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OCT 2017 WRESTLING JIBBER JABBER


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So I started watching 2000 Raw while I have the Network. I had to skip November and December 9 because it was becoming a slog to get thru. They were still trying to imitate Russo's nonsense. 

There is subtle but significant difference between 1999 and 2000 WWF but I can't place it beyond match quality being way up. The angles seem different too. 

Funny thing on an early episode in 2000. 

Ivory: King you are a pervert. 

King: Yeah I know. 

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On 10/6/2017 at 7:36 PM, Eivion said:

So aside from the 92 match what are the best War Games matches? It stopped being a thing by the time I really got into wrestling so I've never seen more than one or two when looking at past matches.

1991, 1994 and 1996. 1996 seems to be underrated.

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‘97 is ok, despite the NWO killing the Horsemen. Benoit was pretty great in that. Been a bit since I’ve seen it, so I may be off, maybe. But I really enjoyed that match, mainly because I’m a Benoit mark. 

Yeah, I know. But I’m still able to enjoy his work. So sue me. 

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24 minutes ago, Boydy said:

Why not have Neville on Smackdown then you can put him in matches with Nakamura, Styles, Zayn, Owens etc, he would be awesome on that show.

Because that would make sense, WWE's hit and miss in that ole department.

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7 hours ago, Ryan said:

How about Dolph Ziggler IN NJPW. Ahahaha! Neville's jacked up enough he should be a credible heavyweight in New Japan where the average height is much lower.

Neville could be a heavyweight in NJPW but the heavyweights don't need more depth like the jr heavyweights do so that's where I'd like to see Neville end up if he's gone from WWE.

Dolph in NJPW could work he's athletic and is willing to bump with little regard for his body but he doesn't have great offense and I don't know how much I'd like to see him trying to have 'epic' matches every night.

I don't think Jinder would work in NJPW and I would have my doubts about Ambrose as well he's just really suited for WWE and North American style the most. WWE has a roster that is probably quietly just as talented as NJPW right now but the booking is just........idk

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3 hours ago, The Natural said:

I really like Tajiri, his performance in a Mexican Death match vs. Super Crazy was terrific and the Unholy Alliance with Mikey Whipwreck/the Sinister Minister is one of my favourite ever tag teams. My 2000 Wrestler of the Year.

NSFW:

 

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They would have to be insane to lose Neville. They have to realize what they have in him. Just go back to the match he had with Rollins on Raw. 

Send him to Smackdown and let him wrestle. He’s good at it. 

Maybe it’s the cruiserweight division. Scrap it, intermingle the better guys onto Raw and Smackdown, send the rest to NXT. If they can hang, they can hang. They can’t? They can wait for the next CWC.

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10 hours ago, Ryan said:

How about Dolph Ziggler IN NJPW. Ahahaha! Neville's jacked up enough he should be a credible heavyweight in New Japan where the average height is much lower.

What did NJPW ever do to you, Ryan?

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2 hours ago, Sublime said:

Neville could be a heavyweight in NJPW but the heavyweights don't need more depth like the jr heavyweights do so that's where I'd like to see Neville end up if he's gone from WWE.

Dolph in NJPW could work he's athletic and is willing to bump with little regard for his body but he doesn't have great offense and I don't know how much I'd like to see him trying to have 'epic' matches every night.

I don't think Jinder would work in NJPW and I would have my doubts about Ambrose as well he's just really suited for WWE and North American style the most. WWE has a roster that is probably quietly just as talented as NJPW right now but the booking is just........idk

My biggest gripe with WWE isn't even with the actual product, exactly.  It's more that I feel like they're content to underachieve.  This is probably the greatest period in WWE history.  They've been able to sign almost anyone they really want,  they've upgraded their developmental system greatly, they've got their own network, developed revenue streams that aren't so closely tied to the in-ring product, etc.  In terms of talent evaluation, training, and presentation, this is probably their high point.  Yet the tv shows are often a slog and a lot of the talent they went to lengths to sign gets wasted.  I feel like if you're doing so well in evaluating and recruiting talent and you have an in-house training center that's so much better than what anyone has had before, you damn well should be able to put out a watchable product on a weekly basis.  And yet the results aren't quite there.

I kinda feel like WWE is on auto pilot.  Right now, there's no clear path back to pop culture popularity and network tv, and they have no credible challengers in terms of other promotions.  And the barriers to success (tv) are such that no wrestling promotion is probably going to challenge them for a long, long time.  Add to that the idea that the company is so large with so many revenue streams that it's going to maintain at least a reasonable level of profitability almost no matter what, and.... you have a company that can afford to get a little complacent.

I dunno.  With all the advantages this company has, even when it's good, I feel like ti should be a lot better.

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Don't really buy into the idea that Neville could do much more in WWE than what they had him doing. He was never super over, and his stuff mostly only got good reactions in smarkier areas. Also if Neville left I kind of see him heading back to DG before trying out for NJPW. I haven't really watched much NJPW in recent years, but they are kind stuff right now with talent from what I can see. If Neville had a problem working the Cruiserweight division I can't see him being satisfied with working NJPW's junior division.

The CW division itself is fine as an idea. WWE is just stupid trying to segregate them too much instead of letting them interact with everyone else more outside of it. On a smaller scale that is fine. On the main roster it just feels very off. It also doesn't help that WWE has trouble keeping momentum on guys when they aren't the main focus.

Also I don't really think WWE is all that complacent. Its more that they have too much tv and are ultimately a product that doesn't/can't rely on simple wrestling build all that often. Add in the stubborn old man who won't give up fast enough on bad ideas and constantly gets in the way of himself and others on good ones it shouldn't be too surprising they are where they are right now. They are constantly trying to improve. They just fail at it often.

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Was just listening to Meltzer on the Santino-Cornette dustup.  Dave said that, after the situation got calmed down, Santino came back and goaded Cornette on two more times.  I'm not a big fan of Cornette's "crazy bitter old guy" routine and he could have defused the situation by acting like an adult, but Santino was definitely the bigger asshat in this particular instance.  I'm inclined to give Santino the benefit of the doubt because of the history between him and Corny, but yeah, it was definitely a case of jerk on jerk crime.  Move along.  Nothing to see here.

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2 hours ago, Horton Hears a Wooo!!! said:

I kinda feel like WWE is on auto pilot.  Right now, there's no clear path back to pop culture popularity and network tv, and they have no credible challengers in terms of other promotions.  And the barriers to success (tv) are such that no wrestling promotion is probably going to challenge them for a long, long time.  Add to that the idea that the company is so large with so many revenue streams that it's going to maintain at least a reasonable level of profitability almost no matter what, and.... you have a company that can afford to get a little complacent.

The way I view it is they have this super talented roster but their business model does not allow them to deliver what the fans actually want. Fans want unique experiences. They want fresh match-ups. They want fights with a big match feel. They want stakes. They want things they havent seen before.  

Unique is not something WWE does well. Even when debuting a new performer with some buzz (think Nakamura) within a month of his debut you've seen his entrance 4-5 times and you've already seen his standard WWE-style match two or three times. Then during commercial breaks they advertise a house show where he will wrestle the match you just saw. Then he will cut a promo setting up a ppv match of the match you just saw. Under that kind of model it's a miracle anyone still wants to see him wrestle after a few months. 

Why do things like the UK tournament or the Mae Young Classic get so much buzz? Why is nxt such a satisfying watch? Because it's fresh faces in fresh storylines who don't face off 5 times before the ppv match.

I think the WWE needs to  try to get as close to the late-80s less is more business model as the current format allows. 

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Neville has been outstanding in his role as King of the Cruiserweights. And for his trouble, he gets to be the pre-show bout on some of the biggest events of the year. He gets to see Enzo featured in show-closing segments on Raw. And he was apparently going to be a TV match to build Enzo up for his PPV match with Kalisto. 

I could easily see a guy who's been a standout like him wanting more. He's been terrific his entire time with the company, going all the way back to his NXT days. But they've never really given him a chance to go to the next level. 

Hopefully they talk him down, put him on SmackDown, and let him be Corbin or Jinder's next challenger. 

Unless he's got some partying or behavioural issues we're not aware of, I'd say it's fair for him to be a bit disgruntled. 

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As long as 205 exists and is booked the way it is, it's the fate of pretty much anyone in the Cruiser catagory that goes to WWE. Although I could argue that Ricochet might have a higher ceiling than Neville.  The possibility of his girlfriend coming along in a package deal might keep him happy if he's not super-pushed.

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2 minutes ago, Raziel403 said:

As long as 205 exists and is booked the way it is, it's the fate of pretty much anyone in the Cruiser catagory that goes to WWE. Although I could argue that Ricochet might have a higher ceiling than Neville.  The possibility of his girlfriend coming along in a package deal might keep him happy if he's not super-pushed.

Austin Aries was right to want out. The cruiserweight division is a dead end.

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6 minutes ago, Raziel403 said:

As long as 205 exists and is booked the way it is, it's the fate of pretty much anyone in the Cruiser catagory that goes to WWE. Although I could argue that Ricochet might have a higher ceiling than Neville.  The possibility of his girlfriend coming along in a package deal might keep him happy if he's not super-pushed.

And the lunatics that run the company won't book them on separate brands or in storyline relationships with other people just to fuck with them.  :rolleyes:

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