Twin Peaks

[Throat]

9 hours ago, CreativeControl said:

Yeah that was essentially my reading of it. I'm not subscribing to the alternate timelines/alternate dimension bullshit flying around. It's all one world, but by Cooper rescuing Laura there is no murder investigation, no Dale Cooper in Twin Peaks, no being trapped in the lodge etc etc which is why I think that weird overlay effect started like Cooper had 'dreamed' the whole thing in the Red Room and the statement he echoes from Phillip Jeffries about how "We live inside a dream". It undid everything and Cooper is now this ethereal Phillip Jeffries-esque character removed from it all while Laura is snatched away.

So if there is only one world of Twin Peaks, and it's no longer the one we're familiar with, there really was no reason to tie up loose ends with any of the characters outside of Cooper's story. That doesn't make it any less frustrating. It makes Audrey's storyline seem even more pointless. All of their stories were pointless if everything got a hard reset. Did Lynch throw the baby out with the bathwater so that Little Nicky, the pine weasel, Super Nadine, Josie in a knob and all the other low points of season two never happened? Or was that just a bonus? He didn't mince words about his opinion of season two in interviews leading up to the return.

If this is where we're at now in Twin Peaks, I wonder what Frost's Final Dossier is going to cover. The synopsis says it tells us what happened to key characters in the 25 years between seasons. Is this branching off from the events of the Twin Peaks that we know? Or is it this altered Twin Peaks? If it's the latter, why the hell would anyone care about that? Who even are these people to us if they didn't experience anything we've seen in the series?

Maybe the fact that this 25-year history exists means the familiar Twin Peaks world is still intact and Cooper is, in fact, stuck in a parallel world. Or the ending was all Lynch's idea and he just rendered Frost's book pointless and non-canon.

Considering how this season wrapped up, and how things worked out for all the other original series characters, Ed and Norma got a surprisingly happy ending. Maybe that's what it took to lure Everett McGill out of retirement.

[John from Cincinnati]

 

[odessasteps]

Happy 28th Anniversary 

 

[BurningBeard]

Man I rewatched the whole thing recently, let me tell you - Grace Zabriskie's performance as Sarah Palmer in those first two seasons comes across as way more frightening and unhinged now we know what we know about her.

Picked up on some other weird threads too - Big Ed's reflection does something really weird in Episode 13, and Audrey says a line in that episode which is repeated by the Evolution of the Arm in the final episode... the implications of which I can't begin to fathom.

Also, that ending is still a totally perfect gut punch.

[John from Cincinnati]

I’m halfway through a rewatch myself. Wanna hit me with that Audrey line, @CreativeControl? 

[BurningBeard]

The whole vibe and scene with Charlie is just so troubling. When she's arguing with him, she says a couple of things that really troubled me but I can't make sense of them @West Newbury Bad Boy

First she says, "What story is that, Charlie? Is it the story of the little girl who lived down the lane? Well, is it?" which is what the Arm repeats in the final episode. Might be an allusion to Sarah Palmer/the little girl from Episode 8 maybe?

And then he calms her down by quietly threatening her by asking "Do you want me to end your story too?"

Then even more visibly upset she says she feels like she’s somewhere else, like she’s someone else, and “I’m not sure who I am but I’m not me.” 

Then a couple of episodes later when Audrey does wake up the sounds wherever she is are the same electricity ones we hear throughout the season. All so weird, can't help but feel the whole thing is a coda for the season as a whole

[HumanChessgame]

Twin Peaks - The Final Dossier is a good, quick read and actually bookends/clarifies a few of the plot points in the new series.

[BurningBeard]

I gave up on the first book so didn't bother with Final Dossier, I resent going to an extraneous sources to get any further insight too tbh

[John from Cincinnati]

12 hours ago, CreativeControl said:

The whole vibe and scene with Charlie is just so troubling. When she's arguing with him, she says a couple of things that really troubled me but I can't make sense of them @West Newbury Bad Boy

First she says, "What story is that, Charlie? Is it the story of the little girl who lived down the lane? Well, is it?" which is what the Arm repeats in the final episode. Might be an allusion to Sarah Palmer/the little girl from Episode 8 maybe?

And then he calms her down by quietly threatening her by asking "Do you want me to end your story too?"

Then even more visibly upset she says she feels like she’s somewhere else, like she’s someone else, and “I’m not sure who I am but I’m not me.” 

Then a couple of episodes later when Audrey does wake up the sounds wherever she is are the same electricity ones we hear throughout the season. All so weird, can't help but feel the whole thing is a coda for the season as a whole

All quality insight, and I caught some of that first time around. But the reason I asked is because the episodes are untitled on my disc set (and most sets, from what I understand), so I thought you were referring to lines from the second season in the 90s. Now that really would have been something! My bad

Re: The Final Dossier, I received it as a Christmas present but have yet to open it. Planning on giving it a go whenever my rewatch concludes. 

[TheVileOne]

17 hours ago, HumanChessgame said:

Twin Peaks - The Final Dossier is a good, quick read and actually bookends/clarifies a few of the plot points in the new series.

Anything in particular?

[HumanChessgame]

4 minutes ago, TheVileOne said:

Anything in particular?

Spoiler

-What happened to the Hayward family after the original series, plus a heavy insinuation that Ben Horne is Donna's father

-As a child, Sarah Palmer's family was living near Los Alamos during atomic bomb testings and the mysterious murders that happened at the radio station (the "got a light" segment).  Sarah was hospitalized after listening to the radio broadcast and it's implied that she was possessed by something in the process which lead to the events surrounding Laura.

-Agent Cooper is suggested to be the father of Richard Horne.

-Recaps of what happened between Ed, Norma, Dr. Jacoby, and a few other supporting characters between the series.

-Backstory on the Log Lady

-Sheriff Truman was actually dying of cancer.  His brother was the only one who knew and took over as sheriff at his request.

 

[TheVileOne]

2 minutes ago, HumanChessgame said:

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-What happened to the Hayward family after the original series, plus a heavy insinuation that Ben Horne is Donna's father

-As a child, Sarah Palmer's family was living near Los Alamos during atomic bomb testings and the mysterious murders that happened at the radio station (the "got a light" segment).  Sarah was hospitalized after listening to the radio broadcast and it's implied that she was possessed by something in the process which lead to the events surrounding Laura.

-Agent Cooper is suggested to be the father of Richard Horne.

-Recaps of what happened between Ed, Norma, Dr. Jacoby, and a few other supporting characters between the series.

-Backstory on the Log Lady

-Sheriff Truman was actually dying of cancer.  His brother was the only one who knew and took over as sheriff at his request.

 

Some of that is interesting however:

I was never really big into that Sarah Palmer subplot. At least from the outset, Sarah didn't come off as a malevolent entity who wanted to destroy her daughter...though I could be wrong there. 

I'm still sort of angry/mixed about that Truman subplot. I still feel like Michael Ontkean should've been brought back, and it felt like a purely political move by David Lynch. A lot of my issues with the series I think would've been assuaged if he was there and had at least one reunion with Cooper.

I thought the implication was that Dopple-BOB-Coop was the father and not good Dale?

[HumanChessgame]

9 minutes ago, TheVileOne said:

Some of that is interesting however:

 

  Hide contents

I was never really big into that Sarah Palmer subplot. At least from the outset, Sarah didn't come off as a malevolent entity who wanted to destroy her daughter...though I could be wrong there. 

I'm still sort of angry/mixed about that Truman subplot. I still feel like Michael Ontkean should've been brought back, and it felt like a purely political move by David Lynch. A lot of my issues with the series I think would've been assuaged if he was there and had at least one reunion with Cooper.

I thought the implication was that Dopple-BOB-Coop was the father and not good Dale?

 

I know his scenes in FWWM were deleted, but I thought Ontkean didn't come back because he'd retired from acting?  Agreed that the series was missing a lot of it's original heart due to his absence.

Spoiler

I think the implication was that Sarah was just a vessel and that Bob/the entity or whatever you want to call it took hold in various other people and things in the vicinity.

It just mentions that Audrey was pregnant after being visited by Cooper.  I don't recall if there was speculation as to which version of him it was, but it being Evil Coop definitely makes the most sense.

 

[Casey]

Some think David Lynch purposely left Ontkean out of the revival (Brad Dukes claims that Ontkean reached out to him to help him find the original Sheriff's jacket in preparation for the role), others side with the "official" story that he declined the role and didn't want to come out of retirement and travel from Hawaii to Washington to do the series. Who knows what the truth is, it's probably somewhere in between. I don't really have a problem with what we ended up with, since I always found Ontkean to be pretty wooden in the original series.

Ya'll are making me want to watch the revival again, and I really don't have the time to do that right now. Damn you guys.

[BurningBeard]

5 hours ago, TheVileOne said:

Some of that is interesting however:

 

  Hide contents

I was never really big into that Sarah Palmer subplot. At least from the outset, Sarah didn't come off as a malevolent entity who wanted to destroy her daughter...though I could be wrong there. 

 

Honestly, her performance in the original series is all the more terrifying and crazed and unhinged viewed in light of The Return. I thought it was a master-stroke personally

[John from Cincinnati]

Nine Emmy nominations. No nods for Best Limited Series or for Kyle's performance. Only things that have a shot of being on the main broadcast are writing and directing. It should win at least a couple of the technical awards. Part 8 specifically is up for editing, sound mixing, sound editing, and cinematography. 

All things considered, that's more recognition than I expected.

[TheVileOne]

If they didn't drag out Cooper being a mental invalid for over half the season, I'd probably be annoyed. I did enjoy him as DOPPLE-COOP-KILLER-BOB, but the lack of actual Dale Cooper was a major problem to me this season. I respect David Lynch putting his pure vision on the screen, but Dale Cooper is such an important character for Twin Peaks to me, and the whole season felt like a lot of bad carrot dangling and teasing. And then you had the fanatics week after week going "Coop is coming back! He's coming back next week! He's going to actually wake up!" And he never did really until right at the end. It felt like a cop out. 

In light of recent events, Twin Peaks isn't going to win a single Emmy.

Part 8 was a pretty amazing episode, so I feel like that one is worthy of recognition. It's one of the most amazing hours of TV ever filmed. It's the best thing to come out of the third season. 

[Throat]

If you mean in light of Lynch's Trump comments, I don't think that'll make much of a difference. I hope it'll at least get a technical award for part 8, which I agree is the best of the season.

I watched a couple of one-year-later retrospectives the other day. They were very positive takes. I still have mixed feelings about it. I did buy the blu-ray this week in a Prime Day lightning deal, though. I may be unsure about it, but it's still Twin Peaks. Or at least something that vaguely resembles it.

A frustrating, unsatisfying third season was better than no third season. Although for me to believe that, I have to ignore that the final episode erased the first two seasons. So cruel of Lynch and Frost to twist the knife like that.

[BurningBeard]

I think you'll get more of an understanding binge watching it. As stated I picked up on and questioned a lot of things

[TheVileOne]

Regarding Annie Blackburn:

She was mentioned in Final Dossier. Annie is still a mental vegetable and doesn't respond to the world around her for the last 25 years. She will only say that she's fine every day at 8:38 pm. She will have herself fed everyday, but other than that doesn't respond to the world around her, and doctors see no chance of her condition improving. 

In short, she's been a mental vegetable for 25 years. The series should've referenced or shown this in some form. Very disappointed, just like not bringing back Harry.

[BurningBeard]

I'm assuming that's in response to Cooper asking "How's Annie?"

[TheVileOne]

Yeah. Still think it should've been in the series since that's the pretty devastating moment we ended the show on, besides the reveals in The Missing Pieces. 

[Casey]

Lynch announced a boxset today on Twitter.

As for the collectibles/packaging...

Quote

A 21-disc collection, TWIN PEAKS: FROM Z TO A will be housed in packaging with an exterior adorned by a wraparound vista of haunting and majestic Douglas Fir trees. Once opened, a depiction of the infamous Red Room is revealed with its brown and crème chevron floor and brilliant red curtains. Sitting in front of the red curtain will be an exclusive die-cut acrylic figure of Laura Palmer kissing Special Agent Dale Cooper. This acrylic figure comes inside a plastic display holder held in place by magnets. Fans will have the option of leaving the figure in place inside The Red Room environment or removing and displaying it elsewhere. The plastic holder can also serve as an easel to display individual images from The Red Room Gallery, a curated set of 5” x 5” printed cards depicting memorable moments in The Red Room. Each package will also contain an individually numbered collectible certificate.

Content:

Quote

• From the extensive behind-the-scenes footage of David Lynch making the  A Limited Event Series (shot primarily by Jason S), 20-30 minute (approx.) pieces titled “Behind the Curtain” were edited and are included for each of the 18 Parts.
• A rare newly-shot interview of Kyle MacLachlan and Sheryl Lee who sit with longtime David Lynch collaborator Kristine McKenna to look back at their body of work on Twin Peaks, as well as Fire Walk With Me.
• In a newly-produced featurette, fans can go “On the Couch” with Harry and Kimmy as Harry Goaz and Kimmy Robertson share fond Twin Peaks memories.
• As an additional treat for fans of A Limited Event Series, a compilation of full-length, unedited versions of many of The Roadhouse Bar musical performances.
• The box set also includes one 4K UHD disc that includes “Part 8” of Twin Peaks: The Return along with a new ultra-high def transfer of both versions of the Twin Peakspilot, overseen by David Lynch himself.

 

Only $139.99. Not bad honestly - I'm considering it, even though I have all of the seasons + the Criterion version of Fire Walk With Me.

[John from Cincinnati]

As it concerns things I know I definitely shouldn't be spending that kind of money on, that's pretty tempting. 

[Casey]

5 minutes ago, West Newbury Bad Boy said:

As it concerns things I know I definitely shouldn't be spending that kind of money on, that's pretty tempting. 

There's only 25,000 of these box sets, so if it's still up for preorder next week - it shall be mine.

But on 10/15 they'll be releasing a box set with all three seasons (but not Fire Walk With Me/The Missing Pieces) called Twin Peaks: The Television Collection on DVD and Blu-Ray.

Edited August 22, 2019 by Casey