Dolfan in NYC Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoneWolf&Subs Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 (edited) 3 minutes ago, (BP) said: As brutal as the Evolution era was with the long winded promos, questionable booking, and epic style, one thing I think can’t be argued is that Hunter had an understanding of what made the Horsemen work from an optics and presentation standpoint. If you ignore parts of the Goldberg feud, and all of the Steiner feud, you have six, or eight months of legit good stuff. The month where I think Tajiri, Foley, Jericho, Shelton, and Benoit formed a brief alliance against Evolution might’ve been my favorite time period of the 00’s. Edited April 10, 2020 by LoneWolf&Subs 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nice Guy Eddie Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 (edited) 5 minutes ago, LoneWolf&Subs said: If you ignore parts of the Goldberg feud, and all of the Steiner feud, you have six, or eight months of legit good stuff. The month where I think Tajiri, Foley, Jericho, Shelton, and Benoit formed a brief alliance against Evolution might’ve been my favorite time period of the 00’s. I'd also ignore the Booker T. feud for obvious reasons. Edited April 10, 2020 by Nice Guy Eddie 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoneWolf&Subs Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 Actually I should’ve said ignore almost all of Triple H’s defenses. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AxB Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 The Aces and Eights angle was a great storyline, if you ignore all the bits that sucked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted April 10, 2020 Author Share Posted April 10, 2020 3 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said: I'd also ignore the Booker T. feud for obvious reasons. Triple H was the fucking worst in 2003. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted April 10, 2020 Author Share Posted April 10, 2020 (edited) 1 minute ago, AxB said: The Aces and Eights angle was a great storyline, if you ignore all the bits that sucked. Wasn't part of that TNA's attempt to turn AJ Styles into a brooding Sting? I remember Fortune trying to make AJ Styles a Ric Flair cosplayer. Edited April 10, 2020 by The Natural Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted April 10, 2020 Author Share Posted April 10, 2020 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SorceressKnight Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 (edited) 6 hours ago, Brian Fowler said: Are we not counting amateur wrestling? Because he was a legit 4-time All America at OU. He was a legit All-America, but even at the time that was 20 years before the Brawl for All (and 20 years where he had been beaten down.) It'd be closer to saying that, for example, Dolph Ziggler would be likely to win a modern Brawl for All because he was a good amateur in college, also about 10-15 years before that. 31 minutes ago, paintedbynumbers said: I think Janella has been hurt the most from AEW. He was the indy golden boy for awhile and AEW hasn't done much to help him. With Janela, it's hard since Janela is okay as an indie wrestler, but what makes him so big is that: There's critically acclaimed bookers on the indies, there's big name workers who were draws as wrestlers and also were able to book- but Janela may be the first true booking DRAW in pro wrestling. Like, even more than seeing Janela on an indie card it might be good- but if an indie card was sold as "We gave the book to Joey Janela for this show. He won't wrestle, but he's going to book it like one of his special events", that would be a bonafide draw to get people in the door. EDIT: As far as Hunter with Evolution, the problem sometimes is he was almost TOO GOOD at the Horsemen pastiche, in a way. Like, instead of taking guys in the current WWE and running an angle like Flair could have worked with them in his prime, he had a bad case of sometimes trying to choose people who were close to the Flair cosplay he wanted to do that month instead (like, for the most blatant example, giving Bubba Ray Dudley a huge push for about a month solely because Hunter wanted to feud with a big fat babyface so he could pay homage to Flair/Dusty.) Edited April 10, 2020 by SorceressKnight 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AxB Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 1 minute ago, The Natural said: Wasn't part of that TNA's attempt to turn AJ Styles into a brooding Sting? It's hard to keep track. I know he turned tweener because the rest of the babyfaces didn't trust him (like the Sting turn) down to some heel stable or other, but there were so many... Aces and Eights went for years. The bit where babyface Bully Ray unmasked the apparent leader of A&8s and it was D-Von, that was good. Tazz turning during the Bully Ray & Brooke Hogan wedding was good. As soon as Bully Ray was revealed as the mastermind all along it was more or less dead in the water. So they kept it going for another 18 months. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted April 10, 2020 Author Share Posted April 10, 2020 Still remember this pop. Jump to 02:15. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Edwin Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 (edited) I'm sure this has been brought up before -- but a lot of these 90's AJW matches that have no aged well. The work is extremely sloppy and a lot of them are just excessively reckless. And the crowds were a bit rough at times. I just watched Manami Toyota botch a missile dropkick and a moonsault off the top rope and the fans just laughed at her. Kandori, Hokuto, Kong, Ozaki, Kansai, Nakano and a select few still have classics that hold up well, but the stuff featuring the smaller folks like Toyota, Yamada, Takako, etc. doesn't and it's rough sitting through 45 minutes of poorly executed reckless head drops. Edited April 10, 2020 by Edwin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elsalvajeloco Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 5 minutes ago, Edwin said: I'm sure this has been brought up before -- but a lot of these 90's AJW matches that have no aged well. The work is extremely sloppy and a lot of them are just excessively reckless. And the crowds were a bit rough at times. I just watched Manami Toyota botch a missile dropkick and a moonsault off the top rope and the fans just laughed at her. Kandori, Hokuto, Kong, Ozaki, Kansai, Nakano and a select few still have classics that hold up well, but the stuff featuring the smaller folks like Toyota, Yamada, Takako, etc. doesn't and it's rough sitting through 45 minutes of poorly executed reckless head drops. You better take cover. Ozaki is an interesting inclusion cause if you take into account that she was out here doing that spastic ass jumping DDT and that dumbass somersault spot that always got reversed, she would be a primary offender. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godfrey Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 RIP The Revival. They had some amazing matches in WWE and NXT. Them and DIY here in Toronto is rightly called a classic but they also made me believe Enzo and Cass could go instead of being a rag doll and catchphrase. Lots of great potential match ups in AEW, Japan, and any indies that survive (sorry for bringing that up). I don't agree they'll get lost in the shuffle in AEW, there are a lot of teams but none of them work the same way. Also, it's one final fuck you. They were keeping one of them on contract to mess with them, but now that they can't go anywhere anyway they stopped paying him. Solid work. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kang Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 Prefer JWP and FMW womens tbh. Anyway in newz, Money in the Bank will take place elsewhere now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Edwin Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Elsalvajeloco said: You better take cover. Ozaki is an interesting inclusion cause if you take into account that she was out here doing that spastic ass jumping DDT and that dumbass somersault spot that always got reversed, she would be a primary offender. On Ozaki: 4 minutes ago, D.Z said: Prefer JWP and FMW womens tbh. She was great in garbage matches. Her feud with Kudo, for example, was excellent and she had some good matches teaming up with Kansai. I was just rewatching some Manami Toyota matches as Kassius Ohno said she was the GOAT performer ever, so I thought I'd give some of her stuff a rewatch and yeah, unfortunately I can't agree with him on that. Edited April 10, 2020 by Edwin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted April 10, 2020 Author Share Posted April 10, 2020 1 minute ago, Godfrey said: RIP The Revival. They had some amazing matches in WWE and NXT. Them and DIY here in Toronto is rightly called a classic but they also made me believe Enzo and Cass could go instead of being a rag doll and catchphrase. Lots of great potential match ups in AEW, Japan, and any indies that survive (sorry for bringing that up). I don't agree they'll get lost in the shuffle in AEW, there are a lot of teams but none of them work the same way. Also, it's one final fuck you. They were keeping one of them on contract to mess with them, but now that they can't go anywhere anyway they stopped paying him. Solid work. I'll be watching the NXT TakeOver: Toronto 2016 match between the Revival and #DIY tonight. My 2016 WWE MOTY. The body of work by The Revival: vs. American Alpha. NXT TakeOver: Dallas 2016. vs. American Alpha. NXT TakeOver: The End 2016. vs. #DIY. NXT TakeOver: Brooklyn II 2016. vs. #DIY. NXT TakeOver: Toronto 2016. vs. #DIY vs. Authors of Pain. NXT TakeOver: Orlando 2017. I need to revisit that one. vs. Undisputed Era. NXT TV, 20th November 2019. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoneWolf&Subs Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 (edited) I’ll agree about some of those AJW matches not aging well. But it’s mostly the singles matches with too many kick outs off big spots one after another. You can tell were M-Pro, and Dragongate got their inspirations. The tags though I still love. Mostly because they are breaking up pins, rather than kicking out of them. Edited April 10, 2020 by LoneWolf&Subs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jiji Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 Never been that high on Manami. She's the worst offender of Joshi spot wrestler but she had appeal for being the classical Japanese long, black haired woman and she could sell pretty well in the moment. Other than the Hokuto matches, the hair match with Yamada is the only one I remember getting much joy from. Takako on the other hand isn't the the most mechanically perfect wrestler but she was great at telling a story through her body language. I think she's great. As a whole, there is definitely some roughness in execution and the women knew for the most part they were there for a short time so they absolutely destroyed each other, but I love the style, particularly with the rabid crowds before it turned into gross dudes. Japanese crowds in general can be pretty merciless on fuck ups but still not quite as bad as the mutants. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elsalvajeloco Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 (edited) 12 minutes ago, D.Z said: Prefer JWP and FMW womens tbh. Speaking of what Edwin said and JWP/FMW... I watched the idol match from the Big Egg Universe dome show. It was Fukuoka and Kudo vs. Takako Inoue and Cutie Suzuki. They went fourteen minutes and literally hit every move in the history of pro wrestling to zero crowd response for 95% of the match. They use a tombstone piledriver as a transition move. ON THE RAMP! At one point, Fukuoka hits a tilt a whirl powerbomb which looked amazing. There was also one point where they just stop cooperating with each other and beat the crap out of each other. It's a spectacle. A frustrated Kudo hits a Tiger Driver '91 which was likely a botch and she doesn't care she just dropped someone on their head. I say that to say that Kudo not going against Hokuto in the V Top tournament is a crime, and we instead got Toyoda vs. Hokuto in a fairly average match. Edited April 10, 2020 by Elsalvajeloco 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoneWolf&Subs Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 No more distractions for Vince anymore... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godfrey Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 7 minutes ago, The Natural said: I'll be watching the NXT TakeOver: Toronto 2016 match between the Revival and #DIY tonight. My 2016 WWE MOTY. The body of work by The Revival: vs. American Alpha. NXT TakeOver: Dallas 2016. vs. American Alpha. NXT TakeOver: The End 2016. vs. #DIY. NXT TakeOver: Brooklyn II 2016. vs. #DIY. NXT TakeOver: Toronto 2016. vs. #DIY vs. Authors of Pain. NXT TakeOver: Orlando 2017. I need to revisit that one. vs. Undisputed Era. NXT TV, 20th November 2019. All great matches. It's a crime (well, a misdemeanor) that we'll never get to see Revival against Roode and Gable from the house shows. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Edwin Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 8 minutes ago, LoneWolf&Subs said: No more distractions for Vince anymore... Time for Vince to try and revive something else. Maybe give Slam Ball a second chance, not his idea originally, but hey, why not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoneWolf&Subs Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 WBF? Our current climate could support it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Cincinnati Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 (edited) 3 hours ago, paintedbynumbers said: I can see them coming in as "the arrival" Putting them with Arn is really the only smart way to do it. I know people keep fantasy booking them with either Arn or Tully, but I'm not sure I need either. They're pretty good talkers in their own right and have shown a capacity for taking all kinds of short-cuts without the aid of a man on the outside. Anyway, I'll echo @Godfrey in shouting out the Enzo and Cass matches. Probably Revival's most impressive work in WWE. Edited April 10, 2020 by West Newbury Bad Boy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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