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The Natural

AUGUST 2018 WRESTLING DISCUSSION.

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Ambrose and Rollins were so much better as a tag team than as singles guys it was crazy. 

I don't mind the rebound lariat nearly as much as the "run to the corner, go to the second rope, pause, come down, pause, run at his opponent spot." Like, if you did it fluidly and it looked like you were building momentum it might not be completely awful. But the way he does it, it's one of my least favorite signature spots ever.

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5 hours ago, Kuetsar said:

Get the pitchforks and torches ready, but I don't "get" the WM III match. I've watched it several different times over the years, but its never blown me away. I got into wrestling in 1989/90, so its not a generational thing, and I like the flair series and love the rude series. I don't watch that much wrestling anymore(despite having a shit ton of dvd's- my early teen self would be astonished), so I'm not sure what it is, perhaps Macho man doesn't hold up for me(I hope not)?

Well, personally my biggest problem with the WM III match is less that it's a good match, and more that when you take the WM III match into context, it's got a pretty glaring flaw in it:

The Ricky Steamboat/Randy Savage feud kicked into high gear in 1986 because Savage attacked Steamboat's throat with a ring bell.

This attack nearly ended Steamboat's career and forced Steamboat to give up everything to try and learn to speak again. 

This led to the WM III match, where they had a very athletic, acrobatic match the likes of which had never been seen by WWF fans to date.

One thing the match did not have...was Randy Savage working the neck. (Considering that the whole storyline was built around "Savage gave a big glaring weakness to Steamboat in his heck", that's DAMNING.)

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Yeah, but the promos leading up to the match were all about Savage wanting to show how great that he was  - actually, how much greater that he was than Steamboat - which explains his flashy and acrobatic style; he wanted to humiliate Steamboat, not to hurt him.

Plus, George Steele was out there and wasn't going to let Savage commence with any fuckery toward Steamboat's neck. 

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4 hours ago, FluffSnackwell said:
  Reveal hidden contents

 

Yes, but for him to go from main eventer to Roman's lackey (and yes, that's exactly what he'd be perceived as) would be a bad step back in his career. 

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I'm glad this topic came up because it correlates to a question I thought of the other day:

I love tag team wrestling. I think I prefer it to regular one on one matches, possibly in part due to growing up watching tag team wrestling in it's heyday of the late 80's-early 90's.

Do you personally prefer set tag teams (tag team specialists) or do you prefer to have two singles stars be paired up?

Adversely, do you like it more when a tag team gets split up and turned into singles or when singles get turned into tag team specialists?

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How man of you got into wrestling as kids and how many of you got into wrestling in your teens. And by kids, I mean mainly pre-10. For another example, I recall getting heavily into wrestling when I was 5. I have no idea how or why, but it almost makes me think it was wired in my DNA.

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25 minutes ago, The Green Meanie said:

I'm glad this topic came up because it correlates to a question I thought of the other day:

I love tag team wrestling. I think I prefer it to regular one on one matches, possibly in part due to growing up watching tag team wrestling in it's heyday of the late 80's-early 90's.

Do you personally prefer set tag teams (tag team specialists) or do you prefer to have two singles stars be paired up?

Adversely, do you like it more when a tag team gets split up and turned into singles or when singles get turned into tag team specialists?

I prefer set tag teams to two singles stars being paired up, on paper...but I'm easy with what I consider a tag team.

Using the example now- the Boss and Hug Connection is a good example. They're two singles stars being paired up- but they have a team name, they dress alike, they have some tag team moves, and now they have merchandise. It's clear, in storyline, that Sasha Banks and Bayley are trying to be a tag team together, so I can go with it.  

Compare that to, (for a recent example) Jason Jordan and Seth Rollins having nothing to do, so they teamed up for a bit, and it's a world of difference. (And likewise, I am a firm believer: If two singles wrestlers- especially two who are feuding- run afoul of a "set tag team", the set tag team should CRUSH them because they're such good tag team specialists.)

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8 minutes ago, Craig H said:

How man of you got into wrestling as kids and how many of you got into wrestling in your teens. And by kids, I mean mainly pre-10. For another example, I recall getting heavily into wrestling when I was 5. I have no idea how or why, but it almost makes me think it was wired in my DNA.

My dad was a huge wrestling fan - when he was little, up until probably about 1996/1997. I know I watched it with him when I was little - apparently I was an Ultimate Warrior fan even though I don't remember any of this. My first memories of wrestling is honestly Attitude Era stuff, so, that would have been when I was around 10 or 11, I guess. Right when I started to really get into wrestling, and not just watching it because my dad was, is around the same time my dad stopped watching it because it got too risque for his tastes.

I think this is when his love for NASCAR really started to take off, around 1998, then it kinda fell off a cliff for a little bit after Dale Earnhardt died. Which happened while we were in line to get into WCW SuperBrawl Revenge 2001. I've never seen so many grown men crying in my life. My mom wanted to go to this show, too, because her favorite wrestler was Kevin Nash and he was in the main event. But she had just been diagnosed with multiple sclerosis, so she couldn't make it. She ended up being the one to call my dad (flip phones!) and tell him about Earnhardt. Really soured the mood for the rest of the evening.

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I got into wrestling really early, at four or five. I remember watching WWF Superstars, WCW Saturday Night, *and* AWA on ESPN (we were lucky enough to have cable at our place). I was a massive stan of Randy Savage and The Rockers at first, and later on, of Bret Hart and DOOM.

I had some AWA figurines that I wish I still possessed: I ran the same Rockers vs. Bockwinkel and Zybysco match over and over since those were the only figurines that I had for awhile, until I got some Hasbro WWF stuff (and a ring!). 

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8 minutes ago, Craig H said:

How man of you got into wrestling as kids and how many of you got into wrestling in your teens. And by kids, I mean mainly pre-10. For another example, I recall getting heavily into wrestling when I was 5. I have no idea how or why, but it almost makes me think it was wired in my DNA.

I started when I was 14-15, so I think I have a different perspective than most having not watched as a child.

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39 minutes ago, The Green Meanie said:

I'm glad this topic came up because it correlates to a question I thought of the other day:

I love tag team wrestling. I think I prefer it to regular one on one matches, possibly in part due to growing up watching tag team wrestling in it's heyday of the late 80's-early 90's.

Do you personally prefer set tag teams (tag team specialists) or do you prefer to have two singles stars be paired up?

Adversely, do you like it more when a tag team gets split up and turned into singles or when singles get turned into tag team specialists?

I prefer set teams though I can dig two single stars pairing up.

No preference on other since it pretty dependent on the people involved for either case.

16 minutes ago, Craig H said:

How man of you got into wrestling as kids and how many of you got into wrestling in your teens. And by kids, I mean mainly pre-10. For another example, I recall getting heavily into wrestling when I was 5. I have no idea how or why, but it almost makes me think it was wired in my DNA.

I knew of and dug Hogan, Andre, Ventura, Piper, & Macho Man before I ever saw a wrestling match. I had sren all in movies or commercials beforehand. Its weird since I knew they were wrestlers, but I didn't show an active interest in wrestling until sometime in 98 which is when I turned 10.

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41 minutes ago, Craig H said:

How man of you got into wrestling as kids and how many of you got into wrestling in your teens. And by kids, I mean mainly pre-10. For another example, I recall getting heavily into wrestling when I was 5. I have no idea how or why, but it almost makes me think it was wired in my DNA.

As a kid for me. One of my earliest wrestling-related memories was asking my parents permission to stay up later to watch Prime Time Wrestling on Monday nights around 1990-1991. I think it was wired into my DNA as both of my parents were huge fans of Houston Wrestling with Paul Boesch, both in person and on tv.

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40 minutes ago, Craig H said:

How man of you got into wrestling as kids and how many of you got into wrestling in your teens. And by kids, I mean mainly pre-10. For another example, I recall getting heavily into wrestling when I was 5. I have no idea how or why, but it almost makes me think it was wired in my DNA.

The AWA was big in our area when I was too young to actually remember almost anything.  My sister had the biggest crush on Tito Santana.  I vaguely recall a Dynamite/Tiger Mask match from around the same time.  Hulkamania hit big when I was 7, but I didn't really get into wrestling until very late 1987.  We didn't have cable, so I had to rely on Superstars and Lord Alfred to keep me up to date.  That cooled off just after WMVI, and I didn't really get back into the swing of things until early 1998, when I was flipping through stuff and caught a glimpse of Rey Mysterio, and thought he was Tiger Mask, rekindling my love for wrestling.

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1 hour ago, Craig H said:

How man of you got into wrestling as kids and how many of you got into wrestling in your teens. And by kids, I mean mainly pre-10. For another example, I recall getting heavily into wrestling when I was 5. I have no idea how or why, but it almost makes me think it was wired in my DNA.

Wired in my DNA as well, had two older brothers who were both into it so I was born into it starting around age 3 or so growing up on figures and VHS tapes that we had.

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1 hour ago, Craig H said:

How man of you got into wrestling as kids and how many of you got into wrestling in your teens. And by kids, I mean mainly pre-10. For another example, I recall getting heavily into wrestling when I was 5. I have no idea how or why, but it almost makes me think it was wired in my DNA.

It's a combination of "wired into my DNA" but "skipped a generation."

My mother and father were not wrestling fans in the least, but my sister and brother were big wrestling fans, with my sister being a big enough fan that she apparently tried to become a wrestler herself in the '70s/'80s. 

As far as timing, it was just weirder- one of the earliest presents for Christmas I remembered were four LJN WWF toys, so I must have liked it when I was really young...but I didn't really get into it until 1991-94, and just happened to fall out of it in 1994...but then in 1999, I got back into it and was hooked for life. 

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Born in England 1974, I grew up on World of Sport wrestling, and on the odd time when they'd show imported tapes of WWF Superstars instead of British Wrestlers, I'd come away with the impression that Americans couldn't wrestle and all their heroes were morons. How stupid do you have to be to fall for the 'chase my opponent's manager around the ring so my opponent can sneak attack me' gambit? OK, so how stupid do you have to be to fall for it in every match? That's what I thought when I was 8. But I stopped watching WoS when I was about 10 (it was cancelled when I was 13).

Got back into it thanks to 1991 WCW Worldwide,which was the only thing on telly at 2 in the morning on a Wednesday night then (nb: TV channels in the UK didn't broadcast 24 hours a day in the 80s. They used to close down at around midnight. ITV went 24 hrs first around 89 or 90, and it was a good few years before any of the other three channels joined them.

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14 hours ago, SorceressKnight said:

Well, personally my biggest problem with the WM III match is less that it's a good match, and more that when you take the WM III match into context, it's got a pretty glaring flaw in it:

The Ricky Steamboat/Randy Savage feud kicked into high gear in 1986 because Savage attacked Steamboat's throat with a ring bell.

This attack nearly ended Steamboat's career and forced Steamboat to give up everything to try and learn to speak again. 

This led to the WM III match, where they had a very athletic, acrobatic match the likes of which had never been seen by WWF fans to date.

One thing the match did not have...was Randy Savage working the neck. (Considering that the whole storyline was built around "Savage gave a big glaring weakness to Steamboat in his heck", that's DAMNING.)

Savage tried to show that he was better than Steamboat and got frustrated that he couldn't put him away. This led to his undoing as he gave in to his psycho tendencies when the ref got bumped and he went to grab the ring bell. He was going to recreate the throat smashing spot but Animal Steel pushed him off the top. So there was a callback to the throat stuff.

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8 hours ago, Craig H said:

How man of you got into wrestling as kids and how many of you got into wrestling in your teens. And by kids, I mean mainly pre-10. For another example, I recall getting heavily into wrestling when I was 5. I have no idea how or why, but it almost makes me think it was wired in my DNA.

Apparently I started watching when I was about 3. My first memories of watching were when I was around 4 or 5 and watching the noon JCP show that our CBS affiliate showed after Saturday morning cartoons were over with my teenage uncle.

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My first vivid wrestling memories were Studd and Patera cutting Andre's hair for WWF and Magnum beating Wahoo for the US title in a cage when I was 6. But I'm positive I watched JCP Maple Leaf Wrestling before WWF took over, it looks so familiar when I see clips on YouTube and Mid Atlantic on the Network.

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Karl Anderson tweeted that baby #4 will be arriving sometime this morning

The WWE is fertile ground recently

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6 minutes ago, RIPPA said:

Karl Anderson tweeted that baby #4 will be arriving sometime this morning

The WWE is fertile ground recently

Well, that would rule out him going back to NJPW anytime soon.

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I was 7 going on 8 when I randomly found WWF on a Saturday morning in 1988. I lived with mom and yia yia (grandmother in Greek), since dad was mostly absent from my childhood. Anyway, we had cable so I was lucky enough to get WWF, NWA, ESPN which at different times had WCCW, AWA, USWA, and GWF. We also got Tony Rumble's IWCCW on WGN, I believe.

I started with the giant LJN WWF figures, got the Ric Flair and Larry Zbyzsko AWA figures for my 8th birthday, then moved onto the Hasbro WWF figures when they came out. I also had the Sting and Arn Anderson Galoob figures. 

To answer the other question, I love tag team wrestling when done right. Teams that look like teams over two guys randomly paired together, double team offense, one entrance, etc. They didn't end up doing much, but Power & Glory is a great example of two guys not doing much at the time to become a real team. As great as the Rockers split was, it started the trend of spliting teams because one guy has to be the breakout singles star. In most cases, there isn't a breakout singles star in the team. I think the only time tag partners that didn't get along was ever done well was Chris Candido and Lance Storm in ECW. 

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I was 6 when I saw the first Mr Perfect vignettes and I was instantly a fan. Dude was perfect at ever sport! Why watch the Blue Jays when you could watch a guy so good at baseball he’s a wrestler? That was my kid logic anyway.

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22 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

... yia yia (grandmother in Greek) ...

Aw, my mom was "ya ya" to my daughter.  Not because we're Greek, mind you; my mom was just big on cultural appropriation.

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