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Raw Is 友達の祭典 - 2/13/17


Niners Fan in CT

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Samoa Joe's been made to look like a damn star, and I'm HERE. FOR. IT. His NXT run was quite good, but post-ROH, I thought his first year in TNA was the best he's been booked. WWE is on the road to surpassing that if these first few weeks are any indication. 

I absolutely marked out when he told Sami to "put some respect on my name." 

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23 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

titles changing hands frequently can happen.  I was fine with The Rock and Mankind doing this sorta thing.  I don't think they devalue the title, it depends on how it's booked. Like, I thought at Hell in a Cell Sasha should have won but all the other matches I didn't have an issue with.

It's far worse when the title is being vacated every other week or random dudes are winning the I.C. title for no reason just to lose to another guy. That was the WCW 2000/RAW Attitude Era stuff that was pretty bad.

Look at the UFC women's division. There was a lot of belts changing hands. It happens. But now maybe they've got a dominant champion.

 

My sense with the Women's Division for a while now has been that it exists on the level it does solely so Vince can make Charlotte into as big a star as possible. Everything that happens with the others in the Division is part of a road that always leads back to Charlotte, and when she's gone over everyone on RAW, they'll move her to Smackdown and she'll stack up title reigns there. I've no doubt that they've already mapped out a path to have her surpass Ric's 16 title reigns within the next 5 years (although at this rate, it could be Wrestlemania 35).

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I love Samoa Joe, but if you want me to hate him, have him kick the shit out of Sami Zayn. (still love it)

 

I'll also expand on my Bayley offense comment earlier.

 

It was so much more believable because I think she was more into bc she knew she was winning.

 

Forearm strikes were awesome, everything felt great. 

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Rusev/Sami was good and I dug the attack on Sami by Joe. The KO/Jericho segment and turn was good stuff.

Charlotte/Bayley was damn good. So pleased to see Bayley finally with the belt. Hopefully this isn't just a rinse and repeat of the Sasha feud and Bayley actually takes Charlotte in at the ppv rematch.

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That was one of the best heel turns I've ever seen.  And that's living in an era where I've seen it all and it's damn near impossible to be shocked by something that you know is coming.  That look on Jericho's face when he knew he was fucked followed by those kids freaking out in the front row....THAT is why I continue to watch pro wrestling.

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13 minutes ago, RIPPA said:

Hoo Boy

Always a treat when you come to the RAW thread less than two hours after the show and it is already on page 4

I'm just hoping we get props for spelling Bayley's name right.

Meanwhile, I look forward to the day when Charlotte becomes 16 time Women's Champ. Over/Under on that date is the day after Mania, 2022. Or should I say Before/After?

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Hey, what was the deal with Enzo tonight?  That part where Cesaro tried to throw him over the ropes and he didn't make it, so he just jumped over the ropes on his own, then shrugged like he didn't really care how shitty it looked, only to pan to Cesaro staring DAGGERS at him, then KILLING him with a vicious stomp right to the stomach.  Then Enzo kinda looked like he sandbagged him on the next lift.  'twas BAD.  And I'm a big Enzo fan.

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5 minutes ago, zev said:

Meanwhile, I look forward to the day when Charlotte becomes 16 time Women's Champ. Over/Under on that date is the day after Mania, 2022.

Not sure if that's supposed to be comedic exaggeration, but she'd have to actually slow her rate of losing and regaining the title to stretch it out to 2022. She's had four title reigns in the last year. That puts her on track to hit sixteen some time in 2020.

 

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1 hour ago, Fallacy! said:

 

He's GOT to be trolling. I refuse to believe he doesn't realize everyone thinks he's a smarmy little shit.

Matthews has been running this gimmick all weekend. He's been going at it with David Penzer and Jeremy Borash. 

 

Also:

 

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2 minutes ago, tbarrie said:

Not sure if that's supposed to be comedic exaggeration, but she'd have to actually slow her rate of losing and regaining the title to stretch it out to 2022. She's had four title reigns in the last year. That puts her on track to hit sixteen some time in 2020.

 

Shit, Charlotte could hit sixteen this year if they felt like it.  That's why these numbers and facts are so useless.  And that's what makes Charlotte's matches pretty dull to me.  You know they are committed.  You know whatever meaningless record they want to hit, they will push towards.  They've gone too far to stop now.  And giving Bayley her moment now when they could have so easily built to WrestleMania (which would have been an all-time moment) confirms that.

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1 hour ago, Fallacy! said:

Jesus, I don't like women's wrestling. That's it. Holding that opinion shouldn't call for a congressional investigation, or even derail a weekly RAW thread. Let's all try to move on with our lives.

I mean, you came in with a "I don't watch Womens Wrestling much, but I'm going to complain about a pre-established finisher everyone else is cool with but I'm gonna take issue with it" opening, in a time frame were the average womens main event on Raw tend to be annual MOTYCs. What reaction were you expecting exactly?

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God, when Jericho said "hey you got me a new list" I was like "Oh Noooooo". I mean I knew the break up had to happen but it was like please don't happen. But that was probably best segment of television they've done in who knows how many years. I can't remember the last time they did a bit of a television that had me that into it. For a brief moment I was like "I really hate that bastard Owens". I really miss that kind of feeling in my wrestling fandom. Not hating someone like Roman because they're being pushed down our throat and we're expected to just accept it. But hating someone because they've done something so despicable.

Bravo Kevin. Bravo.

I also loved the women's match. But I really hope Bayley breaks the damn streak at the next PPV. This stupid Charlotte wins back at the PPV because she loses at RAW thing is just so dumb and really hurts the credibility of anyone who beats her. Bayley honestly can be their female John Cena and the last thing they need to do is screw it up with yo yo title reigns like they did with Sasha.

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2 hours ago, Fallacy! said:

I usually skip through the women's matches, but is Bayley's finisher seriously a belly-to-belly suplex?

A match that includes a top rope frankensteiner and standing moonsault off the guardrail, ends in a fucking BELLY TO BELLY SUPLEX?

That mentality is why so much of wrestling sucks. Every other finisher is the overdrive. 
There is no reason a well executed Belly to Belly cannot be a finisher. Magnum TA's Belly to Belly looked better than most finishers now. 

The Emmalina thing was stupid. Some Vince Russo shit. How are the women booked so badly with only two segments?

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30 minutes ago, El Dragon said:

I mean, you came in with a "I don't watch Womens Wrestling much, but I'm going to complain about a pre-established finisher everyone else is cool with but I'm gonna take issue with it" opening, in a time frame were the average women's main event on Raw tend to be annual MOTYCs. What reaction were you expecting exactly?

To be fair to Fallacy!, Bailey's finisher doesn't quite have the snap of Douglas's Belly To Belly or the impact of Magnum's, so there are times when Bailey hits her move for the win and I have a really rough time believing that someone should stay down for a three count after taking that.

Especially if it is the culmination of a hope sequence where she's been getting the shit kicked out of her and suddenly flurries with one or two baby spots before taking it home after the heel fucks up...

It's the logic of a flash finisher that has been winning championships for decades suddenly being questioned apparently because a woman uses it that baffles me.  Maybe I am losing something through the translation of his dislike for women's matches.

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44 minutes ago, tbarrie said:

Not sure if that's supposed to be comedic exaggeration, but she'd have to actually slow her rate of losing and regaining the title to stretch it out to 2022. She's had four title reigns in the last year. That puts her on track to hit sixteen some time in 2020.

 

Completely serious. I figure Bayley faces Sasha for a stretch over the title, and whenever the draft occurs you'll see a couple new contenders come over from SDL or NXT. Charlotte won't be in the title programs every month this year or next.

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15 minutes ago, J.T. said:

To be fair to Fallacy!, Bailey's finisher doesn't quite have the snap of Douglas's Belly To Belly or the impact of Magnum's, so there are times when Bailey hits her move for the win and I have a really rough time believing that someone should stay down for a three count after taking that.

Well I think that comes down to her being a woman. Its not going to have the same impact. But the same impact is not needed. 

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5 minutes ago, Victator said:

Well I think that comes down to her being a woman. Its not going to have the same impact. But the same impact is not needed. 

I'm not really saying comparison wise to a man doing the same move, though. 

The Belly To Bailey almost looks like a judo throw instead of a suplex and a slow motion judo throw at that.  It shouldn't be enough to put someone like Nia Jax down for the count, much less Sasha or Charlotte and the best way to protect workers in a loss is letting them get hit by a finisher that says, "Yeah, there is no way she should get up from that."

By the same token, I don't think the Belly To Bailey has to actually kill people in order to look like it kills people.  She just has to hit the move so it doesn't look like she's following through so much that she's setting the victim taking the move on the mat rather than planting them there.

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