Movie [MOVIE] 2017 UPCOMING MOVIE DISCUSSION

[OSJ]

2 hours ago, J.T. said:

The thing about Sam Cooke's death is that it so painfully obvious that something else happened that is is absurd.  The condition of his body nowhere near fit the description of the incident.  One gunshot to the chest, my ass.

No one wanted Sam's murder to be solved.

Hard to play detective 50 years after the fact, but I'm guessing that the ho was payed to lure him to that particular motel by whoever it was that wanted him dead. It gets real sketchy after that, Sam made lots of enemies, but there were only a few with the money and connections to set him up like that.

[Elsalvajeloco]

Just now, J.T. said:

Suge wouldn't have drawn any talent after that.  Why go work for Suge at DR and get your ass beat when you could go work for Dre or even Snoop?

Well, when you want to sell records like them and don't know diddly squat about rap, someone like Suge is enticing if he actually knew what the fuck he was doing. I mean LaFace was stealing money from everyone, but people were still working with them because they had everyone there along with the prestige that came with it. There are some smart people in music, but we still got some really not, so bright people.

[Brian Fowler]

1 minute ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

For that time or anytime, that's a pretty big haul. There are major rap labels now that have lasted way longer than Death Row in their heyday that haven't had an album even close to ANY of those albums (critically, commercially, or as influential).

Oh without question. Death Row was absolutely insanely on fire. But it was Dre that made it happen, not Suge. They're a reason Dre formed Aftermath and Snoop moved over to fucking No Limit. 

Anyone think Pac wasn't out the door the second his contact was fulfilled?

But my point isn't that Death Row wasn't great, just that Suge's only accomplishment was getting Dre off Ruthless.

[OSJ]

Y'all are right, Dre was the genius with the eye for talent who was just gullible enough to buy what Suge was selling. (FWIW: It's not uncommon for geniuses to have very little common sense, and I think that applies to Dre and his relationship with Knight.) 

The question of why anyone in their right mind would work for Suge after the decline and fall of Death Row is a good one. "Yes, I want to go to work with a sociopathic bully who is likely to kick my ass once a week just to show how tough he is, where do I sign up?"

[Brian Fowler]

Side tracking here, but how the hell did Death Row not lock up Warren during that time period. They let Regulate... G Funk come out under somebody else.

[J.T.]

1 hour ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

I mean LaFace was stealing money from everyone, but people were still working with them because they had everyone there along with the prestige that came with it.

1. No one at LaFace ever got their ass kicked for being late for studio time.

2. R&B is a pretty timeless genre so you can always make money no matter when you jump into the game.  Gangsta Rap was in the process of evolving or dying since it was quickly approaching its shelf life, but Dre had the blueprint for the survival of West Coast hip hop.

3. DR wasn't evolving and there was no prestige of being the last man on a sinking ship when the founder is about to do a bid for racketeering.

4. Dre was the man who brought the talent in and the producer people wanted to work with.  There was no DR without D-R-e.

1 hour ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

Well, when you want to sell records like them and don't know diddly squat about rap, someone like Suge is enticing if he actually knew what the fuck he was doing.

When it came to the art side of the business, Suge did not know what the fuck he was doing.

Suge had keen senses when it came to spotting opportunity and he was even better when it came to seizing said opportunity.  No hesitation and fully invested.

One thing you cannot say about Suge is that he wasn't willing to go all in when it was time to go all in.

55 minutes ago, Brian Fowler said:

Side tracking here, but how the hell did Death Row not lock up Warren during that time period. They let Regulate... G Funk come out under somebody else.

I'd like to think that Dre was looking out for his stepbrother and waived Warren off from signing with DR, but I've got no clue why G rolled with Def Jam for G Funk.

I personally thought that Warren was a lock for DR since Endo Smoke was a huge track and then Regulate blew up.

[Elsalvajeloco]

14 minutes ago, Brian Fowler said:

Oh without question. Death Row was absolutely insanely on fire. But it was Dre that made it happen, not Suge. They're a reason Dre formed Aftermath and Snoop moved over to fucking No Limit. 

Anyone think Pac wasn't out the door the second his contact was fulfilled?

But my point isn't that Death Row wasn't great, just that Suge's only accomplishment was getting Dre off Ruthless.

My point isn't that Suge should get some credit, but that if he had something other than his rep, people would still be buying into what he had to offer. I mean Diddy (or whatever he is calling himself now) has been able to parlay his shitty treatment of artists into an empire. I mean if you're albums are going plastic (like a lot of rappers are doing nowadays), you don't have a whole lot of options. Yeah, people like J. Cole, Kendrick Lamar, and everyone of that ilk ain't getting anywhere close to Suge. However, that dude who desperately wants to be signed and willing to sign any ole bullshit contract would strangle a puppy to sign with Death Row if Suge any real knowledge of producing and finding talent. There are dudes doing that now for people who ain't nowhere near as famous as Suge (or have the credibility of having those artists under him) and are that "tough guy" centric.

[Brian Fowler]

So basically we all agree that Knight sucked balls at finding or developing talent.

[Brian Fowler]

Also worth remembering none of these people discovered Pac, he was a star before Suge paid for his defense. Not the absurd megastar he became, but it was as much Death Row latching onto him as vice versa.

[Elsalvajeloco]

10 hours ago, J.T. said:

1. No one at LaFace ever got their ass kicked for being late for studio time.

That's because that Greyhound got them to the studio on time.

10 hours ago, J.T. said:

2. R&B is pretty timeless so you can always make money.  

We had so many broke artists for that to be true though. Once you get to people like Drake, you're kinda irrelevant if you're not making music like that straddling the line between pop, rap, and R&B. There have been artists in the traditional R&B genre that would have to re-release their album just so people know they came out. 

I think what happened was people getting dropped from their labels necessitated they go independent, which in the process made them at least break even because you're not being robbed blind in the process. You're not forcing yourself to sign a 360 deal.

9 hours ago, Brian Fowler said:

So basically we all agree that Knight sucked balls at finding or developing talent.

Yes.

[Brian Fowler]

Somebody is making that money though. It's just not the artists.

Record labels love screwing over artists. Especially poor ones that likely have a limited shelf life, and even bigger bonus if they aren't white.

[OSJ]

It's nearly 4AM here and I'm talking with you jokers about Suge Fucking Knight of all people... Let me close by saying that the traditional recording industry sucks balls and that the Internet was the best thing that ever happened for artists. A big "Fuck You" to the recording industry, and as Kenny Omega would say "Good-night and GOOD-BYE"

[Elsalvajeloco]

9 minutes ago, Brian Fowler said:

Somebody is making that money though. It's just not the artists.

Record labels love screwing over artists. Especially poor ones that likely have a limited shelf life, and even bigger bonus if they aren't white.

But there are more non-traditional methods to make money though. Also, add in the fact that some of these people might show up on a Mona Scott produced reality show and get whatever money comes from that instead of having to give most of that up. If I can make money doing club appearances (and perform as well) every other Saturday, I would probably prefer to do that over half empty venues that make me look pitiful as an artist.

[J.T.]

26 minutes ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

We had so many broke artists for that to be true though.

Sadly because they're probably too focused on being artists. There isn't a gene of music where the ratio of successful artists to broke ones isn't skewed toward the negative. You can't just single out R&B.

The bitter truth is that any artist in the music business needs to learn the how business side works as well and they need to take extra care to mind their personal finances and guarantee that the legal shit is on the up and up.. 

Easier said than done as nearly every episode of UnSung or VH1's Where Are They Now? seems to prove.

[OSJ]

Yeah, I'm back, I'll blame it on staying up all last night watching kung-fu movies... What you say is true in almost all forms of creative endeavor, folks will put all their resources towards their passion and sadly, fail miserably at other stuff. 

In the 1980s, Axolotl Press was by far the most successful small press to ever exist. Every book sold out on publication, unfortunately, the one man behind the company was me. In three years, I ran things into the ground. How is that possible for someone who gets all kinds of praise and awards and shit as an editor and publisher? Let's see:

An eye for talent: Check

Sales and marketing savvy: Check

Smart enough to farm out all the stuff I couldn't do: Check

Attractive end product: Check

Ability to manage money and run a company: Not so much. ;-(

That's why I love what I do for Centipede Press and Ramble House so much, I get to do the creative stuff that I'm good at and someone else handles the business end of things that I have neither the interest or the ability to do well.

[RIPPA]

2nd Atomic Blonde trailer

Slightly less graphic than the first one (Only one head gets blown off in this one) but more of the plot is giving away

[Craig H]

Respect for giving details like more plot being given away. I'll avoid the trailer and assume it looks as cool as the first one.

[mattdangerously]

I am all in on Charlize Theron, Action Hero.  That looks great.

[Niners Fan in CT]

I didn't read everything but 2Pac's murder to me is pretty straight forward. They had some ongoing issues (stolen Death Row chains etc.) with the Southside Crips. Meanwhile, the same Crip set had ties to Puffy.  Now, if you believe Keffe D's (one of the crips supposedly in the car that night) interviews with LAPD detectives Puffy was scared of the people who surrounded Suge, the MOB Pirus and afraid to go out West and so he hired the Southsides for protection and ultimately put a hit out on 2Pac and Suge.  

Did Puffy really put a hit out?  Who knows, but I do think it's pretty straightforward that Keffe D and Baby Lane etc. were responsible for Vegas. Shit, Baby Lane was beaten in the lobby at the MGM at the Tyson fight, we know they were there and we know they had issues.  It's not that complicated I don't believe.  

Biggie's death is a little more up in the air. Most people tend to believe that it was one of Suge's associates in retaliation but the guy who has been rumored to be the trigger man is dead. Just like Baby Lane is dead. I believe the girlfirend/wife of the guy told detectives that he was given something like $25K from Suge for a hit but I'm not sure if that's been substantiated. 

@J.T. @OSJ @Elsalvajeloco

[RIPPA]

Detroit

Quote

DETROIT will be in theatres August 4.

From the Academy Award winning director of THE HURT LOCKER and ZERO DARK THIRTY, DETROIT tells the gripping story of one of the darkest moments during the civil unrest that rocked Detroit in the summer of ‘67.

Directed by Kathryn Bigelow. Written by Mark Boal. Starring John Boyega, Will Poulter, Algee Smith, Jacob Latimore, Jason Mitchell, Hannah Murray, Kaitlyn Dever, Jack Reynor, Ben O'Toole, Joseph David Jones, Ephraim Sykes, Leon Thomas III, Nathan Davis Jr., Peyton Alex Smith, Malcolm David Kelley, Gbenga Akinnabve, Chris Chalk, Jeremy Strong, Laz Alonzo, Austin Hebert, Miguel Pimentel, Kris David, with John Krasinski and Anthony Mackie.

 

[OSJ]

Thanks for getting the thread back on track. we late nighters are a bad bunch. ;-)

[RIPPA]

Transformers: The Last Knight

Aka Michael Bay makes a billion dollars because China is stupid

[RIPPA]

The Hitman's Bodyguard

Technically NSFW due to language

The use of the Whitney Houston song probably will be the best thing associated with this movie.. and I hate that fucking song

[Mister TV]

On 4/12/2017 at 9:43 AM, RIPPA said:

Detroit

 

It's a shame that this was filmed in Boston.

[Matt D]

On 4/8/2017 at 7:49 AM, OSJ said:

Yeah, I'm back, I'll blame it on staying up all last night watching kung-fu movies... What you say is true in almost all forms of creative endeavor, folks will put all their resources towards their passion and sadly, fail miserably at other stuff. 

In the 1980s, Axolotl Press was by far the most successful small press to ever exist. Every book sold out on publication, unfortunately, the one man behind the company was me. In three years, I ran things into the ground. How is that possible for someone who gets all kinds of praise and awards and shit as an editor and publisher? Let's see:

An eye for talent: Check

Sales and marketing savvy: Check

Smart enough to farm out all the stuff I couldn't do: Check

Attractive end product: Check

Ability to manage money and run a company: Not so much. ;-(

That's why I love what I do for Centipede Press and Ramble House so much, I get to do the creative stuff that I'm good at and someone else handles the business end of things that I have neither the interest or the ability to do well.

The Paul Heyman of small press publishing, ladies and gentleman.

(I'm so sorry, John)