Craig H Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 5 hours ago, CreativeControl said: That's all it needs to be. Muck raking from years ago is almost as shitty as making the comments themselves, I'd hate to be held accountable for some of the boneheaded things I said and did when I was younger He was an adult when many of these comments were made. We're talking 5 or 6 years ago and he's 30 now. And he had been saying shit like that from 2008 onward. Hell, even a couple weeks ago he said some shit on Twitter about people being overly sensitive or whatever and he deleted that tweet too. This is a little more than him saying "some boneheaded things." If it's one or two comments, I might give you that, but it's a litany of insensitive and bigoted remarks that span years into his adulthood. Him issuing a copy and pasted bland, PR apology isn't "all it needs to be" either. It's not exactly sincere or honest. 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig H Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 On 5/8/2019 at 1:12 PM, Craig H said: You're all way more positive about WWE doing the right thing than I am. Here's how it ends: Lars eventually issues some kind of apology that isn't really an apology for his past behavior and the machine keeps running. He said and did all of this shit as an adult and it wasn't even that long ago. If WWE didn't do anything about it when it first came up, they're not going to do much about it now other than pushing Lars to apologize. Also, this ended exactly the way I said it would. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurningBeard Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 1 hour ago, Infinit said: Everyone needs to be prepared to be held accountable for every contribution or thought they post. What an abhorrent view. I'd recommend reading So You've Been Publicly Shamed 4 minutes ago, Craig H said: It's not exactly sincere or honest. How the fuck do you know?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infinit Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 2 minutes ago, CreativeControl said: What an abhorrent view. I'd recommend reading So You've Been Publicly Shamed Based on your previous posts, in which you stated you posted some "boneheaded" things in your past (whatever that means lol) I can see why you would find taking responsibility for your thoughts and views as abhorrent lol 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godfrey Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 That Contra Unit clip is awesome and reminded me of how fun a compact but messy hour of wrestling really is. Plus MLW is pushing LA Park to the moon when he wrestles like NWO Hogan who can hit a topé. It’s baffling and really rad. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurningBeard Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 5 minutes ago, Infinit said: I can see why you would find taking responsibility for your thoughts and views as abhorrent lo What I find abhorrent is your view that what you say and do is a definitive reflection of who you are for eternity. That's not how people work. Lars has taken responsibility for his thoughts and views. And apologised for them. el oh el 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 This thread is going to get locked nicely again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig H Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 9 minutes ago, CreativeControl said: How the fuck do you know?! To be fair, I don't. What I can do is look at the dozens and maybe hundreds of other similar statements made from others when they got in trouble and realize this is likely more of the same. I, and others, even predicted a canned statement like his because we've seen it so many times. Call me crazy, but when someone holds bigoted beliefs for a large portion of their life, they don't exactly change their stripes with one tweeted apology. Something tells me Lars won't be the person to prove me wrong. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infinit Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 8 minutes ago, CreativeControl said: What I find abhorrent is your view that what you say and do is a definitive reflection of who you are for eternity. That's not how people work. Lars has taken responsibility for his thoughts and views. And apologised for them. el oh el It's not just my view, it is reality. In the internet age, everything stays, so be mindful of what you say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig H Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 (edited) To go back to what I said above about how he's still saying dumb and insensitive things, here's this from a little more than 3 weeks ago. Spoiler Spoilered for size. It's almost like when they apology is a canned, corporate statement, it's hard to take seriously, especially when the person making it is still saying stupid shit like this. I mean, the only thing missing from that tweet is calling people "cucks." And since I'm sure it will come up, the "well what should he say" question, he could have said something to the effect of "when these comments from my recent past came to light I was embarrassed and hoped they'd go away. I was in a different headspace at that time and let a lot of negative views influence my own beliefs. By working with people of other races and cultures, I have changed these hateful views over time because these people protect me in the ring as much as I protect them. It makes me ashamed to have even said something like that about a race of people who wouldn't think the same about me and would also make sure I'm safe in the ring." Something like that would be a good start if I was in his shoes. Edited May 10, 2019 by Craig H 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 He could also just not be a fucking asshole in general. That's a start. 4 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coletti Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 (edited) The one other part of this argument regarding things people have said online in the past that I don't see come up a lot is that with rare exception, fucking nothing prevents someone (especially if you are now more public eye) from going back and deleting stupid shit that they said. If they truly have grown they can take the time and responsibility erasing vile old shit they have sprouted. Lars joking about triggering fans of the company that employs him portrays him as someone who hasn't grown. Honestly they could fire him just for that stupid ass tweet. Edited May 10, 2019 by christopher.annino 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattdangerously Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 28 minutes ago, Craig H said: To go back to what I said above about how he's still saying dumb and insensitive things, here's this from a little more than 3 weeks ago. Reveal hidden contents That's neither as dumb nor as insensitive as you seem to think it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coletti Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 (edited) 2 minutes ago, mattdangerously said: That's neither as dumb nor as insensitive as you seem to think it is. A dude who has said some truly racist garbage mocking the idea that people are easily triggered? especially when he is working for a publicly-traded international corporation that already has its share of problems? Yeah that's not dumb at all. Edited May 10, 2019 by christopher.annino 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattdangerously Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 1 minute ago, christopher.annino said: A dude who has said some truly racist garbage mocking the idea that people are easily triggered? Yeah that's not dumb at all. Do you know what he was referring to? Because if you're going to just assign this context to everything he says, then sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coletti Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 (edited) That's the thing dude, it doesn't matter what he's referring to, he has a history of saying dumb racist shit online and unless he is completely oblivious then he has to know people are aware of the things he has said. if you have a history of saying dumb racist shit online and then you start joking about triggering people and fake outrage then you are absolutely inviting people to connect things you have said in the past do things you are saying now. Let me just ask though because it'll help me understand where you're coming from... The people who like to joke about triggering folks, where do you personally put them on the spectrum of politics and race issues? Edited May 10, 2019 by christopher.annino 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zakk_Sabbath Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 2 minutes ago, mattdangerously said: Do you know what he was referring to? Because if you're going to just assign this context to everything he says, then sure. I guess I see your point, but I mean dude in fairness it's kinda hard not to go there after everything else that was said yknow? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coletti Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 The other thing is why is Lars Sullivan joking about fake outrage and triggering people unless that's part of his character? I actually liked his character in NXT and I thought he had a whole bunch of potential both down there and on the main roster. I know WWE encourages their talents to let loose on social media but it really just does not look good for them to have a guy with a whole lot of terrible opinions from just a few years ago on a roster that has never been more diverse. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattdangerously Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 4 minutes ago, christopher.annino said: That's the thing dude, it doesn't matter what he's referring to, he has a history of saying dumb racist shit online and unless he is completely oblivious then he has to know people are aware of the things he has said. if you have a history of saying dumb racist shit online and then you start joking about triggering people and fake outrage then you are absolutely inviting people to connect things you have said in the past do things you are saying now. 3 minutes ago, Zakk_Sabbath said: I guess I see your point, but I mean dude in fairness it's kinda hard not to go there after everything else that was said yknow? So why should anyone who has done or said some bad shit in the past even try to work on being a better person when this is how people are going to react to them saying anything? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coletti Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 Do you really think that joking about triggering people and being outraged is indicative of him trying to be better? 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig H Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 2 minutes ago, mattdangerously said: So why should anyone who has done or said some bad shit in the past even try to work on being a better person when this is how people are going to react to them saying anything? Do you not get it? Issuing a canned, corporate response is not saying anything meaningful. It's in fact even worse because it's just a hollow statement that flies in the face of anyone who was offended. This isn't someone trying to work on being a better person. Do you not see that? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coletti Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 I was just going to post an apology about not being on the topic of wrestling but holy shit, especially regarding wwe, you can't get away from some of this when it comes to the sport and the industry. it would be really cool if everybody who has said dumb racist shit online could turn a new leaf, but if they don't and they are working in a company with the same people that they talk shit about? Well then hopefully those people who have said dumb racist shit online are ready for confrontation from their coworkers. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zakk_Sabbath Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 3 minutes ago, mattdangerously said: So why should anyone who has done or said some bad shit in the past even try to work on being a better person when this is how people are going to react to them saying anything? Of COURSE not. That would be madness. We're all human beings. I'm just saying the choice of language may have not been the best for someone under the scrutiny Lars is under because 1) it makes the perception of the situation look like he's learned nothing and is the same guy, and 2) it devalues his later apology in my opinion. I dislike any rush to judgment in these public fuckup scenarios that go on seemingly every day now, but again: the whole use of language like "snowflake" is indicative, to me personally, that he's probably, no definitely, learned and grown zero point zero. Purely my opinion. You make some fantastic points about things like redemption and forgiveness but in my heart of hearts, I don't know if they can really be applied here. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig H Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 1 minute ago, christopher.annino said: I was just going to post an apology about not being on the topic of wrestling but holy shit, especially regarding wwe, you can't get away from some of this when it comes to the sport and the industry. it would be really cool if everybody who has said dumb racist shit online could turn a new leaf, but if they don't and they are working in a company with the same people that they talk shit about? Well then hopefully those people who have said dumb racist shit online are ready for confrontation from their coworkers. Hah, I was just thinking about doing the same. It's hard not to comment on it because it is ultimately about wrestling and it's hard to ignore. Like, I'd much rather see and laugh at more of Troma's love of W*ing, but we've got this shit that's hard to look away from. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zakk_Sabbath Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 Just now, Craig H said: we've got this shit that's hard to look away from. WWE in a nutshell actually, so it seems rather than apologize for the derailment, we actually unwittingly got shit back on track Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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