Jump to content
DVDVR Message Board
Raziel

NJPW Best of Super Juniors 26

Recommended Posts

Posted (edited)

Some impressive mat action at the top of the card here. 

Moxley-Juice Robinson: Moxley makes a strong debut.  Juice Robinson was fine, but the way he takes his time/stalling before so many, often big, offensive maneuvers takes me out (at least briefly).  It mostly makes me think he's an idiot.  And when he hits the moves after taking so much time the opponent looks stupid.  Also, that high dive completely missed the mark.  Anyway, he's got some talent, I'd just like to see him tighten up the psychology.  All this said, I enjoyed this match.  Not sure this one gets quite the high ratings if it's a couple months into Moxley's run, but as a debut it certainly was impressive.

Shingo-Ospreay: Certainly lots to enjoy here.  These guys match up well.  I'm somewhat new to Ospreay, and I gotta wonder if people have seen some of these spots enough to overlook how stupid they are?  Especially that tuck the guy's head in the corner, with feet on the second rope, into a kick to the head.  WTF is that?  So convoluted, as are a number of Ospreay's offensive spots.  He's none the less a lot of fun to watch.  Is the over the top babyface looks to the crowd supposed to be funny?  Cause I do find them funny.  Shingo was pretty fantastic here.  Definitely really good, definitely some exciting spots, etc.  EDIT: impromptu second viewing seems better than first time around.   

Jay White-Tanahashi: I've only seen Jay White here and the G1 Supercard MSG match.  I think I understand the detractors (I think I've seen enough to agree he was pushed too high too fast), but that match and this were both really solid.  At 27 years of age, he seems to be well on his way to being the real deal.  Not sure I'd rate this match as high as I've seen.  Didn't really feel special, but definitely solid.  

I also saw the Okada-Romero vs. King-Scrull tag match.  Some nice spots, but didn't hold my interest.  If I'm honest, I'm slightly  underwhelmed by what I've seen from the NJPW BOSJ shows.  Perhaps I just bought the hype too much.  Or maybe I'm not prepared for the modern psychology of pro wrestling?  I'm sure irish whips seemed impossible to overlook back in the 70s too.  This isn't to say that I haven't enjoyed most of what I've watched because I have.  But maybe I don't need a NJPW world subscription.  
  

Edited by HarryArchieGus

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
40 minutes ago, HarryArchieGus said:


I'm somewhat new to Ospreay, and I gotta wonder if people have seen some of these spots enough to overlook how stupid they are? 

Is the over the top babyface looks to the crowd supposed to be funny? 
 

I don't think it's a matter of overlooking so much as accepting. Ospreay's gonna make some weird faces and pose like a geek. Sometimes he'll just pat his opponent on the back to send them sprinting into the rope before hitting a wildly athletic nothing. I don't really like these things but I can manage to suspend disbelief with the right set of expectations.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Also:

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So watching the promo are they turning Juice Robinson heel?  Or is it going to be more Bret Hart thing where he hates American fans and shows respect for his Japanese fans.  I guess I am out of the loop because I didn't know people hated the idea of Juice as US champion

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think it's simply Juice being slightly more serious. Let's see if he ditches the Jimmy Valiant gear.

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, just drew said:

 

 

you know Triple H had to be watching that like...”fuck"

...we really should have held onto CJ Parker.

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I really enjoyed the show the whole way through, even most of the undercard stuff.

Okada / Brody King interactions were fun, I think King is a great prospect and a significant get for ROH. I do find Okada’s reactions to Jericho hilarious, just no-selling the creepiness and being all puzzled ‘what the hell is a pain maker anyway?’

It looked like Shingo was being set up as the all conquering hero after bulldozing through every one in his block, but I have no problem with Ospreay getting the nod. Perhaps Dominion is his final swan song as Junior before moving onto other things? 

Mox and Juice’s post match promos were something else with the intensity. Moxley beating up Red Shoes’ son should be good times.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, The Natural said:

 

I love that Ishii doesn't smile even when celebrating a fellow Chaos member's huge victory.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Custos said:

 I have no problem with Ospreay getting the nod. Perhaps Dominion is his final swan song as Junior before moving onto other things? 

 

I think Sunday is one of the few times that people will buy a run-in to DQ or screwjob finish if Hiromu does it so he can have Dragon Lee for the title down the line (buying himself some more recovery time) and Ospreay goes to G1 without a loss between BOSJ and Dallas. Place will go so unglued that the match will be forgotten.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Had busy May so I was really behind on this tournament, but hoped to catch up eventually till the finals... and I didn't. So I still have bunch of shows left to watch.

Tanahashi/White was my MOTN. Zero fat, perfect storytelling, no pointless head drops, clever finish. Whats not to love? I'm convinced that people who at this point still talk about White not being ready or good enough don't even watch his matches or simply don't get it. Yes, hyperbole.

Juice/Mox was a pleasant surprise. Side note, funny how my crazy theories about TIMES UP guy being Mox actually ended up being true even if I didn't really believe them myself. Anyway, back to match, it was probably best Mox match (and look) that I have ever seen. That being said, Juice almost killed himself multiple times to make him look good and they had many tables/chairs spots. To me Jericho's gimmick got old rather fast so I'm not sure if they can do this type of match often. Do I want him in G1? Kinda? I'd take him over Fale or Tama easily, but at the same time if he is in G1 then it figures that he is going to be, at least, in top 4 of his block and I'm not sure if I want that.

Shingo/Ospreay was fun match, but I probably liked it least from main three matches. Don't get me wrong, it had all the ingredients of big NJPW main event and it was executed close to perfectly. But... it did feel to me a bit like generic NJPW epic main event. And thing with those is that we already got few of them this year and we are sure as hell getting few more. So I'm likely to remember previous two matches for a lot longer than Shingo/Ospreay. On the positive side, Ospreay is slowly getting rid of his annoying tendencies and I suspect that I'll really like his work in 2020.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Archibald said:

Had busy May so I was really behind on this tournament, but hoped to catch up eventually till the finals... and I didn't. So I still have bunch of shows left to watch.

Tanahashi/White was my MOTN. Zero fat, perfect storytelling, no pointless head drops, clever finish. Whats not to love? I'm convinced that people who at this point still talk about White not being ready or good enough don't even watch his matches or simply don't get it. Yes, hyperbole.

Juice/Mox was a pleasant surprise. Side note, funny how my crazy theories about TIMES UP guy being Mox actually ended up being true even if I didn't really believe them myself. Anyway, back to match, it was probably best Mox match (and look) that I have ever seen. That being said, Juice almost killed himself multiple times to make him look good and they had many tables/chairs spots. To me Jericho's gimmick got old rather fast so I'm not sure if they can do this type of match often. Do I want him in G1? Kinda? I'd take him over Fale or Tama easily, but at the same time if he is in G1 then it figures that he is going to be, at least, in top 4 of his block and I'm not sure if I want that.

Shingo/Ospreay was fun match, but I probably liked it least from main three matches. Don't get me wrong, it had all the ingredients of big NJPW main event and it was executed close to perfectly. But... it did feel to me a bit like generic NJPW epic main event. And thing with those is that we already got few of them this year and we are sure as hell getting few more. So I'm likely to remember previous two matches for a lot longer than Shingo/Ospreay. On the positive side, Ospreay is slowly getting rid of his annoying tendencies and I suspect that I'll really like his work in 2020.

If Ospreay would control himself and stopped screaming and pulling faces Omega-style, he'd be in top-5 in the world right now. He seems to have at least slowed down on his tendencies to do annoying shit like that which takes you out of the match. I'm convinced that Tanahashi and Switchblade can steal the show night  in and night out whenever they want to, talk about perfect opponents, they're like Flair/Steamboat, only better. We know that Okada has already cemented his place as one of the greats, but how about the Switchblade? The dude is only twenty-six!!! How much better is he going to get, (considering he's in my top-10 worldwide now)? I think we're watching a legend in the making.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think that comparison with Omega is very interesting. As his popularity grew it looked like he picked up more bad tendencies. With Ospreay it is in reverse. He still makes stupid faces, but screams way less, he still hits his head probably too much, but now its like 2 times per match instead of 7. His character is still a bit too video-game-character for me, but I think it is slowly getting better as well and he has rather obvious spot in the bigger NJPW picture/mythology.

And Ospreay is actually younger by like 6 months or so than White. But with White it is different I think, I don't feel like he needs to change anything about himself, he just needs to further refine his game plan and get some additional rivals aside of Tanahashi and Okada.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I LOVED Moxley/Juice.  Juice is a legend, and, in a shocking twist that no one could have predicted, Moxley seems to have found his motivation and brought the wild, violent energy you want out of him.  The crowd was great for this, and you couldn't have asked for a better introduction for Moxley.  Juice is so good at making everybody look like a million bucks; he'll probably never get a real run on top anywhere, which is a shame.

  • Like 2
  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't know about anyone else, but this was a Card of the Year Candidate for me. And I was at Double or Nothing live. 

Juice Robinson vs. Moxley was badass, and I really thing Juice stepped his game up for this match. NJPW is about stories, they just do it more in the ring and not with stupid skits. I think even Kevin Kelly and the English announcers have gotten better as an announcer because they got across the main story points well with Juice shaving off his dreads and sort of killing his old self.

For any anime fans here, it was highly reminiscent of when characters will cut or change their hair to show they are serious about their fight and are not screwing around.

And hey, for psychology experts, Jay White targeted Tanahashi's injured arm the whole match and won the match relatively clean (after both guys hit each other with low blows) by targeting Tanahashi's injured arm and using that to get the pin. 

There was a little bit of everything on this card. 

Will Ospreay definitely seems to be turning a corner and really becoming something special now. With the Elite leaving NJPW it seems like he could become an even bigger star there now. Entrance gear was awesome, post-match promo was awesome. IMHO Ospreay has proven he's more than just a flippy spot monkey indie guy. He's got intensity. I recall when he was wrestling Marty Scurll in long beach, the way he was selling the chops from Scurll, it reminded me of Sting and Flair matches. Dude clearly has some intensity and charisma that works. 

Ospreay just looks like he's gotten very comfortable with his promos. I mean look at his post-match promo below. He came off like a big deal IMO.

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 6/6/2019 at 12:52 AM, The Natural said:

 

Two great promos from men who have escaped the machine.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, EVA said:

I LOVED Moxley/Juice.  Juice is a legend, and, in a shocking twist that no one could have predicted, Moxley seems to have found his motivation and brought the wild, violent energy you want out of him.  The crowd was great for this, and you couldn't have asked for a better introduction for Moxley.  Juice is so good at making everybody look like a million bucks; he'll probably never get a real run on top anywhere, which is a shame.

Absolutely. It's a valuable skill to have, but it sadly hinders your advancement. I am hoping the post match promo might be leading to a heelish Anti-American run that can get Juice a bit closer to the top. The goofy flamboyant fun guy isn't ever going to make it out of the midcard despite some kingsize performances and carry jobs.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There's nothing wrong for me as a viewer if Juice is super gatekeeper in the vein Goto/Ishii/Honma pre-crock/Ibushi pre-signing. Can see how he might not want that.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

Juice does have a bit of a Gaijin Goto vibe to him with when/how he loses.

I think if Juice wants a top card run, he might have to do it outside of NJPW and take a risk.  I worry he'll reach a glass ceiling in NJPW.  (and yeah, NJPW has glass ceilings like anywhere else to me, though they're usually justified with how great the main eventers are)

 

 

 

Edited by alstein
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 hours ago, alstein said:

Juice does have a bit of a Gaijin Goto vibe to him with when/how he loses.

I think if Juice wants a top card run, he might have to do it outside of NJPW and take a risk.  I worry he'll reach a glass ceiling in NJPW.  (and yeah, NJPW has glass ceilings like anywhere else to me, though they're usually justified with how great the main eventers are)

 

 

 

I mean it sounds like you could make a storyline out of this at some point. 

I mean Ibushi is 37 and now it feels like he's getting to the point where he might finally become IWGP heavyweight champion.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

Ibushi you kinda knew the reason we wasn't elevated- he was freelancer/unreliable.  Juice just seems to have that Goto vibe of always falling short.

 

Edited by alstein

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm not sure his GOTO-ness is clear yet. But I do sense a change. I guess the story will be told in G1. 

Because he's in Lifeblood in ROH I'm not sure it works, but he could potentially be the 4th in Villain Enterprises right?

I think some of his signature offence is a bit goofy and the move names don't help. I dunno, it's just hard to see the IWGP Heavyweight Title changing hands off a 'Pulp Friction'.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 6/6/2019 at 1:01 AM, mattdangerously said:

Juice barely stopping himself from telling everyone "fuck you" was great.

Yeah, I thought he was gonna bust out a heel turn but he stopped on a dime and backtracked. Good work.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just don’t see where else Juice would go. AJPW and NOAH don’t pay at all and I can’t imagine WWE would pay enough to overcome the dissatisfaction he’d feel working there. It’s too soon to speculate about AEW.

He says he’s very happy where he is, doing what he’s doing; and I can’t imagine New Japan or its fans feel different. Gaijin Goto is a pretty great career, if that’s what he gets. And maybe he catches a break or a wave where Goto never did. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well bad things happen all the time. Lets say Ospreay gets injured, wouldn't this make Juice, by default, top gaijin babyface? With Goto it is different, 20 people would have to get injured before he became top babyface.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...