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NXT to WWE main roster: The hits and misses.

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I think Roode's gimmick could work just fine in the IC/US title scene... IF HE WAS A FUCKING HEEL.

A year and a half in, and the guy who is a terrible babyface and the best heel of his generation still hasn't turned heel.

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I'm legit curious where Almas ends up on this scale. I think the biggest problem he has is that he's (rightly) not taking the belt off of AJ and the US Title is held by a heel. But he's in the upper card so there's not much to do with him currently. I wish they'd find a way to hotshot the US title on Almas though as I'm down for Rollins/Almas, especially if they give them 30 minutes or so since Survivor Series is likely to be 300 hours long

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Allegedly Vince is very high on Almas.

I expect them to split him and Vega for no reason and thus kill his act dead.

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19 hours ago, Brian Fowler said:

I think Roode's gimmick could work just fine in the IC/US title scene... IF HE WAS A FUCKING HEEL.

A year and a half in, and the guy who is a terrible babyface and the best heel of his generation still hasn't turned heel.

I don’t usually pay attention to who wrote whatever post I’m reading, but I got to the part where where you called Roode the best heel of his generation and thought “Wait what? Oh, Fowler must have written this. *scrolls up* Yep.”

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Who heelier than Roode?

Not that I'm saying he necessarily is the best heel of his generation, but his run as heel ace in TNA was a fantastic run. And he's part of that generation where a lot of guys, when they start getting over as heels immediately decide they want to be cool heels who get pops and have catchphrases and merch, which kind of... if you can't be a true heel, you can't really be a great heel, let alone the best.

I mean, in terms of generating heel heat, Roman Reigns is the most over heel, only he's supposed to be the top babyface ace.

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1 hour ago, AxB said:

Who heelier than Roode?

Not that I'm saying he necessarily is the best heel of his generation, but his run as heel ace in TNA was a fantastic run. And he's part of that generation where a lot of guys, when they start getting over as heels immediately decide they want to be cool heels who get pops and have catchphrases and merch, which kind of... if you can't be a true heel, you can't really be a great heel, let alone the best.

I mean, in terms of generating heel heat, Roman Reigns is the most over heel, only he's supposed to be the top babyface ace.

You want to place the blame on someone for wanting to be cool heels?

Kevin Nash, Scott Hall, Sean Waltman, Shawn Michaels, HHH

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I'd say the failure rate for NXT has been around 85 to 90%. But it's all on the main company than NXT preparing guys and gals for it. I kinda wish they kept NXT named as ECW or hell maybe even rebranded it as WCW. On it's own, free of main WWE interference NXT runs so damn smoothly. It's amazing this all the same company.

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On 10/31/2018 at 7:42 PM, ComingToAmerica said:

I don't think Bayley has been a particular failure, she just isn't one of the WWE's chosen ones. And to be honest, I think that's not entirely incommensurate with her performance level. She's not a rip-roaring success but I wouldn't call her a failure tbh.

Sasha Banks is a massive hit because 'Boss Time' is a legitimate 'I don't need to be champion to be over' phenomenon. Being the master of the secondary feud is actually a great spot. Lest we forget, it's essentially the Eddie Guerrero spot. There's nothing wrong with feuding with the Riott Squad 'ad nauseam' as long as the matches are good and people care. They are and they do.

Asuka had a huge push which lead to a Royal Rumble win and a Wrestlemania Title Match. Now the problem with secondary title matches at Wrestlemania is that you probably won't get as much time as you want, especially given Brand Split II, & that lead to a slightly weak finish - but whatever.  Good chance she will turn heel and feud with she-who-will-not-be-turned, assuming Charlotte wins the Rumble and goes to Raw to face Rousey. They were teasing heel Asuka in NXT and I think that will be more fun anyway.

Liv Tyler and Ruby Riott have worked out pretty well - the former way better than expected. Sarah Logan wasn't on NXT as a regular so she doesn't count but the Riott Squad have overachieved fair to say.

Sami Zayn......it's complicated but it just feels he never ever really got out of Kevin Owen's orbit so he's a miss. I hope they actually keep the two apart when Zayn returns.

PAC's push was a bit stop-start, but he had his moments until the ankle injury. Then 205 Live happened, but that was a great heel run while it lasted. Fuck you Enzo. I wouldn't quite call Neville a miss though per se.

Joe has been an utility player on the roster, but he's always stepped up when needed. They've clearly never had a vision for him beyond that, because they did throw away a pretty clear opportunity for a babyface run when he got over against Lesnar. But he's still been a hit really.

Roode is a miss, but his gimmick was never going to work as a midcarder. 

Jason Jordan was well on his way to being one of the biggest heels on RAW when he got injured. It's sounding more and more like he's done but I'd still call him a Hit tbh. Gable....hasn't fared that well and might benefit from going back to NXT if he could get a singles push.

Itami has to be the biggest miss really. I don't know of he regrets going to WWE but you do have to wonder.

The Revival are a miss so far, but I still think they could go to Smackdown and yet get a run. 

Ultimately people have overinflated expectations in terms of the pushes they expect NXT guys to receive.
 

 

IDK, man. I like Bayley more than most here I guess, but go back and watch her debut at Battleground 2016. She got the biggest reaction of the night. Fans in England hijacked the show to sing to her. She could've been a STAR. 

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On 10/30/2018 at 11:26 AM, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Weren't Braun's only appearances in nxt as part of Adam Rose's Rosebuds?

I know Rusev wasn't in nxt for very long, but I'd still count him as a success for the most part, but it has been a mixed bag for him. He started out great, but the WM loss to Cena hurt him a lot. Splitting Lana and Rusev and adding Dolph to the mix was beyond stupid. Rusev Day was super over and it had helped rehabilitate both Rusev and Aiden, so instead of the doing the logical thing and give them the tag titles after Erick Rowan's injury, they get split up. Just another time where you shrug your shoulders and say...because WWE.

They got a year out of him and a second smaller run. By modern WWE standards, he was a mega success. To me the real misstep was the rematches. Especially when WWE wimped out on doing the Umaga finish in the bullrope match. Then Lana sabotaged the follow up. 
 

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2 hours ago, just drew said:

IDK, man. I like Bayley more than most here I guess, but go back and watch her debut at Battleground 2016. She got the biggest reaction of the night. Fans in England hijacked the show to sing to her. She could've been a STAR. 

By that logic, Fandango should have been a multiple WWE Champion

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10 hours ago, Brysynner said:

By that logic, Fandango should have been a multiple WWE Champion

Right, because ignoring your fan base seems to lead to such compelling television. People wanted to love and get behind Bayley when she came up. They still would if given reason to. She's a good worker who seems to be able to work with a variety of women, AND she could be marketed to children in a unique way that a lot of stars simply can't be. 

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5 minutes ago, just drew said:

Right, because ignoring your fan base seems to lead to such compelling television. People wanted to love and get behind Bayley when she came up. They still would if given reason to. She's a good worker who seems to be able to work with a variety of women, AND she could be marketed to children in a unique way that a lot of stars simply can't be. 

Bingo.

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Debuts aren't everything but Bayley isn't a miss if for the sole reason that she's still getting heavily featured on TV at least once a week and the crowd is still there for her despite the fact that she's done fuck all for a while now. I think she's one of the chief losers in the Ronday Rousey hiring. Before that, you could easily heat Bayley up for a run but now she's below Nia, Sasha, and maybe even Ruby Riott and Ember Moon on the pecking order, if for now other reason than her gimmick doesn't gel well against a face MMA killer. But put Bayley against a heel Ronda and you'd be printing dollars, guaranteed.

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4 hours ago, Godfrey said:

Debuts aren't everything but Bayley isn't a miss if for the sole reason that she's still getting heavily featured on TV at least once a week and the crowd is still there for her despite the fact that she's done fuck all for a while now. I think she's one of the chief losers in the Ronday Rousey hiring. Before that, you could easily heat Bayley up for a run but now she's below Nia, Sasha, and maybe even Ruby Riott and Ember Moon on the pecking order, if for now other reason than her gimmick doesn't gel well against a face MMA killer. But put Bayley against a heel Ronda and you'd be printing dollars, guaranteed.

This is why the Becky match happening disappoints me. I was really hoping the opening salvo of the Horsewomen feud would be Ronda murdering Bayley.

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Bayley should have a deal with Nickelodeon and/or Disney by now.  Her ability to get over with young viewers makes her Cena-like in terms of face value.

Why they are not milking this is one of the reasons why the product is so stale.  They are throwing millions of dollars away and by the time they realize it Bayley will have lost that look.

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1 hour ago, evilwaldo said:

Bayley should have a deal with Nickelodeon and/or Disney by now.  Her ability to get over with young viewers makes her Cena-like in terms of face value.

Why they are not milking this is one of the reasons why the product is so stale.  They are throwing millions of dollars away and by the time they realize it Bayley will have lost that look.

Hell, market a block of Wwe children’s tv on the network. Make her the center. Old “rock n wrestling” episode, maybe her own show where she interacts w puppets and old wrestlers. Teach kids positive lessons. Would be huge. 

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1 hour ago, evilwaldo said:

Bayley should have a deal with Nickelodeon and/or Disney by now.  Her ability to get over with young viewers makes her Cena-like in terms of face value.

Why they are not milking this is one of the reasons why the product is so stale.  They are throwing millions of dollars away and by the time they realize it Bayley will have lost that look.

I've seen this comment before, but was Bayley really that popular with children outside of Izzy? I thought I recall people here mentioning Sasha was actually more popular with young girls. Aren't most of Bayley's fans actually men, 18 or older?

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20 minutes ago, Eivion said:

I've seen this comment before, but was Bayley really that popular with children outside of Izzy? I thought I recall people here mentioning Sasha was actually more popular with young girls. Aren't most of Bayley's fans actually men, 18 or older?

Bayley was very popular with children. At least at the NXT shows. There are still little girls that dress like her to this day at the live events.

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I feel like the people who talk up Bayley having her own Nick show and such have like... not watched her cut a promo at any point over the past couple of years?  She's been at best passable on the mic, maybe she was better in NXT but on the main roster this is one of her main weaknesses, not strengths.  Cena she is not.

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The thing with Bayley was her character arc in NXT was really well done. Lifelong fan who is living out her dream to be a WWE Superstar and how she grows from super excited fan into an actual champion. The fans could come along with that. Which lead to her being relateable to the NXT fans and a cult hero to young girls in NXT

The problem for her was that once she was called up they couldn't redo the entire story. So the WWE Universe got Bayley in the end of her story arc at the same time WWE had Sasha and Becky as their top female babyfaces. The other problem for Bayley is a similar problem Sasha has had on the main roster. She doesn't get to spend weeks practicing a match with someone on TV and now she has to be on TV weekly. It's easier to hide Sasha and Bayley's deficiencies when they only appear on TV once a month or so. 

Probably the best thing for Bayley would be to get her on Smackdown. Bayley excels when across the ring from a Horsewoman or Asuka. Plus the shorter format of Smackdown would allow them to build her up without having her cut promos or wrestle every week. 

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23 hours ago, Eivion said:

I've seen this comment before, but was Bayley really that popular with children outside of Izzy? I thought I recall people here mentioning Sasha was actually more popular with young girls. Aren't most of Bayley's fans actually men, 18 or older?

I think they are both very popular with young girls but both could have been huge.  Bayley had a Cena like aura surrounding her..  Sasha could have been a big crossover star.  Bayley's debut was huge,   Sasha was receiving those "We want Sasha!" chants every week.   

WWE blew it with them.  But they blow it with a lot of people. 

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18 hours ago, Brysynner said:

The other problem for Bayley is a similar problem Sasha has had on the main roster. She doesn't get to spend weeks practicing a match with someone on TV and now she has to be on TV weekly. It's easier to hide Sasha and Bayley's deficiencies when they only appear on TV once a month or so. 

Nah,  they are both pretty clearly among the best female workers on the roster.  Bayley has some great matches on the main roster especially when she was in title contention. Sasha has a ton of great matches on the main roster also like the Falls Count Anywhere match that everyone was praising.  

Only Asuka and probably Ember Moon are clearly better. 

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1 hour ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

I think they are both very popular with young girls but both could have been huge.  Bayley had a Cena like aura surrounding her..  Sasha could have been a big crossover star.  Bayley's debut was huge,   Sasha was receiving those "We want Sasha!" chants every week.   

WWE blew it with them.  But they blow it with a lot of people. 

The thing that sucks is that they clearly knew it. Sasha was protected for so long only for them to panic because of potential injuries. With Bayley they brought her up a bit early but gave her the early victory over Charlotte only to put her on the backburner with nothing to do once they knew Sasha was healthy. Then when they finally did strike they cut her off for Alexa for no sensible reason.

1 hour ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

Nah,  they are both pretty clearly among the best female workers on the roster.  Bayley has some great matches on the main roster especially when she was in title contention. Sasha has a ton of great matches on the main roster also like the Falls Count Anywhere match that everyone was praising.  

Only Asuka and probably Ember Moon are clearly better. 

I don't think Ember Moon is remotely better. After the recent feud I would say Charlotte and Becky are right up there with both. Only Asuka is really comparable or better than any of the Horsewomen at the moment.

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8 minutes ago, Eivion said:

I don't think Ember Moon is remotely better. After the recent feud I would say Charlotte and Becky are right up there with both. Only Asuka is really comparable or better than any of the Horsewomen at the moment.

I can see where you are coming from but to me I think Ember Moon is probably the only one on the roster who can keep up with Asuka if they are going full speed.  Asuka can have great matches with the others but it's a different style and a slower,  more methodical pace. 

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7 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

I can see where you are coming from but to me I think Ember Moon is probably the only one on the roster who can keep up with Asuka if they are going full speed.  Asuka can have great matches with the others but it's a different style and a slower,  more methodical pace. 

I can that argument. I think Sasha can go at that pace or at least could at one point. No idea if she could now. Charlotte did manage it against Asuka as well though that honestly surprised me. Charlotte and Becky worked a similar pace for a few of their matches during their recent feud though they did eventually have to slow down. To be fair that is a weird joshi pace that not many outside of Japan can go at. I remember watching Shimmer years ago when the Japanese talent started to come in. It was almost sad how second and third rate they made so much of the regular talent look, and that was after many of them had improved over the years.

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