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Raw is Highlander II: The Quickening - 11/16/2020


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8 hours ago, HumanChessgame said:

"Survivor Series team bickers with eachother" is yet another WWE trope that is tired and boring.

To be fair, when they aren’t bickering, the complaint is “why are they getting along? why do they care about brand supremacy?”

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Normally I am all Fuck Randy Orton, but his promo was hot fire and that main event was solid.  It almost made me sad to see Orton eat a title changing pin on normal television but thems the breaks.  

I am digging the Claymore becoming the kick to the face version of the Diamond Cutter that can either be set up to kill you or serve as a situational lights out counter to someone else's finisher.

It's been a long time since I sat down and watched an entire episode of RAW.  So they're going full blown Joseph Park / Abyss DID with Bray Wyatt and the Fiend now?  Is Bray losing his ability to control that persona or has it always been this way?

Edited by J.T.
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I'm also not a huge Orton guy, and I really haven't been watching much wrestling lately, but I thought Orton was particularly good last night. Also, I always pop for his powerslam. It's the one thing that I think is somewhat enhanced by how Dunn captures it from production.

I started watching as Bray was coming to the ring to take on Miz. I think Alexa is having a lot of fun with this, but this may be the biggest disconnect between character presentation outside of the ring, and quality we get inside the ring in a good while. 

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5 hours ago, Ryan said:

Cesaro is VERY European, so he be anything you want him to be, oh yeah. 🇨🇭🇫🇮🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿🇮🇪! 🇯🇵...?

I got into it with Claudio at a restaurant after an indy show because he wanted me to buy his shirt which the only says was M  (it was the Ricola bomb shirt)  I am 6'2, 185 lbs. and shrink my shirts like it's my job. I normally wear a L but prefer XL in case I shrink it.  

The Euro SOB told me the shirt he was wearing was a Medium.  Claudio, 6'4 and jacked.  He insisted but refused to show the tag!  

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15 minutes ago, J.T. said:

It's been a long time since I sat down and watched an entire episode of RAW.  So they're going full blown Joseph Park / Abyss DID with Bray Wyatt and the Fiend now?  Is Bray losing his ability to control that persona or has it always been this way?

It's been that way for a while.  Bray Wyatt, Nightmare Children's Show Host, and Bray Wyatt, The Fiend, are two sides of the same coin, but never appear together.  Wyatt is very tough, but is ultimately beatable and able to be dealt with.  The Fiend is, outside of a couple of extremely rare cases, unbeatable and cannot be reasoned with.  

So yeah, Park/Abyss is a good comparison.  (Hell, this character might be Park's doing.)

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I was skeptical, but the Lana/Nia Jax angle has swayed my opinion on Lana.  I've gone from not really having much of an opinion on her to wanting her and the angle off my tv.  I don't think this angle would get Trish Stratus or "I'm a Hugger" Bayley over, but Lana isn't nearly as sympathetic as either of those two.  I don't feel like Lana connects with an audience well.  Outside of the Bridgitte Nielsen cosplay, I've never really had a handle on her character or felt like she was projecting as either a heel or a face.  

Rest of show was ok.  Bray and Alexa don't do anything for me personally, but the act seems to be working for a decent percentage of the audience.  Figured Vince was going to do a title change before SS.  Was hoping Hurt Business would take the belts from New Day, though I suspect New Day/Street Profits is the bigger draw for SS.

Not too interested in SS outside of Asuka/Sasha and Roman.  Was sort of hoping Randy would hold on to the title and they'd convince him to to put Roman over to make the Tribal Chief look like a world beater.  Though Vince would probably never let the Raw champion look that weak.  Assume Drew and Roman are going to give 50-50 and both be well-protected.

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This story going forward maybe (sort of):

Bray Wyatt: The Joker. He loves Alexa and was the one who corrupted her with his craziness. But he's abusive and the lunatic Fiend sees love as something that must be killed.

Alexa Bliss: Harley Quinn, like in her almost cosplays. She's devoted to Wyatt even though Wyatt sometimes tries to kill her.

Nikki Cross: Poison Ivy. Also loves Alexa (maybe as a friend, maybe more). Wants to free her from the abusive Wyatt.

Not sure if it's as good as my "heel Shield" = "Transformers Conehead Seekers" comparison but it can't really be worse I guess.

(I don't actually read superhero comics I only read ABOUT them please don't kill me for getting something wrong)

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11 minutes ago, CastleVania Rey said:

This story going forward maybe (sort of):

Bray Wyatt: The Joker. He loves Alexa and was the one who corrupted her with his craziness. But he's abusive and the lunatic Fiend sees love as something that must be killed.

Alexa Bliss: Harley Quinn, like in her almost cosplays. She's devoted to Wyatt even though Wyatt sometimes tries to kill her.

Nikki Cross: Poison Ivy. Also loves Alexa (maybe as a friend, maybe more). Wants to free her from the abusive Wyatt.

Not sure if it's as good as my "heel Shield" = "Transformers Conehead Seekers" comparison but it can't really be worse I guess.

(I don't actually read superhero comics I only read ABOUT them please don't kill me for getting something wrong)

Its an accurate description of the Joker/Harley/Ivy triangle. Not quite of what is going on with Bray, Alexa, & Nikki. The Fiend has no interest in killing Alexa as her mind already belongs to him. The relationship isn't seemingly abusive. Nikki just wants her friend to not be insane or following a crazed monster.

Edited by Eivion
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29 minutes ago, Eivion said:

Its an accurate description of the Joker/Harley/Ivy triangle. Not quite of what is going on with Bray, Alexa, & Nikki. The Fiend has no interest in killing Alexa as her mind already belongs to him. The relationship isn't seemingly abusive. Nikki just wants her friend to not be insane or following a crazed monster.

Agreed that it doesn't work for right now. I was just suggesting where they COULD go, for amusement.

Though I then realized I was fantasy-booking which I told myself I wouldn't do. So excuse me while I go pike myself. 😜

I question whether Wyatt is "supposed to be" a face or heel every time he appears now. His actions are sinister like he's a heel, but he's been targeting other heels lately. Maybe he's actually neither currently? They can allegedly do that without getting confused?

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9 hours ago, CastleVania Rey said:

 

I question whether Wyatt is "supposed to be" a face or heel every time he appears now. His actions are sinister like he's a heel, but he's been targeting other heels lately. Maybe he's actually neither currently? They can allegedly do that without getting confused?

I'm under the impression that he's going after people who wronged him in his past incarnation. Cena, DB, Strowman, and now Orton.

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10 hours ago, mystman said:

I'm under the impression that he's going after people who wronged him in his past incarnation. Cena, DB, Strowman, and now Orton.

That's been the throughline. They basically spelled it out - Wyatt, cult leader, was at his nadir when the Fiend found him and rebuilt him into what he is today. Somewhere between demonic possession and the Venom symbiote.

Miz is a bit of a stretch, but then I imagine even eldritch horrors just want to punch that face.

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On 11/17/2020 at 7:46 AM, JonnyLaw said:

To be fair, when they aren’t bickering, the complaint is “why are they getting along? why do they care about brand supremacy?”

I skipped my annual post about it this year. 

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I get Mandy's injury angle - Meltzer says she hurt her shoulder when Nia tossed her out of the ring the previous week (complete accident; Mandy got tangled in the ropes and landed awkwardly) but I don't get why they took Dana out of play.  Except, y'know, Vince.  Didn't Mandy and Dana qualify by winning a tag match?  So leave Dana in and replace Mandy?  Mandy and Dana have been a team for a month or so.  It's not like Dana kayfabe can't go on without her.

Expecting the women's elimination match to be awful.  Company's kinda thin on decent female workers right now and two of them are in a singles match.  Don't remember what Bayley's doing.  Not that it matters.  I'm guessing the match isn't much besides a way to advance the Nia/Lana angle - probably with Lana being the surprise survivor and either standing up to Nia or getting her respect (probably the former),

I don't really want to know where they go from here with the Lana angle.  I don't think Lana can sustain a push without a lot of smoke and mirrors.

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I heard something about Dana going to a boxing event maskless. Perhaps its a punishment for that. 

Peyton & Lacey are ok replacements. Both can be serviceable. Honestly, Lana is the worst wrestler in the match at the moment and unless she is spending a large amount of time in the ring I figure the match will be fine. Shayna is good, and Nia has been teaming with her. The Smackdown side is actually good so far with Bianca, Ruby, & Liv. As long as neither of the last two spots go to Tamina we should be getting capable at worst wrestler. 

I only find it hard to get super interested because they have just done a shit job building up the division with the big story going in focusing on arguably the worst wrestler in it.

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