Wyld Samurai Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 2 hours ago, Casey said: Unpopular opinion: Is anyone else kind of over the "british invasion" of sorts of talent like Sabre Jr, Ospreay, Scrull, etc? I mean, yeah, it's great that talent from the UK is getting international exposure, but I watch their matches and... ugh. I can't get into it. I try to watch WCPW or ICW or PROGRESS and it's just so bad. It seems really low-rent. I'm probably the only one that feels this way, but it's something I've felt for awhile and it came to a head during the Cruiserweight Classic with Sabre Jr. and now it's getting worse with ROH and PWG. As long as Jack Gallagher is still lacing up his boots I'll never tire of British carny-ism. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammo~! Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 I don't mind the British wrestling specifically, I just think we need a one year moratorium on reverse Frankensteiners and suicide dives in any and all indie matches Spoiler 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTTW Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 4 hours ago, The Nature Boy said: That's a different discussion and a real problem honestly. The biggest problem with post-Attitude Era wrestling is that fans say that someone is "wasted" if they aren't being pushed to the moon and receiving World Title shots. A lot of people fail to realize that the curtain jerker and the mid carder are all apart of the tapestry that is a good wrestling show. True, but it's strange that smaller companies can figure out how to make money off guys, but WWE sometimes can't. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SorceressKnight Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 1 hour ago, DTTW said: True, but it's strange that smaller companies can figure out how to make money off guys, but WWE sometimes can't. Key word, though: SMALLER COMPANIES. Saying that a smaller company can make money off some indy star doesn't necessarily mean they're guaranteed to be money in the big leagues for one, especially since pretty much every star who had any independent experience was once money in a smaller fed (The Shining Stars were absolute licenses to print money in Puerto Rico when Carlos Colon was booking the family, but there's been enough time to prove no, they will never be over- much less a draw, in the United States. That is the same for a lot of them- for every "But...but [indy promotion] did it so they could be a new boom period if WWE didn't HATE US and would gladly lose money just to make smarks unhappy!" person, there's at least one "Have we considered that maybe, JUST MAYBE, they were a smoke and mirrors job on the indy scene and they aren't that good?" story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turk128 Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 9 minutes in a lion appears... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turk128 Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 NJPW wrecking crew, freakin classic. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonteCarl Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Not trying to start a fantasy booking thread, but I was thinking ahead to WM 33 and trying to figure out a card for it when I realized that it's going to have to be a really full card due to the brand split this year. In the past, we've had 9 matches take up a 4 hour show. With the brand split, we have 7 titles now. Assuming all those get on the card, plus whatever Undertaker match, Brock/Golderberg match, the rumored Shaq/Big Show match, the Andre Battle Royal, that really starts to fill things up. And that's not counting any other matches/feuds that aren't for any titles. Obviously, some things will be on the pre-show, but man...it could really be a huge show this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Z Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 10 hours ago, Casey said: Unpopular opinion: Is anyone else kind of over the "british invasion" of sorts of talent like Sabre Jr, Ospreay, Scrull, etc? I mean, yeah, it's great that talent from the UK is getting international exposure, but I watch their matches and... ugh. I can't get into it. I try to watch WCPW or ICW or PROGRESS and it's just so bad. It seems really low-rent. I'm probably the only one that feels this way, but it's something I've felt for awhile and it came to a head during the Cruiserweight Classic with Sabre Jr. and now it's getting worse with ROH and PWG. Nope, exactly the opposite actually. I think the UK is way ahead over the other three big wrestling countries right now. Watching the British Indies is my main focus nowadays. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godfrey Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 2 hours ago, MonteCarl said: Not trying to start a fantasy booking thread, but I was thinking ahead to WM 33 and trying to figure out a card for it when I realized that it's going to have to be a really full card due to the brand split this year. In the past, we've had 9 matches take up a 4 hour show. With the brand split, we have 7 titles now. Assuming all those get on the card, plus whatever Undertaker match, Brock/Golderberg match, the rumored Shaq/Big Show match, the Andre Battle Royal, that really starts to fill things up. And that's not counting any other matches/feuds that aren't for any titles. Obviously, some things will be on the pre-show, but man...it could really be a huge show this year. Mania will be 12 hours this year. It's all part of the plan to eventually have live wrestling go 24/7/365 on the Network. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTTW Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 8 hours ago, SorceressKnight said: Key word, though: SMALLER COMPANIES. Saying that a smaller company can make money off some indy star doesn't necessarily mean they're guaranteed to be money in the big leagues for one, especially since pretty much every star who had any independent experience was once money in a smaller fed (The Shining Stars were absolute licenses to print money in Puerto Rico when Carlos Colon was booking the family, but there's been enough time to prove no, they will never be over- much less a draw, in the United States. That is the same for a lot of them- for every "But...but [indy promotion] did it so they could be a new boom period if WWE didn't HATE US and would gladly lose money just to make smarks unhappy!" person, there's at least one "Have we considered that maybe, JUST MAYBE, they were a smoke and mirrors job on the indy scene and they aren't that good?" story. Cept for the part where they bring them in, don't treat them seriously, book them to lose, and then say they arent grabbing the brass ring. If it was a hit and miss thing, ok, but it's got to be around a 90% rate where they never seem to tap into whatever they saw in guys to hire them in the first place. Look at the ratings...and realize they have better depth, diversity, and resources across the board...and yet the company seemingly has zero momentum. They don't have another Cena ready...despite a roster full of guys who were able to be Cena back home. I'll buy a few guys being smoke and mirrors...but nearly every single guy...come on man, at that point, it's not talent, it's WWE. I think back on Taz and compare it to AJ. Took them 20 years but they seemed to realize hey if the guy comes elsewhere and he's massively over, maybe we shouldn't waste all that momentum. And then I remember Roman and hope ends up lost again. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEN! Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 I don't think they should do Brock/Goldberg III at the WrestleMania. At the Rumble: Reigns enters early, Goldberg at 27 and spears and tosses a couple of guys, Strowman around for the final four, Strowman eliminates Roman, Goldberg gets Strowman out right after, Brock enters at 30, wrecks Goldberg for a couple minutes, goes for a big clothesline and Goldberg dips his shoulder, Brock goes flying, Goldberg wins the Rumble. Challenges for the WHC. Styles can carry him to a long-ish main event-level match. Brock goes nuts on Raw, murders a couple of cruiserweights. Literally. RIP TJP. Gets Universal Title match at WM to satiate him. Jericho eventually cons his way into the match making it a 3-way. Brock squashes both guys, eats the shopping list and sends Jericho away to play rockstar. Holds the title until the SummerFest where he baits Goldberg into another match and he finally picks up a win over Goldberg. Also, Roman vs. Strowman. And Ambrose finally snaps on Ellsworth leading to a garbage match against Shane. And I guess, Rollins vs. Trips and Cena vs. Undertaker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curt McGirt Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 12 hours ago, Sammo~! said: I don't mind the British wrestling specifically, I just think we need a one year moratorium on reverse Frankensteiners and suicide dives in any and all matches. FTFY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolfan in NYC Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 "Defending championships is a gimmick...." I'm not sure if I'm more disturbed by that statement or by your "Dana Brooke as Sindel" avatar... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTTW Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 A near 50 year old football drop out beat a certified MMA badass who is juiced to the gills in under 5 minutes. The fantasy booking I have involves a room full writers and executives along with a high capacity weapon that fires rapidly to fix this level of stupid booking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zev Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Why does it matter if he played football or not? Jim Ross won't be calling his matches. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RRR Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 The match layout was Brock's idea motivated by the one thing that motivates him, money. At least Goldberg has some sort of passion for wrestling and isn't just collecting a paycheck like an emotionless robot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevie Ray Von Erich Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 I don't know if calling a guy who was on actual NFL rosters a football dropout (especially when Brock--whom I assume you're homering for here--only ever made a practice squad) is a good argument. Plus, it's wrestling. Everything is believable if it's booked right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammo~! Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 8 minutes ago, zev said: Why does it matter if he played football or not? Jim Ross won't be calling his matches. "I never met a football player I couldn't step over to find a better fight" -Arn Anderson 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIPPA Posted November 28, 2016 Author Share Posted November 28, 2016 2 hours ago, L_W_P said: I dont think all the titles will be defended at Mania. That's a gimmick for Night of Champions. Granted there are more of them now but all titles are defended at almost all the Manias. It seems like at most one isn't defended on each show and that is rare. Like when the Shield was doing all the 6 man's and Ambrose was never defending. Or when they kept putting AJ Lee in tag matches because... well they hated the women. God did they really hate defending the US Title on Mania Especially now when they put them on the preshow too 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casey Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 The WrestleMania pre-show is like, 2 1/2 hours long. You could easily have 3 title matches during that time. For sure though, some titles won't get defended at WrestleMania because it's just not a priority. I see the Cruiserweight title being defended at the Takeover show the night before, personally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Z Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 1 hour ago, Zartan said: At least Goldberg has some sort of passion for wrestling and isn't just collecting a paycheck like an emotionless robot. The guy whose career lasted a whooping eight years and repeatedly said he's only interested in coming back for one more match to show his son how cool he is? That guy's supposed to have passion for wrestling? I don't even want to know how much he got paid for Survivor Series. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casey Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 And the running line from Meltzer seems to be that "Goldberg will keep wrestling as long as Vince pays him what he got at Survivor Series". Honestly, I'm okay with these guys not having "passion" for wrestling. This shit is rough and ultimately, it's business. Get your money and get out, it's the smartest way to do it. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTTW Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 1 hour ago, Stevie Ray Von Erich said: I don't know if calling a guy who was on actual NFL rosters a football dropout (especially when Brock--whom I assume you're homering for here--only ever made a practice squad) is a good argument. Plus, it's wrestling. Everything is believable if it's booked right. I'm saying Goldie has extremely limited qualifications that suggest he is on Brock's level. You're right, it can be...when it isn't contridicted by a harsh reality from a competitor who's entire business model makes your idea look stupid. And they'd market the shit outta such an actually shocking moment...which WWE can't do because we know it's scripted. What's funny is the WWE just keeps reaching backwards to attract new fans...and sooner than later all they are going to find is their hand covered in their own shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casey Posted November 29, 2016 Share Posted November 29, 2016 Yeah, but we live inside the world of kayfabe. Where the notion of using a sledgehammer and not killing the other guy is treated as believable. Goldberg doesn't have extremely limited qualifications, he went on a 100 something win streak in WCW, destroying guys in ways that would make Suplex City look like Candyland. Yeah, okay, maybe Brock Lesnar the character we see on television did take a sabbatical (after being beat by Goldberg in his last match in 2004) and trained to be an MMA competitor and he knows ju-jitsu and whatnot. Does any of that matter? No, because wrestling is fake and we still live in a world of fantasy, where the most feared guy on the roster is an undead zombie and there's grown men on RAW that love unicorns and Dragonball Z and are still taken seriously. What qualifcations did CM Punk have to be on Brock Lesnar's level and have a competitive match? Triple H? JOHN CENA? What, because these guys are/were currently active in wrestling and Goldberg hasn't been seen since 2004 so of course he's just been eating cake and watching re-runs of "2 Broke Girls"? Come on. This is getting a little ridiculous. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joseph2112 Posted November 29, 2016 Share Posted November 29, 2016 I see both sides of this argument, but to me there are some realities. Would it be better for the WWE to build young guys and try to establish the future through Brock? IMO of course. But they are most interested in the buzz and moment that the current situation has produced. Until the 70 year old walks away, I can't really see that changing. Here is the question I believe the WWE asks itself about every booking decision: Will this add or decrease network subscription in any way? I don't see this as a negative at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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