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AEW Dynamite - 4/29/2020


Dolfan in NYC

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Enjoyed the show but not continuing the Dustin retirement stipulation thing from last week now comes off as him saying "Pfft. As if I couldn't beat Kip Sabian..." and possibly also welching on his word because he knew he couldn't beat Lance Archer.

Shitty babyface not honouring his word and making the young heel he did beat look like a total loser.

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23 minutes ago, RolandTHTG said:

Enjoyed the show but not continuing the Dustin retirement stipulation thing from last week now comes off as him saying "Pfft. As if I couldn't beat Kip Sabian..." and possibly also welching on his word because he knew he couldn't beat Lance Archer.

No real competitor goes into a match thinking that he'll loose. Even little Marko thought he was building momentum on the way to victory against Brodie Lee until he got killed dead.

Dustin may have thought he was an underdog, but he went in to compete and win regardless.  Lance had other plans though.

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9 hours ago, Casey said:

Which brings me to: I have issues with this tournament. People like Cody and Dustin and Darby and Lance didn't need to be in this tournament. That title should be for people like Wardlow or Kip Sabian or even fucking Pineapple Pete. Cody/Lance doesn't need a title involved for their program (and the finals was super telegraphed with having Lance and Cody in different brackets - no way were either of them losing, especially Lance).

I disagree.  You can't sell the importance of a title by having Pineapple Pete as your inaugural champion. 

AEW is doing the right thing by selling this as an important belt by having upper tier guys compete for the belt.  That way you can either pull a Prince Iaukea and elevate a mid-card guy by having him beat an upper tier guy and winning the belt, or you can elevate a mid-card guy by letting him give the champ a run for his money.

We were all on pins & needles when we actually believed that Sam fucking Houston was going to upset Arn Anderson for the TV Title but then Gordbuster and 1-2-3.

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I was using who they had available as an example. Pineapple Pete and Musa being in the tournament would give it a bad reputation already, obviously, but if they keep using him post-empty arena shows (and he's not exclusively a jobber) - he's the target of a title like this.

If they had the full crew at their fingertips, there's plenty of options to replace the "upper echelon" that's in the tournament. Maybe keep Darby in there since he's not quite in the main event yet, but I stand by what I said in that I don't think Cody/Lance Archer needs a title belt. I mean, let's be real: this is a midcard title. It's not the Intercontinental title (yet), but for all intents and purposes, it's for the guys that'll probably never see the main event or the World title. I get that the idea of having someone important, like Cody, being the first champion, but unlike the World title, I don't think it's absolutely necessary either. With this one, you could have went either way.

Like... would I rather have Brodie Lee doing squash matches, or in a tournament for a new title? I know which one I'd pick. Let Wardlow squash Marko Stunt or some indie jobber. Lance should be running through established talent en route to a match with Cody, maybe brutalizing Dustin Rhodes in a match (like last night) to finally get his match. Or something.

Point is, I just hate that they introduced a new title during all of this, because I really do feel like they probably had different brackets in mind for it before the world collapsed.

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I also don't think that Lance or Cody needs a title to be over, but they're competing hard and leaving a trail of bodies behind them on the way to the finals so that helps sell the idea that the TNT Championship is a belt worth having.

I don't think you put the belt on Cody since the tag champs and the heavyweight champs are already babyfaces and tweeners, but the problem with putting the belt on Archer is setting up contenders.  Archer should be killing just about anyone who is in the ring with him ESPECIALLY if they are trying to take his gold.  That scenario can be problematic when you're trying to protect Archer's monster gimmick and still lift the title off of him and put it on another guy.

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Overall enjoyed the show. The Baker segment was strong.  The bubbly bunch segment was dumb and fun I guess.  Kinda tired of the low rent comedy content best saved for the BTE channel.  Moxley promo was good.  Nice to see him mix a sense of humour (without the current aew standard goofiness) in there.  He’s been a bit of a drip with these promos lately ‘I’m gonna get u, argh!!!’ type stuff - this was better than that. MJeff on the other hand applied the standard goofiness and said nothing.  What a waste.

Seems like the Cody-Darby finish is getting a pass, huh?  I don’t get how that pin makes much sense in this context, but it was a hair better than a low card job guy (Spears) kicking out of his twice hit finish.  But really, the move Darby put over in his road to promo as thus far being unbeatable when it hits is just gingerly rolled into a pin?  

I dug Archer-Dustin, but what the fuck!?  He kicked him square in the balls and a) Ref Aubrey says nothing and b) Archer is back on offence half a minute later?  Small thing, but Cody getting in the ring at the finish should have led to Archer beating him down.  He comes into the company looking to beat the shit out of Cody at all costs, has him in the ring right there in front of him, and powders out?  Cause he cares more about the belt?  Playing by the rules?  Not exactly a crazed monster type move.  

Brodie-Marko was fun.  I’m really digging Stunt as a rag doll.  Tag match was good.  It’s hard to care about Havoc and Sabian.  It’s hard to care about the goofy Best Friends sometimes too.  

It was reported Tony Khan wrote these shows in minutes. Kudos for delivering a product, but I don’t think I’m the only that would say ‘15 minutes you say.  Sounds about right’.   

Looking forward to the show next week.  Hoping they can expand their live audience a little(?).  And more importantly concentrate on the details like they’d done, at least far better, prior to the pandemic.  I trust that the worst of these mistakes is the problem with trying to put on shows during the pandemic, but I hope it doesn’t carry forward.  

Edited by HarryArchieGus
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Really liked the show last night. As usual, it was a lot of fun. That Wardlow squash and whatever that dropping someone off the top rope to knee them in the face thing was, it was really fucking cool. That shit should be a finisher for Wardlow. 

Opener and main event were both awesome. It's impressive how they keep making Darby look strong, like he does all the work and it's clear he comes within inches of winning, but the tiniest of mistakes causes him to lose and if he fixes those mistakes then you're not going to beat him. And that main event was one of the best hoss fights in a long time.

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1 hour ago, HarryArchieGus said:

Seems like the Cody-Darby finish is getting a pass, huh?  I don’t get how that pin makes much sense in this context, but it was a hair better than a low card job guy (Spears) kicking out of his twice hit finish.  But really, the move Darby put over in his road to promo as thus far being unbeatable when it hits is just gingerly rolled into a pin?  

I've held off on commenting on the show because a combination of being tired last night, having to work during part of it, and being kind of over these empty arena shows caused me to not enjoy it too much.  I will say I felt the same about that finish.  Darby just laid there hooking the leg while pinning himself with no pressure from Cody.  It made him look really bad.  So now he's worked Cody three times and not beaten him once.  This isn't 1987 anymore and this isn't Sting/Flair where going to a draw with the top guy once makes your career forever.  And Cody isn't the champion and doesn't have enough history as the top guy in the company long enough to make a star with a draw, anyway.  Others have said 1) some of these guys didn't need to be in the tournament and 2) Cody/Archer doesn't need the belt.  I agree with both and sacrificing an up and coming star for this doesn't make any sense.  This company is starting to come off like a Cody vanity project and I'm hoping that changes and things freshen up after next week.

Edited by Technico Support
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I think they did the best they could with what they had in regards to the tournament, but you really didn't need Lance Archer or Cody in the tournament at all. Honestly, I do believe they had totally different brackets planned before all of this, but you can only hold off on things for so long. If you wait to debut a new title or new talent until things "get back to normal"... that could be months, or if you want to run California - sometime next year, according to Gov. Newsom. I hate to defend it, but you've just gotta do it and hope for the best. FWIW, Brodie said Tony Khan asked him if he still wanted to debut at that Daily's Place show or wait it out until they could be infront of a live crowd again, and Brodie said he was ready to debut because he just wanted to work after hardly being used for the last year(ish) of his WWE contract. I imagine people like FTR will get the same talk.

Honestly, I don't see it being a Cody vanity project. There was a sizable chunk of this board that thought he should have beat Jericho for the title at Full Gear, while Jericho was still pretty hot, and if that would have happened, then yeah, I could see that argument having legs to stand on. But as it is right now, I think (for better or worse) they've used the tournament as a vehicle for the Archer feud, and that's solely because of the limited workers available. I might be proven wrong in the future by someone like Meltzer or whoever, but that's honestly what I think. They'd be dumb to have this planned for months (or however long) and not include people like PAC or Scorpio Sky and others. They should have waited to debut the title, but again, who knows when things go back to how they were - or how live sports will even look on the other side of the COVID-19 pandemic.

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1 hour ago, HarryArchieGus said:

Seems like the Cody-Darby finish is getting a pass, huh?  I don’t get how that pin makes much sense in this context, but it was a hair better than a low card job guy (Spears) kicking out of his twice hit finish.  But really, the move Darby put over in his road to promo as thus far being unbeatable when it hits is just gingerly rolled into a pin?  

I dug Archer-Dustin, but what the fuck!?  He kicked him square in the balls and a) Ref Aubrey says nothing and b) Archer is back on offence half a minute later?  Small thing, but Cody getting in the ring at the finish should have led to Archer beating him down.  He comes into the company looking to beat the shit out of Cody at all costs, has him in the ring right there in front of him, and powders out?  Cause he cares more about the belt?  Playing by the rules?  Not exactly a crazed monster type move.  

Brodie-Marko was fun.  I’m really digging Stunt as a rag doll.  Tag match was good.  It’s hard to care about Havoc and Sabian.  It’s hard to care about the goofy Best Friends sometimes too.  

Yeah, the finish to Darby-Cody was a bad finish. Darby certainly wasn't selling some sort of exhaustion at that point as he went to the top pretty quickly to do the Coffin Drop and it would have at least helped for Cody to do something to hook his shoulders. Darby is locked into the Jobber to the Real Stars role where he beats Sammy Guevara and loses to Cody, Mox and Jericho every time he crosses their paths. If you wanted to save his big win for a crowd as some have suggested, there were tons of ways to get around having this match again and give Darby some booking protection.

I watched the finish to Dustin v Archer and I get working a match and not wanting to fight 2 other guys right after. The faces have way too many running buddies in my eyes on this show. Archer obviously has a match now scheduled with Cody so I guess he's not in a hurry?  

Marko Stunt getting the shit knocked out of him is the proper use of Marko Stunt.

Sabian and Havoc don't belong together as a unit.  That's a terrible paring.

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9 minutes ago, Casey said:

I think they did the best they could with what they had in regards to the tournament, but you really didn't need Lance Archer or Cody in the tournament at all. Honestly, I do believe they had totally different brackets planned before all of this, but you can only hold off on things for so long. If you wait to debut a new title or new talent until things "get back to normal"... that could be months, or if you want to run California - sometime next year, according to Gov. Newsom. I hate to defend it, but you've just gotta do it and hope for the best. FWIW, Brodie said Tony Khan asked him if he still wanted to debut at that Daily's Place show or wait it out until they could be infront of a live crowd again, and Brodie said he was ready to debut because he just wanted to work after hardly being used for the last year(ish) of his WWE contract. I imagine people like FTR will get the same talk.

Honestly, I don't see it being a Cody vanity project. There was a sizable chunk of this board that thought he should have beat Jericho for the title at Full Gear, while Jericho was still pretty hot, and if that would have happened, then yeah, I could see that argument having legs to stand on. But as it is right now, I think (for better or worse) they've used the tournament as a vehicle for the Archer feud, and that's solely because of the limited workers available. I might be proven wrong in the future by someone like Meltzer or whoever, but that's honestly what I think. They'd be dumb to have this planned for months (or however long) and not include people like PAC or Scorpio Sky and others. They should have waited to debut the title, but again, who knows when things go back to how they were - or how live sports will even look on the other side of the COVID-19 pandemic.

I really get the feeling they came up with this tournament and belt just to have something to do with this month of empty arena, limited talent tapings.  Instead of an aimless few weeks of meaningless matches, we got a tournament storyline.  I mean Cody said in the past that a secondary title would come eventually and that it would be something special and different, and all we got was a dressed-up TV title.  I fully believe, without COVID, this was never the plan.

I'm being too hard on them and I know it's not really a Cody vanity project.  The problem is he's the biggest star available on these tapings and it also makes sense for him to chase this belt since he can't go after the other one.  But they need to be working on building bigger stars, not falling back on Cody.  This should have been Darby's win and probably his tournament.  Just my opinion.

And to put myself over, weeks ago before these tapings started I suggested they have wrestlers at ringside and hold a tournament (I said they should call it The Covid Cup).  Fuck, I'm up there with @Flair’s Shadow as a seer.

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I am Darby's biggest proponent on the board and I'm totally fine with him losing a third time to Cody in theory. Don't watch the empty arena shows, so I won't comment on the finish and its execution, but he's clearly one of the few people who still can get over while losing to established stars. When he finally wins a big one it is going to be a huge deal that should solidify him as a top guy himself. As I said earlier though, I do think this was too soon to run the Cody match back again even if it's been 4 months since the last one (that was the first show of the new year, right?). I don't think a goth punk tiny underdog who is the best at fighting from underneath should be winning too much this early into his run. Let him continue to come close, build angst, and then finally get a big win down the road. Should be against Cody the next time they meet and with fans in the building to make it a special moment. 

Edited by Oyaji
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1 hour ago, Technico Support said:

I've held off on commenting on the show because a combination of being tired last night, having to work during part of it, and being kind of over these empty arena shows caused me to not enjoy it too much.  I will say I felt the same about that finish.  Darby just laid there hooking the leg while pinning himself with no pressure from Cody.  It made him look really bad.  So now he's worked Cody three times and not beaten him once.  This isn't 1987 anymore and this isn't Sting/Flair where going to a draw with the top guy once makes your career forever.  And Cody isn't the champion and doesn't have enough history as the top guy in the company long enough to make a star with a draw, anyway.  Others have said 1) some of these guys didn't need to be in the tournament and 2) Cody/Archer doesn't need the belt.  I agree with both and sacrificing an up and coming star for this doesn't make any sense.  This company is starting to come off like a Cody vanity project and I'm hoping that changes and things freshen up after next week.

Yeah, I am good Cody winning but I didn't particularly care for the sloppy finish.  I can dig Veteran Presence and Experience Beats Youthful Vigor and all, but it didn't look like Darby's shoulders were on the mat when the ref counted 3.  

That being said, I feel that Cody probably would've been a better match for the Murderhawk Monster.  I think that's too much of an ask for Darby as David to slay that particular Goliath especially when Archer is being booked to the Moon and Jake is cutting the best promos in decades selling Archer to the audience.

Edited by J.T.
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I think Cody’s proven himself to be a team player.  I don’t have any issue with him going over anybody.  He’s arguably their biggest star.  I also think he’s been overly fair with all his opponents.  I think he’d be a great first tnt champion.  The idea that it should go lower in the card seems silly to me.  They ought to place it high on the card and make it something worth fighting for.  Make it prestigious.

Darby losing doesn’t make him look bad.  But that finish did.  I think we ought to be patient with Darby’s ascension to top tier.  I like the slow build.  And that draw most certainly did help establish him as a player.  Darby’s in no danger of losing steam from dropping this fall, but I agree it would have been smart to protect him and save the Cody match for a big win in front of s crowd.  Edit: posted before I read @Oyaji‘s comments which I obviously completely agree with.

As for who needs the title, yeah, Archer doesn’t so much need the belt, but it sure would help cement his position as an upwardly moving player.  If Cody wins it, you have one of the biggest stars holding it and to me that’s a pretty terrific way of establishing the title’s value.  

 

Edited by HarryArchieGus
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The ending to Cody/Darby wasn't pulled off particularly well but I'd argue it was the right finish. Darby has been gradually getting close and closer to defeating Cody, this time he had him beat but took his eye off the ball for just a second and took the L. It was a little botched but it was no Ronda/Becky roll up. And I think it's good long term booking and anyone who thinks Darby is somehow losing out from this series is mistaken. Besides, if Cody is going to turn, Darby as the face to stop him would make him.

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3 minutes ago, Curt McGirt said:

Forgot to mention, I found another example of someone getting pinned with a Figure Four: Savage vs. Flair where Flair won the belt in WWF. I was trying to find the Wrestlemania match and watched that on accident instead. 

A finish so bad that they apparently shot twice.

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