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JUNE 2019 WRESTLING DISCUSSION - Thread 2

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Posted (edited)

I thought they had something with Kevin Federline being Cena’s Heenan. But they dropped it too soon. He could’ve had the real-life hook(at the time) of using his wife’s money to fund his war with Cena.

Edited by LoneWolf&Subs
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That's exactly the problem with the company now - they're content to make one million when they could make ten. 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, christopher.annino said:

That's exactly the problem with the company now - they're content to make one million when they could make ten. 

It's just like CM Punk said, "Vince McMahon is a millionaire who should be a billionaire." Most of us have an opinion Punk one way or the other, but you can't say he didn't know what he was talking about. 

WWE's "Summer of Punk" could have been so good if Punk were allowed to stay away for a while to make it look like he really did walk out. Getting HHH involved, then Kevin Nash just fucked the whole thing up.

Edited by Nice Guy Eddie
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3 hours ago, Wyld Samurai said:

And the only people in the WWE that would even fit the Heenan / Akbar / Jones / Hart motif are the McMahon's. 

I don't know. Sometimes they luck into a non-wrestler who'd do it. 

Vickie Guerrero and Michael Cole were two people who fit the role perfectly- both were despised by the fans, and because they were pure non-wrestlers they  had the "We get it. They're not a trained wrestler, you only get so many chances to see them in a ring...and that makes it mean THAT MUCH MORE. We know for a fact that we won't get many chances to see this person in the ring, and so if we ever have the chance to see them in a match, the hero HAS TO MAKE IT COUNT and give this person the beatdown we badly want them to have...because if we don't get it now, who knows when we'll get another chance to see it?"

By contrast, when we know the person is a wrestler and is trained enough to put on a match, we don't get that sense of urgency of "we HAVE to see this person get what they have coming to them". Only Stephanie McMahon has been able to really give us that sense of urgency while also being ostensibly a wrestler.

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Drake Maverick getting ass-whippings for the heels he represents seemed like the way to go. Unfortunately, they seem to have dropped him as a manager for now? I dunno. He's perfect for that role. Shoot, he teamed with AOP in some handicap matches last year

Rush wrestled Balor last year, but Rush is too much of a wrestler to fit the description.

Last time they did one of these properly was Punk laying into Heyman on top of Hell in a Cell. But by that time, the feud had moved past Brock and we were on to Axel and Ryback. It felt like leftovers. 

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5 hours ago, mystman said:

Should Andre be in the conversation? Beat Hogan for the belt, albeit through major shenanigans. Only guy Hogan faced twice at Wrestlemania.

Andre and Hogan also fought in Japan, and at the Showdown At Shea.

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Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, mattdangerously said:

Andre and Hogan also fought in Japan, and at the Showdown At Shea.

and he's going to fight an Andre hologram at the next Saudi show

or he can just fight the The Giant again after seemingly killing him in a monster truck battle in the desert

Edited by Nice Guy Eddie
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Jesus. I keep forgetting that Heyman managed both Axel, Ryback, and Cesaro.

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13 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

and he's going to fight an Andre hologram at the next Saudi show

I hate the fact that this is probably not out of the realm of possibility.

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26 minutes ago, mattdangerously said:

I hate the fact that this is probably not out of the realm of possibility.

That would be the only match I'd watch on a Blood Money show, for the sheer absurdity of it.

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Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, Six String Orchestra said:

Does the hologram come to the ring in the mini ring cart?

Yes

Edited by Nice Guy Eddie

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For the sake of discussion, if WWE's in-ring work and writing overall on the shows really really improved (NJPW grade ringwork, Eddie Graham level finishes, ECW style long term feuds, and so on), which would not cost the company that much more money, would their bottom line ($$$$) go up any worthwhile amount? I could see arguing for side.

- RAF

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Posted (edited)
33 minutes ago, thee Reverend Axl Future said:

For the sake of discussion, if WWE's in-ring work and writing overall on the shows really really improved (NJPW grade ringwork, Eddie Graham level finishes, ECW style long term feuds, and so on), which would not cost the company that much more money, would their bottom line ($$$$) go up any worthwhile amount? I could see arguing for side.

- RAF

...Yes and no.

No, good in-ring work and good writing overall won't make the bottom line go up- because ultimately, it's only the hardcore fans who REALLY care about the quality of the show. Lapsed hardcore fans will probably come back if the show became amazing, but more casual fans are more star power oriented, and non-fans wouldn't know the difference.

Yes, because having said all of that...the biggest thing that killed WWE for bad in-ring work and bad writing is, quite frankly, they blew it. The WWF in 1997-98 should tell how WWE's going to get better ratings (and thus, a better bottom line) again:

Get your shit together. Just spend the next few months, just get your shit together booking-wise.

Once you've got it all together, then throw a celebrity or some big ticket hype thing to get casual fans to give you a chance again.

If you've got your shit together, the celebrity/big ticket thing should get them in the door, and something you already have will KEEP THEM.

 

WWE blew that with Ronda Rousey over the last year, and the post-TLC bullshit makes it worse since fans won't trust you when you say "no, this time it'll be different. THIS TIME we're going to get our shit together."

All they can do now is try to quietly get their shit together, hope we notice, and hope things are all together by the time Smackdown premieres on Fox. Do that, and maybe if they fix all of these things, the hardcore fans will be ready for the battle with AEW, and the casual fans will be willing to give WWE a try if Smackdown on Fox gets them through the door.

Edited by SorceressKnight

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I want hologram Tupac to rap hologram Andre to the ring in the cart. With hologram Bobby in the cart too. 

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1 hour ago, Curt McGirt said:

I want hologram Tupac to rap hologram Andre to the ring in the cart. With hologram Bobby in the cart too. 

Needs more hologram Dio.

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Posted (edited)

I want TNT & AEW to fire the first shot by having the original Law & Order cast attack the SVU cast on a random syndicated episode mid-day on USA. Then all our collective parents, and grandparents ask us “Why did Sam Waterson kick Mariska Hargitay? ...And why did he yell “Superkick party” before doing it?”.

Edited by LoneWolf&Subs
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Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

It's just like CM Punk said, "Vince McMahon is a millionaire who should be a billionaire." Most of us have an opinion Punk one way or the other, but you can't say he didn't know what he was talking about. 

WWE's "Summer of Punk" could have been so good if Punk were allowed to stay away for a while to make it look like he really did walk out. Getting HHH involved, then Kevin Nash just fucked the whole thing up.

I was thinking more of that they should just stop undercutting wrestlers that get over on their own. Motherfucking Rusev had them selling boatloads of calendars. Calendars! Calendar that said Rusev Day on everyday, it is such a dumbass idea and yet he made it work, Aiden made it work, hell they were even getting Lana more and more popular. Instead of running with it they just blow it all up. Makes no fucking sense. 

Edited by christopher.annino
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9 hours ago, SorceressKnight said:

I don't know. Sometimes they luck into a non-wrestler who'd do it. 

Vickie Guerrero and Michael Cole were two people who fit the role perfectly- both were despised by the fans, and because they were pure non-wrestlers they  had the "We get it. They're not a trained wrestler, you only get so many chances to see them in a ring...and that makes it mean THAT MUCH MORE. We know for a fact that we won't get many chances to see this person in the ring, and so if we ever have the chance to see them in a match, the hero HAS TO MAKE IT COUNT and give this person the beatdown we badly want them to have...because if we don't get it now, who knows when we'll get another chance to see it?"

By contrast, when we know the person is a wrestler and is trained enough to put on a match, we don't get that sense of urgency of "we HAVE to see this person get what they have coming to them". Only Stephanie McMahon has been able to really give us that sense of urgency while also being ostensibly a wrestler.

The real answer to this question is Shane-O Mac. Instead of some middle age/frat boy/dad bod/shoot fighter/high flyer gimmick he works, he should be a manager who takes all the short cuts and cheap shots (kind of like he's doing now). But the only time the guy should wrestle is the "get 5 minutes with the heel". Then he has enough credibility to get some cheap offense in, but still get squashed in the end.

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I shamelessly bought a Rusev Day calendar and would've bought a 2019 one as well.

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Posted (edited)

I'm thinking about all of the top stars from the 80s through the early 2000s, everybody from Backlund and Hogan to Austin and The Rock, and then when thinking about the current roster I just don't see anybody who is ever going to reach those upper echelons. Maybe I am a missing something but there is just nobody that screams future hall-of-famer. I think that says a lot, and that's a bummer because holy hell they have one of the most talented rosters ever.

Maybe Daniel Bryan? Edited again to mention New Day, they seem to be bulletproof and like they'll be remembered a la DX.

Edited by christopher.annino

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Becky, maybe? I could see her continuing to be over despite booking issues. I'm struggling to think of another outside of who you mentioned.

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2 hours ago, christopher.annino said:

I'm thinking about all of the top stars from the 80s through the early 2000s, everybody from Backlund and Hogan to Austin and The Rock, and then when thinking about the current roster I just don't see anybody who is ever going to reach those upper echelons. Maybe I am a missing something but there is just nobody that screams future hall-of-famer. I think that says a lot, and that's a bummer because holy hell they have one of the most talented rosters ever.

Maybe Daniel Bryan? Edited again to mention New Day, they seem to be bulletproof and like they'll be remembered a la DX.

Randy Orton, John Cena (does he count as current roster?),  Daniel Bryan, Roman Reigns, AJ Styles, Charlotte, The Uso's

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Posted (edited)

Are we talking Observer Hall of Fame, or WWE’s? Because if it’s WWE bro, fucking Koko B. Ware, and fucking Stan Hansen(Who had a cup of coffee with them) are in it. Hell if AEW somehow goes tits up, then I can see Cody Rhodes ending up there too, like Gagne did.

Edited by LoneWolf&Subs
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