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Captain January says CHEAP TRICK NOW, PRIVATE JOKER haha. Rikki tikki tack and take Vic with you

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I really dug these in-depth posts from OSJ and SK. One problem I see that sets apart this modern era from your more traditional (say) NWA/WCW shows is that the workers are under contract - they are always there. Rotating in monster heels (Abdullah, Killer Tim Brooks, The Great Kabuki) is not done anymore. When someone gets stale, well, they're still there. Terry Funk comes in, runs roughshod, has a series of championship matches of escalating stipulations and fails to win the big one--- and then he moves on for a while. That worked. Keeping everyone on the same level (50/50 booking) makes no one special. A hierarchy (that changes) is good but requires a finesse that no modern booker has shown to possess, let alone a group of often vetoed writers. Heck, even the bookers used to rotate out. Switching shows, enforced sabbaticals, "injuries" - I honestly don't know what would work but it is time to try something new.

- RAF

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7 hours ago, OSJ said:

ban plz

Logical.

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15 minutes ago, thee Reverend Axl Future said:

I really dug these in-depth posts from OSJ and SK. One problem I see that sets apart this modern era from your more traditional (say) NWA/WCW shows is that the workers are under contract - they are always there. Rotating in monster heels (Abdullah, Killer Tim Brooks, The Great Kabuki) is not done anymore. When someone gets stale, well, they're still there. Terry Funk comes in, runs roughshod, has a series of championship matches of escalating stipulations and fails to win the big one--- and then he moves on for a while. That worked. Keeping everyone on the same level (50/50 booking) makes no one special. A hierarchy (that changes) is good but requires a finesse that no modern booker has shown to possess, let alone a group of often vetoed writers. Heck, even the bookers used to rotate out. Switching shows, enforced sabbaticals, "injuries" - I honestly don't know what would work but it is time to try something new.

- RAF

This makes sense, but honestly it's also weird since on paper, WWE should be able to do that now more than ever, even with them under contract.

Between WWE having four recognized brands and multiple promotions (EVOLVE/SHINE, PROGRESS, wXw, Sendai Girls, possibly STARDOM now, etc.) who are recognized as good friends with WWE, they should theoretically be able to bring that concept back for a while.

It'll never be truly the same because national television has killed a lot of the aura of the rotating monster heel even more than being under contract ever could, but you could conceivably have someone like, say, Killian Dain be "he shows up on NXT and runs roughshod there. When he finally gets toppled by the NXT champ, he goes to NXT-UK and runs roughshod there, and the same happens- then he gets the call and goes to Smackdown, then goes to Raw, and you get more time." By the same token, if someone like, say, Jinder Mahal has fallen to the point he's meaningless on the main roster? Demote him to NXT and let him have some time as the "he's a former WWE Champion, and this NXT guy beat him!", send him to NXT-UK for a while and do the same thing running roughshod there...hell, even be willing to try Jinder Mahal in EVOLVE and let the fans riot about it. Same token for the women- if Dana Brooke seems like she's ready to scratch the surface, but there's not as much she can learn by a return to the Performance Center? See if she learns a bit more and gets some street cred on a tour with STARDOM or Sendai Girls.

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7 hours ago, Raziel said:

No, HUSTLE was the mid-20's woman laying an egg that turned into Akebono.

The egg was impregnated by Muta's mist, Kabuki was Muta's father, so Kabuki is Akebono's grandfather. I actually spoke about this with Kabuki and he started laughing.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, thee Reverend Axl Future said:

I really dug these in-depth posts from OSJ and SK. One problem I see that sets apart this modern era from your more traditional (say) NWA/WCW shows is that the workers are under contract - they are always there. Rotating in monster heels (Abdullah, Killer Tim Brooks, The Great Kabuki) is not done anymore. When someone gets stale, well, they're still there. Terry Funk comes in, runs roughshod, has a series of championship matches of escalating stipulations and fails to win the big one--- and then he moves on for a while. That worked. Keeping everyone on the same level (50/50 booking) makes no one special. A hierarchy (that changes) is good but requires a finesse that no modern booker has shown to possess, let alone a group of often vetoed writers. Heck, even the bookers used to rotate out. Switching shows, enforced sabbaticals, "injuries" - I honestly don't know what would work but it is time to try something new.

- RAF

This goes into the “State of the Roster” discussion.

Steve Austin was in WWE for about 8 years. That’s everything from The Ringmaster through to being GM & retiring.

If, like me, you hadn’t seen him in WCW or ECW you saw his whole career play out from talented lower card lackey through to potential GOAT. 8 years.

Dolph Ziggler debuted as Kerwin White’s caddy FIFTEEN FUCKING YEARS AGO! There is an argument to be made that Ziggler’s character hasn’t changed (outside of feel/heel turns) in the last 8 years. The same period of time that Austin had an entire career in.

I know Vince doesn’t want to be giving away talent to AEW/NJPW/Impact but really, outside of the Reigns/Rollins/Bryan/Cena pillar type main event stars there is no reason to hang onto people so long.

Let Harper go become a star in Japan then bring him back for a 1-2 year upper mid card run with that much more heat behind him.

How much money did they leave on the table by doing NOTHING with a Balor/AJ/Good Bros stable & eventual fallout. The “Balor Club” could have been huge & then when Finn goes solo the “Balor Club is For Everyone” slogan makes that much more sense.

I fucking hate being so invested in this shit & never seeing anything resembling a fully formed, cathartic storyline realised... Bryan was sheer force of will from an audience that was at breaking point. Kofi was something they fell into backwards & even then they nearly blew it.

 

I honestly think I need to step away for a while...

 

Edited by L_W_P
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When we talk about WWE’s TV,  we always bring up, Kevin Dunn. But who was WCW’s guy behind the camera’s? I ask because his direction(outside of filming around blood) was usually top notch, from the way they shot the action, the entrances, and promos. He was truly the unsung hero from 94-98. 

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4 hours ago, SorceressKnight said:

This makes sense, but honestly it's also weird since on paper, WWE should be able to do that now more than ever, even with them under contract.

Between WWE having four recognized brands and multiple promotions (EVOLVE/SHINE, PROGRESS, wXw, Sendai Girls, possibly STARDOM now, etc.) who are recognized as good friends with WWE, they should theoretically be able to bring that concept back for a while.

It'll never be truly the same because national television has killed a lot of the aura of the rotating monster heel even more than being under contract ever could, but you could conceivably have someone like, say, Killian Dain be "he shows up on NXT and runs roughshod there. When he finally gets toppled by the NXT champ, he goes to NXT-UK and runs roughshod there, and the same happens- then he gets the call and goes to Smackdown, then goes to Raw, and you get more time." By the same token, if someone like, say, Jinder Mahal has fallen to the point he's meaningless on the main roster? Demote him to NXT and let him have some time as the "he's a former WWE Champion, and this NXT guy beat him!", send him to NXT-UK for a while and do the same thing running roughshod there...hell, even be willing to try Jinder Mahal in EVOLVE and let the fans riot about it. Same token for the women- if Dana Brooke seems like she's ready to scratch the surface, but there's not as much she can learn by a return to the Performance Center? See if she learns a bit more and gets some street cred on a tour with STARDOM or Sendai Girls.

Yes, yes, yes. The practice of sending talent to EVOLVE and still allowing their NXT UK to work select indy shows is a great idea and needs to be expanded exactly like this. It is the closest thing to a territory system they could do to refresh acts and give talent more varied experience.

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@OSJ mentioned Dunn claiming that they're not making "a wrestling show."  That's a huge part of the issue.  The company is lead by Vince and Dunn, two guys who are deep-down ashamed of being involved in "rasslin" so they do all they can to make it not feel like wrestling.  The problem is that people like wrestling.  You take away all the conventional stuff and replace it with bullshit and it's no wonder fans are tuning out in droves.  Instead of making a good wrestling show, they're trying to make a piss poor comedy/drama/variety show.  I can get far better programs in all those categories literally anywhere else. 

Many people have said in the thread the same thing I believe -- nothing is going to change unless they completely revamp the show.  They have been doing the "long promos and authority figures" thing FOR OVER TWENTY YEARS.  I haven't listened to Meltzer yet today but I'm assuming they tried some sort of shakeup at Raw last night.  Sight unseen, I'll tell you it's going to fail like the last one did.  Nothing short of replacing the producer (Dunn) and head writer (Vince) will make a bit of difference.  Fish rots from the head.

 

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Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, Technico Support said:

@OSJ mentioned Dunn claiming that they're not making "a wrestling show."  That's a huge part of the issue.  The company is lead by Vince and Dunn, two guys who are deep-down ashamed of being involved in "rasslin" so they do all they can to make it not feel like wrestling.  The problem is that people like wrestling.  You take away all the conventional stuff and replace it with bullshit and it's no wonder fans are tuning out in droves.  Instead of making a good wrestling show, they're trying to make a piss poor comedy/drama/variety show.  I can get far better programs in all those categories literally anywhere else. 

Many people have said in the thread the same thing I believe -- nothing is going to change unless they completely revamp the show.  They have been doing the "long promos and authority figures" thing FOR OVER TWENTY YEARS.  I haven't listened to Meltzer yet today but I'm assuming they tried some sort of shakeup at Raw last night.  Sight unseen, I'll tell you it's going to fail like the last one did.  Nothing short of replacing the producer (Dunn) and head writer (Vince) will make a bit of difference.  Fish rots from the head.

 

Yes, the newest shakeup was... Are you ready...

So they have the "Wildcard" now, which means that in every Raw, up to 3 people from SDL can appear and wrestle. Same for SDL. So last night in the opening segment we got Daniel Bryan, Roman, and Kofi showing up.

And then they broke their own new rule in the same fucking night they introduced it when later on Shane, Elias, and Lars all showed up.

NOTHING MEANS ANYTHING

Other than NJPW, I'm damn near close to torrenting Impact and MLW to watch those instead, although I think MLW is on YouTube. I can't take WWE's shitty production values, programming, format, and total disregard for rules.

Edited by Craig H
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3 hours ago, LoneWolf&Subs said:

When we talk about WWE’s TV,  we always bring up, Kevin Dunn. But who was WCW’s guy behind the camera’s? I ask because his direction(outside of filming around blood) was usually top notch, from the way they shot the action, the entrances, and promos. He was truly the unsung hero from 94-98. 

Craig Leathers

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Thread's closed for a bit

Some people are getting a week's timeout when I get a chance to double back.

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9 hours ago, Victator said:

Ooh nut flex

Just for the record - this is the exact post that earned you a week off

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10 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

 

Eddie - I have asked you at least a half dozen times to stop doing this type of post

You can post again in 48 hours

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This isn't a surprise because some indies are already promoting him but Rhyno is leaving when his deal is up.

Quote

Former ECW World Champion Rhyno explained why he has chosen to leave WWE when his contract expires on 7/17 in a new interview with Chris Van Cliet.

Rhyno, 43, noted that WWE offered him more than double his current downside guarantee in order to remain with the company but he turned it down, saying it didn't guarantee he would be used and he wanted to work and be on the road.

If Impact is continuing to be ECW lite, I would say he would go there but with Bully Ray having so much power in ROH maybe its there.

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Fightful Select was told that during Monday's WWE Production meeting, (Jen) Pepperman actually brought her Daytime Emmy award and placed it on the table in front of her. Those we spoke to called the move "blind arrogance," and was seen walking around backstage after the production meeting with the Emmy. Several members of the team "zinged" her about the gesture, but she thought they were all joking in regards to it. In addition, it was said that she flew commercial with her Emmy accompanying her.

Several WWE Superstars congratulated Pepperman on her win, and we're told she's generally well liked by staff, the team, and the roster. Considering WWE has never managed to win an Emmy Award, the move was said to gain immediate heat backstage, though she seemed oblivious to it, with one person we followed up with suggesting that she may have just been on "cloud nine" to the point she didn't notice.

Pepperman won a Daytime Emmy For Outstanding Directing in a Digital Drama Series for "After Forever." 

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9 minutes ago, RIPPA said:

Pepperman won a Daytime Emmy For Outstanding Directing in a Digital Drama Series for "After Forever." 

Fucking trophy mark!

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Posted (edited)

Christ I hope she busted into meetings like Owen holding his Slammys.

I also hope every disagreement ended with her brandishing the Emmy like, "oh yeah?  Well Mr. Emmy here agrees with me."

Edited by Technico Support
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Posted (edited)

I assume she walked around like Owen with his Slammy?

Edit: beaten by seconds!

Edited by Six String Orchestra
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Just now, Technico Support said:

Christ I hope she busted into meetings like Owen holding his Slammys.

I also hope every disagreement ended with her brandishing the Emmy like, "oh yeah?  Well Mr. Emmy here agrees with me."

 

Just now, Six String Orchestra said:

I assume she walked around like Owen with his Slammy?

LOLLLLLLLL same thoughts, same time.  Someone owes someone a beer.

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So if the actual Superstars were congratulating her, where's the heat coming from? Who in that company could possibly be offended that an employee was achieving great success and acclaim outside?

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Just now, AxB said:

So if the actual Superstars were congratulating her, where's the heat coming from? Who in that company could possibly be offended that an employee was achieving great success and acclaim outside?

Jealous other writers?

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And as with everything - she could have "heat" with one person who was the one who went running to complain but it doesn't technically make the story untrue.

Of course I am also realizing that AxB could have been totally sarcastic in his post too.

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Has no one in the office thought to congratulate her and be glad she is on their team now? The older I get, the more I hate the WWE office.

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