APRIL 2017 WRESTLING DISCUSSION

[Dolfan in NYC]

1 minute ago, JohnnyJ said:

So... the Vince biopic. I'm curious what a 90 minute movie made for non-wrestling audiences would look like. And who can play big and over the top enough to be a convincing Vince without resorting to caricature? 

An interesting story would be the lead up from him taking over WWWF to kicking out his dad to Wrestlemania I.  That's doable in 1:45 or so. 

Also:

 

[Matt D]

And then there's Gino. A lot of times with wrestlers who died young, especially ones where we only have limited amounts of footage, it's easy to overrate them. You sort of lose track of them in the myth. That's true with wrestlers who died a long time ago, not just ones that are young and not only ones that we don't have footage on. Look at Brody (more on him later). Gino was 23 in 1980. We have footage of him in Houston now back to 77 or so. He was a prodigy, absolutely. In 80-81-82, he's in the same conversation as someone like Buddy Rose, as a heatseeking heel who carried a territory. Granted, Gino had more to work with than Rose did since bigger names came through Houston, but the point remains. He had that same swagger, the willingness to stooge and bump big, the underlying cruelty, the big spots (his elbow off the ropes, the Flair flip to the floor, etc). And franky, I'm not sure there was anything better in wrestling in 81-82 than him and Tully together. Gino was so giving and so committed that every match with him is worthwhile. They just posted a 2/3 falls match with a young, bottom of the card (but billed from Houston) Gary Young and I wasn't expecting much at all from it, just Gino vs a prelim guy but it really was up there with a lot of the Buddy Rose vs a Prelim guy stuff from this period. Young came in game and Gino made him look like a million bucks. 

[(BP)]

11 minutes ago, JohnnyJ said:

So... the Vince biopic. I'm curious what a 90 minute movie made for non-wrestling audiences would look like. And who can play big and over the top enough to be a convincing Vince without resorting to caricature? 

 

Someone on here I think suggested Joel Edgerton and since then I've never been able to picture anyone else. 

[nate]

Michael Shannon would make a fun Vince.

[BurningBeard]

I'd never heard/seen Gino til WWE's WCCW documentary and I was immediately sad that we never got to see what he could do on national tv

[Matt D]

His Georgia stuff (Being national TV) is supposed to be really good but I haven't seen it. 

You know who else I've come to really enjoy? Heel Jim Duggan. I've convinced myself that the solution to the dearth of heels to wrestle Warrior in 90 would have been heel Duggan. He has maybe my favorite Mil Mascaras match (not necessarily the best but my favorite) and even though we haven't gotten too many of them yet, feels like the best possible Brody opponent. He was a big bumping, high energy, unorthodox in offense (he has this great jumping elbow, for instance) just manic heel. Also a great disgruntled, disrespectful promo. I mean obviously he stands out as a really solid standing tall babyface in Mid-South able to have tons of great brawls and power matches but it's the Southwest era heel work that has really stood out. We have a Dusty match too, and a match with a young babyface Landell, and a hoss match with a non-midget Ivan the Terrible who's obviously an undercard foreign heel but kind of gets over as a babyface just because Duggan's so well defined as a bad guy, and there's still some more to come.

[ARMDRAGON]

Ray Liotta could have nailed Vince.

[JohnnyJ]

Could Hugh Jackman pull it off?

Imagine the actor being in character on the set and someone sneezes. 

[Curt McGirt]

36 minutes ago, CreativeControl said:

I'd never heard/seen Gino til WWE's WCCW documentary and I was immediately sad that we never got to see what he could do on national tv

Did you catch the Heroes of World Class doc by any chance too? That one was a lot cooler. The story about Gino having a sugar bowl full of coke in his kitchen (just like the line in Goodfellas) is so fucked up. 

Incidentally the whole thing is on Youtube

Whoa, I FFed that to the Gino part and the story ref dude says about his death just dropped the hammer. Three times the amount of coke needed to overdose in his system... yeah, somebody whacked him out. 

[caley]

1 hour ago, JohnnyJ said:

So... the Vince biopic. I'm curious what a 90 minute movie made for non-wrestling audiences would look like. And who can play big and over the top enough to be a convincing Vince without resorting to caricature? 

 

 

[Victator]

10 minutes ago, caley said:

 

I remember watching this when it aired and I had no idea Nash was imitating Vince. Leave it to Russo to think the seven foot guy would be a master of disguise. 

[HumanChessgame]

J.K. Simmons as Vince.  His portrayal of Jameson in the Spiderman movies is damn close already.

[Roman]

The Simmons version needs a scene where he makes Sid cry because Sid mistimed a run-in.

[Craig H]

A friend and I talked about who would play Vince. I thought Josh Brolin would nail it.

I'm just wondering where that movie ends. It has to go over his childhood, taking over the business, killing territories, the steroid trial, and then it ends at...what, the WCW buyout? Has to be, right?

So who plays Shane and Steph? Do wrestlers play themselves or do actors play them?

Also, do we get a montage of Vince slamming 20 Monster energy drinks, ripping up scripts, and screaming in announcers ears during the broadcast of Raw?

And what movie will have more: "Fuck" in Big Lebowski or "Goddammit" in the Vince biopic

[RRR]

Don't forget The Montreal Screwjob. 

[zev]

4 hours ago, nate said:

Michael Shannon would make a fun Vince.

This works.

 

[Beech27]

2 hours ago, HumanChessgame said:

J.K. Simmons as Vince.  His portrayal of Jameson in the Spiderman movies is damn close already.

He's got the worryingly jacked/vascular old man look down already. 

[Technico Support]

9 minutes ago, Beech27 said:

He's got the worryingly jacked/vascular old man look down already. 

 

[Dolfan in NYC]

2 hours ago, Craig H said:

A friend and I talked about who would play Vince. I thought Josh Brolin would nail it.

I'm just wondering where that movie ends. It has to go over his childhood, taking over the business, killing territories, the steroid trial, and then it ends at...what, the WCW buyout? Has to be, right?

Scope, my man.  Too many biopics fail because they try to cover too large a time and never bother to tell a story well (Nixon, J. Edgar, Jobs).   You can acknowledge the accomplishments of a person while focusing in on a story that really examines how they think or what makes them tick (Lincoln, The Social Network, The King's Speech).

Remember, to the majority of people, they either don't know who Vince is, or have an extremely negative opinion of the man.  You have to introduce this man who, through, lying, cheating, sex, drugs, death, and craven manipulation has become a billionaire. You have to show people that Vince is an absolute heartless motherfucker AND a man who is easily worshipped. This is a VERY strange dichotomy and merits further examination.  

Vince stories you can tell:  Taking over WWWF; The Lead Up To Mania 1; The Steroids Trial; The Monday Night Wars; Over The Edge '99; or The Benoit Murder/Suicide.  

Any one of those paints Vince as a genius businessman, a charlatan, a gambler, a brutal realist, and a circus ringmaster.  

There's a fascinating tale in there, if it's allowed to be told, it could be amazing.  But it HAS to stay focused. 

[(BP)]

2 minutes ago, Dolfan in NYC said:

Scope, my man.  Too many biopics fail because they try to cover too large a time and never bother to tell a story well (Nixon, J. Edgar, Jobs).   You can acknowledge the accomplishments of a person while focusing in on a story that really examines how they think or what makes them tick (Lincoln, The Social Network, The King's Speech).

Remember, to the majority of people, they either don't know who Vince is, or have an extremely negative opinion of the man.  You have to introduce this man who, through, lying, cheating, sex, drugs, death, and craven manipulation has become a billionaire. You have to show people that Vince is an absolute heartless motherfucker AND a man who is easily worshipped. This is a VERY strange dichotomy and merits further examination.  

Vince stories you can tell:  Taking over WWWF; The Lead Up To Mania 1; The Steroids Trial; The Monday Night Wars; Over The Edge '99; or The Benoit Murder/Suicide.  

Any one of those paints Vince as a genius businessman, a charlatan, a gambler, a brutal realist, and a circus ringmaster.  

There's a fascinating tale in there, if it's allowed to be told, it could be amazing.  But it HAS to stay focused. 

I don't think we'll get any of that from a Vince-approved movie, but it sounds like a hell of a Ryan Murphy mini series one day. 

[Shibata Is My Homie]

4 hours ago, Matt D said:

His Georgia stuff (Being national TV) is supposed to be really good but I haven't seen it. 

You know who else I've come to really enjoy? Heel Jim Duggan. I've convinced myself that the solution to the dearth of heels to wrestle Warrior in 90 would have been heel Duggan. He has maybe my favorite Mil Mascaras match (not necessarily the best but my favorite) and even though we haven't gotten too many of them yet, feels like the best possible Brody opponent. He was a big bumping, high energy, unorthodox in offense (he has this great jumping elbow, for instance) just manic heel. Also a great disgruntled, disrespectful promo. I mean obviously he stands out as a really solid standing tall babyface in Mid-South able to have tons of great brawls and power matches but it's the Southwest era heel work that has really stood out. We have a Dusty match too, and a match with a young babyface Landell, and a hoss match with a non-midget Ivan the Terrible who's obviously an undercard foreign heel but kind of gets over as a babyface just because Duggan's so well defined as a bad guy, and there's still some more to come.

Duggan within a 8 month period after leaving GCW was 10000% better when he showed up for Watts. Really surprised Ole didn't see the potential Duggan had.

[Technico Support]

Maybe they'll tell Vince's story through the eyes of a more likable third party a la The People vs Larry Flynt

[PetrolCB]

Dave Bautista can play Vince. Get some star credibility. 

[Zakk_Sabbath]

6 hours ago, ARMDRAGON said:

Ray Liotta could have nailed Vince.

Goodfellas, as evidenced by my avatar, is my absolute favorite movie of all time. Anyone else but Liotta as Vince is gonna disappoint the hell out of me now. I mean, dude, tell me this isn't Vince:

They gotta just CGI him to make him younger like they did with Downey in Avengers, pop a canary blue suit on him, and teach him to WHATAMANEUVERRRR

[SirSmUgly]

I am down for Feud: Ted and Vince only if it portrays Vince as unhealthily consumed with Ted Turner while Ted is too busy taking an asskicking from the AOL merger to notice. Vince McMahon's inability to accept his relative lack of importance in the media and entertainment game is the most compelling thing about him from a narrative standpoint.