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FEB 2020 WRESTLING DISCUSSION


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Fiend drops the title to Goldberg at SuperShowdown, then goes on to beat Cena at Mania to get his heat back. 

Reigns wins the Chamber and goes to Mania against Goldberg to win the title. 

Reigns/Fiend post-Mania feud for months and months until all of Reigns's good will and any interest that is left in the Fiend is completely gone.

 

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Weren't there reports that they'd intentionally tried to make the Raw after Mania less of an event, and more like a standard weekly show, to reeducate fans not to go all boisterous and Bizarro Land on them? There was a while there where it was like a yearly apology for the seven hours of lowest common denominator bullshit and heavily telegraphed Moments they were serving up the night before, but the last couple have been non events in comparison. Sure, the beachball dickheads and the misogynous chants can fuck off forever, but the overall vibe of 'tonight we're going to do the cool shit you wish we did the rest of the year', complete with big debuts, returns, exciting vignettes and maybe a title change or two, was something to look forward to. If they've decided to move away from that on purpose, it serves them right that they're selling fewer tickets.

Edited by SturmCRF
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I don’t know how you’d stop that unless you tell people they’ll be escorted out of the building if they don’t adhere to a new strict fan etiquette guidelines which I don’t remember any posted. They are also still selling 4- day packages for events. So they aren’t discouraging that kind of hardcore crowd to come.

You maybe are thinking about when they told fans to dress more appropriate to the Hall of Fame, and less fan casual.

Edited by LoneWolf&Subs
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Guest Stefanie Without Stefanie
6 hours ago, christopher.annino said:

If Jim could stop being so venomous and distasteful in describing what he doesn't like, and focus on what he likes? That'd be so much more enjoyable. I've really liked listening to him going off about things he loves, but as soon as he starts getting shitty about Omega or Jordynne Grace, it's all garbage.

So I used to listen to Cornette pretty much since the beginning of his podcast, and this is pretty much spot on. I always found that he can be quite compelling when he's discussing a topic that he really enjoys. Even if it's something random or nonsensical, like his bizarre habits when he travels, it was fascinating to me. But I took both of his shows out of my podcast app at the end of last year for two reasons:

1) listening to the same tangents about the same topics every single week got boring very fast.

2) he is either incapable or unwilling to give people the chance to change his mind. When he complains about the women's matches taking up too much time but says he outright skips them, as he did with most AEW women's matches, why should anyone take his criticism in good faith?

So essentially he's a cranky old man who's put himself in an echo chamber. One of the side effects of being in an echo chamber is that you no longer fear reprisals for saying some phenomenally stupid things. This is evidenced by how he writes off women's matches by saying "I'm not sexist but...", then proceeds to give a sexist reason as to why a match he didn't watch didn't work. If it's a gimmick he's running, it's poorly thought out.

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19 minutes ago, LoneWolf&Subs said:

I don’t know how you’d stop that unless you tell people they’ll be escorted out of the building if they don’t adhere to a new strict fan etiquette guidelines which I don’t remember any posted. They are also still selling 4- day packages for events. So they aren’t discouraging that kind of hardcore crowd to come.

You maybe are thinking about when they told fans to dress more appropriate to the Hall of Fame, and less fan casual.

As in, they were trying to stop it by putting on a more boring show, or at least one that appeals less to hardcore fans, so those people either don't go, or go but don't cause a scene when all they get is a bunch of rematches and a nothing tag match for a main event, because they've been trained not to expect anything that caters to them on that night any more.

I don't get the Observer or anything, so I can't quote Meltzer directly, but there was definitely some third hand report along those lines after last year's Mania.

 

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2 hours ago, Infinit said:

Found it so hilarious that Corny was going off on Kris Statlander's alien gimmick this week...was he as vocal about the New Breed? Is being an alien any more "business exposing" than being from the future? Lol

 

That was a Dusty gimmick, and I don't remember him ever defending it. Also: no podcasts in 1988.

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Just now, MORELOCK said:

 

That was a Dusty gimmick, and I don't remember him ever defending it. Also: no podcasts in 1988.

Really? No podcasts in 1988? ?

Corny has had numerous pods where he went over JCP and I don't recall him ever calling out the New Breed as being "business exposing". I'm sure he thinks Ms Atlanta Lively was perfectly acceptable as well too lol

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Regarding the Post-Mania RAW thing - I am doing a scan to see if I can find what y'all are talking about

One thing I immediately noticed was that last year they were still doing the Superstar Shakeup the 2nd week after Mania. So those first weeks shows were basically placeholders because they were moving everyone around the 2nd week. So there are hints that since the Post-Mania RAW would always do good numbers that they don't have to load them as much because the focus would be the Shakeup Shows the following week.

Again - I am trying to pull better quotes but some of it could have been from them doing the Shakeup. Which who the fuck knows what they are doing this year?

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15 minutes ago, Infinit said:

1 old man spear > 18 curb stomps

???

Old man strength is a real thing... lol

2 minutes ago, The Great ML said:

Moments. They make ‘moments.’ Long term booking be damned.

I hate to keep making the comparison but AEW is like what WWF/E used to be with the long term booking leading to 4-5 PPVs a year and I love that model.  

I had a good time at WrestleMania last year I had never been to one but man..  there was really only Kofimania that I was interested in and they stumbled into that story line by accident. I'm digging the Edge/Orton stuff but everything surrounding the titles I am numb. 

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11 minutes ago, Infinit said:

Really? No podcasts in 1988? ?

Corny has had numerous pods where he went over JCP and I don't recall him ever calling out the New Breed as being "business exposing". I'm sure he thinks Ms Atlanta Lively was perfectly acceptable as well too lol


Yeah, that's the thing: you're just assuming his opinion about things you haven't heard him address. There are plenty of things you can hammer Cornette with and be 100% right. You don't have to conjure things out of thin air.

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3 hours ago, The Great ML said:

38 year old life long fan...I look forward to weekly AEW Dynamite. I could t care less about Mania.

Same here. Between going to Mania weekend shows last year and watching the Joey Janela Spring Break shows on Fite, WM was at the bottom of my list in terms of importance. I never watched it and I doubt I ever will. I'm not going to watch this year's, but I've already ordered Revolution and I can't wait for Dynamite in Newark.

Edited by Nice Guy Eddie
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I believe the explanation for the New Breed is

"These two guys are claiming to be from the future. They may be goofs but they are good wrestlers."

Same with booking the Mummy in SMW. The announcers did not say it was a real mummy, they said it was a guy dressed as a mummy. 

But people that dont like Cornette are going to try and come up with anything to discredit any of his valid criticisms. 

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I guess I’ll dissent and say that regardless of how they get there, Goldberg/Reigns and Fiend/Cena (using the Cena/Umaga LMS format) sounds like a perfectly awesome pair of SD main events for WM and a big step up from Fiend/Reigns, to me. I’d actually find it really refreshing to get two big man sprints as the world title matches after so many NXT forced epics have me burnt out on the whole thing.

Edited by For Great Justice
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46 minutes ago, MORELOCK said:


Yeah, that's the thing: you're just assuming his opinion about things you haven't heard him address. There are plenty of things you can hammer Cornette with and be 100% right. You don't have to conjure things out of thin air.

Let me make it little more clearer for you, pal. I've heard his podcasts when he brought up The New Breed in JCP and at no point did he hold it to the same standard of "business exposing" as he does Statlander's alien gimmick.

Jim also says that Kenny Omega should have his legs broken for exposing a business but gave a pass to Harley Race for taking part in a tv show about exposing the business lol

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14 minutes ago, odessasteps said:

I believe the explanation for the New Breed is

"These two guys are claiming to be from the future. They may be goofs but they are good wrestlers."

Same with booking the Mummy in SMW. The announcers did not say it was a real mummy, they said it was a guy dressed as a mummy. 

But people that dont like Cornette are going to try and come up with anything to discredit any of his valid criticisms. 

How is how The New Breed gimmick was presented in JCP any different from how Stadlander's gimmick is presented in AEW?

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13 minutes ago, Infinit said:

How is how The New Breed gimmick was presented in JCP any different from how Stadlander's gimmick is presented in AEW?

because Cornette was getting paid from JCP

His tone would change if he were on AEW's payroll.

Edited by Nice Guy Eddie
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45 minutes ago, odessasteps said:

Same with booking the Mummy in SMW. The announcers did not say it was a real mummy, they said it was a guy dressed as a mummy. 

He has defended himself in the past with The Mummy bullshit by saying it was Rick Rubin's idea, has he not?

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1 hour ago, Infinit said:

Let me make it little more clearer for you, pal. I've heard his podcasts when he brought up The New Breed in JCP and at no point did he hold it to the same standard of "business exposing" as he does Statlander's alien gimmick.


Mentioning the existence of the New Breed isn't the same thing as weighing in on the gimmick. Has he actually defended or addressed it anywhere, or is that just an idea in your head of a thing that he might say?

 

1 hour ago, Infinit said:

Jim also says that Kenny Omega should have his legs broken for exposing a business but gave a pass to Harley Race for taking part in a tv show about exposing the business lol


I appreciate you finding a dumb thing that Corny actually said to take issue with.

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8 minutes ago, MORELOCK said:


Mentioning the existence of the New Breed isn't the same thing as weighing in on the gimmick. Has he actually defended or addressed it anywhere, or is that just an idea in your head of a thing that he might say?

 


I appreciate you finding a dumb thing that Corny actually said to take issue with.

HE SPOKE ABOUT THE NEW BREED WHEN HE WAS COVERING JCP ON HIS PODCAST AND DID NOT CONDEMN THE GIMMICK AS "BUSINESS EXPOSING" OR EVER PEARL CLUTCHED ABOUT IT AS HE DOES OVER KRIS STATLANDER'S ALIEN GIMMICK.

Hope that cleared that up for you, pal

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