John from Cincinnati Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 (edited) Yes, we all know it takes a genius or a titan of storytelling to get people to see a movie with Joker in it. Thank goodness for Todd's grand vision. Without it, this wildly popular comic book character's movie wouldn't have stood a chance against Gemini Man. Edited October 18, 2019 by West Newbury Bad Boy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 Just now, West Newbury Bad Boy said: Yes, we all know it takes a genius or a titan of storytelling to get people to see a movie with Joker in it. Thank goodness for Todd's grand vision. Without it, this wildly popular comic book character's movie wouldn't have stood a chance against Gemini Man. Industry people predicted far less. Far less. Even after opening weekend it was thought that $700M would be tops. And yes it can be fucked up. Anything can be fucked up. It's going to end up being the highest grossing R rated film of all time. You are wrong again. Take your L. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curt McGirt Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 Because it sadly needs to be said, box office does not equal quality 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Cincinnati Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said: Industry people predicted far less. Far less. Even after opening weekend it was thought that $700M would be tops. And yes it can be fucked up. Anything can be fucked up. It's going to end up being the highest grossing R rated film of all time. You are wrong again. Take your L. Industry people dragging on a hard R film doesn't mean Todd did anything right. Industry people sleeping on comic book fans' willingness to throw cash at anything featuring this character doesn't mean Todd did anything right. I'll take my L when you can follow a train of conversation to its conclusion instead of jumping off the moving train, landing in a ditch, and declaring yourself the winner. Stop doing your touchdown dance in a parking lot two blocks away from the stadium. 7 minutes ago, Curt McGirt said: Because it sadly needs to be said, box office does not equal quality It does need to be said. Edited October 18, 2019 by West Newbury Bad Boy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 1 minute ago, Curt McGirt said: Because it sadly needs to be said, box office does not equal quality It doesn't need to be said but since you said it... I can find many quotes on here of people quoting me citing box office results as an indicator of quality. Also, what you said was "what was WB thinking?" What do you mean the only thing that can be looked at is box office.. the only thing WB cares about is if their movies make money, just like every studio. Film is subjective. What is it something like 89% on RT audience score right now? They changed the way they do it, you actually have to be verified to vote now. That's a pretty good number. The fact that it has had very strong holds not only in the U.S. but overseas is another indicator of strong word of mouth. Even critics as divided as it later became, it's had countless rave reviews to go along with some who didn't like it. It's fine if someone doesn't like it but to suggest that most don't like it is inaccurate and to suggest it's a failure is ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Cincinnati Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 Nobody's saying most people didn't like it. Nobody's saying it's a failure. Both of those things are demonstrably false. You're arguing with a strawman. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 4 minutes ago, West Newbury Bad Boy said: Industry people dragging on a hard R film doesn't mean Todd did anything right. Industry people sleeping on comic book fans' willingness to throw cash at anything featuring this character doesn't mean Todd did anything right. You know what the profit margin on a $64M budget is going to be? Do you understand what indicators of strong word of mouth are? If people thought the movie sucked it would have dropped over 50% actually close to 60% in its 2nd weekend here and overseas. This is also doing this without China. So that takes about another $100-$200M out of the equation. It's breaking records, it's not just simply "oh well it's Joker" .. What indicator do you have that people don't like it other than you sharing your opinion with a couple people on here? Show me.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AxB Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 You're going down the Thibs route bringing up box office as an indicator of quality. 2 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said: Film is subjective. Yes. Quote to suggest it's a failure is ridiculous. It's not a financial failure. If someone were to claim, in their subjective opinion, that it was an artistic failure, you can't say "I liked it and it made a lot of money, so you aren't allowed to dislike it, you're wrong". Which fair enough might not be what you think you're saying. But it's what it sounds like you're saying. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Cincinnati Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 1 minute ago, Niners Fan in CT said: You know what the profit margin on a $64M budget is going to be? Do you understand what indicators of strong word of mouth are? If people thought the movie sucked it would have dropped over 50% actually close to 60% in its 2nd weekend here and overseas. This is also doing this without China. So that takes about another $100-$200M out of the equation. It's breaking records, it's not just simply "oh well it's Joker" .. What indicator do you have that people don't like it other than you sharing your opinion with a couple people on here? Show me.. 3 minutes ago, West Newbury Bad Boy said: Nobody's saying most people didn't like it. Nobody's saying it's a failure. Both of those things are demonstrably false. You're arguing with a strawman. Read, dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Man Known as Dan Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 God this thread has made me never want to talk movies with some of you. I saw Joker, I liked it, whatever, continue your shit. 3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 Just now, AxB said: It's not a financial failure. If someone were to claim, in their subjective opinion, that it was an artistic failure, you can't say "I liked it and it made a lot of money, so you aren't allowed to dislike it, you're wrong". Which fair enough might not be what you think you're saying. But it's what it sounds like you're saying. No, that's not what I'm saying. I said it's fine if people don't like it because yes film is subjective. Sure. But to ask why Warner Bros. thought it'd be a good idea to produce this film with Todd Phillips behind the camera suggests that they shouldn't have done so.. and my question is outside of box office what else do you think Warner Bros. is going to look at? This film has already won awards and it's probably going to win more. Other than box office success and adulation from your peers... what else is there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted October 18, 2019 Author Share Posted October 18, 2019 (edited) 8 hours ago, West Newbury Bad Boy said: Paul Dano is Riddler. Like the casting and the Riddler back on the big screen at last. My three favourite Riddlers are Frank Gorshin from the 1960s Batman television show, John Glover in Batman: The Animated Series and Wally Wingert from the Batman: Arkham Trilogy by Rocksteady. Edited October 18, 2019 by The Natural Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted October 18, 2019 Author Share Posted October 18, 2019 Just now, The Natural said: Like the casting and the Riddler back on the big screen at last. Jessie Eisenberg says hi ;). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Cincinnati Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 Just now, The Natural said: My three favourite Riddlers are Frank Gorshin from the 1960s Batman television show, John Glover in Batman: The Animated Series and Wally Wingert Batman: Arkham Trilogy by Rocksteady. Screw that guy. Once I get to his annoying ass, the game doesn't let me beat the life out of him. Just the worst. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 (edited) 10 minutes ago, West Newbury Bad Boy said: Read, dude. You're saying Todd Phillips missed the mark and downplaying his achievement, alright. I already said it's understandable if you personally did not like it but no offense it doesn't make your opinion reside on a higher plane than anyone else. Like I said.. other than box office and adulation from other people in the field what else is there to look at? If you didn't state your opinions as fact we wouldn't be having this conversation. Edit: I don't state my opinions as fact. If I say something sucks I will say I thought this sucked. I will not go over the top saying ridiculous things. Edited October 18, 2019 by Niners Fan in CT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted October 18, 2019 Author Share Posted October 18, 2019 (edited) 10 minutes ago, West Newbury Bad Boy said: Screw that guy. Once I get to his annoying ass, the game doesn't let me beat the life out of him. Just the worst. You deserved to administer a beating if you collected all the Riddler trophies/solved riddles as I did in Batman: Arkham Asylum and Batman: Arkham City, that's one of my top gaming accomplishments. Batman: Arkham Asylum had the right amount of them. I also think it's the best of the two games. Edited October 18, 2019 by The Natural Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bustronaut Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 An actual indicator of "word of mouth" would be the Cinemascore, where JOKER got a B+, the same as GEMINI MAN, JUSTICE LEAGUE and X-MEN ORIGINS: WOLVERINE. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Cincinnati Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said: You're saying Todd Phillips missed the mark and downplaying his achievement, alright. I already said it's understandable if you personally did not like it but no offense it doesn't make your opinion reside on a higher plane than anyone else. Like I said.. other than box office and adulation from other people in the field what else is there to look at? If you didn't state your opinions as fact we wouldn't be having this conversation. Edit: I don't state my opinions as fact. If I say something sucks I will say I thought this sucked. I will not go over the top saying ridiculous things. So you're just not going to read my posts. Got it. Not sure why you keep quoting them then, but you do you. Edited October 18, 2019 by West Newbury Bad Boy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Bustronaut said: An actual indicator of "word of mouth" would be the Cinemascore, where JOKER got a B+, the same as GEMINI MAN, JUSTICE LEAGUE and X-MEN ORIGINS: WOLVERINE. That's a small sample done on the first Friday a movie opens and that's not how CS works anyway. How you view the score is dependent on what genre the movie is. Most horror movies for example even if they are good struggle to get an A or an A+. Us, as a example got rave reviews sure but it's CS was a B. Get Out is a classic but it's CS is still an A- Family movies will receive higher grades. So a movie like Joker with a hard R, not a family movie, receiving a B+ is good. and that's not the only indicator of word of mouth at all. There are people who do this kind of thing for a living. Edited October 18, 2019 by Niners Fan in CT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted October 18, 2019 Author Share Posted October 18, 2019 (edited) https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2019/10/17/joker-600m-box-office-dc-films-logan-deadpool-passion-of-the-christ-it-conjuring-warner-bros-r-rated-matrix-wolf-warrior-2-joaquin-phoenix-todd-phillips-oscars/#602b01152ac5 $600 million. Edited October 18, 2019 by The Natural 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 Sorry to clutter up your thread @The Natural Keep it coming with all the news, friend. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
odessasteps Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 I'm tempted to post Batman 66 gifs just to lighten the tone. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Cincinnati Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 1 hour ago, odessasteps said: I'm tempted to post Batman 66 gifs just to lighten the tone. You're welcome to try. But some days, you just can't get rid of a bomb. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curt McGirt Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 4 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Fowler Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 I will definitely say Lawrence Sher deserves an Oscar nomination. Phoenix certainly belongs in the mix. On the other hand, Joker does not belong in the best picture conversation. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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