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NOV 2020 WRESTLING DISCUSSION


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1 hour ago, For Great Justice said:

Usos > Headshrinkers > Wild Samoans (though current, thinned up Usos obviously have a very different presentation)

I don't really see the Usos > Wild Samoans comparison, either in terms of gimmick or in-ring style.  They've thankfully never really done the "savage" characters most Samoans (and Tongans and Fijians and....) get stuck with.  They debuted on the main roster as preppy anti-Samoans.  They did go through a couple years where they wore face paint and did the siva tau as part of their entrance, but they didn't wrestle like the SST or Wild Samoans.  Their style's always be more of a modern indie style (lots of superkicks, dives, high-flying).  Wild Samoans were basically brawlers.  SST too.  And the Usos have never had the air of invincibility the SST and Wild Samoans had (as well as Umaga, Barbarian, Haku, etc; another "wrestling savage" staple: dishing out punishment while being almost impervious to it).

Even when they wore the facepaint, I thought the presentation was closer to the Rock's than any other Samoan wrestler or team.

SST - I refuse to remember them as the Headshrinkers - were definitely a better version of Afa and Sika.  ST w/ Paul E. are still one of my favorite acts.

Lol, now I kinda want to see the Usos smash a coconut over a jobber's head like the SST did, then eat the pieces. 

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2 hours ago, Log said:

Yes. Both as a worker and as a horrible human being. 

Benoit never called anyone a test tube baby or told them to go back to Jupiter or Mars. Advantage Dynamite.

 

 A

Edited by cwoy2j
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19 minutes ago, Andy in Kansas said:

Name names.

 

I don’t think Bronson Reed is a good spokesman for the “listen to the doctors” campaign.  I’m skeptical his doctors have have been telling him that he’s at a healthy weight.

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3 hours ago, Eoae said:

I don't really see the Usos > Wild Samoans comparison, either in terms of gimmick or in-ring style.  They've thankfully never really done the "savage" characters most Samoans (and Tongans and Fijians and....) get stuck with.  They debuted on the main roster as preppy anti-Samoans.  They did go through a couple years where they wore face paint and did the siva tau as part of their entrance, but they didn't wrestle like the SST or Wild Samoans.  Their style's always be more of a modern indie style (lots of superkicks, dives, high-flying).

There's a lot of Three Minute Warning in The Usos, though. Especially during their "penitentiary" years.

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7 hours ago, Phantom Lord said:

I think Hogan is in his own template. Ventura was trying to be The Superstar. But Hogan while he might have emulated some of Billy's gimmick, he really went in a whole new direction that hadn't been seen before. Plus, unlike Ventura and Graham...Hogan could actually work when he wanted to. I love them all. Ventura was the better promo. Hogan was the better wrestler.

I never thought I would type those words. But i've been gaining an appreciation for Hogan the wrestler lately.

24" pythons... Brother... tie dye... two-tone beards... feather boas... that was all Superstar.

He is the Man of the hour, the man with the power, too sweet to be sour. He is the Superstar and the OG. Ventura, Hogan, and Steiner were all imitations. There is no denying that. 

Graham's work in the 70s was electric. He was a full decade ahead of his time.

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28 minutes ago, Zakk_Sabbath said:

Bryan is one of few who can touch Bret, but a *better* Bret? I don't know, man.

Other than his insane need to try and give himself concussions early on, Bryan is absolutely a better Bret than Bret was.

His "Planet's Champion" run solidified that for me.

Bret in WCW is a non event so looking on his WWE career, for as awesome as he was, Bryan has him covered. It's not a knock on Bret at all. Bryan is just one of the absolute best to ever do this.

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Bryan is not Bret. They're different. Very very different. Bryan is his own thing. In all honesty- Bryan reminds me more of Foley in terms of having that real connection with the fans and that love for wrestling. 

The closest of the current wrestlers to Bret to me is AJ Styles. 

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5 hours ago, Wyld Samurai said:

24" pythons... Brother... tie dye... two-tone beards... feather boas... that was all Superstar.

He is the Man of the hour, the man with the power, too sweet to be sour. He is the Superstar and the OG. Ventura, Hogan, and Steiner were all imitations. There is no denying that. 

Graham's work in the 70s was electric. He was a full decade ahead of his time.

I understand Superstar Graham was way ahead of his time. No one will ever doubt that. I was just saying I think Ventura is a better promo guy than him.

I wish we could have got some of that hot 70's wrestling in the late 80's in the WWF.

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Continuing the conversation from last month's thread about early Survivor Series, especially the first one, I am still in awe of ALL of the babyface teams on that show! There's a noticeable drop in quality even one year later, where the heel teams are actually more impressive on at least two matches. The opening match face team is pretty much perfect and it's no surprise that there's 3 survivors by the end of it.

Now, Andre's team in the main event is one of the best ever assembled, but when you look at Hogan's team too, I'm still a little bit surprised that they lost. Bigelow, Muraco, Orndorff and Patera seemed like a hell of a bunch to back up that one guy!

The tag team elimination match has incredible talent on both sides, while women's match is basically 3 on 3, with some dead weight on both sides, despite the end result is a really good match, too!

Has there been a team with more kayfabe talent than Savage's team in '87? He would have had a similar level heel team in '89, if Windham was there, but co-incidentally he took that team to (a count out) victory with 3 survivors remaining, even with (or due to) Earthquake joining at the last minute to replace Barry.

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1 hour ago, Shartnado said:

Continuing the conversation from last month's thread about early Survivor Series, especially the first one, I am still in awe of ALL of the babyface teams on that show! There's a noticeable drop in quality even one year later, where the heel teams are actually more impressive on at least two matches. The opening match face team is pretty much perfect and it's no surprise that there's 3 survivors by the end of it.

Now, Andre's team in the main event is one of the best ever assembled, but when you look at Hogan's team too, I'm still a little bit surprised that they lost. Bigelow, Muraco, Orndorff and Patera seemed like a hell of a bunch to back up that one guy!

The tag team elimination match has incredible talent on both sides, while women's match is basically 3 on 3, with some dead weight on both sides, despite the end result is a really good match, too!

Has there been a team with more kayfabe talent than Savage's team in '87? He would have had a similar level heel team in '89, if Windham was there, but co-incidentally he took that team to (a count out) victory with 3 survivors remaining, even with (or due to) Earthquake joining at the last minute to replace Barry.

I just watched the 89 SS and it seemed sort of jumbled.  While I always love the SS theme song and Vince doing his over the top narration, there was a lot missing. No Akeem on Bossman's team?  Bret and Anvil on different teams?  Savage and Zeus not on the same team?  Having Rude captain his own team instead of being on team Heenan?

 

Now I will admit I haven't watched the 89 PTW or Superstars to fully get the build, but not having Bret and Anvil on the same team makes 0 sense. 

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25 minutes ago, paintedbynumbers said:

I just watched the 89 SS and it seemed sort of jumbled.  While I always love the SS theme song and Vince doing his over the top narration, there was a lot missing. No Akeem on Bossman's team?  Bret and Anvil on different teams?  Savage and Zeus not on the same team?  Having Rude captain his own team instead of being on team Heenan?

 

Now I will admit I haven't watched the 89 PTW or Superstars to fully get the build, but not having Bret and Anvil on the same team makes 0 sense. 

Akeem WAS supposed to be there, but for whatever reason was replaced by Bad News Brown at the PPV (I don't believe the replacement was announced during the build?) Bret and Anvil were once again trying to be singles wrestlers at that point, but that didn't stick at the time.

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28 minutes ago, Shartnado said:

Akeem WAS supposed to be there, but for whatever reason was replaced by Bad News Brown at the PPV (I don't believe the replacement was announced during the build?) Bret and Anvil were once again trying to be singles wrestlers at that point, but that didn't stick at the time.

Akeem suffered an injury less than two weeks before the PPV.  

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2 hours ago, Shartnado said:

Continuing the conversation from last month's thread about early Survivor Series, especially the first one, I am still in awe of ALL of the babyface teams on that show! There's a noticeable drop in quality even one year later, where the heel teams are actually more impressive on at least two matches. The opening match face team is pretty much perfect and it's no surprise that there's 3 survivors by the end of it.

Now, Andre's team in the main event is one of the best ever assembled, but when you look at Hogan's team too, I'm still a little bit surprised that they lost. Bigelow, Muraco, Orndorff and Patera seemed like a hell of a bunch to back up that one guy!

The tag team elimination match has incredible talent on both sides, while women's match is basically 3 on 3, with some dead weight on both sides, despite the end result is a really good match, too!

Has there been a team with more kayfabe talent than Savage's team in '87? He would have had a similar level heel team in '89, if Windham was there, but co-incidentally he took that team to (a count out) victory with 3 survivors remaining, even with (or due to) Earthquake joining at the last minute to replace Barry.

To me at the time and now viewed Hogan's team as weak, sure he has Bigelow but Muraco, Ornfdorff & Patera weren't over as faces and borderline unwatchable in the ring. Now if it was a legit ass kicking contest that team would be one of the best, even if all Hogan could do was counter someone leg diving him ala Verne Gagne.

Savage's team in 87 was loaded but Honky's team was pretty bad, Davis was a jobber at that point, Bass was low card but got the bump since he was willing to get his head shaved, I always liked Herc but he was all rest holds in this time frame, Harley who would have carried the load for this team was eliminated pretty quickly.

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2 minutes ago, Mister TV said:

To me at the time and now viewed Hogan's team as weak, sure he has Bigelow but Muraco, Ornfdorff & Patera weren't over as faces and borderline unwatchable in the ring. Now if it was a legit ass kicking contest that team would be one of the best, even if all Hogan could do was counter someone leg diving him ala Verne Gagne.

Savage's team in 87 was loaded but Honky's team was pretty bad, Davis was a jobber at that point, Bass was low card but got the bump since he was willing to get his head shaved, I always liked Herc but he was all rest holds in this time frame, Harley who would have carried the load for this team was eliminated pretty quickly.

To my 10(ish) year old eyes Muraco, Patera and Orndorff were over and Hogan and Bigelow seemed like an unbeatable couple! I was very new to it at the time, but Muraco was a bull, Orndorff had stood toe to toe against Hogan recently and Patera was an Olympian with a bear hug and a full nelson that crushed you! I do agree with Honky's team being shit and the team he had the year after wasn't THAT much better. It seemed like they never stood a chance in '87 OR '88. 

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Watching WALTER/Dragunov on last week's NXT UK, I have two WWE dream matches. WALTER vs. Daniel Bryan and WALTER vs. Cesaro. Doubt either will happen as I read WALTER doesn't want to move to the USA and keep on NXT UK. Hopefully a NXT TakeOver will entice him over and a special show like When Worlds Collide put NXT and NXT UK against each other.

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