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APRIL 2019 WRESTLING DISCUSSION

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9 hours ago, joseph2112 said:

Double post. 

 

Dave slowly backing away and Lance looking like he wants to be anywhere but holding a mic for Terry Funk is the best.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, RolandTHTG said:

Rhyno beating Jarrett for the WWA title

giphy.gif

2 hours ago, Technico Support said:

at the 91 Bash when Luger beat Windham for the vacant title at that awful, awful show.

Please tell me more about being there for that. Even watching on tape that show was cringe inducing

Edited by CreativeControl

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21 minutes ago, CreativeControl said:

giphy.gif

Please tell me more about being there for that. Even watching on tape that show was cringe inducing

People chanting "we want Flair" before and throughout the show.  Booing like crazy for the "we called Ric and tried to make a deal but he wouldn't come" announcement.  The attempt to put heat on Flair did not work at all with the Baltimore crowd, who was always pro Flair.  Pretty much a "fuck this company" and "why are we at this awful show" vibe for the whole thing.  Windham was barely a midcarder at the time so nobody bought him in the main event fighting over the world title.  Everybody knew they were just putting the belt on Luger.  Race running in to direct Luger to piledrive Windham got zero reaction from the puzzled crowd.  Nobody gave a single fuck that Luger was apparently turning heel.  The the second half of the main event shitshow, a mixed tag, went two minutes because man/woman physicality was not allowed by the state athletic commission.

Overall, the feeling was that nothing they booked would have gotten any type of positive reaction because the company was such a massive heel that night that it cast a shadow over everything.  Still, they did nothing to even try.  You start the show with a "capture the flag" scaffold match and end with the shit sandwich I just described, you're lucky the people didn't burn the building down.  They should have rebooked the card and had at least a four-man tournament, maybe putting Sting over to send the crowd home a little happier.  But putting suddenly heel Luger over JTTS Barry Windham went over like a fart in church.

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The match was also covered in Death of WCW if people are inclined to check that out.  Still need to catch this to see if the crowd noise is intact or if the Network edited it.

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Another thing I just noticed, checking out prowrestlinghistory.com, is that the building was roughly half full (7000).  I wonder how many people of those empty seats were people staying home due to Flair not being there.  Then again, look at this card:

 

 

Spoiler

 

The Great American Bash 1991


July 14, 1991 in Baltimore, MD
Baltimore Arena drawing 7,000 ($99,000)
Shown live on PPV (1.0)
  1. Junkyard Dog pinned Black Bart (12:45).
     
  2. PN News & Bobby Eaton beat Steve Austin & Terrance Taylor (6:19) in a scaffold match when Eaton grabbed the opposing team's flag.
     
  3. The Yellow Dog beat Johnny B Badd (6:00) via DQ.
     
  4. Ron Simmons pinned Oz (7:55).
     
  5. Big Josh pinned Blackblood (5:39).
     
  6. Dustin Rhodes, Tracey Smothers, & Steve Armstrong beat The Freebirds (Badstreet, Garvin & Hayes) (17:10) in an "elimination" match. Rhodes was the only survivor.
    • Hayes pinned Armstrong (13:49).
    • Hayes was DQed (14:04).
    • Garvin pinned Smothers (15:16).
    • Rhodes pinned Garvin (15:24).
    • Rhodes pinned Badstreet (17:10).
  7. The Diamond Stud pinned Tom Zenk (9:00).
     
  8. El Gigante pinned One Man Gang (6:13).
     
  9. Ricky Morton pinned Robert Gibson (17:03).
     
  10. Nikita Koloff beat Sting (11:38) in a "Russian chain" match.
     
  11. Lex Luger pinned Barry Windham (12:25) in a "steel cage" match to win the vacant WCW World Title.
     
  12. Rick Steiner & Missy Hyatt beat Arn Anderson & Paul E Dangerously (2:08) in a "steel cage" match when Steiner pinned Dangerously.

 

  1.  

 

Even if the main hadn't been changed, and we got Flair vs Luger in the main and Windham and Scott Steiner added to the other match as a six man (the original plan), that's still a terrible card.  And Flair vs Luger had been done to death by then.

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Posted (edited)

Everything about that card looks thrown together, PN News & Bobby Eaton v Steve Austin & Terrance Taylor in a scaffold match. C'mon 🤷‍♂️

What was the aftermath? Did Dusty get fired? Jim Herd? Took em about six months to get the company back on track I know that, they damn near killed the territory

Edited by CreativeControl

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That was the first PPV I ever bought with my own money

Somehow I remained a wrestling fan

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Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, RIPPA said:

That was the first PPV I ever bought with my own money

Somehow I remained a wrestling fan

Dedication that and knowing it would have to go some to be as low as that PPV.

Edited by The Natural

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3 hours ago, nate said:

I want to like this.  I really do.  But I had an ex that often said, "Are you joking me?" so this brings up all sortsa PTSD.

Sorry that brings up bad memories, bud. Best wishes.

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In news that ties back into what I posted about Luke Harper - apparently Vince wanted to do the same to Dustin Rhodes back in January but Triple H convinced him otherwise and he was given a full release.

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I literally never heard of bottle episode until that tweet

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how about instead of sitting Luke Harper out -- maybe they try using him?  Lord knows the heel side of Raw is stale as heck. 

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7 minutes ago, Lawful Metal said:

how about instead of sitting Luke Harper out -- maybe they try using him?  Lord knows the heel side of Raw is stale as heck. 

Their thinking is - because they are doing the same thing to Gallows and Anderson - that if you have already expressed that you are going to leave, they will no longer invest time in you.

Mainly due to thinking by icing a guy it will kill their "value" once they leave. We see how well that went with PAC

BTW - here are the paragraphs from the new WON regarding the people wanting their releases

Quote

As was expected by many and reported in some places including Pro Wrestling Sheet a few weeks ago, Dustin Runnels’ (Dustin Rhodes/Goldust) is headed here and will face brother Cody on Double or Nothing on 5/25 in Las Vegas. Runnels asked for his notice from WWE on 1/19, and they gave it to him, but he was given a 90-day non-compete which ended on 4/19. From the WWE side, Vince McMahon was said to be against it but Paul Levesque talked him into allowing Runnels to leave. The reality is WWE hadn’t done anything with Runnels in years, and he’s 50, and coming off double knee surgery. It’s hard to figure the decisions on who they let go, since with Runnels, it was a lock if he was let out of his contract, he was coming here (and his contract was expiring fairly soon, but WWE could have frozen it and continued it for another eight months due to his time off after the most recent surgeries). So the scorecard is that Runnels, Tye Dillinger and KENTA were let go, although KENTA is likely returning to Japan. Not let go have included The Revival, Banks, Harper, Kanellis and any others that haven’t gone public with it. Basically the decision seems to be they’ve let go people who they think won’t help the opposition, but did let Cody’s brother and former tag partner go.

 

Quote

Right now the WWE side of things regarding Luke Harper is that he is not going to be released and they’ve added six months to his contract because they’ve said that his contract term that was to end in November, has been added to because it was frozen due to his time off for wrist surgery. So their viewpoint is that he can’t leave until just before next year’s WrestleMania. From an outside perspective, this seems to be a way to dissuade people from going public and saying they’re unhappy. The flip side was Dustin Runnels, who has been out for months with double knee surgery, but because he never said a word, denied he was leaving when rumors came out, was given a release and was able to immediately walk into a good position with AEW

 

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52 minutes ago, Casey said:

In news that ties back into what I posted about Luke Harper - apparently Vince wanted to do the same to Dustin Rhodes back in January but Triple H convinced him otherwise and he was given a full release.

 

14 minutes ago, RIPPA said:

Right now the WWE side of things regarding Luke Harper is that he is not going to be released and they’ve added six months to his contract because they’ve said that his contract term that was to end in November, has been added to because it was frozen due to his time off for wrist surgery. So their viewpoint is that he can’t leave until just before next year’s WrestleMania

Independent contractors, everybody!

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Posted (edited)

Woe befall you if you get injured and want to cut ties with WWE.

When Dustin Runnels release was accepted I thought it was because WWE hasn't used him notably, inevitable AEW arrival and respect for Dusty Rhodes.

Edited by The Natural

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1 hour ago, Technico Support said:
  1.  

 

Even if the main hadn't been changed, and we got Flair vs Luger in the main and Windham and Scott Steiner added to the other match as a six man (the original plan), that's still a terrible card.  And Flair vs Luger had been done to death by then.

And this show took place right after Bobby Heenan showed off the NWA World title on WWF Wrestling Challenge and cut the Ice Cream vs Horse Manure promo?

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55 minutes ago, RIPPA said:

I literally never heard of bottle episode until that tweet

I remember first hearing about that on the dvd commentary for the Justified episode “Blowback”(great episode BTW for something that was made for budgetary reasons).

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1 hour ago, CreativeControl said:

Everything about that card looks thrown together, PN News & Bobby Eaton v Steve Austin & Terrance Taylor in a scaffold match. C'mon 🤷‍♂️

What was the aftermath? Did Dusty get fired? Jim Herd? Took em about six months to get the company back on track I know that, they damn near killed the territory

Pretty much no aftermath.  Dusty wasn't working there, Flair and Sullivan were booking at the time, and that was the best Sullivan could do on two weeks when Herd fired Flair and forgot to get the belt back.  That was pretty much it for Herd though, as he was regarded as a dead man walking and ended up "resigning" at the end of 91.

 

For anyone yelling about how out of touch Vince is, he had NOTHING on Herd.

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54 minutes ago, RIPPA said:

Their thinking is - because they are doing the same thing to Gallows and Anderson - that if you have already expressed that you are going to leave, they will no longer invest time in you.

Or.... you could actually DO SOMETHING WITH THEM so they don't want to leave

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2 hours ago, Technico Support said:

People chanting "we want Flair" before and throughout the show.  Booing like crazy for the "we called Ric and tried to make a deal but he wouldn't come" announcement.  The attempt to put heat on Flair did not work at all with the Baltimore crowd, who was always pro Flair.  Pretty much a "fuck this company" and "why are we at this awful show" vibe for the whole thing.  Windham was barely a midcarder at the time so nobody bought him in the main event fighting over the world title.  Everybody knew they were just putting the belt on Luger.  Race running in to direct Luger to piledrive Windham got zero reaction from the puzzled crowd.  Nobody gave a single fuck that Luger was apparently turning heel.  The the second half of the main event shitshow, a mixed tag, went two minutes because man/woman physicality was not allowed by the state athletic commission.

Overall, the feeling was that nothing they booked would have gotten any type of positive reaction because the company was such a massive heel that night that it cast a shadow over everything.  Still, they did nothing to even try.  You start the show with a "capture the flag" scaffold match and end with the shit sandwich I just described, you're lucky the people didn't burn the building down.  They should have rebooked the card and had at least a four-man tournament, maybe putting Sting over to send the crowd home a little happier.  But putting suddenly heel Luger over JTTS Barry Windham went over like a fart in church.

I know everybody LOVES fantasy booking, so here goes.

Start of the night Jim Ross says "If Ric Flair is not here by the end of the night, he will forfeit the World Championship to Lex Luger." Lex comes to the ring and sounds heelish and starts burying Flair as a coward and how he would have tore him apart. This brings out Barry Windham who defends Flair as his friend and a better man than Luger. Lex cheap shots Barry and they fight around the ring. Its announced if Flair does not appear, Luger will defend his World Title against Barry Windham. 

This would hopefully put the heat on Lex, who was turning heel anyway and get Barry over.

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7 minutes ago, BrianS81177 said:

Or.... you could actually DO SOMETHING WITH THEM so they don't want to leave

I've said this before to someone else, but that just isn't logical. People keep assuming negotiations weren't had about their positions and what to do with them. If that happened and discussions fell through then there is literally no reason to use them unless necessary. They aren't going to magically change their minds.

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19 minutes ago, Raziel said:

Pretty much no aftermath.  Dusty wasn't working there, Flair and Sullivan were booking at the time, and that was the best Sullivan could do on two weeks when Herd fired Flair and forgot to get the belt back.  That was pretty much it for Herd though, as he was regarded as a dead man walking and ended up "resigning" at the end of 91.

 

For anyone yelling about how out of touch Vince is, he had NOTHING on Herd.

Dusty had been booking since February. But it wasn't his fault, even if he had been cutting Flair's balls off for months.

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10 minutes ago, Eivion said:

I've said this before to someone else, but that just isn't logical. People keep assuming negotiations weren't had about their positions and what to do with them. If that happened and discussions fell through then there is literally no reason to use them unless necessary. They aren't going to magically change their minds.

You could use them to do jobs. Wrestling needs guys to put other guys over.

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1 minute ago, AxB said:

You could use them to do jobs. Wrestling needs guys to put other guys over.

Who in WWE doesn’t job, though?

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