AEW Dynamite - 4/22/2020

[twiztor]

On 4/23/2020 at 7:45 AM, HarryArchieGus said:

never a fan of unexplainable cameras like the one present in Preston Vance's room as he's watching television.

i've never understood this complaint. the whole of television is built on cameras being where they shouldn't be. 

why are there multiple cameras in Jerry Seinfeld's apartment? the whole show should just be his stand up.

[LoneWolf&Subs]

In defense of the camera in those packages. It’s not like that is supposed to be live footage. It’s a propaganda piece by The Dark Order. They probably asked him if they could recreate the moment he seeked help from The Dark Order.

[Brian Fowler]

50 minutes ago, twiztor said:

i've never understood this complaint. the whole of television is built on cameras being where they shouldn't be. 

why are there multiple cameras in Jerry Seinfeld's apartment? the whole show should just be his stand up.

I think the issue is a lot of people want wrestling to be presented as a sport. We don't get hidden camera footage of NFL players in the locker room, etc.

It very much comes down to how you view wrestling; simulated sport or action TV show.

[John from Cincinnati]

4 hours ago, LoneWolf&Subs said:

In defense of the camera in those packages. It’s not like that is supposed to be live footage. It’s a propaganda piece by The Dark Order. They probably asked him if they could recreate the moment he seeked help from The Dark Order.

Not all of these packages pass the "it's a propaganda piece" sniff test. Who wants to join an organization that's advertising itself as having volatile, abusive leadership? What kind of cult openly broadcasts who it's secretly targeting for recruitment? As propaganda, it makes no sense. Just accept it as the cheesy community theater drama it is. Trying to make any sense of it beyond that is a fool's errand. 

On the topic of Brodie still carrying a torch for his former employer, "I had the whole world in my hands" was this week's example of being too cute by a half. 

Edited April 24, 2020 by West Newbury Bad Boy

[John from Cincinnati]

Brief thoughts on the show:

• Guevara vs Darby was good. Guevara must be taking any coaching from Jericho to heart, because he oozes unearned heel confidence right now. Loved them starting off with another pre-match dive to plunder on the outside. Nobody has a better suicide dive on TV than Darby, he lays that thing in. The foot stuff was great, as was the pin Darby is trying to get over. Only nit-pick was they could have tightened up the springboard cutter, but so could most people doing leaping cutters.
• I'm over this Hardy stuff. Hope Elite Deletion wins me back. 
• This is the Omega match people are arguing about? Jog on. I'd prefer a two minute squash too, but that's not Kenny's style. It was a short, harmless enhancement match you've seen other top guys have. Kenny wrestled big and strong throughout, the apron spot was a shortcut taken by the opponent to get a few extra licks in, and in the end Kenny didn't even need to bust out the OWA to get the job done. I'm not seeing the controversy. 
• Wardlow and Brodie squashes were good, especially the Brodie one. Dude's still got it in the eyes. 

[John from Cincinnati]

23 hours ago, Curt McGirt said:

Don't forget Luchasaurus haha

Until he stops throwing slow, phony kicks, I'm leaving him out of my hoss vs hoss fantasies.

[LoneWolf&Subs]

12 minutes ago, West Newbury Bad Boy said:

Not all of these packages pass the "it's a propaganda piece" sniff test. Who wants to join an organization that's advertising itself as having volatile, abusive leadership?

What some might consider abuse, others see strength. We’ve seen in recent times a level of respect for bully types. Brodie Lee is just one of the latest examples of cult leaders that come off this way.

[John from Cincinnati]

6 minutes ago, LoneWolf&Subs said:

What some might consider abuse, others see strength. We’ve seen in recent times a level of respect for bully types. Brodie Lee is just one of the latest examples of cult leaders that come off this way.

While people respect strength, most people aren't lining up to be the obvious target of said bullying. 

And yeah, cults are rife with abuse and dehumanization. But a lot of them don't lead with that. Which is my point: As propaganda for recruitment purposes, it's nonsense. 

Anyway, if you're in the Dark Order and feel like there's no way out of the cycle of abuse, I want you to know that there is. Feel free to reach out when you're ready. 

Edited April 24, 2020 by West Newbury Bad Boy

[LoneWolf&Subs]

Also we’re not sure if that was indeed the latest recruit. That might’ve been an actor they hired to recreate all that, including the interview. 

Kayfabe, baby...

Also, while I’m not 100% on the Hardy stuff, I dug the Hardy “acting normal” promo. I don’t remember him doing this, and I liked it.

Edited April 24, 2020 by LoneWolf&Subs

[grilledcheese]

13 minutes ago, West Newbury Bad Boy said:

Brief thoughts on the show:

• I'm over this Hardy stuff.

I am still enjoying it, although to a lesser degree than I have historically. I thought that a nice little added piece of the Broken shtick was his ability to flip the switch and allow Matt to pick up and speak. That made things a little more engaging for me, seeing that Hardy wants there to be some more "grounded realism" while at the same time embracing just how fucking weird all this Broken shit is, when looking at it from a universe standpoint.

 

[John from Cincinnati]

The leather jacket Matt stuff was fine. But it feels like a pivot because someone realized that something that was lightening in a bottle a few years ago already needs a fresh coat of paint. 

I'd have personally been there for just leading with leather jacket Matt from the beginning, but I guess there's still an appetite from both Matt and some fans for more of the Broken stuff. Which is fine, enjoy. I hope Matt and the fans scratch that itch with the Elite Deletion, and I hope he finds something amusing enough to get me back on board. 

Edited April 24, 2020 by West Newbury Bad Boy

[Curt McGirt]

58 minutes ago, West Newbury Bad Boy said:

Until he stops throwing slow, phony kicks, I'm leaving him out of my hoss vs hoss fantasies.

That's why I added the laughter; I'm thinking most might feel similar to you. If anything he might be the odd-man-out in such a scenario.

[HarryArchieGus]

21 hours ago, twiztor said:

i've never understood this complaint. the whole of television is built on cameras being where they shouldn't be. 

why are there multiple cameras in Jerry Seinfeld's apartment? the whole show should just be his stand up.

This company has made clear an intention to be presented as sport.  And for the most part, at least prior to the shutdown, they were succeeding.  Further, Tony Khan has been adamant about no magic eye cameras in the back.  That oughtta apply to video packages too.  

Yeah, sport over bad action comedy/drama/adventure. I’m interested in minimizing my suspension of disbelief. It’s a small nuance perhaps but not including bad acting/skits goes a long way in effectively presenting wrestling.  

I assume this would be a bit more debatable if your exposure to wrestling, and enjoyment there of, is tied to the last 20 years of WWE tv.  I excused myself from this era, in part, due to the silliness of this much maligned magic camera.  ‘It Ain’t Seinfeld’.  

Sometimes I wonder if Matt Hardy coupling with the Bucks BTE energy will be pushing for more and more of this nonsense on my beloved Dino-mite.  Squash that shit Tony.

21 hours ago, LoneWolf&Subs said:

In defense of the camera in those packages. It’s not like that is supposed to be live footage. It’s a propaganda piece by The Dark Order. They probably asked him if they could recreate the moment he seeked help from The Dark Order.

I like this idea, but as mentioned its a bit tricky with logic over the course of the gimmick.

Get real AEW.  

[LoneWolf&Subs]

1 minute ago, HarryArchieGus said:

21 hours ago, LoneWolf&Subs said:

 

I like this idea, but as mentioned its a bit tricky with logic over the course of the gimmick.

They’ve been plugging plot holes with comic book logic recently. Like the explanation for Hardy appearing in multiple parts of the arena were holograms from Vanguard 2, and his brothers.

[Casey]

I really have no interest in what some of you are describing as wanting out of AEW, oh boy. Y’all can keep all of that.

[Craig H]

It's like a lot of you saying you don't understand who would sign up for a cult where the leader is abusive and tough have never once seen a high school, college, or pro football coach in action, and yet players trip over themselves to go to the right should to play for certain coaches and so on.

[Craig H]

For example, Brian Kelly screams at his players until he's red in the face, which is usually the first half of the first quarter, and ND still has a great recruiting class year after year.

[John from Cincinnati]

40 minutes ago, Craig H said:

It's like a lot of you saying you don't understand who would sign up for a cult where the leader is abusive and tough have never once seen a high school, college, or pro football coach in action, and yet players trip over themselves to go to the right should to play for certain coaches and so on.

Counterpoint: Football is cool. The Dark Order is not. 

Edited April 25, 2020 by West Newbury Bad Boy

[caley]

But he probably doesn't yell at them in recruiting meetings/video packages promoting the program.  So yeah, he yells, but I don't think he yells and calls them worthless in "propaganda" pieces such as above.

[LoneWolf&Subs]

You probably have a point. Maybe the videos should be more like a fake resort promotional tape, with Lee hanging out in Hawaiian shirts talking about their beautiful facility in the Smokey Mountains.

Edited April 25, 2020 by LoneWolf&Subs

[Nice Guy Eddie]

42 minutes ago, West Newbury Bad Boy said:

Counterpoint: Football is cool. The Dark Order is not. 

Which football? American football or soccer?

I'm not really fan of either, but I do like the Dark Order.

[John from Cincinnati]

Nothing to do with my point. To spell it out: Football is considered cool and is widely popular and people will accept a lot of abuse for a chance to be part of it and be successful. The Dark Order is a bunch of freaks thinly (very thinly) posing as a self-help group that's done nothing to this point but ramble vaguely and openly abuse people who've hit rock bottom. People will be more willing to accept one of those types of abuse for very clear reasons. Football = cool. Being an ottoman for Flabby Uno = Well, I don't want to kink shame too hard...

Bringing it back to my original point, most of these vignettes aren't "propaganda pieces" as suggested earlier. They literally don't work on any level as such. They're a cinematic peek behind the curtain into the abuse that's occurring once you're already in. They suck as that too, but it least it almost makes sense as TV. 

Edited April 26, 2020 by West Newbury Bad Boy

[Casey]

I don’t think Preston Vance is going to be a foot stool for Evil Uno. They gave us his name and backstory, the lowly and subservient members of the Dark Order get nothing of the sort. That little example is a moot point.

[John from Cincinnati]

7 minutes ago, Casey said:

I don’t think Preston Vance is going to be a foot stool for Evil Uno. They gave us his name and backstory, the lowly and subservient members of the Dark Order get nothing of the sort. That little example is a moot point.

I didnt suggest he was going to be used like the rest of the human toilet bottom feeders. Not sure that has much bearing on these things making zero sense as propaganda. 

Taking this from another angle, I can’t wait till JR is back. I want to hear him give that backstory the hard sell on commentary. 

[Unnatural]

I've got a question about the "presented as a sport" talking point that seems to be getting tagged to AEW on the webz.

Is this something that AEW themselves came out and said? Like some mission statement somewhere in black and white with the AEW logo front and center over it?

I'm legit asking because in a company with barb wire nets and mouse trap boards, with eye spiking angles, not one but two invading factions looking to change the look and feel of AEW, and this is all before the lockdowns and no fans allowed started happening... So okay, all that, guys like Orange Cassidy and Nakazawa doing their thing, what would "presented as a real sport" have to do with these things?

I'm saying, my point being, they're hammy wrestling time to time with a heavier dose of solid wrestling the majority of the time, like Nitro but with the violence turned up. Or ECW if they had sillier gimmicks now and again.

How is invading factions a sports feel? Barb wire nets, DDT's through glass tables, thumb tacks and cracker barrel matches and spiked skateboards, all of this back when they had crowds, how would any of that be a "sport presentation?"

Just rambling an opinion here, with shitty references, but AEW=Serious Sport doesn't seem to line up, in my uneducated mark mind. Not when you've got camera zooms on best friends hugging, not when they're being broadcast from a cruise ship. That's just tv fare like your WMAC or something, just my thoughts. 

Some people seem set on this talking point but I've never seen it through that lens, with all the different examples I was trying to remember. 

 

ETA- In my mind if wrestling and sports presentation are in the same sentence I immediately picture amateur, collegiate or Olympic wrestling. Wrestling inside a ring with ropes is not my idea of sport presentation wrestling. I say that as an 80s kid who grew up with lots of cartoonish characters in the ring and so my stance, again, isnt the most educated. 

Edited April 26, 2020 by Hayabusa