Jump to content
DVDVR Message Board

RIC FLAIR 30 FOR 30


 Share

Recommended Posts

Anyone else half afraid to watch the Flair 30 for 30 on ESPN tonight?  I love Flair as a performer, but my general opinion of older RF is that he was too emotionally immature to know when it was time to slip out of the gimmick.  I kinda expect the doc to mostly confirm that impression.  Nature Boy is a great wrestling character.  I doubt he's so great if you're being raised by him, married to him, lent him money, etc.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 minutes ago, Keep Calm, Akira Hokuto On said:

Anyone else half afraid to watch the Flair 30 for 30 on ESPN tonight?  I love Flair as a performer, but my general opinion of older RF is that he was too emotionally immature to know when it was time to slip out of the gimmick.  I kinda expect the doc to mostly confirm that impression.  Nature Boy is a great wrestling character.  I doubt he's so great if you're being raised by him, married to him, lent him money, etc.

 

Somewhat, but I'm not sure that I expect to hear anything that isn't already mostly common knowledge, so I've sort of prepared myself in that way.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

For all the media Ric/Charlotte are doing for this I can't imagine it's going to portray him in that negative of a light. At least with things that aren't common knowledge already(as Zakk said) or things that Ric hadn't given blessing to be discussed. That's how I look at it anyways.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

58 minutes ago, Peck said:

For all the media Ric/Charlotte are doing for this I can't imagine it's going to portray him in that negative of a light. At least with things that aren't common knowledge already(as Zakk said) or things that Ric hadn't given blessing to be discussed. That's how I look at it anyways.

I agree, but I also get the feeling that Ric and I have very different ideas of what casts him in a negative light.  Like Zakk said, I don't expect to hear a whole lot that I haven't heard before, or at least suspected.  It's more that I expect the doc to reinforce my impression of Ric, which I've revised fairly recently.  I've always been a big fan of Ric's - and especially the Horsemen - but Ric himself has worn thin with me.  Years ago, when I was younger and just started hearing about Ric's exploits via the Internet and the Observer, the idea of Ric living the hard-partying, limousine-riding Space Mountain lifestyle 24/7 seemed kinda impressive to me.  I guess I sort of romanticized it.  Now, in my late 40's with two grown kids and a 25-year marriage, the idea of Ric as some sort of Peter Pan figure who didn't grow up and still lives the lifestyle even though it probably was hell on his ex-wives, kids, friends, finances, etc. seems kinda pitiful to me.

If hard-partying cocaine binges, sleeping with a lot of women, and throwing a lot of cash around had been an option at 28, I would probably have gone for it.  At 48, I'm kinda glad that was never really a long-term option for me, because my life would have turned out terribly.

 

1 minute ago, Curt McGirt said:

Great, I went to autotune that and ESPN isn't showing any replays. WTF? Is that a regular thing? As in, how long should I wait for a replay, since I'll be at work for this one?

Film will repeat on ESPN2 at 2 AM Wednesday morning and probably be shown several times over the next month or so.  It most likely will be available online and On Demand pretty quickly.  That's their usual pattern.

I am really intrigued to hear what his first wife has to say - although I can take a rough guess.  I think this is the first time she's ever spoken publicly about Ric.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, Keep Calm, Akira Hokuto On said:

 I've always been a big fan of Ric's - and especially the Horsemen - but Ric himself has worn thin with me.  

As excited as I am to see this documentary, the irony is the person I least want to hear from is Ric.  I'm eager to hear others talk about him, but I feel I'm going to be rolling my eyes a LOT when he's speaking.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm of a very similar opinion about Flair as @Keep Calm, Akira Hokuto On.  It's a big reason why I couldn't listen to Flair's podcast.  Hearing an old man romanticize, if not outright brag about, the stuff that essentially ruined his life was so tone deaf on his part and sad to me.  As Dave Chappelle said, "you don't want to be the old guy at the club."  Hearing Flair brag about spending all that money, boozing, drugging, and fucking around, all the while knowing that he's a multi-time divorcee, broke, in poor health, with one kid in the ground and another who is estranged from him, is heartbreaking.  Flair is really a tragic figure, though he'll never admit it nor will the majority of fans and wrestling journalists allow that to ever be the narrative, because they're all marks deep down.  But the idea of a clown who doesn't know how to take off the red nose and makeup long after the big top has been torn down is just incredibly sad.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The line HBK has in the trailer about Richard Fliehr being the real man and Ric Flair being the myth felt completely hollow and false. It's very clear that he's had a symbiotic relationship with his wrestling character to deal with personal issues his entire career. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Maybe this is the mark in me but this 30 for 30 is one of the best representation of the "sport" of professional wrestling in a while.  The training, the grind, the skills to do something that shouldn't hurt but make it look like it hurt (Flair teaching you how to throw a worked punch), the physicality (Flair vs Steamboat shoot chopping each other), and unfortunately the impact it has on his family and relationship.   Damn good representation of the business for the non pro wrestling fan.

Hogan putting Flair over saying that he is "100 times better than me" was awesome.   Sure we would have like more about why we didn't get that WM match but this is an ESPN 30 for 30 and not a Highspots documentary.

Glad they treated his after retirement career especially in TNA as the embarrassment that it really was.   We can mark out over the Lethal/Flair confrontation but everything else was awful

Obviously there have been better 30 for 30' but really good.

 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I never need to hear that 911 call ever. Muted it when it started.

Very strong (albeit short) overview. 

There is something universal in the Flair story about the athlete (or the entertainer) who sacrifices so much for the thing he loves. It's such a common story in sports, which I think is why that was the focus. The 30 for 30s are, on some level, always asking whether the sacrifice was worth the success.

I don't think I'd go as far as calling him a tragic figure as he is a very flawed, human figure. He was better at something he loved at a higher level than just about anyone ever for decades, but to be that a lot of the darkness came with it. Would one have existed without the other? 

Anyway, very cool documentary that highlighted a pretty complex guy. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This could have easily been two hours.  Even more.  A rare show where I see there's five-ten minutes left, and I'm bummed that it was coming to an end.  

Flair saying he drank from 7am-2am every day for a year after his son died and saying it as if he had no other choice was so painful.  And I gained a lot on HHH for stepping in to help.

But wow, did HHH kinda just admit their testing policy is BS during this?  (We'll test you a second time, and tell you in advance...)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Great documentary. Some real sad stuff in there,  just brutal.  Flair having to settle for being the best ever in wrestling because he's an admitted crappy father and husband.  They definitely didn't hold back..  they told you the full Flair,  the good and focused on a lot of the bad as well.  I liked the Kill Bill animations to go with the stories.  

I'm still confused about why Hogan and Flair didn't happen at WrestleMania.  They both said that basically Vince ran them at house shows and ruined the appeal which isn't the true story obviously. Meltzer reported that the house shows didn't work..  but I still don't get it.  I watched their match from Madison Square Garden.  It looked like a sellout and the crowd was going insane for it.  

So to me the Meltzer simplification of the issue isn't adding up either..  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, sydneybrown said:

This could have easily been two hours.  Even more.  A rare show where I see there's five-ten minutes left, and I'm bummed that it was coming to an end.  

Flair saying he drank from 7am-2am every day for a year after his son died and saying it as if he had no other choice was so painful.  And I gained a lot on HHH for stepping in to help.

But wow, did HHH kinda just admit their testing policy is BS during this?  (We'll test you a second time, and tell you in advance...)

Obviously they could have added another 30 minutes but then you would have gotten to the point where you are trying to appeal to the wrestling fans and not the casual ESPN viewer which is usually their target audience.   sure it would have been to include Harley Race or his WCW stuff with Bischoff but the point was kind of made.  If I would have added anything more it would have been with Charlotte then Ric.  

Yeah for all the shit we can say about Triple H trying to ride Flair's coattails during the Evolution days (which is true), if we are to believe this then Flair may have been dead much much earlier without his assistance.  

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

I'm still confused about why Hogan and Flair didn't happen at WrestleMania.  They both said that basically Vince ran them at house shows and ruined the appeal which isn't the true story obviously. Meltzer reported that the house shows didn't work..  but I still don't get it.  I watched their match from Madison Square Garden.  It looked like a sellout and the crowd was going insane for it.  

I don't know if this fact, but I thought the reason was that Hogan was taking the rest of the year off after Mania (to shoot Mr. Nanny and to let things die down after the steroids scandals), and he wasn't going to lose to Flair.  And he couldn't exactly beat him and vacate the title either.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The Hunter drug test comment was a little odd but I wouldn't make too much of it. I've been in  professional jobs where before you get hired you get screened for drugs and usually you get a heads up just in case you enjoy smoking the weed a little too much on the side or even if you fail they'll give you a do-over "just to make sure." I took the comment to mean "tell your son to get clean and we'll test him again" as opposed to "we'll ignore his drug issue." 

As apparently has been noted with Matt Riddle,  people with drug problems before they're in the WWE system have a real hard time getting in so they definitely seemed like they wanted to give Reid every chance to get in.

In fact, I believe it was on Flair's podcast that he basically said that Hogan paid for Reid's rehab because Ric didn't want to go through WWE and ruin any chance his son had of getting hired. Just a sad story.

Also, agreed with the comment above. I don't know if I'd like to work a Wrestlemania program with HHH, per se, but dude seems like a solid friend to a lot of people

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, Technico Support said:

I'm of a very similar opinion about Flair as @Keep Calm, Akira Hokuto On.  It's a big reason why I couldn't listen to Flair's podcast.  Hearing an old man romanticize, if not outright brag about, the stuff that essentially ruined his life was so tone deaf on his part and sad to me.  As Dave Chappelle said, "you don't want to be the old guy at the club."  Hearing Flair brag about spending all that money, boozing, drugging, and fucking around, all the while knowing that he's a multi-time divorcee, broke, in poor health, with one kid in the ground and another who is estranged from him, is heartbreaking.  Flair is really a tragic figure, though he'll never admit it nor will the majority of fans and wrestling journalists allow that to ever be the narrative, because they're all marks deep down.  But the idea of a clown who doesn't know how to take off the red nose and makeup long after the big top has been torn down is just incredibly sad.

That’s a very good and at the same time sad take.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Regardless of the coattail riding, Hunter does always come off as a really good friend. He was still loyal to Shawn when he hit rock bottom too.

I don't quite agree with the idea that Flair's love for wrestling ruined him. He's portrayed as directionless, impulsive, and desperate for attention before finding wrestling. There are plenty of stories of success warping someone and destroying them, but this is the story of someone with issues discovering they're really good at something and channeling their energy into it. Wrestling also gave him a lot of avenues to lead a wild lifestyle, but Richard Fliehr dock worker or car salesman would probably have led a similarly troubled life, just less ostentatiously in obscurity.  

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Did a little research and Reid died March of 2013.  Flair's infamous drunken RAW appearance during the Shield/Evolution feud was April 2014.  I kinda feel HHH's "Shut the fuck up.  You're getting help or I'm making you get help" speech had to have been immediately after.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...