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The Natural

OCTOBER 2019 WRESTLING CHAT.

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I don't think 4 minute matches fixes much.  The crowds would have to be so invested in the characters that they are okay with the in-ring action being short and secondary to whatever story you are telling. Most matches these days begin with the crowd sitting silently,  these men and women have to work their ass off to get a reaction out there and if they're good they usually can get the crowd going but it takes more than a couple minutes.  

So if the plan is to shorten matches okay that means more time for story telling and you know what WWE is really really really bad at?   Story telling. 

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Everything should be shorter. Nobody has time for multiple-segment Seth Rollins matches.

The longest matches should be 15 minute Ironman bouts. And they should be rare. 

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in the most generic way possible: being compelling in some form is gonna be the key here, and I suspect that a lot of the ways to become compelling are gonna take place outside of the regular TV matches.

Of course, for that to work... you'd need a mix of people who are good at talking and knowing which guys to lean on for that.

But right now, it's almost like a certain amount of Raw/Smackdown is booked by the Battlebowl machine to generate 10/15 minute matches that don't exactly tie into any specific thing going on.

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The problem with WWE doing a "real sports" presentation is that it comes off like a joke in comparison to New Japan where it is presented as a real sport down to the trophy presentations and press conferences.   But that's also something that Japanese fans accept and expect from the promotion.  

I don't know if that would even work for an American audience. I might like it but will a teenager think it's cool or will 40+ year old WWE fan who grew up in the Hogan era want to see it? I think it only works for a niche audience. 

I think what AEW is doing is closer to what main roster WWE should be in terms of booking and presentation and doing away with scripted promos but it remains to be seen how far AEW can go with it. For a startup company they are doing amazing. 

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Every show should be that one hour of Nitro that one time that had no wrestling content and was really weird and had Torrie Wilson in it.

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that's plan Z for the "make Raw 2 hours again so the crowd doesn't die in the last hour" concept..

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6 hours ago, JohnnyJ said:

Without going through the laundry list of reasons, I put a lot of thought into whether or not WWE has effectively killed the town. Whether a series of band aids have disguised just how bad it is and what, if anything, would engage the audience. 

Putting blame on Vince is certainly valid, but simply getting rid of him wont magically make good television. So, what needs to happen? 

Take a page from Marvel or DC. Realize what originally brought you to the party (comics, actual wrestling) doesn't appeal to younger audiences enough. Create a true universe with larger-than-life characters with stakes on the line (championships, winning money for an orphanage, whatever). Use their resources (WWE Studios, deals with toy companies, etc.) to create content and merchandise that may appeal to a bigger group.

Be honest about who can be pushed mainstream. I'm sure WWE has this information in-house. Groom those people and market them consistently. Better use social media and digital tools to create mini-franchises for these possible stars within the larger WWE Universe. There are several wrestlers on the roster who could be superhero types. Roll the dice and see where it goes.

The biggest problem for not only WWE, but wrestling at large, is absolutely no growth in the fanbase. There is more wrestling than ever for everyone to watch. No one outside the diehards care. No one even talks about it. Every show is shedding viewers, no matter the promotion. There's being niche, then there's being off the grid. There are two full-time people among the 250+ wrestlers WWE has under contract who are even sniffing non-wrestling success. If wrestling is to grow, a few will need to make it outside the bubble in some way to reach a new audience.

 

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They could just liquidate the company and run away with the money.

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3 hours ago, West Newbury Bad Boy said:

Everything should be shorter. Nobody has time for Seth Rollins matches.

FTFY 

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Anyone know what's happened with Billy Jack Haynes? Is he still posting extensive ramblings on Facebook challenging Stone Cold to MMA fights with a $10,000 purse on the line at WrestleMania?

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Was there some miss information about the press conferences in Japan? Earlier in the week it was reported that they’ll have two press conferences. One that turned out to the announcement that NJPW’s parent company bought Stardom, and the other a WWE press conference that might’ve announced NXT Japan. But the later hasn’t  materialized. Was it postponed?

Edited by LoneWolf&Subs

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6 hours ago, Brian Fowler said:

How to get back to 1998 or 1985: find a Steve Austin or Hulk Hogan.

That's it, that's the whole game. When you have the guy at the top that draws new viewers, and is red hot, everything gets hot.

I think about this a lot and how it flies in the face of how WWE does things. A generational talent could get signed tomorrow and he/she would spend the next 6 months to a year sitting in developmental waiting to debut on NXT. Then the next 1-2 years in NXT waiting to get the call. If the fans take to him/her add a year so NXT has someone to headline Takeovers. When they do move up to the main roster, unless the office sees you as a top talent you're lucky to get stuck in 50/50 midcard hell. It's a process that is pointless and actually hurts the chances that the generational talent will ever become anything. 

Meanwhile, AEW comes out of the gate with a Darby Allin type and with a simple message; he's young, he's exciting, and you should care about him. He jumped through 3 years of b.s. and if by unlikely chance he is that generational talent he has the opportunity to get noticed as one. 

 

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On 10/18/2019 at 7:57 PM, LoneWolf&Subs said:

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Sort of...

There was also the Federettes in the 80s.

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21 hours ago, West Newbury Bad Boy said:

He really wants to be my favourite wrestler. Well done.

 

 

Respect. I think Ali did the same last time as well.
Edited by The Natural
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Let Brazzers buy the company. They couldn't do worse.

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2 hours ago, The Natural said:

 

Respect. I think Ali did the same last time as well.

Good on him. While I totally get why guys like Bryan would refuse to go based on their personal beliefs (and I have no argument with that either), this seems a more productive way to do it. 

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Putting aside "push the stars" and "scale back" type massive overhauls; I think the biggest thing WWE could do is just change their presentation on TV.

I compare it to the difference between something like the fights in the Bourne Trilogy to what we see in stuff like Hero or Fearless with Jet Li. Heck, even the John Wick fight scenes.

Pull the camera back and stop cutting the angles on every impact.

Next, change up the format.

I posted way back when they announced Cena v Nakamura that it was an awesome chance to do something radically different.

Start that match at the end of hour one. It looks like the top of the hour "main event" before announced Women's title match and a tag match between say New Day vs Orton/Revival.

They come out of the gates red hot and hit the first break as normal.

During the next segment Cena misses a shoulder charge on the outside and crashes into the announce table. "We will take a break while docs check on his injury" Back and Cena has been given the all clear to keep going. Due to the length of this match the 6 man tag has been postponed until next week.

40 mins in and we hit our final break of the evening.

We come back and the Women's title match has been pushed back also. We get a camera in the corner with Bayle's reaction to being pushed back to next week.

Cena goes for the AA but his shoulder gives. He never hits it and Nakamura gets the win with about 10-15 mins of TV time left.

Get an interviewer in the ring asking Nakamura what it means to beat a legend like Cena in their first match. Ask Cena about his shoulder and if he is going to ask for an immediate rematch. This whole thing uses about an hour of TV time, gets both guys over as super tough, and also has people ready for next week because anything can happen.

Then take advantage of that.

The following week opens backstage a brawl between the 6 man tag match that was meant to open the show. End it with Orton hitting a Punt on Kofi and now we have a story of New Day trying to find a replacement. People who don't like Orton could make their pitch.  Ali can talk about how Kofi's run started when Ali got hurt. Now it's Ali's turn to fill that spot and get some justice.

Shades of grey and a revamped format. They are way too comfortable with what they do and it's worn out a huge part of their audience.

Edited by L_W_P
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You know why wrestling hasn’t gone through another boom period? I’ll tell you why. Because nobody on commentary in AEW, or WWE are shouting from the top of their lungs that “So, and so IS THE WRESTLER OF THE 20’s” like they did for Warrior, and Sting.

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16 hours ago, Burgundy LaRue said:

Be honest about who can be pushed mainstream. I'm sure WWE has this information in-house. Groom those people and market them consistently. Better use social media and digital tools to create mini-franchises for these possible stars within the larger WWE Universe. There are several wrestlers on the roster who could be superhero types. Roll the dice and see where it goes.

 

I want a He-Man style cartoon starring Roman Reigns. So many villains from today and yesteryear in the WWE Universe he can battle. 

Also, a show like Ed, Edd, and Eddy starring The New Day. All the funny characters that appear on UUDD could be kid versions of themselves. Alexa Bliss, Samoa Joe, Sasha, Ember Moon, etc.

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I don't know why WWE hasn't thought to do a Saturday morning lineup on the Network. It could be similar to the Teen NBC. 

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2 minutes ago, Burgundy LaRue said:

I don't know why WWE hasn't thought to do a Saturday morning lineup on the Network. It could be similar to the Teen NBC. 

Jeez, did you guys forget Camp WWE, or that stop motion animated program? All currently featuring extremely outdated rosters.

...And probably why they haven’t really invested in more original content? It’s because they’ve all bombed, they’re expensive, and no other network wants to pick them up. Also the WWE Network isn’t going to be a channel anytime soon, as they originally wanted.

Edited by LoneWolf&Subs

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59 minutes ago, LoneWolf&Subs said:

Jeez, did you guys forget Camp WWE, or that stop motion animated program? All currently featuring extremely outdated rosters.

...And probably why they haven’t really invested in more original content? It’s because they’ve all bombed, they’re expensive, and no other network wants to pick them up. Also the WWE Network isn’t going to be a channel anytime soon, as they originally wanted.

The Network is a channel in Canada.

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It is a channel in Canada, but it's as a streaming app that most of its business gets done. 

I forgot Camp WWE back in the early days of the Network. Mix South Park with Brickleberry and somehow make it shittier than either of those shows, and you got Camp WWE. 

I was too busy watching old WCW shows and NXT to do more than watch six minutes of one episode, but man, was it an awful six minutes.

Speaking of NXT and kids shows, does NXT Kids still exist? Is that a thing?

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