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AEW Dynamite - 11/18/2020


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16 hours ago, ChrisPBacon said:

How many more appearances does Matt Cardona have left for AEW? I could see him being used as the third man with cody and Darby against team taz.

Sounds like a question for Flair’s Shadow.

Perhaps Shane Douglas will come in and lead them as the new “Triple Threat”. 

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1 hour ago, Zartan said:

Sounds like a question for Flair’s Shadow.

Perhaps Shane Douglas will come in and lead them as the new “Triple Threat”. 

Cody would have to be in the Shane Douglas role.  Just like Douglas did with Flair,  Cody is good at cutting bitchy promos on bigger fish who barely know he’s alive.

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8 hours ago, Mr Harms said:

AEW don’t do DQ’s, never mind in the main event. I think Allin was protected, because it was a total death move. Cage and Starks need some heat and some momentum before ultimately losing to Darby in the singles matches. 

 

4 hours ago, Curt McGirt said:

Yes, and this is a major problem. Your promotion is not going to turn into '80s AJ just because you have an occasional DQ or DDQ. Even in a main event. Disqualifications are an inherent part of wrestling so stop trying to deny it. 

They did for Avalon/Cutler.

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On rare wrestling issue that JR is seemingly progressive on, I'm with him that DQ's are basically lazy booking. In the main event, it told two key parts of the story: it will take something incredible to beat Darby (drillclaw off the top), and that he is in new world now as the hunted champion. I think both guys came out of that match just fine, and it contributed to the goal that it makes me more interested in seeing the Cage-Darby title match. I swear that people almost need to de-program themselves from dumbass WWE booking this century, as their laziness does not need to be a template for AEW (and for whatever flaws Gedo's New Japan booking has, it mostly makes sense in the end and has drawn a great deal of money for them and is a much better template to work off of).

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Thinking would DQs are a useful tool =/= asking for WWE-level nonsense. 

I have no opinion on the Darby thing. He's not a dominating world-beater, so who cares?

But I do like that a finish off the top was actually a finish. Considering Darby had just recently kicked out of Cody's finish off the ropes, I was expecting that to be another over-the-top near-fall. 

Edited by Andy in Kansas
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One other point in this thread that I want to address is Death Triangle as the faces in the feud with Kingston family. While Pac is probably better as a heel, he was a pretty good face in NXT and briefly during his WWE run (before he went down as another talent Vince squandered prior to his reinvention as a dominant cruiserweight). However, Lucha Brothers have been miscast as heels during their entire AEW run. You can pull off doing awesome moves as heel (see Pac, El Phantasmo, and Omega's early Bullet Club run), but when Fenix's entire character is basically being an awesome wrestler, it works much better as a face. Also, Penta's work with the crowd is much better as a face (Cero Miedo, the glove coming off gimmick). I think that Penta could be a nasty heel down the road, but not ready for Lucha Brothers to be broken up yet, as I want them to get a tag title run at some point. 

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44 minutes ago, Big Z said:

One other point in this thread that I want to address is Death Triangle as the faces in the feud with Kingston family. While Pac is probably better as a heel, he was a pretty good face in NXT and briefly during his WWE run (before he went down as another talent Vince squandered prior to his reinvention as a dominant cruiserweight). However, Lucha Brothers have been miscast as heels during their entire AEW run. You can pull off doing awesome moves as heel (see Pac, El Phantasmo, and Omega's early Bullet Club run), but when Fenix's entire character is basically being an awesome wrestler, it works much better as a face. Also, Penta's work with the crowd is much better as a face (Cero Miedo, the glove coming off gimmick). I think that Penta could be a nasty heel down the road, but not ready for Lucha Brothers to be broken up yet, as I want them to get a tag title run at some point. 

I will go one further and say that at the moment there's nothing that is going to make me boo the Lucha Brothers. I find them incredible and they have talent rarely seen in wrestling. Do they sometimes do too much flippy bullshit in big matches? Sure. But if I could do what they can do I probably would flip around a lot too.

Along the same lines I don't want to boo Will Hobbs. I think we needed a big man babyface and they lost the plot on this one.

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55 minutes ago, Shadow said:

I will go one further and say that at the moment there's nothing that is going to make me boo the Lucha Brothers. I find them incredible and they have talent rarely seen in wrestling. Do they sometimes do too much flippy bullshit in big matches? Sure. But if I could do what they can do I probably would flip around a lot too.

Along the same lines I don't want to boo Will Hobbs. I think we needed a big man babyface and they lost the plot on this one.

The Hobbs one is tough, cause I agree with your basic point about needing a big face (still some potential there with Luchasaurus, but he's kind of been lost in the crowd lately), but they spent too long teasing the Hobbs's turn without delivering on it. If Hobbs would have strongly turned down Taz from the beginning, he could have been a strong face, but it was a decently executed if not very prolonged and telegraphed turn. I will say, I think at least one of Archer, Wardlow, or Miro will turn face in 2021, probably in the first part of the year. 

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7 hours ago, Jiji said:

How did Scott Steiner not paralyze guys with his screwdriver? Every time I see Cage hit his very safe looking Drill Claw, I just wonder how Scotty didn't put guys into wheelchairs with the original version.

There's a Superstars squash with Steiners (before SummerSlam'93) where Scott does this to Glenn Ruth (Headbanger Thrasher in a few years time)! This was the first time I ever saw this. And I used rewind this spot over and over. That was insane and it was probably pretty close that Headbanger Mosh wound up having to look for someone else to become his partner. I heard that Rick did it in ECW and was even more reckless with it (imagine that!)

Edited by Shartnado
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The latest incarnation of The Inner Circle should last a while before any fuckery, that's the only way to make the last few weeks worth it. Furthermore, MJF nor Jericho should turn/revolt. It should absolutely be somebody like Santana/Ortiz or Wardlow breaking away. Hell, Wardlow and Hagar as APA-esque buddy asskickers would be pretty rad. 

The women's match fucking rocked. More of that, plz. 

Edited by christopher.annino
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1 hour ago, christopher.annino said:

The latest incarnation of The Inner Circle should last a while before any fuckery, that's the only way to make the last few weeks worth it. Furthermore, MJF nor Jericho should turn/revolt. It should absolutely be somebody like Santana/Ortiz or Wardlow breaking away. Hell, Wardlow and Hagar as APA-esque buddy asskickers would be pretty rad. 

The women's match fucking rocked. More of that, plz. 

I'm pretty down with a Wardlow y Hagar Diabolical Union

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On ‎11‎/‎20‎/‎2020 at 11:27 AM, Craig H said:

Thank you for the last two posts. It's sad then when I was watching the main event I was thinking about shit like, "what's the board going to say when Cody got his entrance after Darby's" or "the board is for sure going to bitch about Darby dropping the pinfall." Look, Darby isn't unbeatable. 

No one is saying that he is and no I don't really need anyone to justify the booking of the finish by going into some lengthy gaslight explanation of his gimmick to me as if to say that the reason I find fault with the booking is because I somehow don't understand the nature of Darby's gimmick.

I have no issue with Darby eating pins.  I have an issue with Cody not eating this particular pin in Darby's stead out of professional courtesy since they just put the belt on the guy.

Yes, Darby does lose something by dropping that particular fall to Cage because you just had him do something that promotions rarely, if ever, ask of their reigning champions on their inaugural appearance with the title.  That doesn't sound like protection to me.

2 hours ago, ka-to said:

DQs and count outs are fine and should be used to show that there are rules. Double DQ and count out finishes are horrible.

I totally agree with the first and disagree slightly with the second. 

Double DQs and count outs are fine if the point you're trying to make is that both dudes legit hate each other and give zero shits about rules and refs, but these situations should be rare and should lead to an extra special blow-off. 

Double DQs / Count Outs should lead to special stip matches like cage matches, strap matches, and bunkhouse brawls and you shouldn't just hand out matches like on the regular.

I will caveat with the fact that I hate all count out losses that aren't a result of two workers brawling to the back, two workers beating the shit out of each other and losing track of the count, or two workers that just killed each other on the outside of the ring and can't make the count.

Screwjob count outs due to outside interference where the heel makes it and the face doesn't are bullshit, yes.

Edited by J.T.
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On 11/20/2020 at 7:06 PM, Jiji said:

How did Scott Steiner not paralyze guys with his screwdriver? Every time I see Cage hit his very safe looking Drill Claw, I just wonder how Scotty didn't put guys into wheelchairs with the original version.

 

On 11/20/2020 at 7:10 PM, Nice Guy Eddie said:

pure luck

Yep.  Steiner took the Ivan Drago approach.  “If he dies, he dies.”

Edited by Technico Support
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I watched a compilation of screwdrivers and there were times when he'd do what Cage does and turn it into a more "traditional" sitout tombstone. But other times, particularly in NJPW, he'd just let 'em drop at that insane angle and the only thing stopping them from dropping on their dome was his thickboi thighs. 

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4 hours ago, The Green Meanie said:

I'm going to say it right now, it's going to be Wardlow. They've already foreshadowed it plenty enough, it's coming.

Yeah, I think I said it before, he reminds me of Batista and in this scenario he definitely fits that bill. Big Dave breaking away from Evolution to be his own man.

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On 11/19/2020 at 9:31 AM, NoFistsJustFlips said:

Not sure if serious? lol

A cleaner is a hitman. When people say go full cleaner they want him to go back to his full on heel gimmick when he was the hitman for the Bullet Club. Dark shades, leather jackets, jet black dyed hair (that part isnt gonna happen), more serious and shit. He's kinda been this aww shucks silly babyface in AEW. Still presented as a threat in the ring obviously, but people want his more focused New Japan presentation.

 

 

On 11/19/2020 at 9:14 AM, Goodear said:

What exactly is full Cleaner? I know people have been talking about it for a while but I'm not sure what exactly it means other than being a heel and having brooms around.

Kenny described it as Harvey Keitel's Wolf character in Pulp Fiction. They guy you call when you need the mess cleaned up 

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On 11/19/2020 at 3:21 PM, For Great Justice said:

For as much as I’m here for Team Taz, I gotta wonder if they left some money on the table with babyface Hobbs. He really seems to have that physical charisma and size to look good walking tall on heels, and what babyface big guys are left?

Dustin, Luchasaurus 

vs

Cage, Archer, Lee, Butcher, Wardlow, Hager now Hobbs 

I dunno. A Cage and Hobbs team potentially RULES, but there was some breakout good guy equity on the table I think 

I agree they could've gotten more mileage out of Hobbs as a babyface for a while, but I guess we'll see. 

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On 11/21/2020 at 12:40 AM, Big Z said:

The Hobbs one is tough, cause I agree with your basic point about needing a big face (still some potential there with Luchasaurus, but he's kind of been lost in the crowd lately), but they spent too long teasing the Hobbs's turn without delivering on it. If Hobbs would have strongly turned down Taz from the beginning, he could have been a strong face, but it was a decently executed if not very prolonged and telegraphed turn. I will say, I think at least one of Archer, Wardlow, or Miro will turn face in 2021, probably in the first part of the year. 

 

think Archer would be the best face outta the bunch right now.  It's hard not to want to cheer for him as crazy as he is.   Just have Eddie disrespect Jake and start a feud that way.

 

Wardlow could be a money face down the road.

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