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JANUARY 2019 WRESTLING DISCUSSION


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Unless you're a top tag team, 5-8 minutes is all you can expect on either main show. And Vince didn't send them to Raw with a boring gimmick.

No one is denying the Raw tag division stinks, but that doesn't have anything to do with the Revival not having anything in the way of character that will pull in interest.

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54 minutes ago, MORELOCK said:

I can't think of a Jericho promo as strong as Miz's on Talking Smack.

The legendary Jericho promos aren't angry though, they're comedic. Miz would never have pulled off the 1004 holds one. Miz is good at promos where he expresses anger about people not respecting him because he really is angry about people not respecting him a lot of the time.

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Ehhhh... It’s pretty obvious looking back that the Revival were set up to be the top heel team on Raw when they were being called up before the injuries. The Bar getting the belts again as heels was the back-up plan. That wasn’t a very entertaining run, even if they had “characters”.

 Is there a lack of character with The Revival, sure. But it’s not like these “characters” that they push are “entertaining”. Like the B-Team might have been the worse underdog tag team to win in some time. They might as well have pushed The Revival at that point, or push Slater & Rhyno if they don’t give a shit about the integrity of the division. At least we know they are entertaining. 

 

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The only way the Revival was going to get over was by being given a chance to steal the show every night while also being stooging heels in the matches. Which means WWE would've had to have been willing to let wrestle 12 minutes on TV and 20 on ppv.

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54 minutes ago, LoneWolf&Subs said:

No the main fatal flaw is that Vince’s booking style is outdated. We need new(blue) blood, that can utilize everybody’s talents. NXT has shown the capability of the talent there. Hell even No Way Jose looked decent there.

Even then, though, NXT has proven that, if anything, they CAN'T show the capability of the talent the same way as the main roster.

Someone like a No Way Jose has to look a little more decent to show he is decent- but on the main roster...yeah, he was always going to be a "good opening match guy who can get the crowd moving, but you don't have to push the guy or anything", and anything more than that was a pipe dream.

If anything, NXT has hindered the main roster- because of NXT "showing the capability of the talent", you end up with people like Tyler Breeze, who were always going to be "good comedy midcarder" on the main roster...but because NXT booked him further than that, he's in the "anything less than 'Tyler Breeze wins the WWE Title in the main event of Wrestlemania, pyro and confetti going off, Cole, Graves, and Renee crying tears of joy that Tyler Breeze's boyhood dream has finally come true', is proof the only thing the big mean WWE hates more than making money is seeing a fan get to be happy for one moment in their life".

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I think Breeze could be more than he is, and I don't think there are that many people that want him as world champion. But cocky midcard heel champion he could absolutely do. Like 1993 Shawn Michaels without ever being 1996 HBK

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5 hours ago, Craig H said:

If that's true about the Revival, then they're not wrong. There was zero point to signing Gallows and Anderson. The tag titles are an afterthought on Raw while on SDL it's always the same shit. Their way of freshening things up was to make Miz and Shane a team. Like someone else said tag teams don't even get promos, not that I'd trust their scripted promos to be good anyway. 

Styles, Finn, Bloom all likely wanted them in and the latter two had been trying to talk WWE into bringing them in. Finn wanted Fale too. The only reason it didn't happen was because Fale wanted to stay in NJPW.

2 hours ago, Burgundy LaRue said:

The Usos got quite a bit of mic time during their bigger runs and still get to talk.

The Revival was destined to take a step back from their NXT heyday, even without the injuries. They're two average-looking guys who come out to a Southern Rock-inspired theme while bragging about how they're good at tag team wrestling.That wasn't going to be enough to get more fans on board. The New Day ride rainbows, throw breakfast food, and play in the band. The Usos are urban cool, wear the newest Jordans, and can out-rap half the folks on Spotify. The Bar are soccer pals who can whoop your ass in a bar fight. Even the B-Team were the banana peel-slipping goofballs who tripped into wins. Nearly every other team has something that gives them a firm identity. The Revival are great at the in-ring stuff, but don't have much in the way in character and being honest, they never have. Booking has been spotty for them, yes, but the road to stardom was always going to rough for them.

The problem with this is that its all kind of bs. The Revival's throwback characters are fine, especially when they get the chance to talk since they have shown more than often than not they can. Here is the thing, they don't get the chance to get real promo time in and haven't had much in the way of a real feud at all. Meanwhile every other team you mentioned had exactly that before they really got over. Hell the B-Team got all of that, and they never got anywhere near the reaction the Revival did wrestling Drew and Ziggler last year for the belts. The Revival injuries held them back initially, but the past year or so they have been healthy its just been shitty booking. And its not just them, its the entire division.

36 minutes ago, SorceressKnight said:

If anything, NXT has hindered the main roster- because of NXT "showing the capability of the talent", you end up with people like Tyler Breeze, who were always going to be "good comedy midcarder" on the main roster...but because NXT booked him further than that, he's in the "anything less than 'Tyler Breeze wins the WWE Title in the main event of Wrestlemania, pyro and confetti going off, Cole, Graves, and Renee crying tears of joy that Tyler Breeze's boyhood dream has finally come true', is proof the only thing the big mean WWE hates more than making money is seeing a fan get to be happy for one moment in their life".

Breeze is a bad example. No one is really clamoring for a big push for him, and most of us expected him to flop. Him turning out to be good comedy character was actually a pleasant surprise.

 

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13 minutes ago, SorceressKnight said:

If anything, NXT has hindered the main roster- because of NXT "showing the capability of the talent", you end up with people like Tyler Breeze, who were always going to be "good comedy midcarder" on the main roster...but because NXT booked him further than that, he's in the "anything less than 'Tyler Breeze wins the WWE Title in the main event of Wrestlemania, pyro and confetti going off, Cole, Graves, and Renee crying tears of joy that Tyler Breeze's boyhood dream has finally come true', is proof the only thing the big mean WWE hates more than making money is seeing a fan get to be happy for one moment in their life".

Had it really been a hindrance to the main roster? That awful fan energy got us the Becky Lynch tough guy gimmick that everyone loves! 

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3 minutes ago, West Newbury Bad Boy said:

Had it really been a hindrance to the main roster? That awful fan energy got us the Becky Lynch tough guy gimmick that everyone loves! 

That was lightning in a bottle. It did almost feel like they were about to fuck it up when fans were starting to cheer Charlotte again.

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1 hour ago, Brian Fowler said:

. Which means WWE would've had to have been willing to let wrestle 12 minutes on TV and 20 on ppv.

Well that's never going to happen. The shows is only 3 hours long, no way they can spare 12 minutes for a tag match. That would really eat into the amount of time they devote to replaying highlights the opening 20 minute promo.

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51 minutes ago, West Newbury Bad Boy said:

Had it really been a hindrance to the main roster? That awful fan energy got us the Becky Lynch tough guy gimmick that everyone loves! 

First off, I'll say it...the Becky Lynch tough guy gimmick everyone loves had nothing to do with NXT at all.

Remember- in NXT, Becky Lynch meant virtually nothing. She was a secondary low-level person and lackey to Sasha for a little bit, who suddenly lucked into being in that fourway just as being Sasha's sidekick. The Sasha/Becky match was very good- but until that one good match, it's not even a hot take to say "Alexa Bliss meant more than Becky Lynch in NXT before that match."

Becky had that ONE GOOD MATCH, and about a month later she got the callup. Most of her character work was done on the main roster, so people fell in love with her on the main roster. 

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7 minutes ago, AxB said:

Well that's never going to happen. The shows is only 3 hours long, no way they can spare 12 minutes for a tag match. That would really eat into the amount of time they devote to replaying highlights the opening 20 minute promo.

God I'm so sick of "moments ago" and "earlier tonight" replays. Motherfucker, I haven't switched back and forth with Nitro in 18 years.

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20 minutes ago, Burgundy LaRue said:

This is why talking around here is an exercise in futility. Someone gives a different opinion and it's considered bullshit.

Listen I normally agree with you, but you basically pretended the Revival had nothing as characters over so many other teams while ignoring those teams built up said characters over years with various feuds and promo time to show who they are, the exact stuff the Revival and other teams haven't been given.

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31 minutes ago, SorceressKnight said:

First off, I'll say it...the Becky Lynch tough guy gimmick everyone loves had nothing to do with NXT at all.

Remember- in NXT, Becky Lynch meant virtually nothing. She was a secondary low-level person and lackey to Sasha for a little bit, who suddenly lucked into being in that fourway just as being Sasha's sidekick. The Sasha/Becky match was very good- but until that one good match, it's not even a hot take to say "Alexa Bliss meant more than Becky Lynch in NXT before that match."

Becky had that ONE GOOD MATCH, and about a month later she got the callup. Most of her character work was done on the main roster, so people fell in love with her on the main roster. 

"Becky is one of those NXT people who got popular because fans felt she was underutilized relative to value she proved she had in NXT" is a much shorter walk than the "Bo Dallas-level guys main eventing every indy fed will clog the pipeline and be detrimental to the WWE" bit you were selling earlier in the thread. 

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1 hour ago, AxB said:

The legendary Jericho promos aren't angry though, they're comedic. Miz would never have pulled off the 1004 holds one. Miz is good at promos where he expresses anger about people not respecting him because he really is angry about people not respecting him a lot of the time.

But it's not as if Jericho has never had an opportunity to cut a serious heel promo - he's had years of those opportunities and never cut one as good as the Talking Smack one (and arguably the other one you're referencing, where he talks about JBL). It isn't a case of "anything Miz can do Jericho does better."

 

1 hour ago, Eivion said:

Breeze is a bad example. No one is really clamoring for a big push for him, and most of us expected him to flop. Him turning out to be good comedy character was actually a pleasant surprise.

I guess you weren't around for the Raw threads full of fury that Breeze debuted in a feud against Ziggler. That's a spot he'd be lucky to have now. 

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2 minutes ago, MORELOCK said:

I guess you weren't around for the Raw threads full of fury that Breeze debuted in a feud against Ziggler. That's a spot he'd be lucky to have now. 

I'm pretty sure that had more to do with the board's hatred of Ziggler.

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14 minutes ago, MORELOCK said:

 

I guess you weren't around for the Raw threads full of fury that Breeze debuted in a feud against Ziggler. That's a spot he'd be lucky to have now. 

Actually Summer Rea was feuding with Ziggler. Breeze was brought in as her new boyfriend, and had to wear humongous lifts to be at her height. He was going nowhere with that bust of a hand.

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