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JANUARY 2017 WRESTLING DISCUSSION


RIPPA
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5 hours ago, Curt McGirt said:

Someone has to be REALLY bored if they wound up writing a three-page list describing all the Lodi signs. That's just ridiculous.

Is there a similar page with all of Daffney's t-shirts during the David Flair/Crowbar era?

 

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Lodi said I cut a good promo and I enjoyed him on television when I was a youngin. So AOK in my book. Uh if that's relevant. I just wanted to put myself over on what a good promo I am. It's fun coming around these parts every now and then after all these years. Hail DVDVR.

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The latest Mania card speculation from the newest WON

Spoiler tag due to size. And again this is also speculation from Dave based on what he has been told. Both the Rumble stuff and Mania card will change 8420924 more times

Spoiler

The key in charting the winner is to look at WrestleMania. Traditionally, the Rumble winner will be in the title match at Mania. With two brands, that’s two titles. Also, with two PPVs, the Smackdown-branded Elimination Chamber and the Raw-branded Fast Lane, there will be title matches involving both brands’ champions taking place before Mania.

The plans at this point are that neither Kevin Owens nor A.J. Styles will be champions going into WrestleMania. Smackdown has an Elimination Chamber match, meaning six guys will be in, so if John Cena wins the title at the Rumble, and that’s being teased (although they did downplay the tying of the Ric Flair record this past week), that doesn’t mean he’ll retain it in the Chamber match.

The Mania lineup at this point is looking like Goldberg vs. Lesnar, Undertaker vs. Roman Reigns, HHH vs. Seth Rollins, Jericho vs. Owens, Wyatt vs. Orton, Show vs. Shaquille O’Neal and Charlotte vs. Bayley vs. Sasha Banks vs. Nia Jax as the Raw women’s title match. The key is the Rumble winner is likely, although they could swerve, to be the person who will challenge for either the Universal title or WWE title.

The only Smackdown match on that list is Orton vs. Wyatt, and it’s not a secret that Wyatt was scheduled for a title run in 2017. That immediately puts both of them in contention, and if one wins, the other would be favored to win the Chamber match. There’s a story that just started going around about Orton winning the Rumble and Wyatt winning the Chamber match. If that doesn’t happen, it would be because plans changed. Even though historically the booking before Mania always gets out and it almost never changed (it changes for other reasons, such as injuries or guys quitting, but that’s usually known as well), with the increase in social media, my feeling is nothing is a lock until it happens. I doubt we’ll see major destination changes, in the sense the top of the card will probably be pretty close to as is slated now, but how to get there could change.

On the Raw side, Goldberg vs. Lesnar, Undertaker vs. Reigns or Jericho vs. Owens would likely be the title match. Goldberg’s storyline explicitly mentions coming after the title. Owens vs. Jericho would make more sense as the U.S. title match since Owens would figure to win if Jericho is still going to tour over the summer.

Coming off the Rumble, or at least when the Fast Lane main event is announced, that should make the Raw title direction obvious, unless it’s Reigns vs. Goldberg at Fast Lane and Owens isn’t figured in, at which point it won’t be as clear.

Among the key guys, the obvious guys not on the list of matches are Cena, Styles, Balor, Dean Ambrose and Strowman of guys that will likely be in key matches. Cena vs. Samoa Joe was definitely an idea that was pitched, and made sense based on a few things we’ve heard, but we’ve never heard a confirmation on that. There are rumors of Styles vs. Shane McMahon, and Styles did complain about the idea of the Elimination Chamber match to Shane and neither have anything going. As noted before, Goldberg agreeing to stay past one match may have saved Lesnar from this year’s Shane program and Shane pitched for that idea and they had started in that direction before it was dropped cold.

Strowman is harder to figure, as he’s clearly being pushed for something big. They’ve teased the idea of doing spots with him with Undertaker and Show at the Rumble. But all the guys you’d think they are building him up for, Goldberg, Lesnar, Undertaker, Reigns or Show, are all taken at this point. He could be put in there for the Andre Battle Royal, and perhaps take that one (at one point that was the idea last year but the feeling at the time is he wasn’t ready), and then work with one of the aforementioned names after Mania in a top program. One would think he’ll play monster in the Rumble, and there will be a story built from his elimination to take him to his next destiny.

I could see the Smackdown women’s title in a multiple person match, except you don’t want both women’s titles up in the same type of match. Nikki Bella and Becky Lynch are the most over of the women on the brand, but both are faces. Nikki has been kept away from the title ever since the brand split, and they’ve been feeding her heels to fill her time staying out of that picture, so her chasing would be new.

Undertaker vs. Reigns is notable because Vince McMahon made the call to go from the original Undertaker vs. Cena direction to this match. On paper, this would make it a lock that nobody is coming close to the boos Reigns will be getting on this show. Regardless of the outcome, this to me only makes sense if the plan is an all-out Reigns heel turn and use this as the springboard. Otherwise, the idea of Undertaker beating him and then endorsing him won’t work, because Daniel Bryan and Rock endorsed him and it didn’t work. Undertaker losing to him unless the match is dramatically perfect will only get him more heel heat.

With Balor returning, they do have someone who perhaps can be a top face, since Seth Rollins, even though he’s in a great position the next few months, seems to have been botched as far as being the top of the brand face. Then again, Smackdown had Ambrose in that spot when Cena was gone and everything was fine.

The problem the past few months, is for full-time on the road, they only had two they had in that top slot, Reigns and Rollins, and Jericho and Owens couldn’t be turned early or it would kill the timing of their angle. Still, we’ve heard nothing about a Reigns turn and it’s always the idea that he gets cheered on the house shows and it’s only the vocal minority that boo him. Plus, they’re comfortable since the years of Cena being booed and also being the biggest arena draw and merchandise seller have taught them not to overreact to the television the PPV crowd responses.

So that build all starts this weekend.

An angle for HHH vs. Rollins is expected this weekend, where Rollins finally gets some revenge and sets up HHH finally appearing as a television character. Rollins won’t be a participant in the Rumble, unless something changes the day of the show, since he lost his spot in storyline to Zayn on Raw due to manipulations from HHH and Stephanie. Smackdown has also teased something with Jerry Lawler (who will be announcing the Rumble match itself) and Dolph Ziggler, which is likely for the Rumble match.

 

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I saw that this morning as well and really hope that some of that card is not correct or changes because it does not get me interested in Mania, of course there could be matches made with those in the still need to figure out stuff for pile that could be intriguing and interesting but if that's what is in the cards right now it's a pretty uninspired WM 

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46 minutes ago, RIPPA said:

The latest Mania card speculation from the newest WON

Spoiler tag due to size. And again this is also speculation from Dave based on what he has been told. Both the Rumble stuff and Mania card will change 8420924 more times

  Hide contents

The key in charting the winner is to look at WrestleMania. Traditionally, the Rumble winner will be in the title match at Mania. With two brands, that’s two titles. Also, with two PPVs, the Smackdown-branded Elimination Chamber and the Raw-branded Fast Lane, there will be title matches involving both brands’ champions taking place before Mania.

The plans at this point are that neither Kevin Owens nor A.J. Styles will be champions going into WrestleMania. Smackdown has an Elimination Chamber match, meaning six guys will be in, so if John Cena wins the title at the Rumble, and that’s being teased (although they did downplay the tying of the Ric Flair record this past week), that doesn’t mean he’ll retain it in the Chamber match.

The Mania lineup at this point is looking like Goldberg vs. Lesnar, Undertaker vs. Roman Reigns, HHH vs. Seth Rollins, Jericho vs. Owens, Wyatt vs. Orton, Show vs. Shaquille O’Neal and Charlotte vs. Bayley vs. Sasha Banks vs. Nia Jax as the Raw women’s title match. The key is the Rumble winner is likely, although they could swerve, to be the person who will challenge for either the Universal title or WWE title.

The only Smackdown match on that list is Orton vs. Wyatt, and it’s not a secret that Wyatt was scheduled for a title run in 2017. That immediately puts both of them in contention, and if one wins, the other would be favored to win the Chamber match. There’s a story that just started going around about Orton winning the Rumble and Wyatt winning the Chamber match. If that doesn’t happen, it would be because plans changed. Even though historically the booking before Mania always gets out and it almost never changed (it changes for other reasons, such as injuries or guys quitting, but that’s usually known as well), with the increase in social media, my feeling is nothing is a lock until it happens. I doubt we’ll see major destination changes, in the sense the top of the card will probably be pretty close to as is slated now, but how to get there could change.

On the Raw side, Goldberg vs. Lesnar, Undertaker vs. Reigns or Jericho vs. Owens would likely be the title match. Goldberg’s storyline explicitly mentions coming after the title. Owens vs. Jericho would make more sense as the U.S. title match since Owens would figure to win if Jericho is still going to tour over the summer.

Coming off the Rumble, or at least when the Fast Lane main event is announced, that should make the Raw title direction obvious, unless it’s Reigns vs. Goldberg at Fast Lane and Owens isn’t figured in, at which point it won’t be as clear.

Among the key guys, the obvious guys not on the list of matches are Cena, Styles, Balor, Dean Ambrose and Strowman of guys that will likely be in key matches. Cena vs. Samoa Joe was definitely an idea that was pitched, and made sense based on a few things we’ve heard, but we’ve never heard a confirmation on that. There are rumors of Styles vs. Shane McMahon, and Styles did complain about the idea of the Elimination Chamber match to Shane and neither have anything going. As noted before, Goldberg agreeing to stay past one match may have saved Lesnar from this year’s Shane program and Shane pitched for that idea and they had started in that direction before it was dropped cold.

Strowman is harder to figure, as he’s clearly being pushed for something big. They’ve teased the idea of doing spots with him with Undertaker and Show at the Rumble. But all the guys you’d think they are building him up for, Goldberg, Lesnar, Undertaker, Reigns or Show, are all taken at this point. He could be put in there for the Andre Battle Royal, and perhaps take that one (at one point that was the idea last year but the feeling at the time is he wasn’t ready), and then work with one of the aforementioned names after Mania in a top program. One would think he’ll play monster in the Rumble, and there will be a story built from his elimination to take him to his next destiny.

I could see the Smackdown women’s title in a multiple person match, except you don’t want both women’s titles up in the same type of match. Nikki Bella and Becky Lynch are the most over of the women on the brand, but both are faces. Nikki has been kept away from the title ever since the brand split, and they’ve been feeding her heels to fill her time staying out of that picture, so her chasing would be new.

Undertaker vs. Reigns is notable because Vince McMahon made the call to go from the original Undertaker vs. Cena direction to this match. On paper, this would make it a lock that nobody is coming close to the boos Reigns will be getting on this show. Regardless of the outcome, this to me only makes sense if the plan is an all-out Reigns heel turn and use this as the springboard. Otherwise, the idea of Undertaker beating him and then endorsing him won’t work, because Daniel Bryan and Rock endorsed him and it didn’t work. Undertaker losing to him unless the match is dramatically perfect will only get him more heel heat.

With Balor returning, they do have someone who perhaps can be a top face, since Seth Rollins, even though he’s in a great position the next few months, seems to have been botched as far as being the top of the brand face. Then again, Smackdown had Ambrose in that spot when Cena was gone and everything was fine.

The problem the past few months, is for full-time on the road, they only had two they had in that top slot, Reigns and Rollins, and Jericho and Owens couldn’t be turned early or it would kill the timing of their angle. Still, we’ve heard nothing about a Reigns turn and it’s always the idea that he gets cheered on the house shows and it’s only the vocal minority that boo him. Plus, they’re comfortable since the years of Cena being booed and also being the biggest arena draw and merchandise seller have taught them not to overreact to the television the PPV crowd responses.

So that build all starts this weekend.

An angle for HHH vs. Rollins is expected this weekend, where Rollins finally gets some revenge and sets up HHH finally appearing as a television character. Rollins won’t be a participant in the Rumble, unless something changes the day of the show, since he lost his spot in storyline to Zayn on Raw due to manipulations from HHH and Stephanie. Smackdown has also teased something with Jerry Lawler (who will be announcing the Rumble match itself) and Dolph Ziggler, which is likely for the Rumble match.

 

The Undertaker vs. Roman Reigns would be good in ring but more for the crowd reactions against Roman Reigns and especially when he wins. You will like Roman through this mega push!

The difference in popularity from Roman in the Shield to singles in 2015-2017 is big. Booking hasn't helped the Roman Empire (c), the Big Dog (c) and the Juggernaut(c)!!!!

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1 minute ago, Technico Support said:

So really the whole picture is cloudy until after the February PPVs.  But "take the belts off he fresh faces (Owens & Styles) and put them on established names in time for Mania" is WWE booking 101.

I understand why for Kevin Owens. Shame for AJ "I am phenomenal" Styles, he's right. Best wrestler in the WWE. Amazing first year for the company.

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7 minutes ago, The Natural said:

I understand why for Kevin Owens. Shame for AJ "I am phenomenal" Styles, he's right. Best wrestler in the WWE. Amazing first year for the company.

Owens is seriously great but a world champion is not booked as THE top guy in the company unless he's muscular and gives Vince a chub.  So Owens is a world title holder in a midcard comedy act instead, just keeping it warm until they can try to coronate The Big Dog for the umpteenth time.

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What's funny is that the current stuff with them (meaning Orton and Bray) is the most I have actively cared about either in awhile.

Problem is I don't want to see either against each other.

Of course - we have long since past the point where Mania is going to be a card taylored for what I want in wrestling

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Has there ever been a thread or any discussion on the Wrestling Gold series? It's basically a 5 dvd set of old SCW, Memphis and AWA matches but you can switch to alternate commentary and get Cornette and Meltzer talking about the matches, promotions, etc. Great stuff. It has the legendary Savage/Poffo vs. R&R Express match that saw Macho piledrive Ricky Morton through a table in Memphis.

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1 minute ago, cwoy2j said:

One thing I learned from that series is that while Gino Hernandez was a great heel, he was not exactly athletic. His top rope elbow would make even Jerry Sags and CM Punk cringe.

You'll also learn that Bob Sweetan might have been the ugliest wrestler in history

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Just now, Technico Support said:

You'll also learn that Bob Sweetan might have been the ugliest wrestler in history

Ha, that might be my favorite match on the tape due to Cornette and Meltzer. Also, Lawler taking about 20 bumps off of Sweetan's piledriver.

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3 minutes ago, cwoy2j said:

Has there ever been a thread or any discussion on the Wrestling Gold series? It's basically a 5 dvd set of old SCW, Memphis and AWA matches but you can switch to alternate commentary and get Cornette and Meltzer talking about the matches, promotions, etc. Great stuff. It has the legendary Savage/Poffo vs. R&R Express match that saw Macho piledrive Ricky Morton through a table in Memphis.

I don't think there has been a specific thread about it.

It pops up in conversation every once in awhile. Like most recently it came up because Meltzer said he would have loved to have kept making them but I guess the company decided not to. (Ignoring the issue rights ownership now too)

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20 minutes ago, Technico Support said:

Owens is seriously great but a world champion is not booked as THE top guy in the company unless he's muscular and gives Vince a chub.  So Owens is a world title holder in a midcard comedy act instead, just keeping it warm until they can try to coronate The Big Dog for the umpteenth time.

ntA0dnz.gif

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