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Elsalvajeloco

UFC 208: Holm vs. De Randamie (2/11/2017) - Brooklyn, NY (Barclays Center)

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UFC 208: Holm vs. De Randamie 
February 11, 2017
Brooklyn, NY (Barclays Center)

UFC Women's Featherweight Championship: Holly Holm (144.4) vs. Germaine de Randamie (143.6) (vacant) - De Randamie, DEC (unanimous)
Anderson Silva (185) vs. Derek Brunson (186) - Silva, DEC (unanimous)
Ronaldo Souza (185.8) vs. Tim Boetsch (185.8) - Souza, SUB (kimura), R1 (3:41)
Glover Teixeira (205.2) vs. Jared Cannonier (204.4) - Teixeira, DEC (unanimous)
Dustin Poirier (155.2) vs. Jim Miller (154.6) - Poirier, DEC (majority)

Fox Sports 1 Preliminary Card:
Randy Brown (170.6) vs. Belal Muhammad (170.2) - Muhammad, DEC (unanimous)
Wilson Reis (125.2) vs. Yuta Sasaki (125.4) - Reis, DEC (unanimous)
Nik Lentz (155.8) vs. Islam Makhachev (155) - Makhachev, DEC (unanimous)
Phillipe Nover (145.6) vs. Rick Glenn (145.8) - Glenn, DEC (split)

Fight Pass Preliminary Card:
Ryan LaFlare (170.6) vs. Roan Carneiro (170) - LaFlare, DEC (unanimous)

Event Bonuses ($50,000):
Performance of the Night: Ronaldo Souza
Fight of the Night: Dustin Poirier vs. Jim Miller

Attendance: 15,628
Gate: $2,275,105
Buyrate

Cancelled Bouts:
José Aldo vs. Max Holloway - Bout Nixed
Gilbert Burns vs. Paul Felder - Injury to Burns
Derrick Lewis vs. Travis Browne - Bout Moved to Another Card
George Sullivan vs. Randy Brown - Sullivan Flagged for Potential USADA Violation
Ian McCall vs. Neil Seery - Seery Withdrew From Bout
Luiz Henrique vs. Marcin Tybura - Henrique Removed by Commission
Marcin Tybura vs. Justin Willis - Willis Deemed Medically Unfit to Fight
Ian McCall vs. Jarred Brooks - McCall Removed Due to Illness

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Call me bias, but as a Muay Thai practitioner, I am going for Germaine.

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37 minutes ago, Kyuubi said:

Call me bias, but as a Muay Thai practitioner, I am going for Germaine.

Holly's performance in the Shevchenko bout puts some doubt on how she can handle what Germaine brings on the feet. It's one thing to lose to a very talented kickboxer like Valentina, but to lose while having a pronounced size advantage is another. If Holly doesn't bring up offensive grappling game into the mix against GdR, her performance can be even worse than what happened last July.

That's why I like the direction female MMA for the most part is headed in right now compared to 10 years ago. You can go from Ronda and Miesha to Valentina and Germaine in a moment's notice. That wasn't something that routinely happened back when female MMA was just about popularity over depth and skill. The more female MMA moves away from everyone is merely okay at everything, the better it will be. Something like Andrade vs. Hill is proof positive of that.

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22 hours ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

Holly's performance in the Shevchenko bout puts some doubt on how she can handle what Germaine brings on the feet. It's one thing to lose to a very talented kickboxer like Valentina, but to lose while having a pronounced size advantage is another. If Holly doesn't bring up offensive grappling game into the mix against GdR, her performance can be even worse than what happened last July.

I think Holm gets smoked in this fight.  This is like Shane Battier in a game of 1-on-1 with LeBron James.  Shane Battier is a skilled basketball player with nothing dynamic about his game.  LeBron is a skilled player who is bigger, stronger, and faster in a way that is going to negate all of Battier's skills.  Skill wise they are comprable, but those skills aren't going to stop an athlete the caliber of LeBron from dunking on his face if he makes a mistake.  Holm has all the skills, but she isn't the type of fighter who is going to make a fighter with comparable skills worry about her power.  De Randamie's size and power advantage is too large for Holm to just stand in the pocket and strike for 5 rounds.  If de Randamie makes a mistake, Holm will score points towards a decision, if Holm makes a mistake de Randamie may just end her night.

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3 hours ago, supremebve said:

I think Holm gets smoked in this fight.  This is like Shane Battier in a game of 1-on-1 with LeBron James.  Shane Battier is a skilled basketball player with nothing dynamic about his game.  LeBron is a skilled player who is bigger, stronger, and faster in a way that is going to negate all of Battier's skills.  Skill wise they are comprable, but those skills aren't going to stop an athlete the caliber of LeBron from dunking on his face if he makes a mistake.  Holm has all the skills, but she isn't the type of fighter who is going to make a fighter with comparable skills worry about her power.  De Randamie's size and power advantage is too large for Holm to just stand in the pocket and strike for 5 rounds.  If de Randamie makes a mistake, Holm will score points towards a decision, if Holm makes a mistake de Randamie may just end her night.

I think there is sort of a boom or bust thing with Holly's offensive game. Since it happened recently, I will use Grasso/Herrig as an example. Felice Herrig was landing that straight right for 2 and 1/2 rounds anytime she wanted to. The back half of the final round when Grasso woke up and did something that backed Herrig up, that's when that straight right didn't factor in at all. I think with Holly, her reliance on that straight left (especially against orthodox fighters) is going to bring her a lot of luck or a lot of disappointment. That straight left opens up her kicking game, and she can push off using that front kick to create distance that she wants to fight from. She can create counters from that as well. If she isn't landing that punch, she's so ineffective because that shuts down so much of her other game. That's why I believe that she has to threaten Germaine with the takedown because she probably brings in a strength advantage in terms of grappling. However, getting someone down and then being effective on top in guard and not being stood back up is something different. Since this is the second straight fight where most likely she won't be the better overall striker, her success is going to come from being able to mix it up. I think she was so startled that Valentina for a majority of that fight did what Holly wanted to do. She can't let Germaine do that to her.

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As you say, "she can't let Germaine do that to her". Agreed 100%, however, I also don't think she has a prayer of being able to prevent Germaine from doing pretty much whatever she wants. If Holly's best hope is to get to the ground, the fight's already over.

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28 minutes ago, OSJ said:

As you say, "she can't let Germaine do that to her". Agreed 100%, however, I also don't think she has a prayer of being able to prevent Germaine from doing pretty much whatever she wants. If Holly's best hope is to get to the ground, the fight's already over.

I don't think Holly's approach is going to be that of like Anna Elmose or Larissa Pacheco, who I don't think should have ever made to the UFC based on who she beat in the Brazilian regional scene. Those girls didn't have any other option but to walk straight into the woodchipper. I think Holly is talented enough to fight a more tactical fight. It might be a little on the boring side, but there are different ways to fight to allow the momentum not to slide all the way to GdR's side. Because many of her fights have been so one sided, I don't think Holly knew how to deal with someone who could apply her strategy better than her. After that first round against Shevchenko, she missed as much as her opponents did prior to that fight. In this fight against Germaine, she might also have to deal with the fact that she doesn't have a great chin. Her style in MMA has served her better than maybe in boxing because her legs have served as an extra jab to create distance. That has allowed her to protect her chin much better. The problem is that at some point you're going to face another talented striker and more importantly a striker talented enough to get closer to you. How does she deal with that? Because in boxing, that ended up with her losing via KO. Now, she has to worry about knees and kicks as well.

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That loss to Schevchenko was so utterly damning that I can't get behind Holly one bit in the main event. Every time I read a Connor Ruebusch article trashing Holm's decade-and-a-half of bad boxing technique I believe even less. The knocks on her, for the record, are that she generates *no* power in her hands and has this weird lean-in stance that prevents her from closing distance well. I don't know if I can wrap my head around Germaine de Randamie, UFC Champion, but I'm expecting it.

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I think if someone told you the week of UFC 193 that Ronda Rousey and Holly Holm could possibly be a combined 0-4 a year and a half after their fight, they would have said, "So Cyborg came in and dominated as champ?"

 

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47 minutes ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

I think if someone told you the week of UFC 193 that Ronda Rousey and Holly Holm could possibly be a combined 0-4 a year and a half after their fight, they would have said, "So Cyborg came in and dominated as champ?"

 

I hate to say this as a New Mexico guy, (and Holly is such a nice person), but she's little more than a one-trick pony. The only power punch she has is her straight left and the occasional kick. If you're stupid enough to stand directly in front of her in the killzone (yes, Ronda, I'm looking at you), you're going to get hit and possibly KTFO. On the other hand, if you fight from an angle as any Muay Thai practitioner will, you avoid her power and can pretty much pick her apart at will. This is exactly what I expect will happen. First round, Holly tries her usual stuff to no effect. 2nd round Germaine comes in for the kill and knocks her the fuck out.

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9 minutes ago, OSJ said:

 If you're stupid enough to run head first into the killzone (yes, Ronda, I'm looking at you), you're going to get hit and possibly KTFO. 

FTFY.

I'm 100% with you on this one.  Holm doesn't really have many technical weaknesses, but she doesn't have much stopping power.  It is hard to be successful at the top of a division if none of your opponents are worried about you stopping them.  Just think of all the fighters who got to the top of a division by running through the entire division, but couldn't seem to finish anyone once they got a belt.  GSP, Aldo, and even Anderson Silva had a hard time stopping their opponents once they were exclusively fighting elite opponents.  If a fighter can't hurt their opponent, they aren't going to be on top for very long.  Holly Holm is really good at what she does, but she doesn't have the kind of power needed to consistently win against elite competition.  

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The Germaine and Holm fight I'm not sure which way I'm leaning for the fight. Germaine has a ton of power but no great wins and lost her two fights against her best opponents Nunes/Budd. Holm I fear she might be mentally broken after losing to Tate and Shevchenko.

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@Hail Sabin 

I don't think with Holly it's a question of being mentally broken as it is that she's really not all that and a bag of chips. When it was announced that she was fighting Ronda, all of us fans here in New Mexico started digging a grave. We really thought she had zero chance in hell. The only way that would win that fight was if Ronda was stupid enough to stand in the killzone (directly in front) and there was simply no way that a fighter of her caliber would do something so stupid. Hahaha, what the fuck, she ran head first into the one place where Holly could unleash what power she has. Yes, Germaine has lost to Nunes, so what, I think as time goes on we're going to be talking about Nunes as an all-time great. Germaine is simply the worst type of match for Holly, everything Holly does, she can do much better and don't even get me started on how a good Muay Thai fighter can make a boxer's life a living hell.

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9 hours ago, OSJ said:

@Hail Sabin 

I don't think with Holly it's a question of being mentally broken as it is that she's really not all that and a bag of chips. When it was announced that she was fighting Ronda, all of us fans here in New Mexico started digging a grave. We really thought she had zero chance in hell. The only way that would win that fight was if Ronda was stupid enough to stand in the killzone (directly in front) and there was simply no way that a fighter of her caliber would do something so stupid. Hahaha, what the fuck, she ran head first into the one place where Holly could unleash what power she has. Yes, Germaine has lost to Nunes, so what, I think as time goes on we're going to be talking about Nunes as an all-time great. Germaine is simply the worst type of match for Holly, everything Holly does, she can do much better and don't even get me started on how a good Muay Thai fighter can make a boxer's life a living hell.

The thing I know Holm has in her corner is Jackson/Wink will come up with a great gameplan and she will follow it no matter what. I'll probably figure out who I will pick right before I post my picks on here. Interesting Vegas odds have the fight almost a pick 'em.

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36 minutes ago, Hail Sabin said:

The thing I know Holm has in her corner is Jackson/Wink will come up with a great gameplan and she will follow it no matter what. I'll probably figure out who I will pick right before I post my picks on here. Interesting Vegas odds have the fight almost a pick 'em.

Well my friend, I've got $20 right here that says a great gameplan doesn't mean jackshit if you can't execute it. $20 on Germaine, are we on?

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