Jump to content
DVDVR Message Board

Raw is Chair-ity - 6/17/2019


Dolfan in NYC
 Share

Recommended Posts

30 minutes ago, Yo-Yo's Roomie said:

So Stomping Grounds has to end with EC3, Eric Young et al coming out and giving Seth Rollins his comeuppance, right? I mean, heels still get their comeuppance in modern WWE, right.

EC3 needs to be in a coma until his contract is up. The last mention of him should be like when they announced the death of Henry Blake on M*A*S*H*. Seth looks sad at first hearing of the passing of the man he put in a coma, but then he puts on a “Show must go on” face to set everything aside to give the fans an entertaining program.

Edited by LoneWolf&Subs
  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, LoneWolf&Subs said:

EC3 needs to be in a coma until his contract is up. The last mention of him should be like when they announced the death of Henry Blake on M*A*S*H*. Seth looks sad at first hearing of the passing of the man he put in a coma, but then he puts on a “Show must go on” face to set everything aside to give The an entertaining program.

D9TlYiJWkAAxBY9.jpg:large

  • Haha 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 minutes ago, Overly Critical Man said:

Oh yeah, if anyone cares about this sort of thing...Bobby Roode and Cedric Alexander had one hell of a match for the Main Event taping. I assume they got a little extra time due to Dana's injury.

I'll have to check that out.  I don't recall if they had one on NXT TV but first NXT show I went to they tore the house down.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, LoneWolf&Subs said:

Caught the first hour of this, and read the rest of the results to catch up. 

That elimination match to start off the show in the place of a shitty scripted public conversation between two people who have no business reciting lines, was excellent. I didn’t like babyface Ricochet accepting heel Lashley, and heel Cesaro’s help in defeating Strowman without any recourse.

The Seth angle was some of the strongest booking they’ve done with him since Wrestlemania. Took them fucking long enough to present somebody who’s holding your main belt as a star. The whole shows reads like a response to AEW, the booking in general, and the criticism of the way they’ve neglected the call ups. But it feels like one of those condescending responses that Vince, and creative like to do. “See here, are the Viking Raiders. We know they still exist”, but then they make them seem like afterthoughts by having a 24/7 segment immediately following their squash. Like why not have them excessively beat up the jobbers afterwards to the point that makes them scarier? 

The problem is that Rollins just isn’t a star. He can’t convincingly sound or present himself as a guy any grown man would be afraid to step outside with. All the shitty superplex spots in the world don’t mean a thing if they’re done by a guy who can’t cut a promo without sounding like an entitled douche. 

  • Thanks 1
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

19 minutes ago, Casey said:

Someone needs to tell the live audiences at these shows that Rollins isn’t a star so they’ll stop being so fuckin’ loud for him.

Who else is there? And why can’t he hold a television audience to save his life?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Tickled by the argument that fans are cheering for Rollins because there's no one else to cheer for. 

Rollins was basically inserted into the boring Steve Austin mold that WWE has for boring storylines. Which is what everyone says they want: faces that act like badasses. The problem with that is that it isn't really the underlying problem. Neither is Seth or any other talent. 

Austin wasn't popular because he was a dick. He was popular because he was exciting and unpredictable. Which is something WWE performers literally cannot be for as long as the current mode of production is adhered to. 

Edited by MORELOCK
  • Like 1
  • Thanks 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Liked this show, and honestly don't mind somebody, anybody other than Roman being booked as a strong top face. I just hope Sunday ends with Seth setting up a trebuchet outside of the ring and launching Corbin deep into the sun.

The Kofi run has so freshened up New Day.

Dig where they might be going with the Bullet Club stuff.

Bryan was great here, too. What Elvion said about this show being surprisingly competent, if not necessarily good, was spot on. Especially after that trash they rolled out last week.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I got 14 Smackdown superstars appearing on RAW, if you include Shane.

I am including The Iiconics and R-Truth/Carmella, who have cross-brand titles (Carmella doesn't, but whatever).

But even if you eliminate all of those, and New Day who invented their own justification, that still leaves 6 right?

FFS

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

34 minutes ago, MORELOCK said:

Tickled by the argument that fans are cheering for Rollins because there's no one else to cheer for. 

Rollins was basically inserted into the boring Steve Austin mold that WWE has for boring storylines. Which is what everyone says they want: faces that act like badasses. The problem with that is that it isn't really the underlying problem. Neither is Seth or any other talent. 

Austin wasn't popular because he was a dick. He was popular because he was exciting and unpredictable. Which is something WWE performers literally cannot be for as long as the current mode of production is adhered to. 

Is it really a crazy notion to think booking, presentation AND talent don't all matter. 

It can be WWE's fault and Rollins' fault.

Likewise, it can be Rollins fault and WWE's fault.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Casey said:

Are we really blaming the ratings woes WWE is experiencing on Seth Rollins? 🤣

Would he be getting credit if ratings were good? And the quarter hours he’s on are consistently low. People actively tune him out. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Are quarter hours really the best way to assess Seth's star power or lack thereof? With how stale the show is and how hour three normally doesn't stand a chance regardless? 

Seth isn't my cup of tea, but let's be fair: The problem is the overall package and no one talent should be carrying too much water for that. 

Edited by West Newbury Bad Boy
Link to comment
Share on other sites

That’s probably fair. Rollins’ act is awful, but it’s probably not all his fault. I’m sure part of my criticism of him is based on my personal taste, rather than reality. He’s a great athlete. Prodigious, even. There’s just nothing about his moveset or promo delivery that separates him at all, and nothing about him that I can identify that would cause a lapsed fan or casual viewer to seek him out. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Matt D said:

Is it really a crazy notion to think booking, presentation AND talent don't all matter. 


Rollins isn't completely blameless. He's particularly ill-suited to the role. But no one on the roster would have been great in that role, because the role is Stone Cold Steve Austin, and he doesn't wrestle anymore. I'm not convinced I would have given more of a shit about RAW this week if someone better was in Seth's place.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think the best we can conclude is that Rollins isn't able to move the needle positively.

But neither does anyone else. 

I know Rollins is instant fast forward for me on my DVR. And when I do actually watch him, his reactions are way down from a year ago. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Casey said:

Someone needs to tell the live audiences at these shows that Rollins isn’t a star so they’ll stop being so fuckin’ loud for him.

 

4 hours ago, Casey said:

Are we really blaming the ratings woes WWE is experiencing on Seth Rollins? 🤣

 

4 hours ago, MORELOCK said:

Tickled by the argument that fans are cheering for Rollins because there's no one else to cheer for. 

Rollins was basically inserted into the boring Steve Austin mold that WWE has for boring storylines. Which is what everyone says they want: faces that act like badasses. The problem with that is that it isn't really the underlying problem. Neither is Seth or any other talent. 

Austin wasn't popular because he was a dick. He was popular because he was exciting and unpredictable. Which is something WWE performers literally cannot be for as long as the current mode of production is adhered to. 

There's more than a few posts to respond to, but I'll just say that you two really nailed this. Only on DVDVR is Seth hated this much. It really is the only place I see or hear the incredible amount of "he can't cut a promo"  or "he can't wrestle" or "he's not over" bullshit. Anyone I talk to away from here whether if it's in person or chatting with friends online who moved to other parts of the country has an entirely different view. Then you take into account the live audience reactions to him and the amount of merchandise he moves. The guy is far better than a lot of people on the board thinks he is. Then again, and it's easy to always bring this up, people on here also championed folks like Chris Masters or Tyler Reks as incredible talents... Our opinions on wrestling are wild, but it's when it strays away from actually being an opinion that it's worth arguing.

At present, Rollins is the closest thing to what you mentioned - exciting and unpredictable. The last guy that was fucking goldmine for each of those was Braun Strowman and they completely fucked up his push beyond belief. There's literally not one talent in the company who has that sort of momentum that Braun had where you wish the company would just pull the trigger on the guy to see what would happen. There's now no one to pull the trigger on. Seth is what you get when you just try to make it happen and to an extent it's working.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Burgundy LaRue said:

Kofi Kingston is the strongest babyface in the company and has been since WM. Roman is still dealing with Shane/Drew/Revival. Stop with the idea that only Roman gets good booking just because you still wish he was off TV.

All of this. Where Seth may be one of the top edgy babyfaces, Kofi is by far the strongest babyface in the company. WWE may by and large suck, but if there's one thing they've done right, it's how they've handled Kofi post-WM. Trouble in Paradise is a total omega-level kill move. They've done an excellent job protecting it and people love the hell out of Kofi.

Roman has also been booked well at times. Monday was probably the best he's looked. And what a shock - he looked amazing because he was out whooping ass and looking like a fucking savage. He channeled all of the crazy Braun Strowman shit where he'll hunt you down, he channeled the look of someone like Austin where he looked like he was going to kill someone, he was wild and awesome. It's not Roman's fault he's booked against Shane. I remember when people on here said Roman's program wouldn't be against Shane post-WM and lo and behold it is. Everyone could see how bad of an idea this was. 

Point is, Roman is really awesome when you have him be this wild fucking Samoan monster. That guy can be my hero any day of the week and from the sounds of it, crowds are still behind him too.

3 hours ago, just drew said:

Would he be getting credit if ratings were good? And the quarter hours he’s on are consistently low. People actively tune him out. 

How are the quarter hours he's on consistently low when they don't measure quarter hours? People tune out everyone. Look at who he's programmed against - Baron Corbin. Baron Corbin is the biggest black hole of suck. His gear still looks like complete garbage and the only thing about him that looks remotely good is when he hits the Deep Six or End of Days.

4 hours ago, bink_winkleman said:

Liked this show, and honestly don't mind somebody, anybody other than Roman being booked as a strong top face. I just hope Sunday ends with Seth setting up a trebuchet outside of the ring and launching Corbin deep into the sun.

The Kofi run has so freshened up New Day.

Dig where they might be going with the Bullet Club stuff.

Bryan was great here, too. What Elvion said about this show being surprisingly competent, if not necessarily good, was spot on. Especially after that trash they rolled out last week.

You can't say "somebody, anybody other than Roman" because they've given the audience that along with rehabilitating Roman. Roman should be booked as a strong top face. The problem is when he's booked like the plucky underdog. If you're not Braun Strowman or Drew Mac, it should take a lot to put Roman down.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On what planet is Seth Rollins “edgy?” He’s a 50 yr old ad exec’s idea of edgy. That’s part of my gripe with him. He is the least credible tough guy they’ve ever tried to push as a tough guy. He’s the Pat Boone version of “Johnny B. Goode.” It’s the same sheet music, but it ain’t the same song. 

 

Part of it is also that that he embodies everything that’s wrong w wwe’s presentation right now. Every boon period in the business’s history has been ushered in by dynamic characters who could talk people into the building by being themselves turned up to eleven. Seth Rollins isn’t a dynamic personality, he can’t talk people into the building, and yet I’m supposed to believe that he’s a guy who could’ve beaten an explanation out of Dean Ambrose? C’mon. 

 

Sure, he has good matches with the right opponent. But there’s 80 guys in the company who can do that, and they don’t come off like smug hipsters with a gym membership.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...