the Pure division is something they're hammering hard there for the real weirdos... they just need to give up and let in a crowd. FFS. Without a crowd you don't have wrestling. I appreciate the caution (read: sanity) but it can only bring business down.

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4 minutes ago, Curt McGirt said:

Personally I think ROH was colder BEFORE the pandemic. Right now they have a women's division that's maybe (and this is me being fair to Impact) behind the Knockouts and WWE, their factions are strong, they still have cards to pull like Briscoes or Cheeseburger or Danhousen or an even slightly healthy Dalton Castle, the Pure division is something they're hammering hard there for the real weirdos... they just need to give up and let in a crowd. FFS. Without a crowd you don't have wrestling. I appreciate the caution (read: sanity) but it can only bring business down.

They also have the totally awesome Shane Taylor Productions.  But I ain't watching anymore empty arena matches.

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Productions is definitely one of the factions. Honestly I'd switch some of them with AEW's... how about some of that Forbidden Door shit with ROH, Tony? ROOSH and Dragon Lee vs. Lucha Brothers? 

EDIT: That has probably happened more times than I can count.

Edited by Curt McGirt
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21 hours ago, LoneWolf&Subs said:

Apparently they are still doing very well even with a lot of set backs, but I’m wondering how much that is before the recent WK shows. I have a feeling that this past year has been rougher on their business than last year.

I think when someone talks about NJPW/Bushiroad financials they usually ignore elephant in the room - NJPW Strong. It has been running since last year and so far had one paid show. So its not that Japan side has to carry their own shows, they also have to finance USA shows.

As for RoH, it looked like it had picked up some hype just before Covid, but all of that was linked to Marty. I wonder how things would have gone if Covid didn't happen.

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I have been an ROH fan since mid 2002 so almost day one.  Supported them, been to many live shows, purchased countless shirts/hoodies.  But I don't think Covid is the reason for lack of shows. I think it's because they haven't been drawing enough to make any profit and it looks embarrassing.   The matches have been good but they need new talent. 

 

When every little indy fed can run, every TV promotion can run with a crowd  why can't ROH?  Gresham worked GCW last night, many of the guys work other indy's. So surely it's not their call.  The fans who purchased honor club for the year have to be furious. they have only had a handful of live shows if that.

 

 

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I’m sure it’s a Sinclair call more than anything. Especially with their behind the scenes staff in the most danger. But, the truth is it’s probably better a way to save, and make money. Especially if you’re reliant on advertisements to fuel your budget when you can tape 2+ months worth of TV in an empty building, instead of running four shows that barely draw flies in multiple cities that pile up travel costs(A reason why WWE was so profitable the last two years). If it was the wrestlers choice they’d probably push for more live shows. 

It’s pretty crazy a TV-less GCW can outdraw them coast-to-coast, and probably on PPV streaming too. I know they got a TV show, with TV tapings, but I think they need to go back to the old model of producing live events through double shots that air live on FITE, and are edited down into TV.

They want to be a TV show, but they need to think again like an indie, or else a “mud show” like GCW will keep eating their lunch in terms of looking like a hot product. 

Edited by LoneWolf&Subs
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  • 3 weeks later...
On 9/18/2021 at 12:45 AM, Curt McGirt said:

Productions is definitely one of the factions. Honestly I'd switch some of them with AEW's... how about some of that Forbidden Door shit with ROH, Tony? ROOSH and Dragon Lee vs. Lucha Brothers? 

EDIT: That has probably happened more times than I can count.

 

I'd want Josh Woods stretching Sammy.

 

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