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1 minute ago, Brian Fowler said:

Again, neither Ryan nor anyone else I've seen are saying Jim is homophobic because he doesn't like Ryan's penis stuff.

Cornette used a transphobic slur and some generally homophobic language about Sonny Kiss. Ryan tweeted about that. 

Ryan has said that more than once in the past and his leeches use it all the time. 

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Posted (edited)

I think the Young Bucks are going to have to change their finish, #CancelDave

This.

Edited by ComingToAmerica
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That's the thing, I liked a lot of the guys Jim didn't, but the Battle Royal did suck.

But using a slur and hurtful language isn't constructive criticism. 

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Hopefully more people like myself will learn transvestite is considered a slur and avoid the word from all of this. Silver lining?

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Yeah that's fine. I could be wrong, but I suspect Cornette will avoid the term moving forward. But you press too hard on this shit and people say 'fuck this shit, I'm gonna subscribe to Tim Pool'. It's counter-productive, at least if you actually have good intentions. Speaking of which.....

Intent isn't necessarily everything (I'm with Chomsky over Harris here), but it is usually something - and it's pretty clear what Cornette's intent was.

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I don't think there was any malice behind it. He was ignorant on the current terminology, but instead of explaining it, the self important Twitter brigade picked a fight they can't win. But that is not what this is about, Ryan thought he saw a vulnerable point and went for it. In the end Jim will have his many fans and Joey Ryan will have his dozen troglodytes

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On 6/2/2019 at 9:39 PM, LoneWolf&Subs said:

What the hell happened to Buddy Murphy? Did the “Wild Card Rules” kill Buddy Murphy’s Smackdown debut?

I just saw somewhere that apparently he and Aleistar Black have been working eachother on the house show circuit. Now I really, really want to see them have an actual televised match or program.

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3 hours ago, Victator said:


 

And thru out these discussions here and on twitter, I have never seen anyone really defend Ryan as a performer or that spot. They will say it draws, which is debatable, but WWE has done some stupid shit and they make a ton omoney. The Raw where Triple H humped a dummy dressed as Kane, WWE made more money than Ryan will ever see, is Katie Vick a good angle. 

 

 

 

 

Ryan's dick spots went viral, got him worldwide attention, increased his bookings, paid for his house, and eventually got him to a point where WWE wants to sign him.  None of that happens without that spot.  The Katie Vick angle turned people off and did not add one PPV buy.  Honestly, do you just pull this stuff out of your ass based on your general hate for independent wrestling?

 

2 hours ago, Victator said:

Ryan thinks all gay men are anxious to grab any penis they can or have their penis grabbed. A nice variation of a man accusing any woman who rejects him of being a lesbian.

----------------------------------------

I don't think there was any malice behind it. He was ignorant on the current terminology, but instead of explaining it, the self important Twitter brigade picked a fight they can't win. But that is not what this is about, Ryan thought he saw a vulnerable point and went for it. In the end Jim will have his many fans and Joey Ryan will have his dozen troglodytes

You're really good at reading minds and judging people's intent.  Or you just assign the worst possible intentions to strangers you've decided to dislike.

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Posted (edited)

I honestly don’t know whether to blow my brains out, or get them fucked out.

Edited by LoneWolf&Subs
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Getting them fucked out is a lot more fun.

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2 hours ago, LoneWolf&Subs said:

I honestly don’t know whether to blow my brains out, or get them fucked out.

Well, HHH will fuck your brains out. He may even fuck the shit out of you.

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16 minutes ago, LoneWolf&Subs said:

 

 

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Yearly post - but the PROGRESS non-canonical eighties show should really get more criticism. 

My tolerance for goofy wrestling stuff is pretty endless but PROGRESS basically doing a summer improv show is pretty beyond the pale. 

 

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I should help out a little here with trans terminology because I think oversimplification might cause confusion.

Transvestite is kind of/sort of a slur. It's really more outdated language that folks should try to avoid, similar to "transsexual". The reason for this is because of the word's link to something called "transvestic fetishism". One thing trans people get frequently accused of is using their gender/presentation as a means to trick people into having sex with them. Transvestic fetishism is the belief that someone's arousal is increased by wearing perceptibly feminine clothing. This is different from the disproven concept of autogynephilia, which is where it's believed that a trans woman transitions specifically because she's turned on by her own body.

Needless to say, a significant majority of trans people aren't going to be terribly thrilled being compared to that. Hence why people have drifted away from using the word "transvestite" and have replaced it with "cross-dresser" for those who are cis men who occasionally wear feminine clothing but have no intention or desire to transition. It should also be noted that it's frequently trans women who are attacked with slurs, and people tend to forget trans men exist and are valid as well.

Some words that are definite slurs for trans people (and again, most of these are related to trans women) are words like tranny, trap, ladyboy, he/she, shim, shemale, genderbender, dickgirl, and use of the pronoun "it". As you can see, a lot of those are horrifying. I wouldn't begrudge anyone for saying that transvestite is a slur when it's continued to be used against trans people who desire to transition away from their assigned gender at birth.

And that's why I mentioned that gender and presentation are nuanced concepts that aren't necessarily easy to solve on a message board. 😉

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How the hell does a thread that mentions Black vs. Murphy (which could be great, great stuff), descend into talking about Joey Ryan's dick or the fact that a sixty-year old man in the deep South isn't up on currently acceptable terminology? I know Jim Cornette through years of correspondence, a more tolerant, liberally-inclined guy is hard to find. Remember to always separate the worker from the work. When Corny's working, he says outrageous stuff, that's what he does, you're supposed to get all butt-hurt and complain on Twitter, simply means he has a few thousand more listeners next time to see what he'll say next.

Remember Don Imus and Howard Stern when they were just shockjocks? The whole gig was say something outrageous to get listeners talking and to tune in the next day to see if they were going to top it. Jim is an intelligent man, he learns from the world around him and steals the bits and pieces that help make the Jim Cornette character, (which is far different from the real Jim Cornette, the man). To imply that he's a bigot or transphobic because he used the word "transvestite"  is silly, he probably didn't know any better and now he does.

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I don't think it's a subject that needs anyone else's two cents at this point. 

Though @Stefanie the Human 's post is appreciated.

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4 minutes ago, Stefanie the Human said:

I should help out a little here with trans terminology because I think oversimplification might cause confusion.

Transvestite is kind of/sort of a slur. It's really more outdated language that folks should try to avoid, similar to "transsexual". The reason for this is because of the word's link to something called "transvestic fetishism". One thing trans people get frequently accused of is using their gender/presentation as a means to trick people into having sex with them. Transvestic fetishism is the belief that someone's arousal is increased by wearing perceptibly feminine clothing. This is different from the disproven concept of autogynephilia, which is where it's believed that a trans woman transitions specifically because she's turned on by her own body.

Needless to say, a significant majority of trans people aren't going to be terribly thrilled being compared to that. Hence why people have drifted away from using the word "transvestite" and have replaced it with "cross-dresser" for those who are cis men who occasionally wear feminine clothing but have no intention or desire to transition. It should also be noted that it's frequently trans women who are attacked with slurs, and people tend to forget trans men exist and are valid as well.

Some words that are definite slurs for trans people (and again, most of these are related to trans women) are words like tranny, trap, ladyboy, he/she, shim, shemale, genderbender, dickgirl, and use of the pronoun "it". As you can see, a lot of those are horrifying. I wouldn't begrudge anyone for saying that transvestite is a slur when it's continued to be used against trans people who desire to transition away from their assigned gender at birth.

And that's why I mentioned that gender and presentation are nuanced concepts that aren't necessarily easy to solve on a message board. 😉

Nicely done Stefanie. Reminds me of years ago (early 1990s), my dart league had a team of cross-dressers participate, apparently Thursday was their big night, they would have dinner, play darts until 11PM or thereabouts and then go across the street for a midnight fashion show. What a fun bunch of folks! I asked how they wanted to be referred to and the answer was "Just call us "The Girls".  Two of the players could have passed as women and quite frankly dressed better than any women in the league 😉 , the team Captain  however looked like Lurch from the Addams family in a dress, funny individual though. Terrible dart players, didn't want to improve, darts was just something to do after dinner and before the fashion show. They stuck around the league for four years taking last place in eight seasons and then wandered off to do something else. I always missed them.

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Then he should fucking apologize instead of fueling his rageboner. Instead, he made it about attacking his favorite targets again. I fail to see him as some liberal bastion when I know hundreds of people who don't use bigoted language.

 

 

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9 minutes ago, jaedmc said:

I don't think it's a subject that needs anyone else's two cents at this point. 

Though @Stefanie the Human 's post is appreciated.

I'm with Jae. But we're probably pissing into the wind on this one.

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Posted (edited)
27 minutes ago, Stefanie the Human said:

I should help out a little here with trans terminology because I think oversimplification might cause confusion.

Transvestite is kind of/sort of a slur. It's really more outdated language that folks should try to avoid, similar to "transsexual". The reason for this is because of the word's link to something called "transvestic fetishism". One thing trans people get frequently accused of is using their gender/presentation as a means to trick people into having sex with them. Transvestic fetishism is the belief that someone's arousal is increased by wearing perceptibly feminine clothing. This is different from the disproven concept of autogynephilia, which is where it's believed that a trans woman transitions specifically because she's turned on by her own body.

Needless to say, a significant majority of trans people aren't going to be terribly thrilled being compared to that. Hence why people have drifted away from using the word "transvestite" and have replaced it with "cross-dresser" for those who are cis men who occasionally wear feminine clothing but have no intention or desire to transition. It should also be noted that it's frequently trans women who are attacked with slurs, and people tend to forget trans men exist and are valid as well.

Some words that are definite slurs for trans people (and again, most of these are related to trans women) are words like tranny, trap, ladyboy, he/she, shim, shemale, genderbender, dickgirl, and use of the pronoun "it". As you can see, a lot of those are horrifying. I wouldn't begrudge anyone for saying that transvestite is a slur when it's continued to be used against trans people who desire to transition away from their assigned gender at birth.

And that's why I mentioned that gender and presentation are nuanced concepts that aren't necessarily easy to solve on a message board. 😉

Thank you for the insights.

Edited by The Natural

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Posted (edited)

I'm definitely gonna regret this but Jim does plenty of rants where he calls Republican women cunts and bitches and shit like that and make fun of their appearance and you don't really see a lot of umbrage taken, at least to the level of this. Jim says offensive shit regularly but people sure like to cherry-pick when they get offended.  

More relevant to wrestling - what is disappointing is that his podcast has been pretty fun recently with him doing deep dives on history or focusing on shit that he actually likes. Like others have said, the issue with a lot of his rants is that it's clearly pro wrestling hyperbole.  

What Jim does is little different than what people Russo does. It's all about "working the marks" to elicit a reaction. It's just such a tired device now. 

 

Edit for much needed clarity: any member of the LGBQT community most certainly has the right to condemn Cornette for his insensitive comments. I just roll my eyes at the piler-ons who do it to virtue signal their wokeness. 

Edited by Hagan
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(on a tangential note, Aleister is quickly rising on my list of things I like) 

 

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38 minutes ago, Hagan said:

Yearly post - but the PROGRESS non-canonical eighties show should really get more criticism. 

My tolerance for goofy wrestling stuff is pretty endless but PROGRESS basically doing a summer improv show is pretty beyond the pale. 

 

I enjoyed it, and most of the audience seemed to have a great time, although in the interests of full disclosure, myself and most of the audience were drunk.

Of all the problems with current Progress, I'd put it way behind the loss of proper entrance music, the loss of half the roster to heatless WWE UK purgatory, oversaturation and a lack of compelling storylines on the level of the Jimmy Havoc era. It's a way to decompress after the three day SSS16 tournament, and a non canon comedy show is refreshing compared to the inconsequential filler show they might be doing otherwise.

Saying that, this year's 80's show failed to supplement the silliness with really good matches like I remember the 70's show doing last year. But I still can't honestly disapprove of anything that gave the world Ilja Dragunov as a patriotic American and Dan Maloney discovering his true calling as an Iron Sheik impressionist.

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