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DECEMBER 2019 WRESTLING CHAT.


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2 hours ago, L_W_P said:

That or take up a trainer role at the PC because unless Vince & Hunter sit down with a month by month breakdown of the story they have for me leading up to a big Mania match (with eclverything in sitting and under my own creative control) then I'm just not interested.

In this scenario, what happens an hour later after they finally stop laughing at you?

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But I think the thing is this: are you paying off a house for your family and setting up a college fund for your kids on a NXT salary? The answer is probably not. Permanently based in Florida you're probably in a better position to set up side hustles, but the guys on the main roster are the ones saving for their futures.

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1 hour ago, ComingToAmerica said:

Erm....he gets released and goes back to the Indys as per the plan he laid out?

But how many NXT call-ups do you think they've had elaborate booking plans made out for months in advance? And if you walk into that meeting with a huge chip on your shoulder, how well do you think Vince and HHH are going to react? Are they going to give you what you want, or decide you need to be taught a lesson?

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Well, if they decide you need to be taught a lesson, you could just scream "That's not what I want! Give me what I want!" until they change their minds. Should only take a few minutes.

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1 hour ago, mattdangerously said:

But how many NXT call-ups do you think they've had elaborate booking plans made out for months in advance? 

The Shield?

(Maybe not elaborate booking plan, but you get the point).

Probably Balor too, though he got injured.

I can't really think of anyone from NXT who wasn't pushed off the bat but nonetheless got over, save maybe Sasha.

 

Edited by ComingToAmerica
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10 hours ago, The Great ML said:

Truer words never spoken...as a kid growing up in 80s Dallas, we went from the Birds, to Dynamic Duo...to Brian Adias and Al Madril.

Don't you disparage the goddamn good name of Al Madril like that.

Edited by cwoy2j
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1 hour ago, ComingToAmerica said:

The Shield?

(Maybe not elaborate booking plan, but you get the point).

Probably Balor too, though he got injured.

I can't really think of anyone from NXT who wasn't pushed off the bat but nonetheless got over, save maybe Sasha.

 

The Wyatts?

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23 minutes ago, odessasteps said:

The Wyatts?

Pretty strong push off the bat there. They definitely had a lot of TV time. A strong push doesn't mean winning every match (The Shield lost a 3 on 1 handicap against CM Punk lest we forget).

I will admit that the reason why Rusev is over isn't because of the strong push he received upon going to the main roster, but how he became entertaining as he was depushed. But nonetheless.

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1 hour ago, ComingToAmerica said:

Pretty strong push off the bat there. They definitely had a lot of TV time. A strong push doesn't mean winning every match (The Shield lost a 3 on 1 handicap against CM Punk lest we forget).

I will admit that the reason why Rusev is over isn't because of the strong push he received upon going to the main roster, but how he became entertaining as he was depushed. But nonetheless.

The Shield didn't lose a 6 man match until about 6 or 7 months into their tenure, beat up The Rock a couple of times, beat various combinations of Cena, Taker, Kane, Daniel Bryan and Ryback in 6 mans and got to put Taker through a table. I'd say that's a pretty strong push. The only reason they even lost to Punk was because they were going with a break-up angle that was aborted.

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On 12/6/2019 at 11:08 AM, RIPPA said:

From the new WON (it was specifically talking about TLC but this is the bigger picture)

 

I assume the last day thing is less last minute hype, and more trying to extend the free month as long after the free trial as possible, maybe to the next PPV if possible.

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16 hours ago, Rehabilitated Rick said:

I remember being on forums during Randy's transition to the legend killer model, and it was always received as astroturfed . Randy's face run was hamstrung and broken from the beginning. Triple H can LARP as an ally to the IWC but he did more damage to the nurturing of talent than anyone else in those years. It took Vince to hound him down to take the fall for Cena at Mania that year. Triple H was a tumor in the industry in those years where all of those attitude era fans dropped off. But no-one ever mentions it. lol. NXT is apparently his redemption arc? I'm not buying it.

EDIT: Kinda wish this was in the chat thread.

Ask and you shall receive!

Hunter did seem to carelessly cut the legs out from under a lot of guys back in the day, but I think he tried in earnest to make Randy in '04. The problem there was Hunter's other favourite kind of LARPing: As leader of his own Horsemen. His insistence on being top heel at that moment meant they got the face/heel dynamic for the first Orton-Hunter feud wrong from the beginning. I really think they meant to go to Mania and have Orton go over Hunter, but Randy flopped as top face, Batista caught fire, and the rest is history.

I also don't think Hunter needed to be hounded down to put over Cena. It was his third consecutive Mania main event loss. He seemed down to put over "the right guy." He just skipped a lot of those right guys on the way to John and Dave.

Edited by West Newbury Bad Boy
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48 minutes ago, West Newbury Bad Boy said:

Ask and you shall receive!

Hunter did seem to carelessly cut the legs out from under a lot of guys back in the day, but I think he tried in earnest to make Randy in '04. The problem there was Hunter's other favourite kind of LARPing: As leader of his own Horsemen. His insistence on being top heel at that moment meant they got the face/heel dynamic for the first Orton-Hunter feud wrong from the beginning. I really think they meant to go to Mania and have Orton go over Hunter, but Randy flopped as top face, Batista caught fire, and the rest is history.

I also don't think Hunter needed to be hounded down to put over Cena. It was his third consecutive Mania main event loss. He seemed down to put over "the right guy." He just skipped a lot of those right guys on the way to John and Dave.

They didn't do Orton any favours by having him kicked out of Evolution, rather than deciding he had enough of them and challenging them first. I guess they thought they were doing the Sting/Horsemen angle, where they're kicking him out to protect the leader's spot, but Sting was two or three years in as a super-face by that point and hadn't yet won the title. If they were going to do that angle, they should have had Randy kicked out before his Summerslam title shot.

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2 hours ago, cwoy2j said:

The Shield didn't lose a 6 man match until about 6 or 7 months into their tenure, beat up The Rock a couple of times, beat various combinations of Cena, Taker, Kane, Daniel Bryan and Ryback in 6 mans and got to put Taker through a table. I'd say that's a pretty strong push. The only reason they even lost to Punk was because they were going with a break-up angle that was aborted.

Oh I completely agree, and The Wyatt Family didn't get that kind of push. But they were definitely presented as a special act, with weeks of prominent vignettes. Harper and Rowan were not unbeatable as a team, but they definitely got featured prominently. And when the time came, they got two wins over The Shield.

Tbf I forgot about Becky, who was definitely the third member of Team PCB (the clue is in the name). I would say Becky and Sasha are the only two NXT people on the current roster who got significantly over but didn't receive a strong push off the bat. 

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39 minutes ago, elizium said:

They didn't do Orton any favours by having him kicked out of Evolution, rather than deciding he had enough of them and challenging them first. I guess they thought they were doing the Sting/Horsemen angle, where they're kicking him out to protect the leader's spot, but Sting was two or three years in as a super-face by that point and hadn't yet won the title. If they were going to do that angle, they should have had Randy kicked out before his Summerslam title shot.

The other way I've game-planned this in my head is you do an angle where Flair and Batista turn their back on Hunter after his consistent failures to get the title back from Benoit. Maybe Hunter makes some excuses, softly blames them for not having his back. Meanwhile, Orton gets it done on the first shot at SummerSlam and as a result becomes the new leader of Evolution. Let Orton run roughshod over Raw as the newly-minted top heel while Hunter spends the fall redeeming himself as a babyface before going for Orton at Mania.

Knowing they'd eventually pivot back to Orton as a heel against Taker and how well that would work, Orton as a villain is the secret sauce that holds the whole thing together. Always has been, even though he makes for a fairly popular babyface too. 

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