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AUG 2020 WRESTLING DISCUSSION


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I'd like to agree with Brock v Finn and Brock v Bryan, but it was big face against small heel, but if the roles were reversed, as they usually are, those two are amazing! Owen was a heel in the states when facing a then babyface Vader in the UK ppv, while treated as a face in the actual match by the UK audience.

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As Odessasteps said Garvin vs Andre could be pretty close. Back on wrestling classics message board it was said that Garvin actually let Andre choose a partner for a handicap match against him. I've never seen any of those matches, so I wouldn't know about that sort of thing.

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18 minutes ago, Shartnado said:

I'd like to agree with Brock v Finn and Brock v Bryan, but it was big face against small heel

Uhm, Finn was the face in the Brock match. Brock/Bryan both were heels going in.

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6 minutes ago, Eivion said:

Uhm, Finn was the face in the Brock match. Brock/Bryan both were heels going in.

Yes, this was why I said I'd like to agree, but the actual topic was a big face against a small heel. That is a very unusual situation, but I do have to say you are absolutely correct about Bryan being a defacto heel going into the match against Brock, but go ahead, try booing him in that situation.

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That was my bad, I thought Brock was a babyface at that time. That's probably one of the last WWE PPVs I watched, and I just remember Bryan having recently become the planets champion, and having Erick Rowan and all that

Edited by Zakk_Sabbath
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Thanks for the responses - I had forgotten a few of these. I was also thinking that there has to an entry via "existential babyface threat Andre has entered the territory to walk tall over whatever top heel has been giving the territory babyface(s) grief", but I couldn't think of a really good specific example with video.

Edited by For Great Justice
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6 minutes ago, For Great Justice said:

Thanks for the responses - I had forgotten a few of these. I was also thinking that there has to an entry via "existential babyface threat Andre has entered the territory to walk tall over whatever top heel has been giving the territory babyface(s) grief", but I couldn't think of a really good specific example with video.

I thought there were clips of Andre v Garvin in Knoxville but I only did a quick search. 

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31 minutes ago, Shartnado said:

Yes, this was why I said I'd like to agree, but the actual topic was a big face against a small heel. That is a very unusual situation, but I do have to say you are absolutely correct about Bryan being a defacto heel going into the match against Brock, but go ahead, try booing him in that situation.

Ah, I misread the original post. Thought it was the other way around. I love that Brock/Bryan match. Bryan went on so hated only to have the crowd rooting for by the time it ended.

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2 minutes ago, Eivion said:

Ah, I misread the original post. Thought it was the other way around. I love that Brock/Bryan match. Bryan went on so hated only to have the crowd rooting for by the time it ended.

Didn't he though? That was amazing to see! As I said, I was all like "shut up, I don't want there to be a another generation on this planet" in the beginning and all like "c'mon Bryan, stomp the crap out of that Cro-Magnon!" by the end! Very hard to boo him in that situation!

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46 minutes ago, Wyld Samurai said:

Depending on who you sided with- for some its Hogan vs Savage WM5. 

Savage was clearly in the right in this situation. There was definitely lust for Elizabeth in Hogan's eyes.

Speaking of, has there been another babyface who's given so many of his allies legitimate reasons to turn on him? You could argue that Savage, Andre, and Orndorff all were justified in turning on that leathery prick. 

 

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I blame Hogan for all future WWE babyfaces not having friends very often, and for getting turned on so often.  Coz Hogan kept screwing all his friends over, starting with getting Lust in his Eyes.

(I know the mega powers asploding wasn't first but still)

Edited by Morganti
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8 minutes ago, mattdangerously said:

Savage was clearly in the right in this situation. There was definitely lust for Elizabeth in Hogan's eyes.

Speaking of, has there been another babyface who's given so many of his allies legitimate reasons to turn on him? You could argue that Savage, Andre, and Orndorff all were justified in turning on that leathery prick. 

In that regard, he's the anti-Sting, who is just so much of a good guy and so trusting (naive) that he never sees it coming. "Why, yes. I would like to join the 4 Horsemen! Thanks, pals!"

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15 hours ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

I always loved the improbable Los Conquistadors run.  Like a 13 seed in the NCAA tournament. 

Same here.  I assume the Conquistadors run had something to do with the double turn?  They didn't want the Powers of Pain squashing another heel team five minutes after they turned?

The tag team elimination match the year before had the Killer Bees and the Young Stallions both surviving the match.  Last three teams were Bees, Stallions, heel Islanders.  Teams that didn't make it to the end included Demolition, Hart Foundation, Dream Team, Strike Force.  Way to give the fans what they wanted, Vince.

That match also had an absurd finish, even by early Survivor Series standards.  Killer Bees wrestled unmasked for about 35 min, then put on the masks and did the "ref can't tell them apart" thing like 60 second later.

Actually, early SS matches had a lot of odd finishers and headscratching dq's.  Watched Survivor Series 94 last night.  Diesel murders Razor Ramon's team by his lonesome to give his team a 5-1 advantage, then has enough of HBK's bs and turns on Shawn.  Eventually chases Shawn down the ramp while Shawn is the legal man,.  So naturally, the ref.... counts the entire team out and gives the win to Razor.  They had done similar countouts in years past and only the legal man who didn't get back in for the 20 count was dq'ed.  

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24 minutes ago, Doc Townsend said:

Same here.  I assume the Conquistadors run had something to do with the double turn?  They didn't want the Powers of Pain squashing another heel team five minutes after they turned?

The tag team elimination match the year before had the Killer Bees and the Young Stallions both surviving the match.  Last three teams were Bees, Stallions, heel Islanders.  Teams that didn't make it to the end included Demolition, Hart Foundation, Dream Team, Strike Force.  Way to give the fans what they wanted, Vince.

Yeah the 1988 version was better booked for sure.. most of the top teams looked good at points and were somewhat protected in elimination.

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Here's 13+ minutes of Nash hitting Jackknife power bombs.

There's something endearing about just how lazy and sloppy some of these are.  Like Nash, himself.

EDIT: HAHA the one at the 3:00 mark where it looks very much like it's going to be the end of Big Vito's life, then the terrible ref Slick Johnson starts counting three before Nash suddenly realizes it and tries to go over and pin him but Johnson is already calling for the bell and Tony Schiavone is trying to call it "Doesn't even...have to cover him."

Edited by caley
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Yeah, the jackknife had so many different variations depending on who was taking it and how hard Nash wanted to try. Most of them are the pick up and just let 'em drop kind, which honestly is a cool version and suits BIG DADDY COOL. The others, quite a few of the early ones, are this weird angle that has guys land on their shoulders/neck. Looks very nasty. Then there's the side pick up/shoulder one where they spin and he kinda just lets them do their thing. 

edit: DDP saved Awesome from one going really badly at 8:22.

Double edit: Bischoff taking the powerbomb is the best. I LOVED that so much as a kid.

Edited by Jiji
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49 minutes ago, caley said:

EDIT: HAHA the one at the 3:00 mark where it looks very much like it's going to be the end of Big Vito's life, then the terrible ref Slick Johnson starts counting three before Nash suddenly realizes it and tries to go over and pin him but Johnson is already calling for the bell and Tony Schiavone is trying to call it "Doesn't even...have to cover him."

That's great, that looks like a WWE 2k20 gameplay video.

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