DECEMBER 2017 WRESTLING DISCUSSION

[mattdangerously]

9 minutes ago, Edwin said:

You know it wasn’t stopping there...

 

 

Can we please throw both of these idiots into an active volcano?

5 minutes ago, MapRef41N93W said:

Someone please help me understand what "on the comp list at staples" means.

Free tickets at Staples Center shows, I think.

[odessasteps]

I presume he means the Staples Center in LA, not Staples the office supply store.

[MapRef41N93W]

OK, but what does that mean in this context? Some people in the replies to that tweet are acting like it's a scathing diss. How is "MMA fighters get into the Staples Center for free" an insult?

EDIT: Oh, he probably means the comp list for WWE. So he's saying most UFC fighters are actually wrestling fans themselves. Got it.

[odessasteps]

I presume he means they run down the rasslin business but ask for free tickets to the show when the company runs LA. 

[piranesi]

Meltzer: "Old men said "XYZQ" about that thing back then so if patterns repeat then today, which  they will, a bunch of new old men will probably say "XYZQ" about this.  Let's put down some old man bait and see..."

Old man: "XYZQ XYZQ XYZQ XYZQ!!!!!!!!!!"

[Victator]

Seemed to me like Cormier was putting wrestling over. 

The Bucks are trash. I like flying wrestling, RVD and Sabu are all time favorites. But I need some danger and impact. I don't think I have seen a good Bucks match in three years. That said, I'm not looking very hard either. 

It feels like synchronized swimming or gymnastics. I appreciate the athleticism but have no desire to watch it. 

[StretchMediatedHypertrophy]

3 hours ago, Victator said:

It is exactly what brought the darkness out of Jake. On a level he might be grateful for it. In any case, revenge against Quake would have been a slow process. 

The thing about Jake and Quake planning to team at Survivor Series is that they never really explained it, and they did enough team promos iirc.

In terms of weird, I just mean they seemed to do a lot of mega beatdowns that year. You obviously had Quake fucking up Hogan's shit the year before, but this year it was Slaughter trying to murder people, Undertaker's attempted suffocation of Warrior, DiBiase trying to cripple Piper, Quake killing Damien and trying to cripple Andre, Mountie putting the heavy, heavy beatdown on Boss Man and later doing the water-enhanced shock on Bret Hart, Jake doing whatever that was to Warrior and then invading the wedding and 'inadvertently' poisoning Savage, and striking Elizabeth. I'm probably missing a few things.........

[evilwaldo]

Here is the tweet Cody is replying to....

 

https://twitter.com/dc_mma/status/942420416185978880

 

Not sure how it is positive of pro wrestling.

[APO]

He never said all pro wrestling was bad, tho. Just that he didn't like the Bucks' flippy stuff. Cody comes off as a real salty bitch by the end of his tweet trying to big time DC of all people. 

[odessasteps]

I tried to make a joke around one of his Star Wars tweets last week and got a snippy response. 

I blame Phil for posting it on the board.

[Brian Fowler]

Well, they are Cody's friends. It's not uncommon to defend your friends.

And he's right that people love the Bucks. They and Cody are selling tickets and shirts at record rates for indies.

[Victator]

1 hour ago, България завинаги said:

The thing about Jake and Quake planning to team at Survivor Series is that they never really explained it, and they did enough team promos iirc.

In terms of weird, I just mean they seemed to do a lot of mega beatdowns that year. You obviously had Quake fucking up Hogan's shit the year before, but this year it was Slaughter trying to murder people, Undertaker's attempted suffocation of Warrior, DiBiase trying to cripple Piper, Quake killing Damien and trying to cripple Andre, Mountie putting the heavy, heavy beatdown on Boss Man and later doing the water-enhanced shock on Bret Hart, Jake doing whatever that was to Warrior and then invading the wedding and 'inadvertently' poisoning Savage, and striking Elizabeth. I'm probably missing a few things.........

91 felt like the series finale of classic WWF with so many long running plots coming to an end. The new characters like Sid and Taker are introduced as smaller players like Bret Hart are promoted and bit players like Shawn Michaels are introduced. 

In the case of Jake, he gets destroyed by a greater monster in Taker. Its unfortunate that Jake was never a major guy in wrestling after the Sting feud. He was a great heel in SMW and Mexico. He was no older than Hogan or Savage but got the washed up label. Its just a shame. 

[GuerrillaMonsoon]

If I were Jerry Jones, and pursuing a vendetta against Roger Goodell, would a drop in the ocean in funding the XFL which can be then used as a bargaining chip to get rid of Goodell be a realistic proposition?

I hope Trump and Wrestlemania 10 alumni Burt Reynolds "sell him" their USFL shares and creating a new monopoly of minor football league territories. If only Stu Hart could play the Jack Tunney of the CFL.

[BurningBeard]

3 hours ago, Victator said:

Seemed to me like Cormier was putting wrestling over. 

The Bucks are trash. I like flying wrestling, RVD and Sabu are all time favorites. But I need some danger and impact. I don't think I have seen a good Bucks match in three years. That said, I'm not looking very hard either. 

It feels like synchronized swimming or gymnastics. I appreciate the athleticism but have no desire to watch it. 

My thoughts exactly, wrestling has always been different strokes for different strokes but give me a snug lock-up over a fucking meltzer driver any day of the week.

This style that has grown over the past couple of years is part of the reason why I only really keep up with results rather than go out of my way to watch these days. That said, I do get Dave's point. For example, that Ricochet/Ospreay match from last summer felt in part like what Dynamite/Tiger Mask must have felt like back in the day as in you're seeing new levels of athleticism and work in the context of pro wrestling. I appreciate it for pushing the business forward, it's just not my thing at all and looks goofy.

[dogwelder]

2 hours ago, RolandTHTG said:

If I were Jerry Jones, and pursuing a vendetta against Roger Goodell, would a drop in the ocean in funding the XFL which can be then used as a bargaining chip to get rid of Goodell be a realistic proposition?

I hope Trump and Wrestlemania 10 alumni Burt Reynolds "sell him" their USFL shares and creating a new monopoly of minor football league territories. If only Stu Hart could play the Jack Tunney of the CFL.

I'd bet that there's something in the NFL bylaws preventing owners from investing in another football league. 

[The Natural]

8 hours ago, Edwin said:

Get the popcorn ready...

 

It's still real to them dammit!

[Beech27]

I know I shouldn't care about angry online wrestling opinions, but if Cornette's criticism of Okada and Omega is that they didn't/don't hit hard enough, he's just never seen them. You'd have a much easier time arguing the opposite, frankly, that they're athletic and charismatic enough that they don't need to leave matches with welts and boot prints on their skin. And if Flair's bumping isn't business exposing, then I don't know what is. Which isn't even a criticism, but god, no one could possibly mistake Flair/Steamboat for anything but a worked athletic exhibition. It's great! But.

[mattdangerously]

That spot really is dumb as shit, though.

[Craig H]

I took it as Dave using Okada vs Omega to illustrate his point and Corny remained focused on the Young Bucks.

I also watched that match and the spot in it last night. I don't know. I went from thinking it looked overly contrived to laughing pretty hard. At some point during that spot I gave in and just wound up enjoying it.

This shit isn't meant to always be taken that seriously. And given the option of having something light-hearted and silly like the Bucks and something super serious with STRONG STYLE contrived spots like Davey Richards, I'll choose the Bucks every day.

[Craig H]

Matt Jackson and Kenny also wound up destroying Corny pointing out when he ran ROH it was half full and Matt knows because he was there. Kenny took the alley oop and said that Corny would prefer to call it "half empty." I thought that was pretty funny.

So many people love the Broken/Woken shit and then get up in arms about every move and breath from the Bucks. If you don't like the shit, fine, but adding hyperbole to it is really dumb.

[MORELOCK]

14 minutes ago, Craig H said:

If you don't like the shit, fine, but adding hyperbole to it is really dumb.

I doubt the reaction would be as severe if the hyperbole about the NJPW guys wasn't so strong in the first place - I can't escape conversation about The Young Bucks, and people lose their shit about Omega being the greatest wrestler on Earth and act like Meltzer backing it up validates their claims as objective truth.

[Beech27]

54 minutes ago, MORELOCK said:

I doubt the reaction would be as severe if the hyperbole about the NJPW guys wasn't so strong in the first place - I can't escape conversation about The Young Bucks, and people lose their shit about Omega being the greatest wrestler on Earth and act like Meltzer backing it up validates their claims as objective truth.

You're right that fandom operates this way, but it's such a weird phenomenon to me, honestly. Of course there can be no objective truths about subjective performance, but "People are getting excited about a thing, so other people need to hate it in equal measure" is just logically incoherent. People can hate whatever, but it's the application of causality that confuses me. Positive fan responses don't actually require a backlash.

[Craig H]

I'm hard pressed to call anyone better than Okada or Omega at this point. Naito comes close. Ishii is another. I almost want to say AJ given the bullshit he's had to work with.

[Ace]

1 hour ago, Beech27 said:

I know I shouldn't care about angry online wrestling opinions, but if Cornette's criticism of Okada and Omega is that they didn't/don't hit hard enough, he's just never seen them. 

That's usually the case. Cornette buried the entirety of Lucha Underground based on a 2 minute clip.

Jim Cornette is such an inspired wrestling mind that nobody can remember when his booking and promoting actually drew money to give him credibility.

 

[Godfrey]

It's classic nerd fandom: when it becomes that much of their personality, if someone disagrees it's not just a differing opinion but an assault on them personally. And the more people argue, the harder they stick to their guns. There's never going to be an old timer saying "Well, I used to think it was flippy bullshit but then Meltzer made an apt comparison and Cody yelled at me on Twitter so now I think it's great!"