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The Viceland Wrestling Documentaries


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7 hours ago, Brian Fowler said:

Good Lord that poor fucking kid. I already knew his life must've been hell, but fuck man. Nobody should have to grow up with that weight on them. I feel bad for a lot of people in this. Chavo we already talked about, Vickie, Nancy's sister, etc... But poor David Benoit. And doesn't David have a sister as well, also from Chris's first marriage

I have never in my life wanted to reach into my tv and hug someone.  I'll be damned if I didn't want to do that to poor David Benoit.  My heart broke for that kid when I was watching this.  

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4 hours ago, MORELOCK said:


The Owen episode will surely shed some light on this, since we finally get Martha's side of the story. Though it's not really hard to imagine what it is - I'm guessing she won't budge on the HoF issue because she doesn't feel like the company should make even more money off of her dead husband. It might be different if it was just a simple ceremony honoring Owen. Vince gonna Vince so it has to be a huge spectacle not fully focused on the actual legendary wrestlers, and he's got to sell an arena full of tickets to the most annoying wrestling fans he can find.
 


How is it a red flag? Maybe she just doesn't want to talk about her murderous father on national television. It's weird that she wasn't mentioned, but there might be a legal issue and there might not have been a real reason to be sidetracked into talking about why she wasn't there.

At the very least I appreciate that Martha Hart has come forward for this series. I was rather shocked when I heard about it. 

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8 hours ago, TheVileOne said:

I'm curious about what his daughter has to say about all of this, but they might be trying to shield her as best they can. She was much younger than David when this all happened, and she might not have wanted to come forward and speak about this at all. I couldn't blame her, whatever the case may be.

Also, not just Megan Benoit, but also his first wife. We never hear much about her either. 

Shit, these people may have changed their names for all we know. And I wouldn't blame them. 

Edited by Curt McGirt
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I kind of wish they'd have shed more light into Chris and Nancy's texts in the months leading up to it. On that Reelz autopsy show last week, there was a scene where they showed some of the transcripts. One of them was Nancy yelling at him about the fact he'd recently set aside a portion of money for his other kids in a separate bank account.

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5 hours ago, Boydy said:

Can someone upload Part 2 onto something other then Youtube so us Brits can watch it please.

I watched part 2 on YouTube this morning. Wasn't on Vice's official channel though. Just showed up in my recommended list (presumably because I watched part one also bootlegged, and everyone who did that then watched a part two rip).

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3 hours ago, TheVileOne said:

At the very least I appreciate that Martha Hart has come forward for this series. I was rather shocked when I heard about it. 

On Talk Is Jericho, the two producers said Martha replied to an e-mail they sent with a list of around 10 questions, on things like their intentions, who they are, etc. From what those two said, they spent a few weeks drafting responses to each question, and it resembled something like an essay when they were done and finally sent their reply back. She must have liked what she read, since she supplies them with a lot of home video footage of Owen with the family and whatnot. They said Oje Hart's interview in particular was really moving, since he remembers the night he got the news like it was yesterday.

I've never read her book before, so maybe this is in there, but they also tell a story about Martha and the kids (maybe a few other people?) flying to Kemper Arena after this happened, maybe a few weeks to a month or so after it all happened, and the staff walked her through everything Owen did that night. They went up to the catwalk, her and the kids, and saw the view that Owen did moments before he died. Crazy shit.

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2 hours ago, AxB said:

I watched part 2 on YouTube this morning. Wasn't on Vice's official channel though. Just showed up in my recommended list (presumably because I watched part one also bootlegged, and everyone who did that then watched a part two rip).

Its ok I managed to find it on a Kodi add on I use.

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14 hours ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

To be fair, usually when someone levies serious claims at someone in a doc or news story, you pretty much have to insert that in there if the accused doesn't appear. That's litigation territory.

Of course.  The message they put up for Kevin was 100% appropriate. 

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10 hours ago, MORELOCK said:


How is it a red flag? Maybe she just doesn't want to talk about her murderous father on national television. It's weird that she wasn't mentioned, but there might be a legal issue and there might not have been a real reason to be sidetracked into talking about why she wasn't there.

Because it makes me question their honesty.  They completely hid the existence of an entire other kid.  What else are they not telling us?  They HAD to have selectively edited it to remove any mention of her.  I 100% understand why she might not participate, etc, but to be basically erased from existence?  

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Well this fucked me up real good. If you're repressing some stuff, I suggest avoiding it. I don't think I was ever really emotionally invested in wrestling again after the Benoit murders.

In hindsight, Cody got off lightly for taking that unprotected chairshot months ago, and with Dean Malenko providing oversight making it even more egregious. 

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13 minutes ago, Tabe said:

What else are they not telling us?  

He couldn't have made that shot from the book depository. Oh wait...

Quote

Because it makes me question their honesty. 

Honesty about what exactly? I haven't listen to any podcast with the producers, but my only gripe is the jumping of timelines from here to there. That could be due to time constraints and availability of footage to show, or they could want to paint people a little differently in a certain light or all of the above. I think all that does though is indicate it should be three parts instead. However, I don't think anyone should be concerned about how many kids got TV time. The show is about what happened on the weekend of June 22-24, 2007, and everything else is pretty much secondary at best.

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For the "why didn't they mention Benoit's daughter?" thing as well- didn't David Benoit say somewhere that he was given a choice on who he wanted as talking heads for the show and he picked Vickie, Dean, and Chris as talking heads? 

Might make some more examples (as presumably he would have talked to his sister, found she wanted nothing to do with it, and gone from there.)

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My wife and I just watched this and it completely wrecked us. But I'm so incredibly happy that David and Sandra are hanging out and seem very happy now. Just wish them the best. And in a way I kind of feel a sense of closure that took 13 years for it to happen. Can't say I'll check out Benoit matches still but it's nice to at least see as happy of an ending as this situation can be. 

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They mentioned the daughter multiple times in the doc. I actually didn't realize there was a sister until I watched this thing. 

She probably did not want to participate and so she's not in it. This happens a lot in documentaries.

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I'll cop to never thinking much of the guy, but I thought JR came across as a real piece of shit, in part two especially. Continuing to parrot the party line for a company he doesn't even work for anymore. And I'll also cop to crying like a baby in the last five minutes-- really happy to see David and Sandra get together.

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That might've been him taking all the news coverage personal, considering he has based most of his life on wrestling. He definitely came off as loud and abrasive. 

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8 hours ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

However, I don't think anyone should be concerned about how many kids got TV time. 

Not about her air time.  Don't care if she was on TV or not.  Please don't misunderstand what I'm saying.

The 2 parts of this show included a LOT about Benoit as a husband, as a father, and so on.  We were told what an amazing dad he was - to his two sons.  We see lots and lots of pictures - of his two sons.  We're shown a picture collage from his wedding that's the greatest thing ever - with his two sons.  They made a big theme of the documentary his family life - but completely deleted one of his children. Why?  Maybe it bothers no one else but it  makes me question what they're leaving out to weave that narrative if they're completely leaving out one of his kids while emphasizing what a great father he was.

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Spent an hour coming up with the following...

I watched Dark Side of the Ring: Benoit Part One and Two over the past fortnight. It’s the most I’ve seen of Chris Benoit since that horrific June 2007. This is one of the best documentaries I’ve ever seen but it’s tough to get through, had to break it up. I felt so sorry for Nancy Benoit, Daniel Benoit, David Benoit and Sandra Toffoloni, Nancy’s sister. The things Chavo Guerrero Jr., Chris Jericho, Vicki Guerrero and Dean Malenko have gone through. You feel for those alive wondering how it came to this. I’m glad Nancy/Woman’s work was praised as it should be. There is an uplifting moment seeing David Benoit and Sandra Toffoloni back in touch through Chris Jericho and went to watch wrestling together.

Chris Benoit and Eddie Guerrero are two of the greatest wrestlers of all time. Eddie got clean, is loved by all and his matches/segments are shown to this day. Benoit’s a murderer, his name and footage of him is hardly seen. I strongly recommend this documentary but the subject matter is obviously distressing and seeing Benoit/Nancy/Daniel together is chilling.

Thanks for reading.

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19 minutes ago, The Natural said:

Spent an hour coming up with the following...

I watched Dark Side of the Ring: Benoit Part One and Two over the past fortnight. It’s the most I’ve seen of Chris Benoit since that horrific June 2007. This is one of the best documentaries I’ve ever seen but it’s tough to get through, had to break it up. I felt so sorry for Nancy Benoit, Daniel Benoit, David Benoit and Sandra Toffoloni, Nancy’s sister. The things Chavo Guerrero Jr., Chris Jericho, Vicki Guerrero and Dean Malenko have gone through. You feel for those alive wondering how it came to this. I’m glad Nancy/Woman’s work was praised as it should be. There is an uplifting moment seeing David Benoit and Sandra Toffoloni back in touch through Chris Jericho and went to watch wrestling together.

Chris Benoit and Eddie Guerrero are two of the greatest wrestlers of all time. Eddie got clean, is loved by all and his matches/segments are shown to this day. Benoit’s a murderer, his name and footage of him is hardly seen. I strongly recommend this documentary but the subject matter is obviously distressing and seeing Benoit/Nancy/Daniel together is chilling.

Thanks for reading.

I think this sums up just how heavy those episodes were: The next one will be on a guy who essentially committed attempted murder in the middle of a match on no fewer than three different occasions and did several other sick and heinous things in a match that probably should've gotten him jail time and it's going to feel like comic relief after watching that.

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52 minutes ago, The Natural said:

Spent an hour coming up with the following...

I watched Dark Side of the Ring: Benoit Part One and Two over the past fortnight. It’s the most I’ve seen of Chris Benoit since that horrific June 2007. This is one of the best documentaries I’ve ever seen but it’s tough to get through, had to break it up. I felt so sorry for Nancy Benoit, Daniel Benoit, David Benoit and Sandra Toffoloni, Nancy’s sister. The things Chavo Guerrero Jr., Chris Jericho, Vicki Guerrero and Dean Malenko have gone through. You feel for those alive wondering how it came to this. I’m glad Nancy/Woman’s work was praised as it should be. There is an uplifting moment seeing David Benoit and Sandra Toffoloni back in touch through Chris Jericho and went to watch wrestling together.

Chris Benoit and Eddie Guerrero are two of the greatest wrestlers of all time. Eddie got clean, is loved by all and his matches/segments are shown to this day. Benoit’s a murderer, his name and footage of him is hardly seen. I strongly recommend this documentary but the subject matter is obviously distressing and seeing Benoit/Nancy/Daniel together is chilling.

Thanks for reading.

This may sound crazy, but I truly think this two-parter is worthy of award recognition, and I hope they push it for some. And since Chavo is a producer, he should get some award recognition as well.

I don't think I've seen a better wrestling-themed documentary possibly ever.

Quote

 

Not about her air time.  Don't care if she was on TV or not.  Please don't misunderstand what I'm saying.

The 2 parts of this show included a LOT about Benoit as a husband, as a father, and so on.  We were told what an amazing dad he was - to his two sons.  We see lots and lots of pictures - of his two sons.  We're shown a picture collage from his wedding that's the greatest thing ever - with his two sons.  They made a big theme of the documentary his family life - but completely deleted one of his children. Why?  Maybe it bothers no one else but it  makes me question what they're leaving out to weave that narrative if they're completely leaving out one of his kids while emphasizing what a great father he was.

 

 

If I were to ever talk to the showrunners, it's definitely a question I would ask them, but no one knows the answer right now. If I were to wager a guess, I imagine it's because they either don't want to revisit it or they might want to remain anonymous. It's not a simple thing to get filmed and talk about how your father murdered his wife and your little brother.

 

Edited by TheVileOne
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Yeah, acting like the filmmakers made a conscious decision to exclude Benoit's daughter because of some sinister motivation seems ridiculous. She clearly didn't want to be a part of it. It was her decision. She clearly would have been allowed to speak had she wanted to. If you want to take a weird issue with how the filmmakers handled that decision, fine, but acting like there's some narrative out there not being heard is bullshit. Maybe they didn't go into why she didn't want to be there because they have decency and respect?

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3 hours ago, TheVileOne said:

This may sound crazy, but I truly think this two-parter is worthy of award recognition, and I hope they push it for some. And since Chavo is a producer, he should get some award recognition as well.

I don't think I've seen a better wrestling-themed documentary possibly ever.

That's not crazy at all as I would hope for the same thing.  As for best wrestling documentary I think fondly of many wrestling documentaries but this one may indeed be the best.

I was thinking last night about how WWE looked in all of this.  Having JR go in theory wasn't a bad move but it depends on how he presented things.  If he said he was with WWE then no wonder he got kicked out.  But if he just went and stated he was there because he cared then I kind of feel like it was wrong place, wrong time.  Either way he was in a tough spot and while he may have come across as cranky I think there's genuine frustration from him.

As far as the families not hearing from anybody in WWE I wonder if that was a Vince directive to not reach out while under contract.  And I wonder that because the people that have talked about him before were ones where they weren't in WWE at the time.  So if it was Vince telling them not to then it's unfortunate because I'm sure there's some that would have wanted to reach out.  I do kind of wish there was some bit of clarification either way but maybe it would have came across like somebody trying to defend WWE.

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