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So when Jungle Boy was on TiJ, he said that he started training when his parents noticed he kept trying to wrestle his sister on their garden trampoline. And they said if this is what you want to do with yourself, we want you trained in how to do it safely, so they found a trainer and booked him classes.

He was 10 years old. Hollywood parents are unlike other parents.

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1 minute ago, SturmCRF said:

I enjoyed it, and most of the audience seemed to have a great time, although in the interests of full disclosure, myself and most of the audience were drunk.

Of all the problems with current Progress, I'd put it way behind the loss of proper entrance music, the loss of half the roster to heatless WWE UK purgatory, oversaturation and a lack of compelling storylines on the level of the Jimmy Havoc era. It's a way to decompress after the three day SSS16 tournament, and a non canon comedy show is refreshing compared to the inconsequential filler show they might be doing otherwise.

Saying that, this year's 80's show failed to supplement the silliness with really good matches like I remember the 70's show doing last year. But I still can't honestly disapprove of anything that gave the world Ilja Dragunov as a patriotic American and Dan Maloney discovering his true calling as an Iron Sheik impressionist.

Glad you enjoyed it! My issue is, and I'm not a huge stickler for this usually, is how can it possibly be reconciled in kayfabe? Like...is a meeting held where all the heels and babyfaces table their issues and agree to do summer theater?

Like, I can understand goofy shit within the confines of a wrestling match but this is basically GLOW skits as wrestling show. It just crosses my arbitrary line. It's beyond comedy wrestling, really. I can't think of anything that really compares. 

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10 minutes ago, Hagan said:

Glad you enjoyed it! My issue is, and I'm not a huge stickler for this usually, is how can it possibly be reconciled in kayfabe? Like...is a meeting held where all the heels and babyfaces table their issues and agree to do summer theater?

Like, I can understand goofy shit within the confines of a wrestling match but this is basically GLOW skits as wrestling show. It just crosses my arbitrary line. It's beyond comedy wrestling, really. I can't think of anything that really compares. 

Well, strictly speaking it can't be, as in kayfabe it's a show that happened 30 years ago and everybody in the building is a person from 1989, watching or performing in a wrestling show, as recalled by Jim Smallman's retro commentator alter ego.

If you go up (or down? I dunno) a meta layer from that, it makes a sort of sense in that the matches are still performed as if the moves are painful and both guys are trying to beat each other, they're just doing it while playing stupider characters. Like, Travis Banks and TK Cooper were still spiteful, conniving dickheads, they were just playing the Bushwhackers while doing it, maybe taking out their anger at a previous generation's backwards Kiwi stereotypes by reclaiming them while beating up their opponents. And Niwa was dressed as a Dudley Boy, cos he only remembered the bit of the memo about wearing camo.

A lot of the matches seemed to follow a formula of old style, clubbering wrassling to start while milking the comedy, with a finishing stretch where it all went PWG to give the people their work rate money's worth. It definitely can't be fully kayfabe justified, and it'd give Cornette a coronary, but he did say Jim Smallman should be hung, so fuck him. It's not a family show, so it's not like they're ruining things for kids, and the illusion is already shaky when you have heels at the merch table and Canadian Destroyers to spare. Can see why it'd cross the suspension of disbelief event horizon for some, though.

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That is a really good post. Thanks for that.

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, HumanChessgame said:

I just saw somewhere that apparently he and Aleistar Black have been working eachother on the house show circuit. Now I really, really want to see them have an actual televised match or program.

Saw them on the Coconut Loop last year when Buddy hadn't been on TV in months and it was one of the best matches I've ever seen live.DDE9-FFA3-2-BE3-485-B-816-A-98-AFD887-F9

 

 

Edited by Peck
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56 minutes ago, AxB said:

So when Jungle Boy was on TiJ, he said that he started training when his parents noticed he kept trying to wrestle his sister on their garden trampoline. And they said if this is what you want to do with yourself, we want you trained in how to do it safely, so they found a trainer and booked him classes.

He was 10 years old. Hollywood parents are unlike other parents.

Luke Perry was probably an awesome father.

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12 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Luke Perry was probably an awesome father.

He definitely sounds like he was. The interview with Jungle Boy is really good if just to give you some insight into what he lost.

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Hypothetical: You're running a wrestling show. You've got 30 minutes to fill, and there's 20 guys in the back. Do you book one Battle Royal, or three trios matches and a promo leading to a brawl? Or a ten minute tag plus a bunch of sausages? Squashes. Not sausages. Or send 18 guys home and have the two best workers use all the time having the best possible singles match?

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32 minutes ago, AxB said:

Hypothetical: You're running a wrestling show. You've got 30 minutes to fill, and there's 20 guys in the back. Do you book one Battle Royal, or three trios matches and a promo leading to a brawl? Or a ten minute tag plus a bunch of sausages? Squashes. Not sausages. Or send 18 guys home and have the two best workers use all the time having the best possible singles match?

I'd do a 30 minute version of that episode of Impact where the entire hour was Angle vs Rhino vs Christian with a bunch of other dudes coming in and out of the show and creating a ton of side stories. 

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6 minutes ago, West Newbury Bad Boy said:

I'd do a 30 minute version of that episode of Impact where the entire hour was Angle vs Rhino vs Christian with a bunch of other dudes coming in and out of the show and creating a ton of side stories. 

That's actually an episode that Impact uploaded at the beginning of the year

 

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, Technico Support said:

Ryan's dick spots went viral, got him worldwide attention, increased his bookings, paid for his house, and eventually got him to a point where WWE wants to sign him.  None of that happens without that spot.  The Katie Vick angle turned people off and did not add one PPV buy.  Honestly, do you just pull this stuff out of your ass based on your general hate for independent wrestling?

I don't hate independent wrestling, I hate garbage that does long term damage to something I loved. You listed things that helped Joey Ryan, which has negative value to me. Just because you get attention doesn't mean its good. Which again, you made no attempt to defend on any artistic (for lack of a better term) basis. So replace Katie Vick with any number of things that drew money in the attitude era. The Undertaker once chokeslammed Kane into their dead mother's classic. This segment gained a lot of viewers and that feud drew real money, does that make it good? There are numerous examples of things that have drew money that were bad. Not that I think Ryan ever drew money, no matter how hard he tries to convince us.

 

 

6 hours ago, Technico Support said:

You're really good at reading minds and judging people's intent.  Or you just assign the worst possible intentions to strangers you've decided to dislike.

Correction, I'm great at it. But Its easy enough to read people. Anyone can see what Ryan's intentions are, despite the dozen people he has hypnotized. 

Edited by Victator

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1 hour ago, AxB said:

Hypothetical: You're running a wrestling show. You've got 30 minutes to fill, and there's 20 guys in the back. Do you book one Battle Royal, or three trios matches and a promo leading to a brawl? Or a ten minute tag plus a bunch of sausages? Squashes. Not sausages. Or send 18 guys home and have the two best workers use all the time having the best possible singles match?

It depends on how over the wrestlers are. I would likely do quick singles, tag, trios and eight man tags. Or go nuts and do a ten vs ten elimination match. 

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28 minutes ago, Victator said:

I don't hate independent wrestling, I hate garbage that does long term damage to something I loved. You listed things that helped Joey Ryan, which has negative value to me. Just because you get attention doesn't mean its good. Which again, you made no attempt to defend on any artistic (for lack of a better term) basis. So replace Katie Vick with any number of things that drew money in the attitude era. The Undertaker once chokeslammed Kane into their dead mother's classic. This segment gained a lot of viewers and that feud drew real money, does that make it good? There are numerous examples of things that have drew money that were bad. Not that I think Ryan ever drew money, no matter how hard he tries to convince us.

 

 

Correction, I'm great at it. But Its easy enough to read people. Anyone can see what Ryan's intentions are, despite the dozen people he has hypnotized. 

What long term damage was done? To most anyone else, there was no long term damage done. That Joey Ryan of all people could do more long term damage to wrestling than what Vince McMahon has done (killing the territories and now, killing interest in a national product with the side effect of driving people to go to indies) or Eric Bischoff has done or Vince Russo has done and on and on and on. Joey Ryan does two spots that no one even talks about anymore except for you, Cornette, or others who love to hang onto this bullshit notion of "outlaw promotions" or "mud shows" or whatever he calls them.

Regarding the spots themselves and how they only helped Joey Ryan, that's also false. Look at how many people show up to Bar Wrestling or other places Joey is at. All of that money doesn't just go to money. Any increased attendance trickles down to other people on the same card so they can continue making money doing the thing that they love.

Beyond all of this, as multiple people have tried to tell you, this whole issue people have isn't about what Cornette said about Joey Ryan. You continue hanging onto that though. It has to do with what he said about Sonny Kiss. For the record, I couldn't care less about what Cornette shouts at the clouds because he's another huckster carnival barker selling his shit to his audience. I think he said some shit he probably didn't think would be offensive and now he's hopefully clued in to the fact that terms like transvestite or the way he used that are offensive. Regardless, Joey, Killian McMurphy, and others came to Sonny's defense. The outrage wasn't about what Cornette said about Joey.

Regardless, you may not like Joey, hell, I'm not even a fan since I can't even recall a match of his and can't even comment on if he's a good wrestler, but he has done other stuff that is funny, mainly the BTE stuff and the angle where he was killed. Just because YOU don't like Joey doesn't mean he's garbage.

Want to know what is garbage in wrestling though, where it can actually hurt things long term? Letting people with HIV or AIDS or Hep wrestle without being tested where they're bleeding all over their opponent, increasing the risk of transmission. Or the case of the other indy wrestler who knowingly had HIV, wrestled with it, and had sex with multiple partners without informing any of them that he's positive. How about the amount of chairshots to the head that continue to this day? That's the type of garbage that would do long term damage. There's more than that though, but I just decided to focus on the transmittable diseases. Point is, what Joey Ryan is doing is far from doing any sort of long term damage to wrestling. If people look at a wrestling card and don't recognize any names, see Joey Ryan's, decide to go because of him, and wind up seeing one or more other wrestlers they like and now those people want to see those wrestlers, then how is that a bad thing?

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Posted (edited)
52 minutes ago, Victator said:

I don't hate independent wrestling, I hate garbage that does long term damage to something I loved.

 

Dramatic much?

What "long-term damage" has Ryan's ridiculous signature spot done to our beloved sport of kings?  Are there major wrestling promotions that are just absolutely teeming with cock-based maneuvers due to the influence of that awful Joey Ryan? 

I hit the post button as @Craig H was posting.  Apologies for any repetitive content.

 

Edited by Technico Support
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1 minute ago, Technico Support said:

Are there major wrestling promotions that are just absolutely teeming with cock-based maneuvers due to the influence of that awful Joey Ryan? 

AEW signed Pentagon Jr, so fans of that promotion are going to be seeing a lot of package piledrivers. 

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Someone tag me when Cornette and Joey Ryan are no longer the topic of conversation.  😆

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2 minutes ago, Technico Support said:

Dramatic much?

What "long-term damage" has Ryan's ridiculous signature spot done to our beloved sport of kings?  Are there major wrestling promotions that are just absolutely teeming with cock-based maneuvers due to the influence of that awful Joey Ryan? 

I hit the post button as @Craig H was posting.  Apologies for any repetitive content.

 

I didn't even want to really say anything about Joey Ryan because aside from him on BTE, I don't even really care about the guy. When there was talk of him signing with WWE or AEW, I didn't know what good he could do for either company. If anything I did appreciate him saying he would stick with the indies because he is making more than enough money doing them and he brings in an audience that will see other talent they may not have otherwise known about.

It's just hard to not say something when you see the same false bullshit uttered repeatedly. And even now after typing all of that out I wonder why I even bothered because it's not going to change his thinking on the matter. It's just wasted time on my part so jokes on me I guess.

If anything, this silly as fuck notion that something he or Sonny Kiss or someone else is doing is killing the business needs to go away. It's not true. Not even close to being true. When you think back to the long, wild history of wrestling, there's a lot of shit you can look at and imagine people now, mainly Cornette's followers, saying would kill the business. Goldust, dudes grabbing a woman's crotch in ECW (Beulah maybe?), women grabbing a dude's crotch (Luna?), dudes piledriving women, powerbombing women, straight up blasting women with all sorts of wrestling moves, the Rock giving Mick Foley permanent brain damage with 13 unprotected chair shots to the head, numerous wrestlers dying way too early, and on and on and on. When you look back and think about all of that, Joey Ryan and his dick flip that no one even cares about now wouldn't even rank.

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What is ridiculous is that people at the same time accuse people like Ryan, Janela, Priscilla Kelly, The Elite of ‘killing the business’ but then say ‘and these people have never drawn a dime,* implying there’s no fanbase. 

Pick a lane. 

*this is a phrase that should really be retired. What does it even mean? 

 

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I think Cornette selfishly working a large group of would-be paying fans into thinking that pretty much all wrestling today sucks and is not worth their money does more long-term damage than Joey Ryan's cock.  That's just me, though.  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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9 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

Someone tag me when Cornette and Joey Ryan are no longer the topic of conversation.  😆

I tried my best to change the subject, man. Not my fault people changed it back.

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Posted (edited)

The Progress 70s show last year was fun but they were kind of too half-assed on the period details for it to really work a lot of the time. Stuff like "the mod and the rocker", 90s WWF style wrestling gimmicks about 70s style stereotypes, instead of stuff that was actually like 70s wrestling

The bits I remember being really good were 1) Jack Sexsmith's peacock entrance gear 2) Chris Roberts doing the first pin count of the night in the bullshit Bronco Lubich kneeling-slightly-and-stretching-to-lightly-tap-the-mat style and everyone turning to look at him in bewilderment and disgust and 3) Kyle Fletcher in an exaggerated Aussie gimmick shouting WE DIDN'T CAM HERE TO FACK SPOIDERS and everyone in the ring and pretty much everywhere else heavily corpsing

Edit: I would like to thank all the mods who did not lock this thread due to the interminable Cornette argument while I was haltingly typing this post on a phone

Edited by Firebreaker Chip
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On the subject of controversial announcers who divide opinions, I would like to announce that I like Pat McAfee.  I think he is an entertaining big jock doofus.  He has that same dumb enthusiasm that Don West used to have.  I get the feeling though at some point he is going to say, tweet or do something really dumb or controversial that will get him fired.

Then I will hate him, like his stupid anti virus software.

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3 minutes ago, AxB said:

I tried my best to change the subject, man. Not my fault people changed it back.

I'm sorry, but it's a topic of conversation that fits into a thread about wrestling and it's a discussion that's not even heated. No one is saying we can only talk about this one thing, threads can have multiple conversations take place at the same time for various people interested in them, and Niners could have responded to your hypothetical question instead of making a meta comment, which just winds up derailing things.

Last month, it felt like people talked about Sasha Banks for what felt like 10 pages. Or maybe that's every month? Other people talked about other stuff in that same period of time. *shrugs* I fail to see the problem unless something turns heated or nasty.

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2 minutes ago, Ultimo Necro said:

On the subject of controversial announcers who divide opinions, I would like to announce that I like Pat McAfee.  I think he is an entertaining big jock doofus.  He has that same dumb enthusiasm that Don West used to have.  I get the feeling though at some point he is going to say, tweet or do something really dumb or controversial that will get him fired.

Then I will hate him, like his stupid anti virus software.

He used to be at Barstool Sports. Give it time.

Also, thank christ it's Beth doing commentary on NXT and not Pat McAfee. Just leave Pat and his shorts to the watch along shows.

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