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Raw is MSG - 9/9/2019


Dolfan in NYC

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You know how there’s the idea that WWE pushes the brand and tries to avoid pushing anyone super strong to avoid making another Rock in the off chance they become a huge mega star outside of wrestling and leave?

I can understand now why Seth Rollins is pushed so hard over anyone who shows even the least bit of charisma or likeability. Because he’s such an unlikeable dork, it doesn’t matter how hard you push him. He’ll never in a million years be a mega star that Hollywood will beckon to go make movies. You can safely have him beat Brock Lesnar a billion times without fear of him having any crossover appeal outside of wrestling.

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I'm old enough to remember when we were the verge of Braun Strowman being put in place as the focus of the show and Seth was in the IC Title position and people were all "You can't put Braun over, he's too much like Andre.  Give me Seth!"  

I blame you people.

Seth couldn't muster the fire to go after Corbin for hitting his finisher on Rollins' fiance for heavens sake.  He's an empty set of tights.

Edited by Goodear
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6 hours ago, Matt D said:

I'd argue that the Fiend is better defined and developed too. You can explain what the fiend is in a sentence. For the Demon King, it's a bit more of "well, this nerdy Venom fan spends six hours putting on facepaint and..."

I also can't explain Ember Moon in a sentence so it's not like this is the only thing they've developed poorly.

Ember Moon is a vampire that hails from Dallas, Texas. 

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32 minutes ago, Goodear said:

I'm old enough to remember when we were the verge of Braun Strowman being put in place as the focus of the show and Seth was in the IC Title position and people were all "You can't put Braun over, he's too much like Andre.  Give me Seth!"  

I blame you people.

Seth couldn't muster the fire to go after Corbin for hitting his finisher on Rollins' fiance for heavens sake.  He's an empty set of tights.

I never bought the Andre talking point because Andre wasn't on TV every Monday Night having competitive matches or doing silly skits. If you can see the monster on the same channel at the same time every week,  he's no longer a mysterious monster. As others have pointed out, that's the very reason why the Fiend should be used sparingly. Nothing would kill his buzz faster than the Fiend appearing in thrown together tag team main events on RAW in the lead-up to his next PPV match. 

I don't know what you do with Braun after he loses the title, but a monster that can never even manage to win the title just comes off as lame.  

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7 minutes ago, Overly Critical Man said:

I thought she was a werewolf. See, she doesn’t even have a well defined supernatural entity.

I wasn't really sure myself. Maybe a War Goddess can be either or both. It's the supernatural entity blowing off steam by riding a mechanical bull part that is ill-fitting for me. At least Undertaker was billed from Death Valley. That reminds me of all the dumb ass e-fedders that thought it was Death Valley, Arizona. 

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1 hour ago, Matt D said:

Constantly drawing money by getting fans to pay to see a babyface beat you is the whole point of being an effective heel. 

Exactly. Boos from a live crowd that have already paid for their seat are one thing but if that doesn't translate to people tuning in or buying tickets the next time it doesn't mean shit. There's multiple reasons why business stunk after Wrestlemania but putting Corbin on top for months didn't help. The counter argument is that nobody is paying to see any wrestler, they pay to see the brand. Not only do I not believe that, I think that if the top program of your brand sucks then your brand probably sucks.

But Corbin isn't in that position anymore, so I can't fault what he's doing. I just don't think it's a money maker. As in, if he becomes King Corbin and the only thing that changes is now he wears a dumb crown on the side of his dome like Adebisi from Oz, why would I pay money to see him? Or pay money to say him get beat up? Give him an edge, a mean streak, and I might be more inclined.

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1 hour ago, Goodear said:

I'm old enough to remember when we were the verge of Braun Strowman being put in place as the focus of the show and Seth was in the IC Title position and people were all "You can't put Braun over, he's too much like Andre.  Give me Seth!"  

I blame you people.

Seth couldn't muster the fire to go after Corbin for hitting his finisher on Rollins' fiance for heavens sake.  He's an empty set of tights.

Was this happening here though?  I know a lot of us were BEGGING for them to pull the trigger on Braun and they didn't do it.  Maybe for good reason as he's started to break down already but Seth to me wasn't the right alternative. 

I said a couple years back that AJ Styles should just be the main guy and in a lot of ways he is. 

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16 hours ago, clintthecrippler said:

Is there any word on if Rey Mysterio was okay after the match? Save for one or two instances, he looked like he was moving a bit slow after Metallik landed on his head and neck and it didnt seem to be in a way that was selling, but potentially genuinely rocked. 

That looked bad but I was more worried about Joe when Ricochet landed short on that 630. Hoping he didn't break an arm or wrist.

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2 hours ago, Goodear said:

I'm old enough to remember when we were the verge of Braun Strowman being put in place as the focus of the show and Seth was in the IC Title position and people were all "You can't put Braun over, he's too much like Andre.  Give me Seth!"  

I blame you people.


That's just the thing - Seth was doing great in that position, as the IC champion surprising us with fun gauntlet matches. He's just not a good main eventer.

As for Corbin - no one is drawing money, so the best way to measure the heels now would likely need to be who gets the loudest boos. Whether it's "heel heat" or "change the channel heat" (which, again, only works if you're actually changing the channel) doesn't matter because what the company hears are boos. If you really want to send the message that Corbin is boring, sit on your hands. Go take a piss break or buy some food. You 100% are not communicating your apathy by booing him.

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11 minutes ago, Peck said:

That looked bad but I was more worried about Joe when Ricochet landed short on that 630. Hoping he didn't break an arm or wrist.

Joe was pretty clearly being checked on after the match. So you're probably not the only person who had that concern.

In other news that I'm vaguely interested in: The no-hard-camera style of presenting a match made another appearance during Rey vs Metalik. 

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I don’t remember this Andre talk at all. I remember around Elimination Chamber last year Braun was genuinely a few weeks and a WM main event win over Lesnar away from being an uber over made man and a legit draw (insofar as anyone’s a draw these days). To me that was the apex and after his loss that night it was downhill. I don’t recall anyone clamoring for anyone else in that spot.

Also, Wyatt has to win clean as a sheet at HIAC doesn’t he? I don’t see how he can’t right now. This reminds me of when Orton was champion and Henry caught fire. This should have the same outcome - Rollins needs to get squashed at HIAC and they need to use the next 6 months to find their next fiery babyface.

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10 hours ago, J.T. said:

Nah.  The Demon King was a well developed gimmick during Finn's run in NXT and then he got brought up to speed when Finn gave us this marvelous lesson on Gaelic mythology.

The problem is that the Demon King gimmick was put out there almost immediately to put some fire under RAWs sagging ratings since Finn was mega over in NXT and the book needed something with molten heat to get RAW's main event hour over. 

I totally lay the blame for the ruination of the DK gimmick at the feet of WWE Creative.  The Demon King should've been brought out for big matches only, but the book overexposed Finn's gimmick in order to put asses in seats and keep prime time eyes glued to normal television.

Then Rollins fucked things up when he injured Finn and he's never really gotten back into the title picture after taking time off to rehab his shoulder.  More than enough time for Rollins to incorporate Finn's Sling Blade into his own arsenal!  Yay!

I also want to add what damaged the DK is, you bring it out for Corbin but not for your shot at Brock?

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42 minutes ago, For Great Justice said:

I don’t remember this Andre talk at all. I remember around Elimination Chamber last year Braun was genuinely a few weeks and a WM main event win over Lesnar away from being an uber over made man and a legit draw (insofar as anyone’s a draw these days). To me that was the apex and after his loss that night it was downhill. I don’t recall anyone clamoring for anyone else in that spot.

Also, Wyatt has to win clean as a sheet at HIAC doesn’t he? I don’t see how he can’t right now. This reminds me of when Orton was champion and Henry caught fire. This should have the same outcome - Rollins needs to get squashed at HIAC and they need to use the next 6 months to find their next fiery babyface.

Finn. Demon vs Fiend at Mania.

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Also I may be missing something but I count about 7 Demon appearances since Balor made the main roster. That'd put it at about once every five or six months and while one can argue it should be a bit rarer than that, I don't think one can argue for overexposure cutting its legs off. I think it's not a bigger deal because aside from a slightly different entrance neither WWE nor Balor do much of anything to make it seem different from normal Balor.

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15 hours ago, MORELOCK said:


Fantasy booking anyone but Corbin to the bitter end, eh? Y'all can send thoughts, prayers, vibes, and align all of your chakras: You're getting King Corbin.

I hope so. I like Gable coming off the Andrade match more than Ricochet, but I'd honestly prefer Corbin.

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